RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: bella9 on Saturday 12 November 11 23:01 GMT (UK)
-
Any other information anyone might know about Thomas Fox & Mary Anne Ware. They married in Springsure in Qld in 1867. Thomas was born in Cork Ireland Abt 1844 (parents were Thomas Fox & Mary McCarthy) Mary Anne Ware was born 1852 Victoria, Aust (parents William Ware & Mary Evans). Thomas and Mary Ann Fox had 4 children that we know of all born in Qld. They are Mary Anne, William B1869, Agnes b1871, Lillian B1873 D 1876. Thomas & Mary Anne Fox were witnesses in the Springsure Murder case of 1870. Thomas Fox, (bootmaker) also became insolvent in 1885.
We have not been able to find out any other information on what happened to them or any of their children.
bella9
-
Hi Bella9, A big welcome to Rootschat ;D
There is a death recorded to a Mary Fox at Mudgee in 1945 parents William and Mary.
18630/1945 FOX MARY Father WILLIAM Mother MARY at MUDGEE.
Neil
-
Not so sure about that one, she would be 93.
-
The births for WILLIAM WARE and MARY (nee EVANS) stopped in Victoria in 1863 and recommenced in QLD in 1865 with the birth of Martha in Brisbane.
Marriage
WARE William
To EVANS Mary
Year 1849
Reg Number 29085
Denomination Church of England
Parish St Peters, Melbourne
Fiche 420
At least one sibling remained in QLD
Death
In 1914 REG C681 Emily Hastings. Father William Ware. Mother Mary Evans.
Observation... The birth of your Mary Ann does not show on the Vic index.
Born 1852 and married 1867 makes a 15 year old bride.
Sue
-
We have all the information on William Ware & Mary Evans, except for their deaths, no one can find them.
We have all their children and every sibling remained in QLD except one that was left behind in Victoria.
Yes, Mary Anne Ware was a 15 year old bride she was born 22/1/1853 (Bapt entry).
We are unable to find what happened to Mary Anne Ware & Thomas Fox
Thanks
-
Hi there
Welcome to RChat from me too
May I ask if you have looked at m.c. for each of their children to look for any mention of either of them as deceased at that time ... if any after 1885 would have been for their under 21 aged children ... if Mary Anne gave the consent then perhaps search for Thomas' dc before that mc
Cheers JM
-
hi bella9,
I see in the Cairns Post that a Thomas Fox was arrested in Townsville for drunkeness in January 1885, became insolvent soon after then arrested living on his in a tent at Townsville, do you think it could be possible that Mary Anne Fox may have left Thomas around the time of the insovency and re-married later. I see a couple of marriages for a Mary Anne Fox in 1903 & 1909 but this is probably a bit late.
Regards
Gerry
-
I think you may need to be looking for WILLIAM and MARY WARE at seperate locations from 1865 onwards, after Matha's birth.
Or perhaps you know of a reconcilliation.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/1276191?searchTerm="mary ware" &searchLimits=l-title=The+Brisbane+Courier...%7Ctitleid%3A16
Sue
-
There are no marriage certificates for any of the children, that we can find.
And yes, I feel that Mary Ann either died or took off sometime before Thomas Fox became insolvent, as I have read his insolvency file and there is no mention of a wife or children. She has possibly lived with someone else, we don't know.
William & Mary Ware - yes I think they have separated as well, as I found a newspaper article where she is arrested for taking someone's money who was living with her. There were another two children after Martha.
-
Hi there,
I think that if you have the QLD bcs for the children of Emily Ware and John Hastings, you may find the details of their own marriage that they provided to the registrar when those births were being registered.
John Edward in 1882 #C1189
Thomas William in 1884 #C1608
Charles Frederick in 1888 #C2331
Florence Emily in 1893 #C2331
I think this would be the marriage of Emily WARE and John HASTINGS registered in Qld in 1879 #B6406 (Brisbane).
Cheers, JM
-
I am not after the details of Emily Ware and John Hastings, we have all this information, someone else put this in.
I am only interested in Thomas Fox & Mary Ann Ware at this point.
-
I understood that, but from the mc for HASTINGS = WARE, as Emily was married with the surname WARE, rather than FOX, may I please ask some questions to help me to help you.
From the 1879 mc for Emily
;) what names for her father, and his occupation please
:) what names for her mother, and was there any notation re "dec"
:) were any of Emily's family recorded as witnesses
;) how old was Emily, did she need consent to marry, if so who is recorded as providing that consent.
These questions can help to find if Emily's Mum was living at the time of Emily's marriage, and also give you some upper limit to the year that Emily's parents seem to have gone their separate ways. Perhaps then helping to find a possible re-marriage for Emily's Mum.
Cheers, JM
-
Mary Ann Ware is the daughter of William Ware & Mary Evans.
Mary Ann Ware married Thomas Fox as my original posting said.
We have put together three books on the Ware Family and have every birth, marriage and death certificate for all children. The only information we are missing is for Mary Ann Ware & Thomas Fox and the deaths of Mary Ann's parents (William Ware & Mary Ann Evans).
Mary Ann Ware who married Thomas Fox is the sister of Emily Hastings. There is no extra information on any child's marriage certificate that indicates what happened to William & Mary Ann Ware.
We are looking for Mary Ann Fox (nee Ware) and Thomas Fox information and both Mary's parents death.
-
I apologise, I had mis-understood.
Cheers, JM
-
I am sure, bella, that you and colleagues have been thorough in your searches.
I can only mention that New Zealand has men of the name (which is not uncommon ;D) on their indexes.
I have had in my own family, men embarrassed by insolvency or marital difficulties, who headed there and whose later life details were not discovered until recently.
NZ indexes give very little of useful help and their "print-outs" are required for further details.
Sue
-
Mary Ann Ware is the daughter of William Ware & Mary Evans.
Mary Ann Ware married Thomas Fox as my original posting said.
We have put together three books on the Ware Family and have every birth, marriage and death certificate for all children. The only information we are missing is for Mary Ann Ware & Thomas Fox and the deaths of Mary Ann's parents (William Ware & Mary Ann Evans).
Mary Ann Ware who married Thomas Fox is the sister of Emily Hastings. There is no extra information on any child's marriage certificate that indicates what happened to William & Mary Ann Ware.
We are looking for Mary Ann Fox (nee Ware) and Thomas Fox information and both Mary's parents death.
From a submitted tree on a commercial website, and without that tree providing a source for this piece of information, Mary Ann EVANS, wife of William WARE died in Queensland 14 Feb 1889. Emily WARE, spouse of John Hastings is on that tree as the daughter of Mary Ann and William Ware.
I am aware that both the NSW and Qld BDM online indexes have some flaws.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,565872.0.html
I agree with Sue, I too have family moving back and forth to NZ particularly in the decades pre Federation, when there was a lot of debate for the Federation to include NZ.
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast I think of this link to the on-going NZ project digitising their newspapers as being as valuable a resource as Trove.
Cheers, JM
-
I don't believe the commercial tree information is correct if there is no source information.
I am well aware of the problems with the QLD BDM's as it was me who alerted them to missing entries. It was earlier this year and to date they have not fixed the problem as I keep checking the ones that I found and they are still not listed on the website.
I will check things out in NZ but I have my doubts.
-
From a submitted tree on a commercial website, and without that tree providing a source for this piece of information, Mary Ann EVANS, wife of William WARE died in Queensland 14 Feb 1889.
The death that JM has noted above from the online tree is indexed as follows:
EVANS Mary Ann d. 14/02/1889 #C3863
Father: Samuel Root
Mother: Mary Ann Alliston
-
Hi
Mary Ann and Elijah Evans ( from Essex) arrived in Australia Qld 1875 on the Ramsey. I do not think that this is the correct Mary Ann Evans.
Muss
-
I also believe it is unlikely to be the correct woman.
MARY (nee EVANS) was married in Victoria to WILL. WARE and began her birthing schedule there before the move to QLD as is described above.
Sue
-
I also don't believe it is the correct woman .... Trove gives the details ... 16 Feb ...
But what a good example of co-operative efforts of RChatters.
Cheers JM
-
And a perfect example of fictitious tree on the internet ;D
Sue
-
This Thomas Fox, Mary Ann Fox nee Ware, William Ware and Mary Ann Ware nee Evans, COULD be anyone..
As most of them seem to be escaping from the Law for one reason or another they are hardly liable to leave A WONDERFUL PAPER TRAIL.
It was not unusual to take an assumed name, most criminals at one stage or another have done so.
It would follow if they had assumed another name their children may have done similar. ;)
-
Hi,
Mary Ann Ware who married Thomas Fox is the sister of Emily Hastings. There is no extra information on any child's marriage certificate that indicates what happened to William & Mary Ann Ware.
We are looking for Mary Ann Fox (nee Ware) and Thomas Fox information and both Mary's parents death.
Some questions re Mary Ann Fox' and Emily Hastings' parents ...
From the marriage certificate for Emily, 12 March 1879, re her parents ....
:) were either of her parents noted as deceased?
:) were any of the witnesses related to Emily?
Cheers, JM
-
Both answers are no and no.
-
Thankyou for those answers,
Q1 ;) So have you presumed that William and Mary Ann Ware were alive at the time of Emily Ware's 1879 marriage?
Q2 :) Was Mary Ann's nee name recorded on that 1879 mc for Emily?
Q3 ;) Were there any marriages for any of the children of William and Mary Ann Ware that took place later than Emily's marriage?,
Q4 ;) and if so, how were the parents noted on those particular mcs please?
Q5 & Q6 :) was Mary Ann's nee name noted, and recorded correctly to match your research to date?
Q7 & Q8 & Q9 :) Was Mary Ann Ware noted as Ware, or was Ware noted as a former name, and what surname/s?
Q10 :) was "dec" or "deceased" noted for William and/or Mary Ann (Ware) on any of their children's mcs, if so, year/s please?
Cheers, JM
-
The answers to most of these is no
We don't assume anything - we wait till we have proof
The only names recorded are William Ware and Mary Ann Evans (as stated earlier) on each certificate (there is one exception and that is the child that was left behind in Victoria, he may not have known his mothers name, (we don't know who raised him) by the time he dies he has his parents correct on his death certificate. He had contact with them, so therefore knew the correct information.
There is no indication on any certificate that the parents are deceased
We have followed every possible lead that we have been able too.
-
Thank you,
I am pleased to read that you have followed every possible lead that you have been able to.
Have you checked what were the ecclesiastical and the civil laws/practices/regulations at the times of their children's marriages in the colonies in which they married, specifically for the recording of information on mcs regarding "deceased" for parents of the bride and groom ?
Cheers, JM