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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Mayo => Topic started by: soliver on Saturday 21 January 12 23:24 GMT (UK)
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I wonder if anyone could please help me on this. I am trying to find the full names of the parents of Marion Kathleen (Kate)O'Malley.She was born in approx. 1845 in the manor house in Cong, Castlebar, Co.Mayo.She had a sister Emily Frances Malley (she dropped the "O", as did Marion on her marriage record)(aka Daisy) who was born on Jan.1st. 1844, I believe also in Cong. Also an Aunt name Catherine Malley
Her father's name was believed to be Charles O'Malley and he owned a bank there.During the famine he used his money to pay his customers so that they could buy food, but then he had to sell the manor house and they moved to England, London
believe.It was sold to the Guinness family. In 1866 Marion married an Edward Sands and they went to live in Maidstone, Kent where they raised their sons and one daughter named Emily Elizabeth Sands. The boys named (1) George Spencer Sands, born abt. 1867 in Linton, Kent and who died in 1890. (2)Harold Percy Sands. Born Feb. 10th 1873 in Linton,Kent. (3)Edgar Hugh Sands. Born 10th Feb. 1874 in Linton, Kent. (4)Charles(Charlie Edward)Sands, Born abt.1870 in Linton, Kent. (5)Holton Evans Sands. Born abt.1875 in Linton, Kent. They became journalists in Canada. Marion died in Los Angeles, California on January 30th 1919.On the Death Cert. it gave her father as C.O'Malley and no mother's name.We would really appreciate any information on Marion's parent's names.
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Hello,
Firstly if you don't already have Edward Sands marriage certificate you need to get it to confirm the father's name.
Camberwell 1866 1d 929 sept quarter
Best wishes
Heywood
Added:published trees have him as Charles and mother Frances
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What searching have you already done?
1866: Edward Sands and Marion Malley marry
1871: Marion born Dublin and Emily born London.
1881: both women born Castlebar
1891: both born Ireland
1901: Emily and Aunt Catherine both born Ireland
I can't see Catherine before 1901 and Emily and Marian before 1871 (apart from marriage).
Who witnessed the marriage?
You mention Cong and Castlebar. Where is the evidence for the Cong residence?
There are several Charles Malley entries in Griffiths Valuation (abt 1850s) .
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What searching have you already done?
1866: Edward Sands and Marion Malley marry - got this from family bible
1871: Marion born Dublin and Emily born London. - haven't seen this
1881: both women born Castlebar - seen this
1891: both born Ireland - seen this
1901: Emily and Aunt Catherine both born Ireland - seen this
I can't see Catherine before 1901 and Emily and Marian before 1871 (apart from marriage). Catherine doesn't state marital status in 1901 so don't know if she is widow or spinster, haven't found her before the 1901 census either
Who witnessed the marriage? - this i don't know but will see if i can find
You mention Cong and Castlebar. Where is the evidence for the Cong residence? - this info comes from family lore and the family bible (which starts with marian and edwards marriage)
there is a story about the o'malley/malley family owing a bank - losing it because the father helped during the famine, then going to england and the family estate being sold to the guinesse(?) family but that's just rumor.
There are several Charles Malley entries in Griffiths Valuation (abt 1850s) .
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Catherine is single in 1901 as is Emily.
Her will - 1923 also states 'spinster'.
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thank you - i have added this note to my info
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I have tried searching but don't know what you have already covered and what information you have.
As I said earlier, the marriage certificate will give Marian's father's name and occupation.
The wills of Catherine and Emily may help with some background information but then also may not - do you have copies of those?
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unfortunately i can't afford to look at those yet maybe one day - most of the work i've found is from free sources - and i live in canada so i can't go and look them up
thank you for all your help
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Hi, researching Charles O Malley of Cloonane, Mayo and his brother J B O' Malley ran the National Bank in Castlebar. Remembered this post. Have you joined the o'malley dna project? A
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No I haven't done any DNA things yet, waiting for the right time for me.
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My Dad's Mother was an O'Malley only one of six Siblings born in Liverpool the others born in Dublin
She always maintained there was a Family connection to the Guinness Family but she never elaborate on her known secret that Died with her.
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I too, heard the story about the Guinness family purchasing the family home in Ireland, some relatives I have located also tell me this, plus a "nodding acquaintance" with Queen Victoria, we have a picture of Marion Katherine Sands (born Malley or O'Malley). We have a story that her father used family money to assist victims of the potato famine. She had a sister Frances Emily, who never married, and an aunt who was a widow in 1900. I do know that she listed her father "Charles Malley", as a gentleman (no occupation) when she married. We also know that her mother was a Spencer. She used both Malley and O'Malley at different times.
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Aunt Catherine Malley gives Ballina as her birth place in 1911.
1921 index shows County Mayo but the document might have more detail of birthplace.
There is a will in 1923 with probate granted to Sir Francis Minchin Voules knight.
He was a solicitor and it doesn’t look as there was a family connection. The will might have family information.
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I too, heard the story about the Guinness family purchasing the family home in Ireland
Sir Benjamin Guinness purchased the Ashford estate in 1852.
https://www.mayo-ireland.ie/en/towns-villages/cong/history/ashford-castle.html
Added. https://irelandxo.com/ireland/mayo/cong-mayo
Click "Cong in the 1830s" for description + list of "gentlemen's seats".
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Charles O Malley of Cloonane, Mayo and his brother J B O' Malley ran the National Bank in Castlebar.
A branch of the National Bank was established in Castlebar in 1836. Mentioned in an article about Castlebar history in "Connaught Telegraph" 19th Feb. 2022.
"Conaught Telegraph" and "Mayo Constitution" newspapers were both founded 1828. There may be relevant articles or adverts in them.
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The "cousins" in the United States, sent me a handwritten paper titled "The O'Malleys" written by Rev. William Gordon Tanner, her son-in-law. And while some of the items written about are not exactly accurate, from the research I've done, some of the "Memoirs" I have been able to confirm, however, and I sure that some of the memories were of an aristoractic woman who exaggerated a little were very accurate, but there are pieces missing. The book "Charles O'Malley The Irish Dragoon" was said have been written about Marion Kathleen's great-great grandfather while the author was guest in his house.
That after her father paid the bank's starving creditors, he was force to sell and move to England. Her memoirs say that Edwin Sands was a banker but census records indicate he was a grocer and brewer, her story says he was killed in a stage coach accident, I was told he commited suicide after getting religion and losing the family fortune. That her eldest son, George in her memory was a cricket player of note, I was told that he was killed in a carriage accident, with his fiance.
When the Edwin died, Marion opened a school, however at one point the boys were in a work/poor house (census records).
So I do believe that is a whisper of truth that we had some pretty fancy ancestors, I don't know all the facts and probably never will.
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You mention ‘Cong, Castlebar’. These are different places. Ashford Castle is Cong which was purchased by a Guinness member, see Maiden Stone’s post , but I have not found a mention of Malley there previously.
In newspaper snippets there are references to Charles Malley, Cong Abbey, a miller. There is mention of bankruptcy in 1861.
Griffiths Valuation https://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/ shows a Charles Malley in Creggaree https://www.townlands.ie/galway/ross/cong/cloonbur/creggaree/ which may be that Charles.
You also post, “ We also know that her mother was a Spencer “
Apologies if these have been posted already and with your research you will have them but I am posting for others who are trying to help.
Charles Malley death Castlebar 1874
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1874/020657/7248374.pdf
Calendar of Wills http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/search/cwa/index.jsp
Charles Malley death 1874 (late of Castlebar)
Charles Spencer Malley death 1865 (late of Castlerea but died in Africa)
Sarah Jane Malley death 1862 (late of Castlebar)
All these appear together in 1875 and administration granted to Caroline Gray (Malley from marriage records)
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Her memoirs say that Edwin Sands was a banker but census records indicate he was a grocer and brewer, her story says he was killed in a stage coach accident, I was told he commited suicide after getting religion and losing the family fortune. That her eldest son, George in her memory was a cricket player of note, I was told that he was killed in a carriage accident, with his fiance.
When the Edwin died, Marion opened a school, however at one point the boys were in a work/poor house (census records).
So I do believe that is a whisper of truth that we had some pretty fancy ancestors, I don't know all the facts and probably never will.
Edward Sands
1861 Grocer and Draper
1871 Grocer
1877 Probate record - Farmer and Grocer
I don’t see the boys in the workhouse on censuses though.
Added - sorry, yes I can see them in ‘Infant Orphan Asylum’, Wanstead in 1881. Other children are with their mother.
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This newspaper snippet is interesting and hopefully helpful. I can’t see the announcement.
1st April 1890 Maidstone Journal and Kentish Advertiser
“DEATHS.
.. Spencer Sands, eldest eon the late Mr Edward .Sands, of Linton, near Maidstone, and eldest grandson of the late harles Mai ley, Esq., formerly Cong Abbey, Co. Mayo. Ireland”
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As I mentioned earlier, there are several snippets re Charles Malley, Cong Abbey and bankruptcy /insolvency 1861.
The Griffiths Valuation record I posted earlier shows ‘House, Mill, Stores’ and another ‘Land’ for Charles Malley, Creggaree.
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You mention ‘Cong, Castlebar’. These are different places. Ashford Castle is Cong which was purchased by a Guinness member, see Maiden Stone’s post
Cong and Castlebar are about 20 miles apart.
Map https://www.swilson.info/regdistmap.php?gregdistid=10 Enlarge map to see locations of Cong Abbey and Ashford Castle. Cong is in Ballinrobe Superintendent Registrar's District for births, marriages and deaths. Ballinrobe town is a few miles north, on the way to Castlebar. Select Cong from list of civil parishes to see a list of townlands in Cong civil parish.
Towns and villages in Mayo. Several pages of information for each.
https://www.mayo-ireland.ie/en/towns-villages/towns-villages-overview.html
It says under "Cong Abbey" in the section on Cong that Sir Bernard Guinness began rebuilding the abbey in 1860.
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Charles O Malley of Cloonane, Mayo and his brother J B O' Malley ran the National Bank in Castlebar.
https://irelandxo.com/ireland-xo/history-and-genealogy/timeline/castlebar-town-1830s
Spencer Park, seat of Major O'Malley D.L.
List of subscribers to "Topographical Dictionary of Ireland" by Samuel Lewis, published 1837. Surnames beginning with O include:
O'Malley, James, Esq. Cloonane, Castlebar
O'Malley, Major Owen, D.L. & J.P., Spencer Park, Castlebar
See also letter M for Malley/Mally &c.
https://libraryireland.com/topog/subso.php