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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Suffolk => England => Suffolk Lookup Requests => Topic started by: hotrodpansy on Tuesday 10 January 12 21:42 GMT (UK)
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Hello, I have a William Kitson 1757-1780 married to Elizabeth Carter 1760-1780 living at Monewden. Do you have any info on them, I think that they might have had something to do with the Mill? also they both die in the same year?? There son, William Kitson 1779-1851 married to Lydia Philpot 1785-1876 also lived at Monewden, possibly taking over from his father....there is definately a link with the Flour trade?? Any help greatly appreciated. Thank you Jenny
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I can help you out with the burial dates of Elizabeth (3rd January 1780) and William (24th December 1780) at St Mary, Monewden.
Victor
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The Suffolk Burial Index gives the dates quoted by Victor but also states that both Elizabeth & William lived in nearby Easton.
Keziah
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Thank you Victor & Keziah, I will add this to my tree, do you have any other info showing in the registers, ie birth? Baptism? Marriage?. I have tried googling Monewden and there really isant much history? Do you know where else I could look? regards Jenny
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Try the Suffolk Family History Society (FHS). FHSs are a valuable resource often manned by volounteers who will often do a free lookup.
Email: admin@suffolkfhs.org.uk
Website: www.suffolkfhs.org.uk
Victor
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Thanks Victor, I will try them regards Jenny
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As a former member of the SFHS Exec, we were always advised not to carry out research for members, it was at our own discretion - that may have changed.
However for the Suffolk Look Up Exchange at the Suffolk surnames List website there is a volunteer with the following records
Monewden
C 1705-1811
B 1705-1812
M 1705-1837, banns to 1849
I can PM her email address if you would like it.
Pat ...
Administrator/owner of The Suffolk Surnames List
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Taken from Easton parish register.
William s/o William and Elizabeth Kitson baptised 18th (or 28th?) November 1779
I couldn't see any other Kitson baptisms around this time.
No banns or marriage at Easton for William and Elizabeth.
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Hello Pat, could you Pm me the e-mail address please, lets keep our fingers crossed. Annes, that's really helpful as I wasnt sure where William jnr was born/baptised. Does anyone have any ideas why both the parents died within a year of each other? they were so young? Perhaps, Small Pox?
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Hi Hotrodpansy. I am the recorder for the parish of Monewden so perhaps I can help you.The Court Baron of 7th July 1830 shows William and his wife Agnes being copyhold farmers The first Kitson mentioned in the registers is William marrying Elizabeth Carter on 15/02/1779, daughter of Henry & Elizabeth Carter, and the last is the baptism of Rosabella on 22/04/1859. The records for Monewden mill are sketchy until the 19th Cent and the name does not appear so I don't think they were millers. I am writing this fairly late on 23rd Dec so I haven't delved very deeply. Hope this helps, Kettleburgher.
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Hi, I now have had time for a closer look at what I have got on your Kitsons.The earliest entry I have is for a baptism of an Elizabeth Kittson (sic) on 21/10/1733 The court baron entry I spoke of,(07/07/1830) is William & Lydia surrendering their copyhold farm in Monewden and moving out as there are no Kitsons living in the village at the time of the Tithe map of 1838. I think you will have to be very careful of the repeating names William & Elizabeth! Against the burial entry for William 24/12/1780 & Elizabeth 04/06/1780 there is a note saying "both lived at Easton" (approx 2 miles from Monewden). The year before, 15/02/1779, William married Elizabeth Carter whose parents were Henry and Elizabeth.William was educated and could sign the register but Elizabeth could not. The family have one branch living in Monewden until the 1830s and the wedding of William, described as a farmer, to Lydia Philpot on 30/05/1809 appears to be a "shotgun" affair as there is a birth,Elizabeth, on 13/08/09. They go on to baptise Sarah,, 1811,William,1814,Benjamin Philpot,(27/07/1817),Henry Carter,(12/07/1818)Lydia,(08/04/1821),Mary Ann,(09/05/18240 & John,(08/04/1827). To end with,there were Kitsons farming at the adjacent village, Charsfield,until the 1990s.Regards, Newdenpete.
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Hi Hold everything! I have just had a look at Windy Millers excellent site and he speaks of the dissolution of a partnership of Monewden mill between William Kitson and James Durrant in Feb 1803 Quote "the partnership consisted in the flour trade only which will be continued by James Durrant on his own account" So you were correct in your assumption. Regards Kettleburger
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Hi Hotrodpansy, As promised, a bit more on your Kitsons. I was in the S.R.O today and found the following adverts in the Ipswich Journal.
14/12/1822. By order of William Kitson all live and dead stock in Monewden. 3 carthorses, a chestnut colt, 2years old by Mr Clokes horse of Framlingham, 2 milch cows, 2 cowbuds,2 sows, one with 10 piglets, 7 small shoats, a capital road waggon, harvest waggon, 3 strong three quarter load tumbrels, a luggage cart, a turnip cart, a set of iron scarifiers, 3 ploughs, 2 gangs of harrows, 2 rollers, farm utensils and working tools.
Household. Mahogany and common bedsteads, 5 good feather beds, wool and hair matresses, a handsome 8 day clock, 30 hour ditto, a bureaux and bookcase, elegant sofa, mahogany and other sofas, chairs and every other article found in a well furnished farm house.
5/12/1829. Valuable farm house, stables & other buildings in good repair with 47 acres more or less of capital arable and pasture land with a new built cottage situated in Monewden in the occupation of the proprietor, William Kitson. This estate is part freehold & part copyhold.
N.B. Shoat= a young hog, Milch cow =one yielding milk, cow bud= a heiffer, a scarifier =probably a horse drawn rake to break up the soil. I haven't located the actual farm yet but I am pretty sure that it is Folly farm,a moated site and the oldest in the village. Some more meat on the bones
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Hi Kettleburger, thanks so much for taking the time to look through the paper.....it certainly puts "meat on the bones" I will be able to add this to the life & times of William Kitson......Interesting, that you are convinced that it is "Folly Farm" what makes you so sure? as there are plenty of other farms around? I know that William's wife Elizabeth Carter, her father Henry Carter was a well repected Farmer of Monewden and had some vague connection to the mill their, but I cannot find anymore info on him atall...It's ashame that no farm names have been recorded on the documents.
I will continue looking/researching and let you know if I find anything interesting.
By the way, if there's anything that you wish me to look out for then just ask...I will be only to willing to help. Regards Hotrodpansy
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Hi Kettleburger & hotrodpansy,
Do either of you (or anyone else) know if Durrant's mill was the same mill that stood in the village till about 1928? I suspect it was but it would be good to get confirmation.
Cheers,
Windy
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Hi Windymiller, I thought that the mill that William Kitson was in was called "mortimers" but I could be mistaken?? I have definately heard of Durrants Mill but cannot think where....I will have a search around and let you know if I find anything....meanwhile Kettleburger may be able to help. Regards Jenny
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Thanks Jenny,
I'm leaning towards Kitson's & Durrant's mills being one and the same.
Windy
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Hi Windy & Hotrod, I am 100% sure that you are correct Windy. Having lived in the village for more than 45 years and having spoken to the "gud owd boys" They never referred to it by any personal names but always as "the mill". As you know both Durrant and Mortimer had connections to the building although nearly a century apart. The Late Clifford Arbon. the last wheelwright who worked for his uncle in the wagon making business until it closed in the 1920s, told me that the Mortimers were a bit "above themselves". One of the daughters was short in stature and, according to Clifford, would stuff hay in her shoes to make herself look taller! As far as I know Mortimer was the last miller and, in the village hall, there is a photo of him standing on the mill steps. Interestingly enough Windy we have a field in the village which is referred to in a Manorial document of 1558 as "mellmount field" suggesting that this may be where the older mill stood. All evidence has been ploughed out but it would be placed about 400 yards from the later mill.Fascinating all this history isn't it? Regards, Peter.
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Hi Kettleburger,
I agree about the mill, though I'll nown have to research the mill mount mil reference!
Cheers
Windy
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Hi Windy. Ref Monewden's possible ancient mill site. The first reference is in the will of a wealthy man named John Chapman proved 1456 which talks of his son, Thomas inheriting land called "melle close" When son John dies, his will of 1472 has the name as "le mylne close"
The Manorial Extent of the first year of Elizabeth 1st (1558) has an open field called milne field containing "milne close" described as "lande of the lord". The same document refers to a road as "milnemount way" all pretty convincing for the existence of an early mill. The big problem is that most of the pieces of land were strips within a larger field and even though the abuttals are given it is quite difficult to be sure of the exact location. The nearest I can get is that it is just west of the present Firs farm. Hope this helps, Kettleburger.
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Wow, Kettleburger that is great info...straight into the db! I'll have to look into it further, but you are absolutely "melle", "mylne" & "milne" are all old spelling of mill, and if not by a rive could well have been a windmill (though less likely an animal powered millhouse), and "milnemount" is a windmill give-away!
Brilliant!
Windy
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Just found your information about the Mortimers who were millers at Monewden, I am related to them I was there last week looking and finding their graves in the churchyard, I was interested to hear the story about the daughter filling her shoes to make her taller, and was interested that there is a photogragh of William in the village hall would it be possible to take a photogragh of it ? also I would like to find where the mill stood, I think that William Mortimer's brother a grain merchant and maltster in Ipswich bought the mill for his brother from the miller called Gissing, the family originated in Ashfield cum Thorpe, if you could let me know how I can access the village hall to take a picture, i live in Ipswich so would be able to come over
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Hi Smoug, The mill stood almost opposite the village hall. When you get a look at the photograph you can see the old school house in the back ground. The village has a coffee morning, open to all, on Sat Sept 19th at 10-30am, or, the third Saturday every month, so you will be very welcome to come and photograph it. Regards, Kettleburger.
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Oh thats brilliant thankyou, I will try and get along on the 19th Sept, is there someone I should make contact with i don't want to go in and just start taking pictures and people wondering what on earth its about regards Smoug
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Hi Smoug, I will be there from 10-45 so will keep an eye open for you. Regards Kettleburger
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Thankyou looking forward to it Tessa