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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Denbighshire => Topic started by: Lolly Willowes on Monday 24 October 11 10:02 BST (UK)
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I'd really appreciate an expert looking at this and telling me if I'm making wrong connections. I'm looking for my gggfather in Denbighshire. The details from different census returns vary & place names in particular shift around.
He is Jacob Davies b Rhos Ruabon abt 1831 (1861 census) - family names match so I'm sure this is him. (He moved around between 53-9 according to the birthplaces of his children - Ireland 53, Staffs 55-9, then back to Rhos in 1859)
Can't find him in 1841.
In 1851 I think he's the JD brickmaker b Ruabon abt 1828 married to Mary living at Near River, Morton Above.
In 1871 the only likely JD in the area is at Plas yn Clawdd, Gardden, Ruabon, age 41 (b abt 1830) with 3 younger children, no wife. But now he is a 'farmer' b Acrefair Denbighshire. Is this a likely job change/location?
In 1881 it's possible he's the JD who is a widower & a brick manufacturer. Says he was b RHOSAMEDRE Flint abt 1831. He is now living in Kearsley, Bolton with son John age 25 brickburner b Rhosllanercrugog (a ditto so a possible mistake? other census returns say Staffs) abt 1856. Another son did move to the lancashire coalfields via Bolton, so there is a link.
I can't find him in 1891, nor can I find a death record.
Can anyone advise whether I am getting this right? Thanks.
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Hi Lolly :)
I have a baptism for a Jacob Davies in the Ruabon parish records:
2 Augist 1829 Jacob s/o John Davies (brickmaker) and Mary. Abode - Acrefair.
This would fit with your 1851, I'm not too sure about the 1871 and 1881 ones. The 1841 census for the area is missing.
Morton Above was Rhosllanerchrugog, a way from Acrefair.
See map here ~
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0fx0/
I'll see if I can find anything more.
gnu
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Hi again
Have you found a marriage for him to Mary? I've checked through the North Wales BMD and the GRO index and don't see a likely one so far :-\
gnu
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Hi.
Thanks, that's helpful. I have no marriage record (know Mary's name from son Jacob's birth cert). And I didn't have a birth record for the elder Jacob - it's very possible he's the one you have found. (Can I access that record on line?)
Your help is much appreciated.
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Hi
What was Mary's maiden name on the birth certificate? I might be able to locate her if I knew her surname.
The Ruabon records aren't online - film of the original records can be viewed at local archives and at the National Library at Aberystwyth and booklets of transcribed records are available from Clwyd FHS:
http://www.clwydfhs.org.uk/registers/index.html
gnu
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She was Mary Wright - son JACOB b 10 DECEMBER 1859 RHOS RUABON.
Thanks for the info re local history records.
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Hi again
In 1861 they are in Rhos (Morton Above):
RG09/4283/14/48
Jacob Davies, 30, Brick Manufacturer employing 6 men and 9 boys, b. Rhos
Mary, 33, b. -do-
Louisa, 8, b. Ireland
Mary Ann, 6, b. Staffs
John, 4, b. -do-
Elizabeth, ,3 b. -do
Jacob, 1, b. Denbs
Isabella, sister, unm 23, b. Denbs
I think you have this from what you say but it's worth listing for others to see. It seems the same family as the 1871 where he's a farmer.
Will have a look for Isabella.
gnu
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The 1871 at RG10/5652/58/4 and the 1881 at RG11/3816/109/2, where Jacob is with his son, John in Bolton, b. Rhosymedre that you've found, seem to be the same family as the 1861 one. I wonder why he decided to be a farmer in 1871 :-\ Also, he's down as married in 1871 but I don't see Mary at the moment.
gnu
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Yes, I had the 1861 and that is really the basis for thinking the others are right - even though there are 1 or 2 small discrepancies. It's odd that Mary isn't on the 1871... I'm glad you agree that 71 & 81 seem like matches. The brick manufacturing was the clincher for me.
Do appreciate your thoughts.
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There is a wonderfully titled single unconnected record in familysearch.org for
Isabelle Davies-May 1836 Rosemedre,South,Wales,Yorkshire,England
Obviously the suspicion is that this is Rhosymedre
This purports to show she died in April 1915.As there is a death for such a name under Yorkshire,aged 61 this record looks like a mix of two different people(see below)
Irrespective of this there is a marriage of Isabella Davies to Thomas Metcalf in Wrexham 1861.
I can't find them in 1871 but they are in Gresford in 1881,1891,1901,1911(in the latter Isabella is a widow with married daughter(Hamer)etc
1881 5511 90 27
1891 4611 168 26
1901 5215 110 19
1911 Gresford(too long to type!)
Isabella Metcalf died aged 91 in 1927(Wrexham area)
Roger
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In Ancestry.com there is a family tree under the name Newton that has
Louisa Davies b.1851 Ireland
Parents Jacob Davies and Mary
Spouse David Phillips
Died Willington,Co. Durham
There is an 1871 marriage,Wrexham district,that matches this and census data:-
1881 3781 107 47 Orrell,Lancs
1891 4074 21 44 Co. Durham
The death is probably the 1892 record for Co. Durham rather than the 1894.
Roger
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Hi Roger
I think many of the Ancestry trees are suspect and all the dates and sources have to be checked out.
I recommend going to original (or very reliable) sources before committing them to a tree. Otherwise, it's speculative only.
gnu
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Will have a look at sources and see how how much further I can go now you've set me off.
Thanks to both of you.
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Hi gnu
I agree entirely with your comments-I was only pointing out the existence of the record as a lead(I have no access).At least in this case the census data,presumably reliable,appears to corroborate the basic premise of the record title/summary.
Roger
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A few more(and final) references for your consideration:
1871 5651 113 17
This may be Isabella as Medcalf
1871 5653 29 54
This looks like the "missing" parts of Jacob's family,with a comment on the original re an administrative mix up.There are questions as usual re dates
(Mary appears not to have aged,but is wife of a bricklayer,Louisa is born in Staffordshire and there is an Albert who cross links with Jacob's record in 1881.
In the Blackwell Index(non conformist)there are two nearly identical records
Rhosllanerchgrugog Calvinist
1.Mary Wright born 02/071830 Father Joseph Wright(Blacksmith) Afongoch
Mary(mmn Jones)
2.Mary Wright born 12/07/1830 Father Joseph Wright(Blacksmith) Ruabon
Mary(mpn Jones)
Both records have baptism 04/10/1830
Roger
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The 1871 find looks very interesting, Roger, and makes me wonder what was going on ::), We have Jacob, described as a farmer, living in Gardden ( Penycae - ish) and Mary, described as a Brickmaker's wife, livinging in Pentrefelin, Rhos.
Children with Mary - Louisa, 15 (b.c. 1856); Albert, 5 (b.c. 1866)
Children with Jacob - John, 15 (b.c. 1856); Elizabeth, 13 (b.c. 1858); Jacob, 9 (b.c. 1862).
Compare this with the children on the 1861, that I listed above:
Louisa, 8, b. Ireland
Mary Ann, 6, b. Staffs
John, 4, b. -do-
Elizabeth, ,3 b. -do
Jacob, 1, b. Denbs
Map link to show the relationship of Gardden to Rhos:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0g0e/
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More to think about re the Farmer/Brickmaker occupation and the marriage and ages of Louisa and Elizabeth:
Rhosymedre Parish Registers
Marriages
27 Sept 1871 Louisa Davies (sp. 19) of Rhos - father Jacob Davies (farmer) AND Godfrey Pemberton, policeman (ba. 27) of Liverpool (* If Louisa was the same one as living with Mary earlier in the year, she's aged 4 years - probably 18 and mistranscribed by the enumerator[/i]!) *Added - David Phillips, farmer, aged 21
3rd July 1876 Elizabeth Davies (sp 19) of Flint - father Jacob Davies (brickmaker) AND John Jones of Flint.
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Not sure about the Mary baptisms as I've also found possibles in the Ruabon parish records. I think mary Wright was more common that Jacob Davies.
In relation to the John and Mary Davies , probably parents of Jacob - I've checked for marriages in Ruabon OPRs 1813-1839 but nothing showing. They could have married in a neighbouring parish. Nothing for them on the 1851 so they must have died.
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Have you located a birth reg for Albert (b.c 1866?)
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gnu
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I had stopped looking other than the reference below because I got the impression from "Lolly's" last response that there was a real desire to carry on by herself(?) from the info given to date.I only provided what I did as I thought the Blackwell Index ref might provide a completely new angle and the Louisa/Ireland/Staffs might prevent unnecessary searching
Staffordshire BMD
Louisa Davies 1852 Tunstall TUN/018/046 Mothers Maiden Name:Wright
I will wait for"Lolly" to respond before I do anything further
Roger
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Sorry, Roger, I'm puzzled by your last reply. You seem to still be looking but yet you say that you're not. Have you changed your mind since this morning :-\
I gather from Lolly's initial request and earlier replies that she was keen to work out the 1851-1881 census listings. This I worked through with her in the early postings and also found a possible set of parents for Jacob. . I'm still trying to work out what happened to Mary and Jacob's relationship, which was one of the problems. And also Jacob's change of occupations. Your 1871 find makes it more puzzling.
gnu
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Thanks for all this new and fascinating information - lots of puzzles. I haven't had time to follow it up yet, but plan to do so in next few days.
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Lots to think about!
So in 1871 Jacob wd be living at Plas yn Clawdd, Gardden, a farmer. With John 15, Elizabeth 13 & Jacob 9 while wife Mary is a few miles away in Pentrefelin, Morton Above with Louisa 15. I wonder why. (I have looked at 1833-43 map of area but can’t find Plas yn Clawdd or Pentrefelin. However, there’s a Pentre y clawdd just east of Gardden Lodge. Can't find them on the current OS map which you sent me the link to. Are you familiar with either of these places?)
1871 mistake re Mary's age: 10 years out. Could this be an enumerator's mistake? The other puzzle is Louisa's birthplace : Ireland or Staffs? Maybe the mistake is in fact in 1861 census & she was born in Staffs like several other of the children. I guess I need to look at census returns for her as married woman to see which birthplace she gives. But then are the marriage records going to be straightforward? I'll pursue this later. There's a similar 'mistake' made in relation to John in 1881 who is recorded as born Rhosllanercrugog but in 1861 born Staffordshire. Were mistakes / confusions like this fairly common?
re Blackwell Index/Mary Wright: what is the Blackwell Index? Can I access this? many of my family were Methodists & it sounds a plausible source for Mary (though gnu has pointed out this is a common name). Would it have marriage & christenings too for nonconformists? I haven’t yet got a record for Jacob & Mary who were married by the time of 1851 census. [Their son Jacob was married at Cannock Register office 1883 so was Methodist by then.]
I'll try following up Albert & Louisa.
Thanks again for all your help.
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Hi Lolly
The Blackwell Index is the Non-conformist Index of (mainly) baptisms for Denbighshire to 1837. It doesn't cover all the chapels but is the best source. It can be purchased from Clwyd FHS:
http://www.clwydfhs.org.uk/misc_pubs.html
and scroll down.
The marriage of Jacob and Mary is a puzzle. It would have had to be around 1851 but they don't appear on the NW BMD or the GRO index. The most likely RDs would be Corwen or Wrexham but, so far I've not found them.
Will get back to you if I find anything.
gnu
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Locations ~
From the 1871 census, Plas yn Clawdd is between Fir Tree Cottage and Ruabon Colliery and Gardden Hall. So it might well be in this area:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0g1e/
Pentrefelin was between Hall Street and School Street. This is the approx location, as far as i can work out:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0g1f/
(Felin is the mutated form of melin = mill, so look for a mill on old maps - see http://www.old-maps.co.uk/index.html)
So, although in the same general vicinity, they were about 1-2 miles apart.
William Russell Jones might know more exactly as he has ancestors from Rhos whereas mine were closer to the Rhosymedre end of Ruabon parish. I did spend the first 18 years of my life in the area and continued visiting regularly until a few years ago but I hardly ever went to Rhosllanerchrugog ::)
gnu
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Hi again Lolly
I've found Plas yn Clawdd on the old maps site (link in previous posting).
If you go to the site and enter Rhosllanerchrugog. Then, when the modern map shows manoevre to the area of Gardden Hall and click, pin should show where you've centred the map. Now select the 1879 map from the selection on the top right and choose enhanced zoom.
Plas yn Clawdd is to the East of Fir Tree Cottage (opposite it) and North of Gardden Hall.
gnu
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GODFREY PEMBERTON. This may be him.
THE SINGULAR DEATH OF A LIVERPOOL POLICEMAN .
Liverpool Mercury Monday, February 24, 1873
Police Officer Godfrey Pemberton went on duty from Rosehill police station with deceased man.
The Lancaster Gazette May 27, 1882
On the 24th inst . Death of Godfrey Pemberton, late of West Derby, policeman aged 35 years.
Deaths Jun 1882
PEMBERTON Godfrey 35 Lancaster 8e 486
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:D
I'd forgotten about the Pembertons - got deep into old maps.
So Louisa may possibly have married again then - any sign of them on the 1881?
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In 1871, Godfrey Pemberton was in Hatton Gardens Police Section House in Liverpool RG10/3771/34/5 Aged 26, born Ruabon.
Not found either on the 1881 so far :-\
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A note of caution here centred around the same confusion re Ireland/Staffs:-
The other party in the 1871 "pairings" for the Rhosymedre marriage is David Phillips and I would say that Louisa Davies(b.Ireland) might marry him.. and he is a brickmaker.... and they move to Lancashire....
1881 3781 107 47
Roger
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And in 1891 they are in Durham, David b Ponkey / Louisa b Ireland .
RG12; Piece: 4074; Folio 21; Page 44
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While I remember-there is also the issue of Albert being described in 1881 as "brother in law" to John when"brother" might have been expected.Gnu says this could well mean "step brother" as currently understood,implying a second marriage(?).Whatever the case it seems he is deliberately not described as brother.
Roger
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A note of caution here centred around the same confusion re Ireland/Staffs:-
The other party in the 1871 "pairings" for the Rhosymedre marriage is David Phillips and I would say that Louisa Davies(b.Ireland) might marry him.. and he is a brickmaker.... and they move to Lancashire....
1881 3781 107 47
Roger
I took this from the parish records film notes that I've had a while, not from the GRO index. Had a look at the other two. Godfrey Pemberton married a Mary Williams. David Phillips down as a farmer, aged 21.
I think that Albert's birth cert ought to be obtained to find out what the relationship was.
gnu
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I think David is from Pant Farm Ruabon as in
1871: 5653 84 11
Roger
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Just been looking at all the other censuses, and it would appear that Louisa was born Ireland on all except the 1871.
I think the Irish registrations started late 1850s - just checked - 1864 :(
gnu
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How about this going in the mix!?
Marriage 3/9/1862 St Peter Liverpool
Jacob Davies father John Davies(as in gnu's quoted 1829 baptism)
Mary Wright father Edward Wright(as in IGI 1828 Ruabon record)
Could explain the lack of a previous marriage or a second marriage for someone or one amazing coincidence or....
Roger
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Looks interesting, Roger - it would be worth Lolly getting the cert just to check on the occupations and their ages. Why would they have married so late on though :-\
I'll have a look at Mary Wright against the ones I found the other day.
Added - the most likely baptism of a Mary Wright with a father Edward, is this one:
Ruabon
20 January 1828 Mary d/o Edward Wright (butcher) and Elizabeth of Cefn Mawr
(the IGI one is a no-no submitted entry, Roger, so this confirms)
gnu
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Found an advert in the Wrexham and Denbighshire Advertiser, Sat March 16 1861
Plas Issa Building Bricks
Jacob Davies respectfully annouces his being Agent for the sale of these Bricks in Rhos and it's neighbourhood.
Rhos March 14 1861
This seems to be a regular advert for a while!
BUT also this in the same paper, Saturday 8 February 1868
Public Notice
I hereby give notice that I, Jacob Davies, Plas yn Clawd, near Ruabon, will not be answerable for any debt or debts contracted by my wife, Mary Davies, after this date.
Signed, Jacob Davies
Feb 7th 1868
Explains the 1871 - they obviously split up
He also appears as an auctioneer in 1870, selling land near Ponkey !
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Interesting - same paper, Sat 22 May 1875
Marriage - 13 May 1875 at St Mary's Flint. Samuel, the fourth son of Mr William Edwards of Ysceifiog to Mary Anne, the second daughter of Mr Jacob Davies, Brick and Tile Works, Flint
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Same paper -
Saturday 24 Nov 1877
Death
Nov 12, aged 50, after a short illness of half an hour, Mary, the beloved wife of Mr Jacob Davies, brick manufacturer of Flint, formerly of Plas yn Clawdd farm near Ruabon
gnu
and various other bits and pieces
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Just a final highly speculative thought for today:-
The 1851 census HO107 2503 287 15
which presumably has the right Jacob Davies features a mysterious(?) "lodger" Job Edwards 1 month,who appears unrelated to the other two occupants(if he is Mary Parry's child somehow would they put them in this order?)I cannot seen a Job birth only(boy) Edwards.With Job being a "Jacoby" kind of name what if his first "partner" is Mary Edwards masquerading as Davies with their child(registered or not at this stage?),though why wouldn't they call him Job Davies for the enumerator?
Perhaps Edwards is a family connection somewhere and if he is unrelated to the head of the household he could only be a visitor or lodger.
Roger
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Thanks everyone for the new and fascinating lines of enquiry. Am about to start following them up.
Lolly
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Looking through the Wrexham Advertiser has proved very useful. John Davies married Elizabeth Davies - hence Albert in 1881 living with John in Kearsley could indeed be a brother in law. I've also found the marriage of Mary Anne in 1875 (who was missing from both family addresses in 1871). There are other interesting bits of social history involving Jacob, so he's really come alive for me. I've sent for various certificates to try to clear up remaining puzzles.
Just 1 query: are you saying that Mary definitely ISN'T the one first discussed (ie the Blackwell index one posted by despair 26 October)? and that she's more likely daughter of Edward Wright butcher (gnu posted 27 Oct)? - I wasn't clear what you were saying about the IGI.
Thanks again for opening this up for me.
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Hi Lolly
Glad you managed to get all the refs to Jacob in the Wrexham Advertizer - my typing fingers got a bit sore with all the entries ;D
My ref to Mary Wright, daughter of Edward, was that the IGI entry was a submitted entry so I confirmed it via the parish records. Her father on those was Edward Wright, Butcher. I've not trace Edward and Elizabeth but if you'd like, I'll check up on them later :)
The IGI submitted entries could be accurate or they might well be a product of someone's imagination as they are just what they say - they could be submitted by anyone - and need to be verified by other sources. The IGI entries that are trustworthy are the 'extracted' series which have a letter in theire Batch number ref - usually an M, P or C but can be other letters.
I recall a long correspondence ( a few years ago) with someone about the Ruabon Wrights who might have been linked to some of my ancestors - I don't think they were though!
gnu
Added - a couple of links to the IGI and submitted records
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,326224.0.html
https://help.familysearch.org/kb/UserGuide/en/fsbeta/search/c_search_international_genealogical_index.html
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Yes, please, if you've time - would be good to have info re Edward & Elizabeth. Thanks
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Edward (butcher) and Elizabeth Wright had the following children baptised at Ruabon:
27 July 1823 William. Abode - Newbridge
17 Nov 1824 John. Abode - Newbridge
6 July 1826 Joseph. Abode - Cefnmawr
20 Jan 1828 Mary . Abode Cefnmawr
Newbridge and Cefnmawr were part of the newly formed (1844) parish of Rhosymedre.
I'm wondering if the 'born Rhos' for Mary on one or two of the censuses might mean Rhosymedre rather than Rhosllanerchrugog. Although the latter is the one that is usuallly referrred to locally as Rhos. I've not heard of Rhosymedre called just Rhos.
I don't, at the moment, see a marriage for Edward and Elizabeth in Ruabon. Maybe neither of them were of Ruabon but moved in later.
There's a family in Cefnmawr in 1851 ( HO107/2503/176/49 )which is tempting but I'm not convinced it's them - Edward is a warp man, which doesn't fit with being a butcher earlier in life and thes don't quite fit. None of the children appear in the Anglican Church records of either Ruabon or Rhosymedre.
Throwing this in the pot for consideration -
Baptism, Ruabon 12 Sept 1830 - ElizabethDavies/Wright, illegitimate daughter of Edward Wright and Sarah Davies, both servants. Edward of Plasbenion and Sarah of Pontadam.
I'm hoping to get sight of the Rhosllanerchrugog records later this week.
gnu
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Certificates: Albert born 1865 Ponkey parents Jacob + Mary formerly Wright. So that's OK. But the Liverpool marriage at St Peter's is dubious, probably wrong. Although the fathers' names match, both are described as labourers and Jacob Davies is a mariner. Both he and Mary are living in Vauxhall Road, which is near the docks. Jacob signed with his mark, which seems unlikely given his business and other activities. The witnesses don't have family names. So we're back to the mystery of their marriage, I think.
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From Denbighshire baptisms, Davies:
Louisa 4 Aug 1822 Jacob and Mary Labourer Chirk
William Walter 6 Jul 1823 Jacob and Mary Brickmaker Acrefair
Obadiah 17 Oct 1824 Jacob and Mary Brickmaker Chirk
Mary Anne 18 Feb 1827 Jacob and Mary Brickmaker Acrefair
Jacob 2 Aug 1829 Jacob and Mary Brickmaker Acrefair
Belafina 7 Feb 1836 Jacob and Mary Brickmaker of Acrefair - I suspect this is the mysterious Isabella
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Thanks for the reply. I've found out quite a bit about Jacob since the correspondence with Gnu & others. Including the fact that he died in Denbigh Lunatic Asylum.
The Denbighshire baptisms you list don't fit, I'm afraid. (My Jacob was b. later, parents John & Mary, his children b 1853 onwards.) The problems of looking for Davieses in Wales!
Thanks again for your interest.
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I'm pretty sure this is the same Jacob - he was my great great grandfather. The others would be his siblings. Obadiah too went on to be a brickmaker. And it seems unlikely there were multiple John and Mary Davies, brick makers, with sons named Jacob born around the same time.
I've (unsurprisingly perhaps) heard the lunatic asylum aspect before - do you have a date for that?
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How interesting! Jacob is my gggfather too. My ggfather was Jacob’s son Jacob. Which line do you come through?
I hadn’t continued looking for father John & was surprised to get your message - especially with the different father’s name... but we may have been at cross-purposes. You gave father’s name Jacob in your list, then mentioned John. My Jacob is definitely son of John, & other things did fit when I looked up the other children’s names that you sent me.
As you’ll have seen from my rootschat correspondence of a couple of years ago, I didn’t get any further with John & Mary Davies. But I’m pleased now to have some siblings as well as Isabella.
I have now found
Louisa 4 Aug 1822 Newbridge Chirk parish father JOHN mother Mary labourer
Obadiah 17 Oct 1824 parents JOHN & Mary Penyclawd, Chirk brickmaker
Mary Anne 18 Feb 1827 father JOHN & Mary Acrefair brickmaker - so it very much looks like these are my Jacob’s missing family.(However, I didn’t find a William Walter or a William or a Walter with John/Jacob & Mary around 1823 & didn’t find Isabella (or Belafina) 1836/8) What was your source for these? (I used findmypast which isn't always reliable.)
I found out about the Lunatic Asylum via Flint Parish burials: 12 August 1897 age 72.
Then death cert. - 7 August at Lunatic Asylum Denbigh “cerebral haemorrhage 2 days exhaustion”. He is described as Brickmaker of Ffynnon groew, Holywell (which is where his son John William was living). He is buried in Northop Road cemetery, Flint.
I’ve seen the asylum records at the County Record Offices in Ruthin & Bristol. He was admitted in 1891, transferred to Bristol Asylum from 92-5 then back to Denbigh.
Do let me know which of Jacob's children you are descended from.
Best wishes & thanks again.
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I was pretty sure these were right.
I'm the grandson of Jacob(jnr)'s son Alfred, via my father Harold (he's still interested in all this at the age of 94).
In the past I've found Findmypast almost impossible to use, but took advantage of a recent 'month for a pound' offer to scan through the Denbighsire BMD parish records.
Jacob snr does appear a bit erratic - as well as the apparent separation from Mary, I found two business partnerships dissolved - Davies and Savage Brick Manufacturers in 1861 and the Pant Brick Tile and Fireclay Co in 1871.
I'm still intrigued by where all these people were in 1851 - given the birth of Louisa in Ireland, it's possible they all headed over there - the timing is right for when they were trying to start a coal mining industry in northern Ireland.
I'm pretty sure Isabella is the baptized Belafina - and intriguingly there is an Isabella Davies, aged 15, in Ruabon in 1851, described as, as far as I can decipher "daughter of wife". But there is no wife, only John Lloyd - and two more Davies children - Benjamin 13 and Jane 9 (also son and daughter of wife). This could well be irrelevant.
If you PM me your e-mail I can send you copies of the other baptism
Thanks (I think this makes us second cousins)
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Yes, Jacob does seem "erratic". The asylum records are quite moving. I've also wondered about Ireland - your suggestion sounds right.
I've sent you a message with my email.
All the best.
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Hi Lolly and sw1132, I hope you are still active on here. I am extremely interested in your Jacob Davies posts, and would like to hear from you as I am more than likely related to you both as my grandmother was a daughter of Albert Edward Davies, who was I believe the youngest son of Jacob and Mary (Wright), and a brother to louisa, mary anne, john, elizabeth and jacob(jnr). I have read the postings, and I want to be sure there is no mix up. I have Jacob as born and died in Denbighshire, death 1897 but I understood he was born 1829. Your info re the asylum death in 1897 suggests he was 72yo which if correct puts his DOB back to 1825?
Would be great to hear from you both but I realise your posts were some time ago!!