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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: bella9 on Monday 26 December 11 03:23 GMT (UK)
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Hi
I am having trouble reading the surname of a family in the 1841 census who lived at White Hall, Romford, Essex. South Ward Upminster. Page 15
The parents are John 60, Elizabeth 45, Richard 15, Maryanne 15, Caroline 11, Noah 9, Allen 7.
It looks like the name is Rasin/Paine/ I am really not sure what it is.
Bella9
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What is the surname transcribed as?
Don't worry - I found it transcribed as Rasin (horrible writing). I will take a closer look. ;)
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I think it looks more like Rasin than Paine. I think the name ends with an n.
Are you hoping that the surname is Paine? ;)
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We aren't sure what the name is, we have a Noah Pain coming to Australia in 1849 who says his parents are John & Elizabeth and he was born in Upminster Essex.
The reason we are not sure is, that the family story is that the surname is not Pain, Noah was told to use the name Pain.
This is the only family who links up with a Noah the right age, and the names of John & Elizabeth's other children are what Noah Pain called his children here in Australia, example, Caroline, Mary anne, Noah, Thomas Allen.
Bella9
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Compare the first letter of the surname to the P in Parish. They look different. But the name is scribbled and the first letter a bit of a mess, so it really is difficult to be sure. I don't think it ends in an e, but I suppose it could be Pain. :-\
The children's names being used for his own children do add weight to your theory, especially since Noah and Allen are not very common names. Location is also right.
Where did the story of the change of surname come from?
You say that Noah came to Australia in 1849 - have you tried locating that Rasin family in later censuses to see if these people with this surname exist? Have you looked for births/baptisms for the children?
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I'm not sure that Rasin is even a surname ... I can't find anyone with that surname on freeREG, familysearch or Ancestry London PR's (I know yours are Essex, but was just checking ;)). If your surname is Pain/e, you might also need to consdier spelling as Payne.
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I see in 1851 Allen Pain is an apprentice (probably shoemaker) b Upminster. This points to the 1841 surname also being Pain. :) No results for Noah Pain* in 1851 which is good news.
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Yes, I also found Allen as an apprentice in 1851, but could not find any one else from the family. I need to find what happened to them, in order to say that this is our line I have found.
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Yes, I also found Allen as an apprentice in 1851, but could not find any one else from the family. I need to find what happened to them, in order to say that this is our line I have found.
There appears to be no such surname as Rasin. The family who were transcribed as Rasin in 1841 do not appear on the 1851. But a couple of the sons with unusual names have been located. Noah has emigrated, Allen is apprenticed. It's pointing towards this being your Pain family. Some people just cannot be found and although it's wise to be cautious, you shouldn't dismiss this family just because you cannot find out what happened to all of them.
I haven't (with any certainty) located any of the others in 1851. Caroline and MaryAnn may have married. I did find two Carolines b Upminster in the 1851 but was unable to find the matching marriages (someone else may wish to investigate this as I only had a quick look. ;))
It might also be worth checking for deaths of any other family members between 1841 and 1851.
Have you looked for immigration records for any of the other children? Do you know if the son transcribed as Richard is his correct name? The name seems to end in a d, but the writing is so awful it's difficult to decipher.
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Just to throw a spanner in the works, there do seem to be others in the 1841 census with the surname Rasin - and it's written quite clearly so there can be no doubt. For example, this family in Brightlingsea: HO107/338 Book 7/Folio 56/Page 22 :-\
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The Upminster PRs have been digitised and are available online on the Essex Ancestors Website
http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/EssexAncestors.asp
You have to register and buy a subscription though.
Ian C
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The passenger list for the Scotia that arrived 9 Jul 1849 has his native place as Upminster Essex, and his religion as CofE, so there is every chance his baptism would be in the Upminster PRs.
Ian C
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Apologies - you are correct of course Prue. Thanks for pointing that out. :) I am still unable to find that particular "Rasin" family in 1851 (but did not check spelling variations). :-\
Have also since located some Rasins (+var) on familysearch. :-[