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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Suffolk => Topic started by: Pandabeary on Tuesday 20 December 11 23:22 GMT (UK)

Title: WELHAM/HOWELL brickwall
Post by: Pandabeary on Tuesday 20 December 11 23:22 GMT (UK)
I have a brickwall with my ancestor Harry Welham Howell and I wonder if anyone could help me out.

Harry Welham Howell was born on 15th Feb 1868 at 5 Quilter Street, Bethnal Green to Benjamin Johnson Howell, a shoemaker, and Ellen Howell nee Welham

Harry married Minnie Wright on 29th Sept 1894 in Needham Market, Suffolk. His father was listed as Benjamin Howell, deceased, no occupation listed. One of the witnesses was Ellen Welham who was presumably a relative of Harry's but I don't know how.

I can't find a Howell/Welham marriage, or any record I can be sure is Harry until his marriage. I really want to know more about Harry's parents, and if he had any siblings etc but I'm not sure what to do as I can find no record of the family in London.

I'm also confused as in the 1901 census Harry is living at 12 Upper Orwell Street, Ipswich, with his family and Anne Keeble, a grocer, who is listed as his mother. In the 1911 census Anne Keeble is still living with Harry's widow when they moved to the Railway Tavern, Cotton, where she is listed as a 69 year old widow.

I have found a Harry Howell in the 1881 census, who was born in 1868 in London and lived with his grandparents Eliza and George Welham in Battisford, Suffolk. Does this sound like the same Harry? Are Howell and Welham common names in Suffolk? How should I try to work out if this is the right family?

Many thanks for any help people could offer!
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: Just Jane on Wednesday 21 December 11 07:51 GMT (UK)
Working back from Anne Keeble, shown as Harry's mother in 1901, there is a marriage for Ann Howell to James Keeble 1889 Q2 Bosmere, Suffolk.   

On the 1891 census Ann is shown as born 1842 Battisford.

On the 1851 census Ann Welham born 1842 is the daughter of George and Eliza, the grandparents that Harry is living with in 1881.   He is also there is 1871.

So it would appear that Ellen Howell nee Welham is likely to be Ann Welham using the name Ellen when Harry was born but reverting to Ann later on in life.

The marriage certificate to James Keeble should sort out whether she was a widow, although I haven't found a marriage to Benjamin Howell, and who her parents were.

I hope this helps.

Jane

Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: Just Jane on Wednesday 21 December 11 08:06 GMT (UK)
I've now found Ellen Howell on the 1881 census, shown as a widow, working as a servant, in the same household as another servant - Minnie Wright, presumably Harry's wife-to-be.

Jane
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: Suffolk Mawther on Wednesday 21 December 11 09:32 GMT (UK)
Quote
Are Howell and Welham common names in Suffolk?

There are 19 researchers looking for Welham folk and 7 looking for Howell on the Suffolk Surnames List.

So it looks as though Welham was not an uncommon name in the county  ::)

Pat ...

Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: suffolk*sue on Wednesday 21 December 11 14:49 GMT (UK)
A Ben Jonson Howell, aged 23yrs, bootmaker married a Lydia Sarah Wright aged 22yrs, at St. Michael and All Angels, Paddington on 31st August, 1868. fathers were William Howell, painter and John Wright, carpenter.


1871 census has Bens occupation as a letter carrier.
 RG10; Piece: 1324; Folio: 95; Page: 13 = Harrow


1881 has Bens occupation as shoemaker and letter carrier.
His and Lydias first child was born in Dedham Essex, same as Lydia, so if he is THE reputed father, maybe he disappeared from Middlesex for a year or two.
 
1891   RG12; Piece: 1039; Folio 5; Page 4
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: suffolk*sue on Wednesday 21 December 11 15:03 GMT (UK)
Baptism

St. Mary, Harrow

Ben Jonson Howell
6th July, 1845
son of William=painter
and Mary

1851    HO107; Piece: 1700; Folio: 8; Page: 9 = Harrow
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: suffolk*sue on Wednesday 21 December 11 15:34 GMT (UK)
Can't seem to find a marriage for William and Mary, census say both born in Harrow Middlesex.


Baptism

St. Mary, Harrow
William Howell
son of William and Sarah
2nd December, 1810.
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: suffolk*sue on Wednesday 21 December 11 15:46 GMT (UK)
Death

 Ben Johnson Howell
Est. Birth Year: abt 1845
1891, Dec qtr.
Age at Death: 46
Hendon
Vol 3a
Page: 89 
Title: Re: Welham / Howell brickwall
Post by: suffolk*sue on Wednesday 21 December 11 15:58 GMT (UK)
William Howell born c1779 father of William born c1811 is till alive in 1851, he was born in Herefordshire, so we are now getting back to Wales.

 HO107; Piece: 1700; Folio: 524; Page: 5
Title: Re: WELHAM/HOWELL brickwall
Post by: Pandabeary on Monday 26 December 11 22:12 GMT (UK)
Thanks everyone so much for your help, it's really opened up my search and solved the mystery of Harry's 'other' mother! I will now check out the James Keeble / Ann Howell marriage certificate and as a James Keeble died in Bosmere district in 1893 that looks likely and explains why Ann was a widow in 1901. He was aged 75 then though so would have been an awful lot older than her!

I had found this Ben Johnson Howell before but discounted him as he married someone other than Ellen / Ann Welham, even though his occupation fits Harry's birth certificate and year of death fits with Harry's father being dead when he married, and it's a pretty unusual name.

Given that Ben was marrying Lydia Wright only 6 months after Harry's birth, and we cant find a Welham / Howell marriage, should I assume that Ben Howell and Ann Welham were never actually married and therefore Harry was illegitimate? Could a woman say she was Ellen Howell nee Welham without having to prove it?
Thanks again,
Charlotte
Title: Re: WELHAM/HOWELL brickwall
Post by: Pandabeary on Friday 13 January 12 23:33 GMT (UK)
Marriage certificate arrived. Ann Howell age 50 married James Keeble age 70, so that fits with the death of James Keeble I found. It doesn't fit with Ann Howell being born in Battisford in 1842 though, is it likely the registrar rounded up her age? She is recorded as a widow but I still can't find any marriage between her and Benjamin Howell - perhaps they never were and she simply took his name? She lists her father as George Welham, a deceased farm labourer, so that fits with her being the daughter of George and Eliza Welham even if the age is slightly out. I have no idea why she was recorded as Ellen on 1868 certificate and 1881 census but given the mention of the surnames Howell and Welham on the same certificate and the later census record she must be Harry's mother and he was indeed with his grandparents in Suffolk in 1871 and 1881 censuses. Thanks for all the tips, I'm now starting on the next generation of Welhams, and still mulling over the strange Benjamin Howell angle.
Title: Re: WELHAM/HOWELL brickwall
Post by: Dawn Smith on Friday 21 August 20 19:02 BST (UK)
My husbands family on his mothers side are Welhams in Suffolk.  They had a farm just yards away from the The Railway Tavern pub in Cotton on the oppersite side of the road.  My mother in law had loads of cousins on the Welham side so it is quite possible that there is a link given the locations being so close and Welham does seem to be a Suffolk name