RootsChat.Com
Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Carmarthenshire => Wales => Carmarthenshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: x5girl on Thursday 26 January 12 16:40 GMT (UK)
-
Would anybody be kind enough to find a marriage for a William Thomas b c 1820 Pembroke Lampeter? and Margaret possibly Rees or Llewellyn b c 1825 in St Davids. I think Margaret was only 15 or 16 getting married and they may have married in the Eglwyscummin district of Laugharne/ Red Roses area possibly around 1840. Their first child was born in 1841 in Eglwyscummin.
Thankyou.
-
Hello :)
You need to confirm Margaret's maiden name first. I think she had a daughter Phebe, born 1849?
Narberth volume 26 page 721 is the likely birth, but specify parent's names and William's occupation, plus Eglwyscummin.
Once you have Margaret's maiden name it will be easier to trace the correct marriage certificate.
Kind Regards
Morgan
-
1851 Newton Farm
William Thomas Head age 30 Born Lampeter, Pembroke Ag Lab
Margret Thomas Wife age 25 born St David's
John Thomas Son age 10 born Eglwyscummin
Thomas Thomas Son age 8 born Eglwyscummin
Mary Thomas Dau age 5 born Eglwyscummin
Phebe Thomas Dau age 1 born Eglwyscummin
HO107 Piece 2472 Folio 420 Page 13
I assume this is your family?
-
Hello :D
Thanks for your reply...
Yes that is the correct family. I have been trying to find them in the 1841 census but no luck as yet..
I was just hoping that they would show up in the Eglwys cummyn records for possibly a marriage.
I am sorry but I dont know Margarets maiden name for sure, so I do understand it is difficult to say the least..
She must have been only about 15 years of age getting married and having her first child !!
One question,would "Lampeter" , Williams birthplace be Lampeter Velfrey as we know it ??
Thankyou for your time.
-
Hello :)
It is likely to be Lampeter Velfrey, Pembrokeshire.
Margaret may not be the Mother of the older children, so that is why it is important to buy a birth certificate to confirm her maiden name. William may have been married before.
Why do you think her maiden name was Rees or Llewellyn?
Best wishes
Morgan
-
Hello again :D
I have been trying to get hold of a birth certificate for my great grandfather Benjamin Thomas b 02 April 1854 Laugharne. Still awaiting a reply nearly three months later from Carm registrars Office >:( slightly miffed to say the least....
1861 census Meidrim St Clears the family is listed @ Sarnau Farm ?
I must admit I didnt think of the possibility that Margaret may not be the mother of the other children or that William could have ben married before..
Thanks for your help, will just have to keep waiting for a reply I suppose and hopefully Benjamins Birth Certificate will confirm Margarets maiden name when I manage to get a copy....
kind regards
-
If you're confident about the date of birth, there is only 1 birth of a Benjamin Thomas in June quarter of 1854.
Carmarthen volume 11a page 602
It is unusual for Carmarthen register office staff not to reply for 3 months so perhaps your email went astray. You could try telephoning them (Tuesdays are usually best), or order the certificate online from GRO, specifying details such as parent's names, occupations, location,, etc:
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
-
Hello Back again :-\
Took your advice and ordered a copy with the GRO.
Well that has arrived and im now more confused than ever... ???
I think I need to start from scratch and forget the family mentioned above...
I have Benjamins date of birth as 2nd April 1854.
Place of Birth, well on several of the census returns it is St Clears, on one it is Llandwr,and another it is "The Roses" which made me think Red Roses.
The copy certificate which arrived is for a Benjamin Thomas born in Llangynnin (which I know is just outside St Clears) but different birth date.
I think the next step is to find his wedding certificate to find out his fathers name for sure.
Thank you.
-
Are you looking at the chap who is b Llandowror in 1871, living in Llanstephan? THis links to someone on 1861
Benjamin Thomas aged 8, b Eglwys Cummin, resident in Llanstephan
Piece 4138, Folio 62, Page 7
Jason Thomas 40 b Lampeter, pembs. Ag lab
Sophia Thomas 41 b Laugharne
Mary Thomas 10 b Eglwys Cummin
Benjamin Thomas 8
Anna Thomas 3 b Llanstephan
-
Hi Mabel,
I have made a note of this family as a possible match for my Benjamin.
I have just ordered a Marriage Certificate for Benjamin so hopefully I will be able to move on with this once I find out his fathers name for sure.
Thanks for yor interest.
Best wishes
-
Hello ,
Im back again, just got Benjamins marriage certificate back and his father is named as
John Thomas / occupation "Tailor".
So can someone please help with this.I cant find him in 1861 or 1871 census returns
Im now looking for Benjamin Thomas born in St Clears April 2nd 1854. On some of the census returns he is listed as being born in St Clears/ "The Roses"/ and Llandwr....
Any help is most appreciated
Thanks
-
Hello again :)
To summarise latest position, you are looking for Benjamin Thomas, born 2nd April 1854, at St Clears, Llanddowror, or Red Roses. On Benjamin's marriage certificate, his Father was named as John Thomas, a Tailor.
Think I've found them in 1871. :)
Narberth Road, Castle Dyrran, Carmarthenshire
John Thomas Head age 52 Taylor born Mynachlogddu, Pembs
Elizabeth Thomas Wife age 50 born Dale, Pembs
Benjamin Thomas Son age 16 Mailcart Driver born West Roses, Carms
Thomas H Thomas Son age 12 Scholar born Narberth Road, Carms
Ann M Thomas Dau age 4 born Narberth Road, Carms
RG10 Piece 5508 Folio 3 Page 6
Modified: West Rose was in Eglwys Cymin Parish, and is between Red Roses and Tavernspite. I think the 1861 is incomplete for Castle Dyrran.
Kindest Regards
Morgan
-
Looks like this could be John in 1851:
Shop, Llanddowror
Joseph Davies Head age 20 born Llanddowror Grocer
John Thomas Servant age 30 born Mynachlogddu, Pembs General Servant
HO107 Piece 2472 Folio 494 Page 14
Modified - Benjamin's birth was probably in Narberth district, but I can't see 1 for that quarter :-\
http://www.ukbmd.org.uk/genuki/reg/districts/narberth.html
-
Hello ;D
Thankyou very much for the information that you have found for me :)
This is looking very promising indeed,infact I am sure we have the right family..
I had Benjamins Birth from his GWR records as the date mentioned, so presume this is correct ?
If he was born at "West Rose" inbetween Tavernspite and Red Roses,could that come under Llandowror Carmarthen District?
I think I will now have to find his parents marriage which would have been between 1851-1854 hopefully in Red Roses/Llandowror area which would make sense..
Benjamin spent his life working on the GWR Railway and progressed to Station Master,living at Castle Dyrran (Clynderwen) was obvioulsy where the story starts .
Many thanks once again :-*
-
Hello :)
Llanddowror to Red Roses is about 4.5 miles, about Red Roses to Tavernspite is about 1.5 miles. You would pass West Rose on the way!
Use zoom level 3 on this map:
http://streetmap.co.uk/map.srf?x=219445&y=212380
It's a shame that we can't find them in 1861 as there may be other children who have left home by 1871. John and Elizabeth both seem a little old (age 36 and 34 when Benjamin was born) :-\
Also the John Thomas I found in 1851 may not be the right one, as the occupation is not the same, even though the birthplace matches. It's difficult with John Thomas marrying Elizabeth, isn't it?
I can't see a birth for Benjamin in the right quarter of 1854. I wonder whether the register office staff could look at the births of Benjamin Thomas at "West Rose" ca 1854. They normally search 2 years either side, and it's a very small place.
Best Wishes
Morgan
-
Looking at it again, I think that West Rose is a farm, and it's been there a long time. See the 1888-89 Carmarthenshire map on here:
http://www.old-maps.co.uk/maps.html?coords=218100,212700
It's still a farm and there's a holiday cottage there, West Rose Barn.
So Benjamin was very specific about his birthplace! :D
Picture of the farm:
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/1020741
-
In case there's any connection, here's the family at West Rose:
West Rose, Eglwyscummin
1851
John Evans Head age 54 born Llangolman, Pembs Farmer 50 acres
Jane Evans Wife age 54 born Ludchurch, Pembs
Thomas Evans Son age 20 born Bletherston, Pembs Dumb
Rosy Evans Dau age 13 born Bletherston, Pembs Scholar
HO107 Piece 2475 Folio 314 Page 1
1861
John Evans Head age 63 Farmer born Llangolman, Pembsl
Jane Evans Wife age 68 born Llandwey, Pembs
Eliza Evans Dau age 26 Dairymaid born Bletherstone Pembs
John Reed Nephew age 14 Scholar born Cadoxton, Glam
RG9 Piece 4148 Folio 77 Page 2