RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: Infobunny on Tuesday 11 October 11 10:47 BST (UK)
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Dear Amazing Rootschatters,
A wonderful newly found cousin has relayed a story that one Myrtle Eva Quelch was raised by Arthur Joseph McKeon and his wife Cecila. The story has it that Cecilia was nee Quelch but my cuzzie says nobody seems to know who Cecilia was. We know who Myrtle's mother was and when Myrtle was born, but nothing else after that for Myrtle herself. It is assumed that these people all lived in Auckland as this is where most of the Quelches in the family were living.
I've found a death registration for an Arthur Joseph McKeon in 1929 but nothing for Cecilia. It's possible that she remarried but the free bmd's don't go that far to help me. There is also no marriage available for Myrtle Eva yet.
Can anyone help to find out what happened to these people and where they have ended up??
Crossing my ears in luck for a good search.
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Hi
there were two M E Q's, so just need to be aware when following marriage etc
which one? assume when you say mother known it is the 1900 birth
1906/3295 Quelch Myrtle Eva parents Martha Elizabeth and Harry Archibald
1900/14825 Quelch Myrtle Eva parents Harriet Ellen and NR
Bye
althea
1919 electoral roll
Arthur McKeon,Kaipara Electorate, Waikiekie, labourer, no other person by that surname registered in that dustrict
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Hi Bunny
In order to tackle this "mystery", we need to have Myrtle Eva's details also. ;)
Birth
1900 - QUELCH - Myrtle Eva
Mother: Harriet Ellen - Father: N/R
Mmm .... I'm seeing an "Arthur McKEON" on Electoral roll listings for Auckland area ... nothing at all for a "Cecilia" (or var.) so far ?
~ Lu
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Hi Bunny
Mmm ... two "Myrtle Eva's". ;)
I had assumed it was the earlier birth (1900), as you say you know the mother's name. ???
~ Lu
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There are no MYRTLE EVA QUELCH marriages (or using soundex)
to 1956
Bye
althea
did her mother marry JENNER
there is none under that surname either
the only Myrtle McKeon marriage is a MYRTLE MAY MCKEON in 1921 and one much later
Bye
althea
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Arthur Joseph McKEON
Burial - Waikumete Cemetery, Auckland
Roman Catholic Div. C / Row 18 / Plot 67
Died 1929
Appears to be buried alone.
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Hello there my wonderful friends,
Lu - Yes sorry I forgot to add in Myrtle's details. And yes she is the one registered in 1900. She was born 30 Dec 1899 to Harriet Quelch with no father recorded. And yes there are two Myrtle Eva's born to the Quelch family to different parents.
Althea - yes I had seen that marriage for Myrtle May....wondering if they changed her middle name to avoid confusion in the family???? And yes Myrtle's birth mother did marry Fred Jenner.
This is such a freakish mystery to have them just disappear like that. Where are they??? Outside of Auckland???
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Unless Arthur married overseas, the marriage must be under a massive variant spelling
Was he even married?
were his parents ?James..I didn't write down details but there was a large family of mckeons in previous indexed roll at ancestry
you can search these indexes free online
so tracking him back, may help prove or dispel whether he brought the child up
Bye
althea
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Hi bouncing Bunny,
If the Waikumete Arthur Joseph is your man,the FD records are held at Auckland Library in the special reading room,there is a cardex system in the research room which gives you the file to ask for,these records are great as they have all the info that was used to register the death,
Cheers Janette
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In 1911 when Myrtle was 11, Arthur was:
Source 1911 Electoral Roll
Electorate Auckland West
Record Number 5076
Surname MCKEON
Given Names Arthur
Place of Residence 22 Brown Street
Occupation labourer
Nature of Qualification
Also at this address were:
James, James Jun,Mary and Mary ann (Married)
Added:
in 1905, they are all there at Brown Street, plus a Henry McKeon
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Hi Bunny
Just adding your previous thread which contains further information on Myrtle Eva.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,507900.10.html
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From the previous thread, it is confirmed by the other contributor, that Myrtle Eva died as Myrtle Eva FILMER (buried at Tuakau ?).
Can't see a marriage to FILMER (up to 1956).
Electoral rolls (index only) have the following listings :
FILMER - Myrtle Eva
1969 - Franklin / 1972 - Franklin / 1978 - Rangiriri (Auck.)
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oops ... hit the "post" button too soon.
Some things to try.
* Myrtle Eva's burial place for others named FILMER.
* Electoral roll listings, to see who is living at same address.
* NZ Marriage Index microfiche (available at libraries) for a marriage of Myrtle Eva, after 1956.
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Mmm... ignore the suggestions in my previous reply.
On re-reading the post by "maggie49" (other thread), it seems that she has the birth, marriage and death certificates for Myrtle Eva FILMER.
:-\
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Hi there my fantastic seekers,
Althea - wow! So Myrtle was really there with Arthur and his family? Do you remember if she was listed as a McKeon or as a Quelch?
Lucy Lu - thanks so much for the linking link thingy (completely clueless in that area I tell you!)
Janette - That's good to know....now I need to find help.
Is anyone able to go to Auckland Library to check the research room data on Arthur Joseph McKeon?
Tiny bunny bounces of possible excitement.
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Hi Bouncing Bunny ;D ;D
I will attempt to do that in the next week for you
Cheers Janette
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Dear Janette,
HUG! HUG HUG HUG HUG HUG HUG!!!!!!!!
You are sooooo cool!!! (trips over ears in delight)
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Hi Bunny, :D
Do you have or would like to have a photo of Myrtle's Gravestone? No problems if you have, just thought I would ask :D
Cheers
KHP
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Althea - wow! So Myrtle was really there with Arthur and his family? Do you remember if she was listed as a McKeon or as a Quelch?
No I don't know if she was with family
my point was your informant said that Myrtle was bought up by Arthur and Cecilia
But going by the electoral rolls he was always living with his ?parents during the years when she was a child
Bye
Althea
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Dear Althea,
The thlot pickens!!! Hm, going to have to work on that one.
Dear KHP,
No I don't have a photo....do you mean you can get one.... ;D
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Dear KHP,
No I don't have a photo....do you mean you can get one.... ;D
Cheers
Bunny 8)
Yes, my grandparents, parents, FIL and family are buried there ..... cemetery isn't far from me. Probably get it for you either by end of week or next :D
Cheers
KHP
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Aw, KHP, you're a real gem you are. :-*
I would really appreciate that. You're just too cool.
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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We are quite found of Bunnies in Auckland :P :P
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Ha ha ha ha!!! I'll have to tiptoe past on my ears!
Oh and by the way apparently Myrtle Eva Quelch was renamed and married as Myrtle May McKeon. So she married William John Lynch who died in 1958 and then Myrtle remarried to Mr Filmer. So she's born Myrtle Eva, marries as Myrtle May and dies as Myrtle Eva.
Unsure if she was every formally adopted.
Cheers and warm fuzzies,
Bunny 8)
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And she is down as Myrtle Eva (May) for the Newspaper clipping that the NZSG Branch hold.
Cheers
KHP
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Gah!!!!! Don't tell me I have to go and get a subscription with NZSG!!!!
KHP, just where do you pull out these gems from? Wait....it might have been hiding in one of my overly large ears. Do you do magic??? :D
Right, now have to figure out how to obtain said thingy from NZSG.
Ears in a knot,
Bunny 8)
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Gah!!!!! Don't tell me I have to go and get a subscription with NZSG!!!!
KHP, just where do you pull out these gems from? Wait....it might have been hiding in one of my overly large ears. Do you do magic??? :D
Right, now have to figure out how to obtain said thingy from NZSG.
Ears in a knot,
Bunny 8)
It was on the burial locator. Where to obtain it from, well I can do it, I am wanting to get some Notices from them, leave it with me, and when they send them out, will let you know. Usually it takes about a couple of weeks depending how much in demand they are.
Cheers
KHP
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Dear, dear KHP,
I pile carrots at your feet in homage to your powers. You may prefer carats but they are in my ears at the moment ( ;D).
My tail just fluffed up in excitement!!! Now how am I supposed to sit down???
You're an ace!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Dear excited Bunny,
You will just have to lie on your stomach then. Will get them in the post today. :D Another carat wouldn't go amiss ;D
Cheers
KHP
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Hi Bunny :D
I have the cemetery photos of Myrtle and Hubby, would you please hoppity hop and PM your addy. ;D
Cheers
KHP :D
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Hi Bunny,
I found the FD's record for Arthur Joseph McKeon,he never married and died at his sisters's house 8 Patteson St Freemans Bay,his sister was Mrs W J Lynch (1921/8722 Myrtle May McKeon to William John Lynch )
His father was James McKeon ,married to Mary Ann O'Hanlon
Arthur is buried with with his brother James who died in 1921
1921/6176 McKeon James 56Y
Cheers Janette
PS if you would like the photos of the FD record PM your email addy please
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Hi Janette
good find and info
so does this make it that Myrtle Eva was actually adopted/bought up by Arthurs parents?
Bye
althea
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Hi Althea,
It does look like the most likely scenario,maybe names have got muddled in the oral history.
Here are James and Mary Ann
The Town Clerk's file 162/59 of 8/1/1960 at Auckland City Council Archives has K. McKeon describe James McKeon who died 9 August 1914 aged 88 years and his wife Mary Ann McKeon who died 4 December 1916 aged 77 years, both buried in the Catholic section. K. McKeon is a grandson. The Catholic register has James McKeon died 9 August 1914 aged 88 years and buried 11 August 1914 of Brown Street, confirmed a Symonds Street Cemetery burial from Little's funeral records at Auckland City Libraries.
The Little's funeral records at Auckland City Libraries have Mary Ann McKeon died 4 December 1916 aged 74 years and buried 6 December 1916 in Symonds Street Cemetery.
The New Zealand Herald of 10th August 1914 has James McKeon died 9 August 1914 aged 88 years, husband of M.A. McKeon, and buried 11 August 1914 in Symonds Street Cemetery.
Cheers Janette
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Back in 1969/1972 Myrtle and her husband Harold would have driven past our farm to get to their place as they lived further down the road. :D
Cheers
KHP
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Dear Bunny Welfare Group,
KHP - bouncing down the line to you sharpish is one addy. You rock!!!!!
Janette - Wahoo! More info! Eat, eat, eat, ea....oh wait, that's important! Spit! You are so awesome!
Thank you SOOOOO much! ;D
And now we have a problem....my cuzzie says there is a Cecilia Quelch mixed up in all of this. I'll have to ask just where the name comes from. I can't find a Cecilia Quelch anywhere!
Fluffy hugs
Bunny 8)
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Photos have been sent.
Enjoy.
Cheers
KHP
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Dear KHP,
The photos are AWESOME!!!! :D. You are just blimmin' marvellous!!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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You are welcome. Just waiting for the death notices now.
Cheers
KHP
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Dear Janette,
Oh my gosh! So we were all muddled up!! I wondered why the replies weren't making any sense. Duh! ::) Trust me to get my ears in a knot.
Thank goodness I have someone clever like you around to sort me out! ;)
If Myrtle was adopted then I have a heck of a job before me trying to get all the parents and family onto my programme ;D.
Oh! That explains the fact my cuzzie gave me that Myrtle married a Catholic when every other Quelch was Anglican - she was raised by Catholics!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Janette, you are a marvel! The FD information is just wonderful!!! I had no idea that funeral directors let you look at their actual books! I probably have a heap of rellies that went through that FD in Auckland but it would take me yonks to find out which ones. Pity they don't have a computer database ;D.
You are a top carat/carrot!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Janette is a marvel with the FD industry, she knows it inside and out.
Cheers
KHP
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Janette is a marvel with the FD industry, she knows it inside and out.
Cheers
KHP
Shhhhhhhhhhh :P :P :P
Cheers Janette
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Ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!! :D
Everyone has to have a talent somewhere! Lucky me to find all the best ones here.
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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And now we have a problem....my cuzzie says there is a Cecilia Quelch mixed up in all of this. I'll have to ask just where the name comes from. I can't find a Cecilia Quelch anywhere!
Hi Bunny
Does "Cuzzie" have both marriage records for Myrtle Eva ?
If so, what names has Myrtle stated for her parents on each of these ?
Cheers
~ Lu
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Oh! That explains the fact my cuzzie gave me that Myrtle married a Catholic when every other Quelch was Anglican - she was raised by Catholics
A new place for you to look would be the catholic registers. bap/confirmation and marriage
they can provide a lot of info
assume it would be auckland dio/parish...these are available on fiche for ndex or you can contact/vidit catholic archives
Bye
althea
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Hi Althea,
Thanks for that! Didn't think of that one - another duh on my part ::).
What a real treat it is to have such wonderful mystery solvers on this board!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Dear Sherlocks,
A conundrum presents! This one is for you, Lu!
My cuzzie says: Myrtle was never formally adopted by the McKeons. I have a letter from the Registrar-General for Births, Deaths & Marriages that was written to me in 2001 that says "Thank you for your letter of 6 April 2001 regarding Myrtle Eva Quelch.
While we have no record of an adoption for this person I am enclosing a copy of her death registration which indicates that she was raised by Arthur Joseph McKeon and Cecelia McKeon (nee Quelch)."
The copy of Myrtle's death registration shows : Name and Surname of Father : Arthur Joseph McKeon. Name and Surname of Mother : Cecelia McKeon. Maiden Surname of Mother : Quelch.
Myrtle's marriage registration shows fathers name as :Arthur Joseph McKeon, Bricklayers Labourer, and Mothers name as Cecilia Quelch formerly McKeon. Maiden name Cross.
Cuz agrees that the Arthur who died in 1929 is most likely the correct one. But his DOB is most likely 1861, while Harriet Quelch was born 1880 with Myrtle in 1899. So it makes it hard for any assumption that Myrtle was his 'sister' and more likely to be his ward. Goodness knows how that happens when there is no record of Arthur marrying! And double no record of Cecilia unless she had another name.
Can't find any combo of Cross/McKeon/Quelch in the BDM (unless I'm a blind bunny).
All I can say is - huh? ??? Would there be any help in the card index at Auckland Public Library if it carries births, deaths and marriages??
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Arthur Joseph McKeon,he never married and died at his sisters's house 8 Patteson St Freemans Bay,his sister was Mrs W J Lynch (1921/8722 Myrtle May McKeon to William John Lynch )
His father was James McKeon ,married to Mary Ann O'Hanlon
Arthur is buried with with his brother James who died in 1921
Given that its stated here Sister..hard to deny
Is your cousins info an official death certificate? as well, you say letter/rego..is it a copy of the page in old death rego book. ?marriage elsewhere, but then why does his death info say never married.
Bye
althea
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There is a CECILIA CROSS in NZ pre 1900
in school records for 1887, Southland, Father Alexander.
Bye
Althea
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Hi Bunny
After much head scratching (and unsuccessful searching for the mystery woman "Cecilia") I've arrived at the following : ::)
* That Arthur (Joseph) McKEON was the natural father of Myrtle Eva QUELCH.
* Arthur Joseph McKEON is very likely the child Arthur McKEON whose birth was registered in 1874. [That y.o.b. differs from the death registration but allowance needs to be made for the informant not perhaps having precise information.]
* It's not beyond the realm of possibility that Arthur was in a relationship with Harriet Ellen QUELCH and that this situation was opposed by Arthur's (Catholic) family - or indeed even Harriet's family. And so it may have been that once Myrtle was born, Arthur (or members of his family), decided that they would raise this child.
[By 1900, though Arthur's parents are aged in their 60's and early 70's, it does seem that Arthur's spinster sister Mary Ann is also on the scene at the family home and as such may have shared in child-rearing duties ? ]
* I'm of the view that "Cecilia QUELCH" was simply a name selected by the family, in order to deflect interest from "Harriet Ellen (QUELCH)". [Whilst Myrtle grew up as a "McKEON", Arthur (and perhaps his family) would have been mindful that Myrtle's official birth registration remained in the surname of QUELCH. ]
continued >>
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* Yes it's odd, that at Arthur's death, Mrs W J LYNCH (Myrtle Eva / Myrtle May), is stated as being his sister.
But, had Myrtle really grown up thinking Arthur was her brother ?? [Wonder what parental info was given on Myrtle's marriage to Mr LYNCH in 1921 ?? ]
Perhaps this pretence of being "sister", was just a cover-up to protect (questions being asked of, or about ), the never-married Arthur ? :-\
* But as "cuzzie" reveals (in the other thread), Myrtle did eventually meet up with Harriet in 1927 shortly before her death. [It's not entirely clear from that, though, whether Myrtle knew that Harriet was her birth mother ??]
And that meeting was two years prior to Arthur's passing .... was it with his knowledge ... or blessing ??
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I think we've all searched pretty thoroughly for "Cecilia". :D
There's just nothing to be found, that in any way stacks up.
(And that marriage registration ... Mother's name : Cecilia QUELCH, formerly McKEON ... nee CROSS -- is especially odd ? ) ;D
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Arthur's sister :
Also buried at Waikumete ...
Roman Catholic Division - Row 21 - Plot 61
Mary Ann McKEON - spinster - aged 60 *
Died : 23 May 1939
[* Note: Age on cemetery record is incorrect. Should read as "68 years" (as per online Death index) = bc 1871. There is a Mary Ann McKEON birth reg'd. in 1870. ]
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Here is another spinster sister buried with Mary Ann
1948/20846 McKeon Bridget Ann 86Y
MCKEON, BRIDGET ANN
ROMAN CATHOLIC DIVISION C Row 21, Plot 61
Age 86
died: 23-Nov-1948
Cheers Janette
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I think we've all searched pretty thoroughly for "Cecilia".
There's just nothing to be found, that in any way stacks up.
(And that marriage registration ... Mother's name : Cecilia QUELCH, formerly McKEON ... nee CROSS -- is especially odd ? )
All very well but there is actually a person called CECILIA CROSS
Name CROSS Cecilia
School Waihopai
Register Number 402J
Admission Date 1887
Parent / Guardian Alexander Cross
Bye
Althea
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Hi Bunny,
Another occupant of ROMAN CATHOLIC DIVISION C Row 21, Plot 61
MCKEON, HENRY
Age 73
LABOURER
died 22-Aug-1936
Cheers Janette
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Hi Bunny,
It would be worth contacting the Auckland Catholic Diocesan Archive
http://thecommunityarchive.org.nz/node/74118/profile
There is a reference to the Catholic register in the cemetery records for James,Arthur's father
The Catholic register has James McKeon died 9 August 1914 aged 88 years and buried 11 August 1914 of Brown Street
Cheers Janette
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Hi there everyone,
I can feel Althea's frustration so I feel the thread must be followed just to see if it goes anywhere.
The only Alexander Cross that features in the Births index is married to an Augusta Veronica Cross. They had six children, four of whom were girls - Violet Blanch Victoria (1887), Augusta Louisa (1879), Lavender Gladys Irene (1890), and Mary Rowena (1880). Papers Past has an Alexander Cross living in the East Invercargill area which included Waihopai. If Cecilia is Alexander's daughter then it could be a pet name that one of the daughters had. The closest daughter to school age if a first registration would have been Mary Rowena who would have been 6-7 years old in 1887 as per Althea's post, and then Augusta Louisa who would have been 7-8 yrs old. It is possible that either Mary or Augusta could have been called Cecilia by the family. Possibility that it might be Augusta Louisa so as to not muddle her with her mother.
Auguste (sic) Veronica Greig married Alexander Cross in 1871. Just to round that off.
The best Violet Cross match married Allen Burns in 1913. I can't find a marriage for Augusta Louisa. Lavender married John Bonwell Tale in 1911. Mary Rowena is hard as there is no marriage for the 'Rowena' bit but two for Mary Cross that seem likely in 1902 to Tom Inch or in 1903 to Henry John Hamilton.
If all the daughters married except for Augusta Louisa - is it possible for her to have been 'Cecilia'???
Chewing on this carrot for a bit
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Hi Bunny
yes that was my conclusion as well re Cecilia
all in all we can speculate all we like
the baptism and confirmation for Myrtle seem the only factual docs missing and school records as to who is recorded as guardian
In a way its a closed case, as you have the facts as they were known from the NZ BMD
We can specualte reason as much as possible but the facts recorded in our official registers are that the parents were Arthur and Cecilia.
Bye
althea
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Re Mary marriages
There is a Tom and Mary Inch buried at Oxford Public Cemetery, with same record number.
Mary d. 1948 age 82 and Tom d. 1954 age 82, so if this is the couple that married 1902,
this Mary was born 1866.
John B
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In a way its a closed case, as you have the facts as they were known from the NZ BMD
We can specualte reason as much as possible but the facts recorded in our official registers are that the parents were Arthur and Cecilia.
Bye
althea
Parents : "Arthur Joseph McKEON and Cecilia McKEON (maiden surname QUELCH)" is what is recorded on Myrtle's death certificate .... BUT it needs to be remembered that this is information supplied by a third party.
Myrtle's marriage registration shows fathers name as :Arthur Joseph McKeon, Bricklayers Labourer, and Mothers name as Cecilia Quelch formerly McKeon. Maiden name Cross.
What Myrtle herself has offered (above) in respect of her "mother", is different.
Why is Cecilia recorded as "formerly McKEON" ???
[It suggests that "a Cecilia CROSS either married a McKEON or adopted the McKEON surname, and later, through re-marriage or other, then becomes (surname) QUELCH. "] ?
The only reliable record so far, is the birth registration >>
1899 - QUELCH - Myrtle Eva
Mother: Harriet Ellen QUELCH -- Father: Not recorded.
I'm in no way suggesting that this (Southland) Cecilia CROSS should not be followed up on. :)
* What may be helpful to this search, is the record of Myrtle's other marriage - to determine if the "mother's" details have been recorded in the same manner.
~ Lu
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there are some Cecilia Cross' bron from 1850s onwards in Aus
Bye
Althea
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Hi Bunny, :D
Just received the death notices today, will forward them to you as soon as I scan them.
Cheers
KHP
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Hi KHP,
Received with a HUGE amount of thanks!
Awesome service from an awesome Chatter!
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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I thought I had better add my piece to all the information that has been given on Myrtle Eva Quelch / Myrtle May McKeon. As Myrtle was my father's half-sister, I can maybe correct a couple of items. Myrtle did not meet Harriet for the first time around 1927 - she had always visited Harriet, her husband Frederick and my father - my father could remember her coming to visit at their house from when he was a small child, and often commented on how much Myrtle looked like Harriet. Harriet died when he was 8 years old, so obviously Myrtle did know that Harriet was her birth mother.
Her marriage registration to Harold Filmer in 1958 shows Myrtle's father as Arthur Joseph McKeon and her mother as Cecilia McKeon, with maiden surname of mother as Quelch. Arthur McKeon's death notice from the NZ Herald shows that he died at 8 Patterson Street at the residence of his sister, Mrs Egan. His Death Certificate shows he died at 8 Patterson Street from 119 Franklin Road (where several McKeons were living at the time). His Death Certificate shows relationship status at time of deat as Not Recorded, place of marriage, name of spouse/partner as NR. It is possible that Arthur McKeon was her birth father, but my father could also remember visiting a motor building (panelbeater) shop in/around Pitt Street Auckland with his mother (Harriet) where they were always welcomed as if they were part of the family, and he had always felt that possibly one of the sons there was Myrtle's father. He thought the family's name there was McGhee or similar, and I believe there was a motor building shop in that area at that time. Myrtle and Harold Filmer married in May 1958, after Myrtle's first husband William John Lynch had died, although Myrtle had left him some years before. The marriage certificate shows both Myrtle and Harold living in Arthur Street Ponsonby at the time of their marriage.
Although we can't find anything on Cecilia/Cecelia Quelch, she must have been related in some way, as there were not that many Quelches in Auckland, and all I believe were related at that time. It may have been a family (nick)name, as Harriet was known to all her family, including in handed-down family stories) as Sissy. None of my father's cousins that we kept in touch with knew about Myrtle, and didn't know of Cecilia either, so she is probably a dead end. If anyone can find anything it would be great to know, and thanks for all the research you have all done.
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Hi all....what a fun search.
Here's another thought.... think Catholic .... they gave homes to unwanted children. There were at least TWO McKeon unmarried females. Could these ladies have been in an Order, with one taking the name of Sister Cecilia of the Cross or something like this???
Arthur McKeon would probably have paid for the up keep of his child - food, goods or trade. Arthur & Cecila would then rear this child?
Kate
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Although we can't find anything on Cecilia/Cecelia Quelch, she must have been related in some way, as there were not that many Quelches in Auckland, and all I believe were related at that time. It may have been a family (nick)name, as Harriet was known to all her family, including in handed-down family stories) as Sissy.
Hi Maggie .... and thank you for the clarification and additional info, will read through it more thoroughly in a moment. :)
Most interesting though is that Harriet was known as "Sissy".
"Sissy" or "Cissy" are diminutives are of the girls names Cecilia / Cecelia / Cicely. ;)
~ Lu
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oops, sorry ... typo in previous post. :-[ Should read ....
"Sissy" or "Cissey/ Cissy" are diminutives of the girls names, Cecilia/ Cecelia/ Cecily/Cicely. ;)
[I think it probably makes sense then that the more formal "Cecilia" was used in place of the pet name "Sissy" for the purpose of say, any official records .... and that Cecilia QUELCH really was, Harriet nee QUELCH. ]
~ Lu
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Hi Bunny,
I found the FD's record for Arthur Joseph McKeon,he never married and died at his sisters's house 8 Patteson St Freemans Bay,his sister was Mrs W J Lynch (1921/8722 Myrtle May McKeon to William John Lynch )
His father was James McKeon ,married to Mary Ann O'Hanlon
Arthur is buried with with his brother James who died in 1921
Arthur McKeon's death notice from the NZ Herald shows that he died at 8 Patterson Street at the residence of his sister, Mrs Egan.
Hi Maggie
Hmm ... yes I see now that we really didn't have the benefit of knowing earlier just what was contained in the actual death notice.
Have you managed to find out which McKEON sister was married to a Mr EGAN ?
~ Lu
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Hi Lu
Thanks for your reply - any thoughts help. Problem is Harriet's full name was Harriet Ellen Quelch, although it is possible that it was a name used purely for upbringing of Myrtle.
No, I haven't had time yet to look at marriages for McKeon/Egan - my next job!!! Always so many things to do / think of. It seems that several of the family members changed their names - one of Myrtle's daughters is shown on her marriage certificate as Betty May Lynch (father William John Lynch that was Myrtle's first husband), married to Graham Rattray Whyte, yet the electoral rolls show Graham Rattray Whyte and Elizabeth Marie Whyte!!!!! It would be much easier if people stuck to their original names!!!
Maggie
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Hi Maggie
The electoral rolls (able to be viewed in full at Anc**try if you have a subscription) are probably the quickest way to locate Mrs EGAN. Somebody on here, may be able to help with that info. ;)
I'd cross-checked EGAN / McKEON marriages and didn't find anything (- it's possible though that the sister if widowed, was re-married to an EGAN ? ) .
~ Lu
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HI -BIT OUT OF SYNCH WITH YOUR CURRENT THREAD BUT Just been making a list of descendants of Mark and Hannah Newton who were part of the Albertlander migration - we were thinking of trying to contact as many descendants as possible and encourage them to come to the reunion EASTER 2012 SEE ALBERTLAND WEBSITE for a family reunion
The names that led me to you (and rootschat) are
SOLOMON FINEY M ROSA EMILY NEWTON 189(4?)
EVA JANE FINEY daughter of above M THOMAS QUELCH 1906
am a descendant of Eva NEWTON sister of ROSA EMILY
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Hi Disedburgh,
Welcome to Rootschat!!! You will find lots of helpers on the boards willing to give you any assistance you need (as long as it is to do with people that are not living). However you just happen to be in the right place if you are looking for a new cousin!
Eva Jane Finey Quelch was my great-grandmother. HI CUZ!!!!! ;D Wonderful to 'meet' you!!!
Maggie49 is a new cousin on the Quelch side that I've just met recently due to the lure of Rootschat and all of the information on it. Maggie49 has the coolest photos!!!!
Under most of our user names is a little green scroll. I think it becomes active after three postings and then you are able to send private messages to board members and sensitive items like email addresses.
This is so awesome!!! Another cousin!!! :D :D Wow!!! Makes me want to hit the web again to find more things.
Cheers
Bunny 8)
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Yeee haa Bunny,
Your ears must be bouncing ;D ;D ;D
Cheers Janette
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That is awesome Bunny ..... another carrot has been planted ;D
Cheers
KHP
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Dear Janette and KHP,
Currently wearing a big buck-toothed grin and my ears are all awhirr (if that is a word)! ;D
Everything is possible with wonderful helpers like you both around!
Hugs
Bunny 8)
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Hi All
I am also interested in finding out who my Grandmother's mother was (a bit of a mystery). Yes I am the granddaughter of Myrtle May McKeon/Lynch/Filmer she lived in Auckland at Arthur Street, Ponsonby and retired to Port Waikato with my grandfather Harold Filmer. She died in December1979 and was buried at Tuakau.
My grandmother Myrtle was born 1 January 1900 and had 4 children to William John Lynch who died a couple of years after my birth. My mother was the eldest of the 4 children, her name was Alma Joan Lynch (Deceased) and she had 2 other sisters and 1 brother. The sisters were Eileen Katherine Lynch, (Deceased) Betty May Lynch (Elizabeth Marie Whyte) (don't know if still alive) and William John Lynch (Deceased).
My grandmother's father was a McKeon but unsure of his first name and I know he never married. He had 2 sisters that lived together called Aunt Mary Ann and Aunt Cecilia (I believe Cecilia was married at one stage) and there were a couple of brothers as well. I remember Mum talking about them and the name Arthur kinda rings a bell with me. I know that my grandmother was educated at a private girls school in the South Island that her father paid for. Apparently he was quite well off.
By the way the family were catholics. My grandmother had all of her children educated at St Patrick's School in Auckland located next to St Patrick's Cathedral.
Have to go now......will keep in touch
Well folks the mystery continues.
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Hi HerneBay
So pleased to see your message appear on the website. Myrtle May McKeon/Lynch/Filmer was my father"s 1/2 sister, born Myrtle Eva Quelch on 31 December 1899 according to her birth certificate. Her mother, Harriet Ellen Quelch, married my grandfather Frederick Harry Jenner, and Myrtle used to visit them and my father in Devon St Auckland where they lived. According to the information I have from the Registrar-General of BDM in NZ Myrtle was brought up as Myrtle May McKeon by Arthur Joseph McKeon and Cecelia McKeon (nee Quelch). We have not been able to find any information on Cecelia McKeon - maybe you can help? We have wondered if this was a name used by Harriet in helping to bring up Myrtle, as she was know by her family as Sis/Sissy.
After I got a copy of Myrtle's death notice I was able to contact your mother Alma Joan, (Known as Joan), but she wouldn't see me until she had spoken to her daughter in Australia, and I never heard back from her. I guess you are that daughter?
Eileen Katherine (Palmer) is buried at Purewa Cemetery in Auckland, Elizabeth Marie (Betty Whyte) is buried at Waikumete Cemetery in Auckland, and I have been unable to find any information on William John.
I have been to Myrtle's grave at Tuakau cemetery, and was able to take my father to see it before he died - he always remembered Myrtle visiting Harriet their mother, before his mother died in 1927. He also visited her when she was married to William Lynch, after he returned from WWII. William & Myrtle were married at St Patricks Catherdral in Auckland.
Would love any information you have on Myrtle, as Dad could remember how much she looked like their mother.
Hope this information is of help - have a number of family photos, including Harriet at about 13? yrs old, and her wedding photo to my grandfather; also of some of her brothers and her parents.
Hope to hear more from you soon.
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Hi Maggie
Great to hear from you. I was wondering if I would get a response.
I was unaware that my grandmother had a half brother, but I do recall the name Jenner been spoken about on a few occasions.......now the puzzle fits.
Yes I am the daughter of Joan and I have lived in Sydney, Australia since 1979. I am surprised that mum never mentioned that you had contacted her. I would say maybe she didn't won't to open old wounds (who knows).
My grandmother left William Lynch because he treated her badly along with the children. My mother was sent to live with 2 aunts Annie? and Mary Ann McKeon. She would go back to the family home daily to get her siblings ready for school and cook and clean for them and her father. During that period I don't know where my grandmother resided. I am wondering if Annie who I know was married and lost her husband is the missing link in this puzzle as my grandmother was very close to both aunts.
I loved my grandmother dearly.......and I was very fortunate to have a great relationship with her. I loved her humour and wit. She was a very wise and caring soul (No fool though).
My mothers brother William Lynch, got mixed up with a religious cult and married a woman called Jessie. Not long after the marriage they disappeared of the face of the earth and none of the family ever saw them again. I did a bit of research and found that they lived at Taumaranui and he died 21 Sept 1968 aged 41yrs.
Mum's sister Eileen Palmer died at an early age also, if I recall she was 50 when she passed.
Looking back, I wished I had asked more questions about the family, but life was so different then.
I have some pictures of my grandmother that I will send to you and if possible could you send some of the ones you have of her family. The pictures are packed away so will have to do a bit of a hunt.
Look forward to the next instalment.
Thanks for replying
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This mystery has been fantastic to follow... thank you everyone.
I have followed hoping someone would turn over another mystery and resolve it.
Thomas QUELCH had a daughter Mona Edna Kate Quelch. Known as Edna Kate - she married Frank COLLEDGE in 1921 and later divorced in 1938. Edna married Jackson BOURDOT in 1933.
Something is wrong with those dates.
I need to know more about Frank COLLEDGE. He is born about 1894 and died 15 may 1959. Cremated at Purewa. He is Anglican.
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Hi
So pleased to read your reply - I think you have some (a lot!) of information about Myrtle that I would love to know, and I can help you with the family history that you may not know.
Myrtle used to visit Harriet (her mother) reasonably often from what my father told me, but William John Lynch was never allowed inside the house - obviously my grandfather didn't like him and I know William was an alcoholic, but Myrtle seemed to be quite welcome. Dad could also remember William Lynch. Your comments about him explain this!!! I knew Myrtle had left William Lynch, but didn't know when, but she was living with Harold Filmer when William Lynch died. William Lynch died on 17 March 1958 and Myrtle and Harold married on 21 May 1958 in the Registrars Office in Auckland. They were both living at 10 Arthur St, Ponsonby at the time of their marriage. William Lynch is buried in the Soldiers Area at Waikumete Cemetery.
On Myrtle and William's marriage certificate her parents are shown as Arthur Joseph McKeon (Bricklayers labourer) and Cecilia Quelch formerly McKeon, maiden name Cross. This is the person we have not been able to find any trace of, maybe you can help?
Dad and Mum also visited Myrtle when he returned from WWII when the Lynch family were living in Arch Hill in Auckland but lost touch with her after that, but told me about Myrtle when I was 16 and pregnant - his comment was "that I wasn't the first one in the family for it to happen to".
It is interesting about William Jnr, as your mother made a comment that he had got mixed up in some strange religion and they had heard nothing more of him.
I would love to see pictures of your grandmother, and I will send ones that I have - I don't know if Myrtle had any of Harriet, but you will at least see what she looked at - Dad always thought they looked very alike. I am so glad to hear a little of what Myrtle was like - that has been one of my dreams since I first knew about her - to be able to talk to someone who knew her, which was why I contacted your mother.
Harriet (your ggrandmother!) is buried at Hillsborough Cemetery in Auckland, but we moved the plaque from her grave to Waikumete and placed it on the Jenner family grave as the area she was buried at Hillsborough had started to slip. This whole area has now been repaired, so the grave is still intact and in good order.
Under most of our user names is a little green scroll. I think it becomes active after three postings and then you are able to send private messages to board members and sensitive items like email addresses, so after your next post we can email with our address etc to send photos.
Look forward to your next reply.
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Hi KaeDee
Thomas married Eva Finey, and had 4 children - the eldest was Mona, then Madeleine, then Hilda, then a son William born later. Infobunny on this site is related to Thomas through Mona. I have Thomas and Eva's wedding photo, also a photo of Thomas, Eva, and the three girsl taken (we think) when Thomas returned from WWI - he is in his uniform.
Cheers
Maggie
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I need to know more about Frank COLLEDGE. He is born about 1894 and died 15 may 1959. Cremated at Purewa. He is Anglican.
Here is a bit about the divorce
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=EP19380609.2.106&srpos=8&e=--1920-----100--1-byDA---2frank+COLLEDGE--
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=AS19381128.2.115&srpos=9&e=--1920-----100--1-byDA---2frank+COLLEDGE--
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=AS19390824.2.84&srpos=10&e=--1920-----100--1-byDA---2frank+COLLEDGE--
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=NZH19390825.2.156&srpos=11&e=--1920-----100--1-byDA---2frank+COLLEDGE--
Cheers Janette
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There is a probate for Frank at Auckland Archives
BBAE 1570/1466 P1100/1959 COLLEDGE Frank - Auckland - General Manager 1959 Akld
http://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=14748594
Cheers Janette
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I think I get it.... we have TWO Miss QUELCH's
Edna Kate QUELCH
Mona Edna May QUELCH
So no early marriage - two separate girls.
Thanks everyone... I can take Frank of my list as he is born in England.
That's great news
KaeDee
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Hi KaeDee, Maggie and Hernebay,
Nice to see you all on the site! I've just been catching up on the latest between you all.
Maggie - I've been thinking about you. Ever since I met you and saw those lovely photos that you have of the Quelches I've been trying to figure out how to get up to you and get copies! I love that glorious photo you have of Thomas in his boxing days.
Hernebay - How lovely of you to have found a cousin in Maggie! It mean you are also my cousin!!! Yes, we have tried to sort out the Cecelia Quelch mystery but have had no luck so far. That does not mean we will not keep trying!!! I can't stand having mysteries like that in the family. Must...find...info... Anyway from your info I determined that William's wife, Jessie Florence Lynch died in 1992 in New Zealand, but I don't know where yet. Oh, new cousins are so cool!!! :D
KaeDee - Welcome! Now to your interesting enquiry. My grandmother Mona Edna May Quelch is unfortunately not your Edna Kate Quelch. The clue to the origins of Edna come in the newspaper report in the Auckland Star on 28 November 1938 when she is said to have gone to see her parents in England and doesn't want to come back to New Zealand. Edna Kate Quelch was born in Leicester in 1897 to Robert (I can't read - it's Herbert!) and Rosa Quelch. Edna emigrated alone to New Zealand landing on 19 April 1921 in Auckland. This emigration can be found on www.familysearch.org in the New Zealand Passengers collection as E K Quelch. That being the case, it would seen that she must have met Frank Colledge soon after arriving into the country for them to be married the same year. My grandmother would have been 14 at the time if it were her. I have not looked at Frank yet but will do so to see if I can help you out. Don't give up and never stop asking questions!!!
Much love to you all,
Bunny 8)
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Hi KaeDee,
Gah! Just noticed newspaper clipping where Frank said he was married to Edna on 21 April 1921 - which was two days after she had arrived in Auckland. The shipping manifest says Edna got on the ship in Sydney. I don't know if this is transit from London, or she lived in Australia. So she must have known Frank earlier than in New Zealand.
Spade out now.
Cheers,
Bunny 8)
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Hi Maggie
Will contact you later in the week. Dying to see the photos you have of the family. I have some that I will send to you of my Grandmother and her family.
How does this post work, as I need to get your email address.
HB
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Wow..its is amazing. What amazing researchers you all are. Two uncommon surnames but I still had them confused.
If Frank Colledge is NOT BORN in New Zealand then he's not my relative - but this has been a great help for me as I can now unlink the pair of them and stop wondering.
many thanks KaeDee
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Hi KaeDee,
Don't unlink yet!!! Another newspaper report that discussed the divorce of Frank and Edna contained Frank's testimony that they had both been born in England and had come out to New Zealand in (he says 1920) where they were married.
Can you please tell us just how you know for sure that your Frank Colledge was born in New Zealand?
Cheers,
Bunny 8)
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There is only one birth of a Frank Colledge in NZ and he appears to be too old for the Frank cremated at Purewa
1881/6161 Colledge Frank Nixon to Mary and William
There is a F Colledge arriving as a bosun on the Paparoa in 1822
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11028-116899-15?cc=1609792
An E K Quelch arrives in NZ from Sydney on the Riverina 19 Apr 1921
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11675-181338-79?cc=1609792
she had previously travelled from London to Sydney on the ORVIETO leaving on the 26th Feb.1921
Cheers Janette
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Hi to all
Bunny - Good to hear from you again. I will get copies of photos of Tom, and get them to you. Wasn't it lucky Dad's stepmother kept that album after she married my grandfather!!!
Hernebay - I have emailed you, so hope the message gets through - if so you can reply to me by email with your details, but can also keep posting on this site with any information you have so others that are interested can keep up with the story.
KaeDee - Sorry I couldn't help you, but the Quelches made a habit of having the same names in different branches of the family - there were 2 Myrtle Eva Quelch - Harriet's daughter that we have been researching, and one of Harriet's brothers also had a Myrtle Eva Quelch. Very tricky for trying to sort out who you are actually looking at/for.
Cheers
Maggie
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Hi Maggie,
Oh, you are a love! I'll PM you.
I have been looking but I can't find any trace of Myrtle Eva Quelch who was born in 1906 to Harry and Martha Quelch. Myrtle would have been 5 when her parents divorced in 1911. It is possible that she was 'adopted' if Martha remarried and changed her surname. This makes it quite hard to track her down. There are no marriages for a Martha Elizabeth Quelch, but there is a marriage in 1912 for a Martha Elizabeth Smith (maiden name) to an Archibald Bradley. A death for a Martha Elizabeth Bradley in 1926 proves not to be her as that one lived all her life in Otago - where I need Auckland. And the marriage in 1912 is for the Otago Martha - so definitely not that one.
I wonder where Martha and Myrtle went?
Cheers,
Bunny 8)
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Hi I am related to you through Solomon and Rose Finey, write back please,
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Hi Paulina,
Whoop! Yay! Now where have you been hiding all this time???
Cheers,
Bunny 8)
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Hi Anna, I've been raisin my son with spec. needs. so glad to aeet up with again. Hey we have Finey Family Tree Hut Facebook page, are you on FB? If so send a friend request. You my dear are an amazing wealth of information, we need your super sleuth skills. So good to be in touch again X
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Sure thing! I was a bit concerned when you vanished, but here you are!!! So glad you are back!
I'll go find that page
Hugs to you,
8)
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Good to find you too Anna :)
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https://www.facebook.com/groups/246997152055444/
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Requested....pending....
;D
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OK Linda (Grandaughter of John Finey) is the administrator, she's not always on FB but a shortcut would be to send me a friend request to Roderick Mackenzie (Roddy) Cairns and then I can accept you on the Finey page :) There's a picture of my son Callan on an exercise bike :) See you in the Hut :)
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Hi Paulina,
Just a reminder that we don't identify living or possibly living persons on RootsChat. ;)
Could you please edit the post above to remove those names and instead use the Personal Message (PM) facility to exchange such information.
Spades