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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: Navarino on Sunday 16 October 11 14:51 BST (UK)
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Can anyone tell me where Everstow nr Brig is please???
My ancestor was born about 1799. In April 1829 he arrived in Tasmania under a sentence of Transportation for Life. "Everstow nr Brig" is stated as his native place. He had been married in Manchester, was arrested in Leeds and tried in York. I found a town called Brigg in Lincolnshire but couldn't find Everstow. Any help greatly appreciated. Thank you.
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Hi Navarino
Lincolnshire sounds promising. There is a record in here....
http://romanyconnections.wetpaint.com/page/Census+Information%3ASmith%3A
...of someone born in Everstow, Lincs.
Hibee
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Knowing the funny ways Lincolnshire folk pronounce some place names, Hibaldstow is about 4 crow-flying miles south-south-west of Brigg.
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All ideas greatfully accepted. Thanks to you both.
:)
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It might be easier if we had his name. :)
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Whilst waiting for further details I'll go for Hibaldstow misheard by someone unfamiliar with the accent, and with the aspirate dropped as usual.
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His name was John Rainford.
We've found a number of people with this name born around 1799 in different counties. These include one in 1798 in Hibaldstow, Lincolnshire and another in 1799 in Billinge, Lancashire.
We're in Australia so don't want to jump to conclusions without knowing the the area.
Thanks for your interest. :)
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Subject to confirmation it looks to me as though the most likely location is Hibaldstow. Many village names in Lincolnshire are pronounced very differenbtly to their spelling e.g. Saltfleetby is pronounced Sollerby, Wyberton pronounced Wibberton so your "Everstow" seems likely to have been Hibaldstow to me.
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Whilst waiting for further details I'll go for Hibaldstow misheard by someone unfamiliar with the accent, and with the aspirate dropped as usual.
Hi Redroger,
Yes, we wondered if it could have been Hibaldstow misinterpreted by whoever was writing down John's birhplace. We're not familier with the accent so that didn't help. Please excuse my ignorance but what is an "aspirate"?
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An "aitch" H; should be pronounced as aitch, but often I have noticed in parts of Lincolnshire pronounced as "Haitch" particularly by those who often drop it at the front of words. :)
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Would it not be odd if Hibaldstow were twice misinterpreted as Everstow?
Hibee
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Going by the number of syllables, I would assume it to be Hibaldstow, but just to throw this in- there is Horkstow which is also near Brigg but in the other direction.
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How to pronounce "H" is often a matter for disagreement here in Australia.
All these ideas are a great help. :) :)
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RAINFORD is an unusual name in Lincs - of nearly 23,000 "R" marriages in my index, there are only 13 RAINFORDs, 32 RAINFORTHS and 15 RAINSFORD/RAINSFORTH.
So to find one in Hibaldstow, not the biggest of places, (1796 John RAINFORD/Mary ELLIS) seems quite coincidental. :)
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Would it not be odd if Hibaldstow were twice misinterpreted as Everstow?
Hibee
Perthaps I'm thicker than usual tonight, but I can't see anywhere in the posts where this suggestion has been made. Please enlighten me.
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Would it not be odd if Hibaldstow were twice misinterpreted as Everstow?
Hibee
Perthaps I'm thicker than usual tonight, but I can't see anywhere in the posts where this suggestion has been made. Please enlighten me.
First post, where it's stated as 'native place' of the ancestor.
Second post, where there's reference to it in the link (to the 1911 census).
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Thanks Pam! Think it has to be Hibaldstow largely because of the number of syllables as previously stated. If there were any incidences of the surname in Horkstow it would wreck things though! :)
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A third reference to Everstow(n) in here......If it were me, I'd dismiss the Hibaldstow theory.
Everstown, near Bregy, Lincs..........
http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/w/h/e/Jody-Mahan-KS/GENE1-0004.html
Hibee
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It's tempting to dismiss the Hibaldstow thing ... were it not for several CROWDER marriages there. ;)
... and how many mentions of Everstow on Google (apart from this thread and a bookie's in Norwich)?
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A third reference to Everstow(n) in here......If it were me, I'd dismiss the Hibaldstow theory.
Everstown, near Bregy, Lincs..........
http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/w/h/e/Jody-Mahan-KS/GENE1-0004.html
Hibee
Well, if you'd like to find a place called Bregy in Lincolnshire then I'll think about dismissing Everstow(n) as a very badly mis-pronounced, and therefore misspelt, Hibaldstow. ;D
The thing is, from exactly where has that third piece of information come from?
I have allegedly looked quite carefully in the Gazetteer published by Lincolnshire FHS, and although it doesn't claim to list what my dad used to describe as 'every pub and pigsty' it does list some obscure places, including hamlets, and place names from way-back.
The only place beginning with 'Ev' is Evedon which is near Sleaford.
There are no places beginning 'Hev'.
So the only alternative is that you are talking about somewhere that is not in Lincolnshire. e.g. Everton in Lancashire.
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An appearance by our old friend "the hilliterate haitch" 'ere ;D http://www.archive.org/stream/antiquary24slsniala/antiquary24slsniala_djvu.txt
Search for Heverstow
Some very interesting spellings of more familiar places too :)
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There is always Haverstoe, but that's the name of a Deanery.
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LIN/Deans/index.html
Map of the Deaneries
http://www.lincolnshirefhs.org.uk/Documents/DeaneryMap.pdf
Love some of those spellings, Geoff in that link you've found. ;D ;D ;D
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I found an old text which calls Hibbaldtstow Hibberstow. Pronounced without an 'H', it would be Ibberstow, which could be misheard as Everstow.
"Redbourn and Hibberstow are two villages before, and Brigg, a more noted Town after passing them"
Another text
"Roman remains have been found at Brough opposite to Wintringham where the great Roman Road from Lincoln via Broughton (Ebberstow) descended to cross the Humber on its way to York."
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:) :) :)
I can't thank you all enough.
I'm sitting back here in Sydney amazed at how helpful you all are.
Thank you. :) :) :)
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Hi Pamthomas
I would put "Bregy" down to being a misinterpretation of "Brigg", which it can look remarkably like, in some of these old scripts.
Hibee
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Hi Pamthomas
I would put "Bregy" down to being a misinterpretation of "Brigg", which it can look remarkably like, in some of these old scripts.
Hibee
I would agree.
But by the same token you can't then just say
A third reference to Everstow(n) in here......If it were me, I'd dismiss the Hibaldstow theory.
Everstown, near Bregy, Lincs..........
http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/w/h/e/Jody-Mahan-KS/GENE1-0004.html
because you've just proved that names can be misspelt/misinterpreted/mistranscribed. :)
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There is another similar record.
Harriet Crowder
Birth 10 Oct 1805 in Eberstow near Brigy, Lincolnshire
Death 1 May 1849 in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
I can't find a baptism, although there are several other Crowders in Hibaldstow.
It sounds like a mixture of local accent, dropped H, local pronunciation of the village etc., given in a foreign land.
Also:-
1851 Census Swinderby - Ann Scratchard 1810 Hibalstowe, Nottinghamshire
1881 Census Swinderby - Ann Scatchard 1805 Iberstow, Lincoln
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I think we can rely on the place being Hibaldstow, the variations being caused by standardised spelling being in its infancy in the early 19th century, compounded by the lincolnshire custom? of multiple names for the same place, plus regional accents unfamiliarity and dropped aitches etc. Have i missed anything? ;) The surprise to me is that it is still reasonably intelligible.
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Many thanks to everyone for their information and advice.
Very much appreciated. Thank you :) :) :)