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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cumberland => Topic started by: Cazza47 on Thursday 08 September 11 13:53 BST (UK)

Title: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 08 September 11 13:53 BST (UK)
I am looking for maiden name of Sarah Brown.
She married Thomas Brown in the dec quarter 1859 in Wigton, Cumberland (10b 666)
Have looked on ancestry and Free BMD site but there is no Sarah listed, according to the 1871 census she was born in wigton in 1836.
A bit stuck here can anyone help?
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: norma_jess on Thursday 08 September 11 14:26 BST (UK)
Hi,

I don't know where you got the marriage from but the names on Fndmypast are:  Thomas Brown and the following:
GRAHAM, Ann

ROPER, Mary

GLAISTER, William

Which explains why there is no Sarah.  There are Sarah and Thomas's 1863 and later for Cumberland.

Regards Norma
 




 

Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Ruskie on Thursday 08 September 11 14:35 BST (UK)
I am looking for maiden name of Sarah Brown.
She married Thomas Brown in the dec quarter 1859 in Wigton, Cumberland (10b 666)
Have looked on ancestry and Free BMD site but there is no Sarah listed, according to the 1871 census she was born in wigton in 1836.
A bit stuck here can anyone help?
Carol

From Freebmd:

Marriages Dec 1859 
Brown  Thomas    Wigton  10b 666   
Glaister  William     Wigton  10b 666   
Graham  Ann     Wigton  10b 666   
Neilson  Elizabeth     Wigton  10b 666   
Roper  Mary     Wigton  10b 666

There is no Sarah as Norma says.

What leads you to believe that Thomas Brown married a Sarah in Dec 1/4 1859 in Wigton?
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Thursday 08 September 11 15:50 BST (UK)
From Freebmd:

Marriages Dec 1859 
Brown  Thomas    Wigton  10b 666   
Glaister  William     Wigton  10b 666   
Graham  Ann     Wigton  10b 666   
Neilson  Elizabeth     Wigton  10b 666   
Roper  Mary     Wigton  10b 666

There is no Sarah as Norma says ...

 ... and there should be only two women on the page.  :-\
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 08 September 11 16:24 BST (UK)
Sorry think I am getting confused here.
Am looking for the marriage details of Thomas Brown and his wife Sarah. With them both being born and living in wigton I presumed the Thomas Brown married in 1859 in wigton was the one but obviously not.
They were living in 52 Burnfoot, Wigton in 1871 census but their first child Joseph was born in 1856 so I need an early date I think.
Thanks for trying.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Thursday 08 September 11 17:40 BST (UK)
These ones in 1861?

Old Lane, Wigton
Thomas BROWN 27 Tin Plate Worker, Wigton
Sarah 25 Carlisle
Joseph 4 Carlisle
Hodgson 2 Carlisle
Mary Jane 6m Cartlisle

Perhaps the census clerk got carried away with his dittoes.  All of those kids were bap at Wigton.

There were a couple of Sarah HODGSONs bap at Carlisle in mid 1830s :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 08 September 11 18:20 BST (UK)
Yes thats them, I have found a Sarah Braithwaite possibly marrying a Thomas Brown in 1851 in Carlisle.
Looking into that idea now.
Oh I do love this!!
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Thursday 08 September 11 19:31 BST (UK)
Yes thats them, I have found a Sarah Braithwaite possibly marrying a Thomas Brown in 1851 in Carlisle.
Looking into that idea now.
Oh I do love this!!
Carol

She married James SAVAGE (see IGI)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Press on Thursday 08 September 11 19:46 BST (UK)
Hi
I the couple married in Wigtown, this is Scotland so will not appear of BMD records for England and Wales. I doubt the Scottish records BMD are online
Linda
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 08 September 11 21:08 BST (UK)
Thanks for that, just have to keep searching.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: norma_jess on Thursday 08 September 11 23:39 BST (UK)
Hi, 

There is this marriage in Wigton which is not in Scotland at this time.

BROWN, Thomas
Registration District:  Help    Wigton
County:     Cumberland
Year of Registration:     1847
Quarter of Registration:     Apr-May-Jun
Spouse's last name:     Not available before 1912
Volume No:  Help    25
Page No:  Help    187

MarriageFinder™:  Thomas Brown married one of the following people
 

COULTHARD, Sarah
MOORE, Mary
BRAWN, Thomas .
 BUSHBY, John

It is spelt Brown on the original copy it has been transcribed wrong.

Regards Norma
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Gan Yam on Thursday 08 September 11 23:46 BST (UK)
Hi

There was  Thomas Brown married 3rd quarter in 1853.  The record has a name missing and according to family search he didn't marry either Elizabeth or Nancy.  Could this be a possibility? Not too far from Wigton.

BANKS  Thomas    Cockermouth  10b 451    
Brown  Thomas     Cockermouth  10b 451    
CHAMBERS  Nancy     Cockermouth  10b 451    
HARKER  Elizabeth     Cockermouth  10b 451    
SWINDLE  George     Cockermouth  10b 451

Could just be a double transcribe?
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Friday 09 September 11 08:50 BST (UK)
There was  Thomas Brown married 3rd quarter in 1853.  The record has a name missing and according to family search he didn't marry either Elizabeth or Nancy.  Could this be a possibility? Not too far from Wigton.

BANKS  Thomas    Cockermouth  10b 451    
Brown  Thomas     Cockermouth  10b 451    
CHAMBERS  Nancy     Cockermouth  10b 451    
HARKER  Elizabeth     Cockermouth  10b 451    
SWINDLE  George     Cockermouth  10b 451


There should only be four names on a page (from 1852) :)

I think Thomas BROWN was 10b 456

This could give a possible Sarah JONES

Marriages Sep 1853 
BROWN    Thomas        Cockermouth    10b   456    
JONES    Sarah         Cockermouth    10b   456   
RALPH    John         Cockermouth    10b   456    
WHITELOCK    Agnes         Cockermouth    10b   456

Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: silvery on Friday 09 September 11 08:56 BST (UK)
Hi
I the couple married in Wigtown, this is Scotland so will not appear of BMD records for England and Wales. I doubt the Scottish records BMD are online
Linda

Well, how about Scotland's People?

http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/content/help/index.aspx?r=554&402

It's pay-per-view but a lot more information on Scottish records. 
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Gan Yam on Friday 09 September 11 09:01 BST (UK)
Family search is showing Agnes Whitelock marrying Thomas Brown in 1853.

I think its more likely that as Thomas was born in Wigton in Cumberland, the census would seem to confirm that, the marriage would take place in somewhere in Cumberland, but of course nothing is beyond the realms of possibility.

Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Friday 09 September 11 14:11 BST (UK)
I am pretty sure Thomas was born in Wigton, I have found him in the 1861, 1871, 1891 census and it looks like Wigton, Sarah was born in Carlisle although in one census she says she was born in Wigton.
The 3 oldest children Joseph, Hodgson and Mary Jane were born in Carlisle while John, Annie, Catherine and Sarah were born in Wigton.
Their daughter Annie married John William Holdsworth in Wigton but John died in cockermouth so there could be a cockermouth connection.
Sarah Jones could be a contender.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Friday 09 September 11 14:28 BST (UK)
The 3 oldest children Joseph, Hodgson and Mary Jane were born in Carlisle ...

Sarah Jones could be a contender.

The first three kids were bap in Wigton ... and 1871 says they were born there so probably not born in Carlisle - indeed

Births Sep 1858 
BROWN    Hodgson        Wigton    10b   418

I'm afraid Sarah JONES is not really a contender because, as steelos-mrs found, that Thomas BROWN married Agnes WHITELOCK.  :-\
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Ruskie on Saturday 10 September 11 11:17 BST (UK)
The 3 oldest children Joseph, Hodgson and Mary Jane were born in Carlisle ...

Sarah Jones could be a contender.

The first three kids were bap in Wigton ... and 1871 says they were born there so probably not born in Carlisle - indeed

Births Sep 1858 
BROWN    Hodgson        Wigton    10b   418

I'm afraid Sarah JONES is not really a contender because, as steelos-mrs found, that Thomas BROWN married Agnes WHITELOCK.  :-\

Well wouldn't the next logical step to be to purchase this birth certificate. You will then discover Sarah's maiden name - at least if you know her surname you'll have something to follow up.
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Saturday 10 September 11 13:15 BST (UK)
Hi

If you can hold off for a day or two I'll have a look at the Wigton baptisms and marriages in the church records in the archoives when I'm in at the start of the week.

I did look in the Wigton RC marriages online to 1856 and they're not there.

Best wishes

 :)Emms :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Saturday 10 September 11 13:44 BST (UK)
Thank you Emms for that, where are the wigton records kept?
That would be very helpful.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 10 September 11 16:37 BST (UK)
Yes Emms where are those records online? ???

I'll be in Whitehaven RO on Thursday (and maybe Carlisle on Friday). :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Saturday 10 September 11 19:53 BST (UK)
Hi Carol and Goeffe

Sorry, I should have put a link!

As far as where the Wigton records are kept, the original parish records are in Carlisle, but there are copies of all the Cumbria parish registers on film in Carlisle and Whitehaven.  Also films of Westmorland BT's in Carlisle.

Not sore offhand how much is in Kendal and Barrow as they're Cumbria but originally in Westmorland and Lancashire.

I'll find the link for the Wigton RC register and put it in another post.

There are also some for the Parish Church and the cemetery but they don't have your dates for the parish church.

When I lose the link I always look in the resources for the relevant Rootschat county board.

best wishes

Emms :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Saturday 10 September 11 19:59 BST (UK)

Hi RC records here

http://www.cumberlandroots.co.uk/WIGCATH.htm

Emms :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Saturday 10 September 11 20:03 BST (UK)
Hi List for Wigton on here


http://www.cumberlandroots.co.uk/page4.html

and full list for Cumberland Roots on here.

http://www.cumberlandroots.co.uk/

Good starting point!

Emms
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 10 September 11 20:13 BST (UK)
Thanks Emms :)

I had WigCEM, WigBUR and WigMAR but not WigCATH  ::)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Saturday 10 September 11 21:42 BST (UK)
Hi Goeffe

You're welcome

Maybe they've added it more recently.

Best wishes

Emms :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Saturday 24 September 11 16:40 BST (UK)
Update on Sarah Brown's maiden name.
I sent for Hodgson Brown's birth certificate.
I think her maiden name reads Lowry, anyone agree with this?
Also Thomas was a Tin Plate Worker with Master underneath it, does this mean he was in charge?
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 24 September 11 17:15 BST (UK)
Also Thomas was a Tin Plate Worker with Master underneath it, does this mean he was in charge?

Yes, I agree with LOWRY but can find no marriage ???

"Master" implies that he had served his apprenticeship as a Tin Plate worker and now had some apprentices under him.

I can see her (I think) in 1851

King St. Wigton
Henry JORDAN ?? Weaver, Wigton
Mary (wife) 21 Wigton
Richard (father,wid) 58 Weaver, Wigton
Sarah LOWRY (niece) 16 Weaver, Carlisle

JORDAN marriage http://tinyurl.com/3sqkame

Perhaps 1841
Gray Stone Cottage, Botchergate
John LOWRY 30 Joiner
Isabella 30
Robert 5
Sarah 3
Richard 1

Baptism http://tinyurl.com/3ffmbru

Marriages Dec 1837 
LOWRY    John        Carlisle    25   49   
MAXWELL    Isabella         Carlisle    25   49
   
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Saturday 24 September 11 18:15 BST (UK)
No I cannot find a marriage either.
Maybe they did not marry, or married later on.
Thanks for the information on her whereabouts though.
Could you tell me what a hair draper was please Geoff?
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 24 September 11 18:38 BST (UK)
Could you tell me what a hair draper was please Geoff?

It's a "long s" usually used when there was a "double s" at that time.

Hair drefser = Hair dresser  :D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_s
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Saturday 24 September 11 18:53 BST (UK)
Thanks Geoff.
Found a Sarah Lowery living with a Richard, Elizabeth, Henry Jordan in 1841, living in Hudson Court, Wigton, possible do you think??
Richard was a cotton weaver.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 24 September 11 19:49 BST (UK)
Thanks Geoff.
Found a Sarah Lowery living with a Richard, Elizabeth, Henry Jordan in 1841, living in Hudson Court, Wigton, possible do you think??
Richard was a cotton weaver.
Carol

Looking very good I should think :)

Living next door to my SHERRARD ancestors! :)
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Sunday 18 December 11 21:59 GMT (UK)
I am still trying to find the parents of Sarah Lowry, she was living with Richard, Elizabeth & Henry Jordan in wigton in 1841, and living with Henry Jordan, his wife Mary and his father Richard, she is down as Henry's niece, in the 1851 census, Henry seems to have 3 sisters, Mary, Sarah & Elizabeth but known of them married a Lowry that I can find. Henry's wife was Mary Anderson but I cannot find a connection there either. Has anyone any other options that I have not thought about?
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Wednesday 21 December 11 16:52 GMT (UK)
Have found that a James Lowry was buried at the Holy Trinity Church in Carlisle on 3rd august 1839, and a Sarah Lowry was buried at Stanwix, Carlisle on 6th august 1839, probably just a coincidence but possibly Sarah's parents, not sure how to check this.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: elzabels on Thursday 22 December 11 00:57 GMT (UK)
I am still trying to find the parents of Sarah Lowry, she was living with Richard, Elizabeth & Henry Jordan in wigton in 1841, and living with Henry Jordan, his wife Mary and his father Richard, she is down as Henry's niece, in the 1851 census, Henry seems to have 3 sisters, Mary, Sarah & Elizabeth but known of them married a Lowry that I can find. Henry's wife was Mary Anderson but I cannot find a connection there either. Has anyone any other options that I have not thought about?
Carol

Henry JORDAN appears to be the son of Richard JORDAN therefore Sarah LOWERY could be Richard's granddaughter

Richard JORDAN marriedElizabeth ANDERSON 1812: Henry married Mary ANDERSON 1848

There is a burial for Richard LOWERY in Wigton in 1840
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 22 December 11 13:54 GMT (UK)
THank you for that.
I do not live too far away from wigton so I will go and see what is on Richard Lowery's headstone.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Geoff-E on Thursday 22 December 11 16:19 GMT (UK)
I do not live too far away from wigton so I will go and see what is on Richard Lowery's headstone.
Carol

I doubt you will find a headstone for an infant, for that's what he was http://members.madasafish.com/~cgrs/WIGBUR.htm
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Thursday 22 December 11 16:31 GMT (UK)
Thanks Geoff. Think I am going to have to admit defeat with Sarah parentage and her marriage to Thomas.
Thanks for all help.
Carol
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: emmsthheight on Friday 23 December 11 17:31 GMT (UK)
Hi ;D  ;D  ;D

If this is Wigton Parish Church, most of the head stones aren't standing.  Many are laid flat in the pavement  and garden or if it's inside many are under the floor covering.

It's a beautiful church though.

if you're local, you might also know that there is a brilliant little book in the library in Wigton.  It's one of the old hard back transcripts and covers the old monumental inscriptions with an index.

From that you can find a transcripthe full inscription which I've found brilliant.

You have to ask as it's not on the shelves.

Merry Christmas   :)  :D  ;D  :)

Emms
Title: Re: Sarah Brown's maiden name
Post by: Cazza47 on Friday 23 December 11 21:20 GMT (UK)
Thanks for that Emms.
Happy Christmas.

Carol
 :)