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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: johnbarr on Friday 12 August 11 00:56 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I'm still trying to break through the brick wall outlined in my previous thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,503491
I have recently made some significant progress, but still some unanswered questions.
The family is complicated because we now have definite confirmation that both father and son used surnames Newson and Lewis. Searching for these at BDM had been unsuccessful until I realised their surnames had to be entered as "Newson CKA Lewis".
(CKA stands for "Commonly Know As" and the fact that entering either "Lewis" or "Newson" or "Lewis CKA Newson" produced no results is a beef that can be aired elsewhere :P )
So now I have found the births of the two boys in 1902 and 1907 using name as above, e.g. birth of William is shown at BDM as
1924/11661 Newson CKA Lewis William Lawrence Hunter Margarett Watt George CKA Alfred Lawrence
Apparently the births were not registered until 1924, just to add to the confusion :o
Now that we know the father also used the given name of "George", I believe his birth is the one shown at BDM as 1877/15474 Newson George Jane Alfred.
George was born in Auckland (which matches details from his death/obit as Alfred Lewis found by Lu in previous thread, and his military record supplied by spades)
Jane and Alfred Newson had 5 other children, 2M and 3F 1879 to 1886, all born in Napier.
There are references at PapersPast to Jane and Alfred Newson that show Alfred was a carpenter.
Electoral Rolls show an Alfred Lewis, carpenter, was in Napier 1880 to 1906, then Alfred Newson, carpenter, appears in Napier 1919.
BDM again confuse the issue with a death shown as
1920/3039 Newson CKA Lewis Alfred CKA Alfred 88YA
Cemetery records show this man's burial plot was purchased by Angelina Conelius [sic] and one of Jane and Alfred's daughters was Angelina, who married Paul Graham Cornelius, so I think we can safely say this is our man.
BDM show the death of a Jane Lewis
1887/48 Lewis Jane 30Y
PapersPast references to this show she died in Napier Hospital of phthisis, and show her age as 29. Cemetery records show this lady had issue 3M and 3F, which matches what we know of Alfred's wife, so looks like she died shortly after the death of her last child, Alfred in 1886. Incidentally, this will be the Alfred Lewis found by Beg at Waikumete d 1949 in other thread.
Cemetery records for Napier 1887 were apparently destroyed by fire in 1895, but the Council have access to some details from the Napier Courthouse death register. These show Jane Lewis d 1887 was born in Ireland, and lived in NZ for 13yrs, so arrived approx 1874 aged approx 17.
I cannot find any marriage in NZ 1870-1880 for the couple Alfred and Jane Lewis/Newson. I cannot see any arrival in passenger lists of the couple (although Jane unlikely to have been married at 17?) or an Alfred Newson/Lewis in single men.
So, can anyone suggest any way to trace the origins of Alfred and Jane Lewis/Newson, or better still offer an explanation why two generations have used two surnames ???
Sorry this is so long, but I wanted to avoid duplicating searches that had already been made. ;D
John B
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Jeepers, John ! ;D
A cuppa tea and a lie down needed, I think ... before we tackle this one. :D
First question though ... did you ever manage to discount the Alfred NEWSON (and family) who arrived in Wellington on the "La Hogue" in 1874 ?
~ Lu
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Hi Lu,
Yes, there have been many "Stop and have a cuppa's" with this family ;D
The Alfred Newson/Lewis who married Margaret Watt Hunter in 1901 is my target.
Thanks to the Obit you found, giving his birthplace as Auckland, with confirmation from his military record from spades , I am 99% sure he is the child shown by BDM as
1877/15474 Newson George Jane Alfred
So, not the 4month old child Alfred that arrived on La Hogue 1874.
However, checking from your suggestion, and after another cuppa ??? I see that a Sarah Elizabeth Newson aged 33 died 1875, i.e. it looks like she died shortly after she and husband Alfred arrived on La Hogue in 1874. Burial Locator says she is buried at Masterton, but not on Masterton Council site. So possibly her widower Alfred moved to Auckland and teamed up with a "Jane ?" to form the parents of the Alfred born in NZ 1877 ???.
The death of my Alfred in 1920 age 85 or 88 would mean he was born 1832-1835, pretty close to the birthdate of the Alfred Newson on La Hogue (bc 1838). His occupation as carpenter also matches the ship passenger list !
Any clues as to who/where Jane came from ???
John B
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Just trying to catch up
so is the the son of the Alfred you are after
Karori Cemetery (Inscriptions) - Wellington
Area/Block/Row/Plot
03/C/09/046
Description
(Cross IHS, heart & thorns) `Sacred heart of Jesus
have mercy'. ILMO Margaret Watt LEWIS b w of Alfred
Lawrence LEWIS who dep this life 21 Dec 1926 a 49
yrs. `Sadly missed'. `May she rest in peace'. Also
Alfred Leo son of the above d 30 Dec 1928 a 21 yrs.
And Alfred Lawrence LEWIS hus of above d 11 May
1943.
Bye
Althea
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Hello Althea and Lu,
Thanks for dropping in and offering to help ;D
And apologies for such a complicated thread - I was just trying to provide some background ! Yes, Althea, that is the same family.
Let's try to simplify things. :o ??? ::)
I am now trying to trace the origins of Jane Newson/Lewis.
First mention of her is as mother of six Newson children, 1877-1886.
1877/15474 Newson George Jane Alfred in Auckland
1879/1764 Newson Angelina Jane Alfred in Napier
1880/10056 Newson William Jane Alfred in Napier
1882/2906 Newson Christiana Jane Alfred in Napier
1884/7074 Newson Sarah Jane Alfred in Napier
1886/11137 Newson Alfred Jane Alfred in Napier
There are several mentions of the couple, Alfred and Jane Newson, at PapersPast, in Auckland in 1877.
Then in 1887, from Napier, there is mention of the death of Jane Lewis, age 29 or 30 at Napier Hospital. Cemetery records show she had issue 3M and 3F, which fits with Jane Newson above. Also mentions she is from Ireland, and had been in NZ 13 yrs. The newspaper report however, said she was from England.
Because I cannot find any other reference to Jane Newson/Lewis after 1887 I'm assuming (?) this was Alfred's wife - although there is no record of a marriage either.
Can anyone spot any other clues to help establish the identity of the mother Jane Newson mentioned above?
John B
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Hello John....
Late to the party but just making sure I understand what's what.
Are you saying that the George NEWSON born in 1877 in Auckland (BDM1877/15474) and the Alfred Lawrence LEWIS who died in Wellington in 1943 (BDM1943/31655) are the same person.
That's really impressive detective work linking them, considering they are two totally different names.
And now you want to find out about the parents of George/Alfred, namely Alfred NEWSON and Jane ?
Plus you think that Alfred NEWSON is the Alfred who came over on the La Hogue in 1874 with his first wife Sarah E ?
And that Sarah died in 1875 and is buried somewhere near Masterton.
And that Jane (originally from Ireland or England) died in 1887 and is buried in Napier (?)
Whew :-)
Regards
Beg
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Deleted post
Red herring
Sorry
Beg
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Are you saying that the George NEWSON born in 1877 in Auckland (BDM1877/15474) and the Alfred Lawrence LEWIS who died in Wellington in 1943 (BDM1943/31655) are the same person.
That's really impressive detective work linking them, considering they are two totally different names.
Hi,
I'm still trying to break through the brick wall outlined in my previous thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,503491
Hi Beg
More detail available in John's previous thread. :)
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Hi John
Yes, I agree, the George (later known as Alfred Lawrence LEWIS), is most likely to be the son born to Alfred and Jane NEWSON. :) [And that we can rule out, the infant Alfred who arrived on the La Hogue, 1874.] ;)
My curiosity was with the man Alfred NEWSON (arr. La Hogue) ... and the Napier electoral roll discoveries you made (in that both A... LEWIS and A.... NEWSON were carpenters.)
But anyway we've both reached a similar conclusion, that there exists the possibility that Alfred NEWSON the widower of Sarah NEWSON, could be the man who goes on to father children with Jane. ;)
~ Lu
see next >
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Don't want to dwell on Alfred NEWSON per the "La Hogue" ... cos that ain't what you're asking about here. :D
But ... there's this record also.
NZ Birth
1875 - NEWSON - Richard Edward Smith
Parents: Sarah and Alfred NEWSON
Place of birth would need to be checked .
He was born on 9 September 1875 - two months before the death of Sarah Elizabeth NEWSON on 13 November 1875.
Have not been able to find anything further relating to this child (nor info for the children - Robert, Susannah, Alfred - arr. "La Hogue").
* Were they "adopted" out ... had changes of name ?
Did this allow for their father Alfred to move on ?
~ Lu
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Name change -- NEWSON / LEWIS
Hi John
Electoral Rolls -- Wellington area (from index only) :
1900 - HUNTER - Margaret Watt
1905-06 - at Newtown, Wellington
LEWIS - Margaret WATT (though not yet married)
LEWIS - Alfred Lawrence
and ...
NEWSON - Alfred ???
Any idea who this Alfred NEWSON is ?
[A listing also for this man - 1911 & 1914 -- Wellington Central electorate. ]
~ Lu
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Name change - NEWSON / LEWIS
* Were there any school records for the children of Jane and Alfred ?
What surname did the children use in their younger days ?
Angelina seems to have stuck with NEWSON.
[Some curious birth entries for her pre-nuptial children. ]
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Hi Beg,
Sorry for the delay in reply - computer problems have taken precedence!
Yes, Newson and Lewis are the same persons, and it looks like three generations used this duplicate naming. Traced originally thanks to great help from Lu and spades. Complicated by BDM's trick of not listing them under either Newson or Lewis, but only as "Newson CKA Lewis" - the whole lot needs to be entered to get a strike.
Yes, to your last three questions.
John B
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Hi Lu,
Thanks for taking a second look at this, and your confirmation of my guesswork. Your suggestions and clues are always helpful.
Also, thanks for finding Richard Edward Smith Newson - I found him on microfiche b 1875 folio 1822 and born in Masterton ! I wonder where the Smith comes into the picture, and more importantly where does the Lewis connection fit ???
Still working on retrieving my genealogy program and records (computer problems) so will look into your other comments re electoral rolls and school records when back up and working again. Meantime, Thanks !
John B
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1905-06 - at Newtown, Wellington
LEWIS - Margaret WATT (though not yet married)
LEWIS - Alfred Lawrence
and ...
NEWSON - Alfred ???
Any idea who this Alfred NEWSON is ?
[A listing also for this man - 1911 & 1914 -- Wellington Central electorate. ]
Hi John
Just checked out the above ^ "Alfred NEWSON" whilst doing some other look-ups.
1905-06 -- he is with a William Henry and Maria NEWSON at 18 Waterloo Ave -- occupation, salesman.
[Very likely he is the son of this couple ? ]
1911 - now married to an Edith Mary, he is at a Devon street address -- has same occupation. [William H. and Maria now residing at Ghuznee Street. ]
So we can cross this Alfred N. - off the "list". :D
~ Lu
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Hi Lu,
Thanks for the extra details. Not sure we can cross him off, yet, as there were two sons of Alfred named Alfred :o One arrived on La Hogue, 1874 age 4mths. the other born to Jane and Alftred in 1886.
I've receioved further details on Jane Lewis from NZSG - proving once again that it pays to check, check and check again! ;D
Details of her death from Napier Council:
Plot Purchase Details, Purchaser D/O W & S Nee Scott.
BORN IN IRELAND. Funeral Dir note IN NZ 13 YRS. 3M, 3F.
Details from NZSG:
Daughter of William and Sarah SHANNON nee SCOTT. :D
Born Ireland. In NZ 13 years.
Married at Auckland at age 18 years to Alfred LEWIS. :D
Children: 3 male, 3 female.
Apparently taken from the same source, but the second information had vital information of her parents and marriage.
John B
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Name change -- NEWSON / LEWIS
Hi John
Electoral Rolls -- Wellington area (from index only) :
1900 - HUNTER - Margaret Watt
1905-06 - at Newtown, Wellington
LEWIS - Margaret WATT (though not yet married)
LEWIS - Alfred Lawrence
and ....
** CORRECTION ** to above ^
Just deleting my earlier comment - had been confused as to the year the couple had married -- now see it was 1901.
Sorry. :-[
~ Lu
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I've receioved further details on Jane Lewis from NZSG - proving once again that it pays to check, check and check again! ;D
Details of her death from Napier Council:
Plot Purchase Details, Purchaser D/O W & S Nee Scott.
BORN IN IRELAND. Funeral Dir note IN NZ 13 YRS. 3M, 3F.
Hi John
Interesting. :D
Confused about ... "Plot Purchase Details"
"Purchaser D/o W & S (SHANNON -- presumably ?) nee SCOTT"
Does that mean ...
* The purchaser is "Jane LEWIS - d/o W & S etc .. " ???
* OR ... has the information about Jane's parentage, simply been added to the same line on which the plot purchaser's details would normally be recorded. ???
~ Lu
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Mmm ... I'm of the view that there is likely an error re: details of plot purchaser. :-\
* Jane LEWIS is only 30 ... has six children and a "husband" ... her death might have been expected, but where does she get the money, and why would she purchase her own plot ?
Is Jane LEWIS's mother present in New Zealand at any time ??
There is this death ... might be worth checking to see where it was registered ?
1897 - SHANNON - Sarah - aged 73 years (bc 1824)
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Hi Lu,
Yes, good point.
Fortunately, Napier Council sent me their full record entry.
I suspect that some details have been entered into a convenient 'space' rather than under a correct heading. So...........
Purchaser D/O W & S Nee Scott.
Clergyman BORN IN IRELAND.
Funeral Dir note IN NZ 13 YRS. 3M, 3F.
NZSG details had no headings, just a string of sentences, including those shown above.
I think we can be confident she was d/o William and Sarah Shannon, and discard plot purchaser.
Cannot see the 1897 Sarah Shannon listed on Burial Locator, but following your suggestion, there is another possibility perhaps, Sarah Shannon d 1937 age 84 (bc 1853) at Northern Cem, Dunedin .
John B
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Cannot see the 1897 Sarah Shannon listed on Burial Locator, but following your suggestion, there is another possibility perhaps, Sarah Shannon d 1937 age 84 (bc 1853) at Northern Cem, Dunedin .
Hi John
This 1937 Sarah SHANNON was a widow, born Scotland, and had been in NZ, 65 years. Buried with James SHANNON (a native of Canada).
I'll check the microfiche (sometime this week) to see where the 1897 (SHANNON) death was registered.
------------
Of course it would not have been unusual for Jane to have arrived in NZ without her family. [Many very young Irish and English girls were shipped to our shores (as parts of various immigration schemes), to address the imbalance of the sexes ... and ultimately to boost the population.] ;)
~ Lu
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Thanks Lu,
I checked the La Hogue passenger list on the offchance she might have met Alfred there, but not listed.
Yes, have come across quite a few single Irish lasses arriving in NZ in my searches - and very hard to trace them back any further than a passenger list. ::)
Have confirmed Alfred Lewis/Newson d 1949 is the son of Alfred b 1886.
But confusing !!
From BDM
1949/27673 Newsom [sic] CKA Lewis Alfred 63Y
From Waikumete
Surname : LEWIS
Given Names: ALFRED
From Burial Locator
Surname NEWSON
Given Names Alfred Lewis
What a tangled tree we weave! :D
John B
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re: Reply # 14
Alfred NEWSON - (living with a William Henry and Maria NEWSON - Wellington, 1905-06 ) :
Not sure we can cross him off, yet, ....
I think we can now. ;)
This Alfred NEWSON is mentioned, along with his brothers, in his father's death notice
("Evening Post" - 10 August 1942 -- William Henry NEWSON).
His parents didn't marry until 1886 and his birth was registered under his mother's maiden surname.
1882 - NORRIS - Alfred Hill
Mother: Maria Father: N/R
Alfred NEWSON moved to Christchurch at some point - (his first wife and son are buried at Bromley).
Death
1971 - NEWSON - Alfred -- aged 88 years (bc 1883)
[Probate record held at Archives NZ, Christchurch :
NEWSON - Alfred - Christchurch - Retired Salesman - 1971 ]
~ Lu
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Hi John
I think there is a very good chance that the following may be the arrival of Jane LEWIS (NEWSON) nee SHANNON
..... despite the age given on passenger list. ;)
"Dover Castle" -- arrived at Auckland - 24 August 1875
SHANNON
* William - aged 22 - Farmer
* Jane - 24 - servant
* Sarah - 18 - servant
Place of origin for all -- Co. Mayo
The passenger list image can be viewed at FamilySearch (NZ Immigration) :
[It shows the above as a family group -- L 49-10-0 having been paid in total for their fares.]
~ Lu
see next >>
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SHANNON family per "Dover Castle" - 1875
"In favour" of this being the correct Jane :
-- death (cemetery) record gives Ireland as her birthplace
-- she'd been in NZ for 13 years (@ 1887) est. date of arrival 1874
-- her parents named (on death record) as William and Sarah .... it's very probable she had siblings with these same names
"Against" ...
-- age given as 24 years (1875) ... born circa 1851 ???
But bear in mind that the only "approximate date of birth" you have for Jane (so far), comes from her death record. ;D
~ Lu
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Hi Lu,
Once again you have come up with some excellent results ;D
I'm just trying to fit these new details into the picture and see what can be verified.
This has been a nightmare family, but we all love a challenge, don't we !!
Thank you
John B
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Well, what an interesting family!
Alfred Newson was a builder and was married to Sarah Elizabeth Newson. She died c1875, buried in Masterton. They had a daughter named Sarah Newson who lived with Charles Frederick Langdon.
They ran the clifton boarding house in Bulls, Rangitikei, New Zealand as well as Charley boy was a baker. Sarah and Charles had a very large family but never married! George their son took over the bakery around 1903-1906, when Charles Frederick Langdon mysteriously disappeared. I have never been able to find him. There are Charles Langdons buried in Wellington but not HIM!
After his disappearance, Sarah married Charles Martin Dawson of Oroua Downs, Rangitikei.
I knew Sarah as a very young child but she died in the early 1960's. There has always been a confusion over her age. She supposedly arrived on the "La Hogue" in 1874 but she is shown as a minor - living in the young ladies quarters - on the boat ????? FUNNY. When she died she was meant to be in her 90's, but we all thought she was more likely to be over 100 years old!
To this day, we have never found out what happened to Charles Frederick, but we do know that he scarpered out of the Rangitikei rather quickly, with the help of a constable (we think), that seems to be the rumour.
Sarah had brothers named
Thomas who was adopted out to the Blinkbornes - I know that history
Robert lived in around Rangitikei - He only had one arm......story was that it was shot off!
Susannah Maude Newson ....................Disappeared............adopted
another sister - can't remember her name off pat.......in amongst my filing somewhere -goodness knows where ........??
It is believed that some of the children were adopted by the kite faimily - near wellington.
Charles Frederick Langdon owned land in Mangaroa, upper hutt. This is where he met Sarah Newson. Charles Frederick Langdon's previous life is a bit of a mystery as well.
His first wife Emma Sabina Dye, died around the 1870's. After that he married Clara Dillon.
That marriage lasted a very short time. There was a divorce around 1886, I think By 1890 Sarah had had a child by him and had moved up to Bulls, Rangitikei.
Charles' past is very sketchy. We know he married in London to Emma Sabina. We know who his parents were but a little difficult prior to that.
I have a marriage certificate here of a Alfred Newson marrying a Jane Chittock/Shannon, not sure what the name was, but I am going to have to find it......it may help!
Well sorry folks, this makes the plot even thicker......help me if you can....I have been working on this whole mystery - Newson included - for 30 odd years.......................HELPl
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Hi John,
Someone was wondering about a connection with smith - re Newon CKA Lewis
try: 1864 Norwich (Norfolk) Thomas Hunter Newson marrying Emma Smith ??
It's worth a try.
I am also trying to trace Alfred Newson ............a bit of a lad I think.
He is very hard to trace.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra
... welcome. :)
Hoping John will pop back to this thread soon. [We're missing him ... expect though he's soaking up the Nelson sunshine ? ]
Mmm ... I'm thinking that the word *completed* in this topic title, it should be replaced by *complicated*. ;D
I've read through it all again to refresh my memory, and have done some more digging.
Have a whole lot more info, (in respect of NEWSON/LEWIS and the Sarah's ), which I'll add tomorrow.
In the meantime, do you happen to have details from the cert. (or printout), for the marriage of Sarah NEWSON to Charles Martin DAWSON, please ?
~ Lu
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We sent for a cert, but it never gave us a lot of detail. It showed Sarah as Sarah Newson and it did not name her parents as far as I can remember. I will try to find it, but goodness knows where it is.
I would like to know what happened to her sister, Susannah Maude. That is a real mystery.
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Hi again
> Do you maybe have a birth certificate for one of Sarah and Charles Frederick's children - which confirms Sarah NEWSON's place of birth ?
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I have a lot of detailed (new) information for the NEWSON family who arrived per the "La Hogue" (1874) which I'll begin posting shortly ... just need to get it into some sort of order so that it can be followed easily. ;)
~ Lu
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Hi again
> Do you maybe have a birth certificate for one of Sarah and Charles Frederick's children - which confirms Sarah NEWSON's place of birth ?
... just adding ... Sarahs' age (as shown on birth cert. for one of her children) would be helpful too.
;D
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I can remember all the details as being inconsistent. Every child, when it was born, the mother's age seemed different. When Sarah died, she died in 1964. email me (*)
Sandra
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Hi Sandra
It will be to your ultimate benefit to add any additional information you have, to this thread.
That way, if others have anything to contribute / share, they can also be party to helping solve the puzzle. :)
Also RootsChat asks that we don't publish our email addresses in these threads (to avoid spamming etc. etc.).
Cheers
~ Lu
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I have sent for documents over the years and they tell us nothing.
Sarah Elizabeth Newson Wife/Mother is buried at St Johns, Upper Hutt.
There appears to be no headstone.
Sarah (daughter) married Charles Martin Dawson and lived at Orua Downs, Bulls, Rangitikei.
That was after Charles Frederick Langdon disappeared.
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Hello again
Don't worry too much about Sarah Elizabeth and Sarah NEWSON, as I said, I have new information on their backgrounds which I'll add here, because I'm sure that John will be interested in that aspect. ;)
Earlier you had given an account about Sarah (Newson / Langdon) - where you'd mentioned she had a brother named Thomas who'd been adopted out ... and that another brother, Robert, had lived "around Rangitikei". ??
I haven't been able to find "a brother named Thomas" for Sarah ... so I'm merely curious about what info you already have and whether your Sarah is indeed the same girl who arrived on the "La Hogue" in 1874. Hence my asking about info on her marriage to Charles Martin DAWSON ... or if there were any clues from her children's births certs. which might give an indication as to her real age at given times or confirm her place of birth.
[The Sarah NEWSON I have (and NEWSON wasn't actually her birth name), was born late in 1858. So if she is the same Sarah who died in 1964, then she was approaching her 106th birthday ! ] ;)
~ Lu
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Yes we realize that she would have had to have been 106 years........BUT I wouldn't take any notice of all the ages that you have found, because they are all wrong, even names were wrong.
I wish I could discuss this on a easier forum, as there is just too much to discuss.
I have also found a KITE marrying a BLINKHORNE, in nz, which adds to the marvels of wonder.
Are you actually connected to this family history or are you researching for John?
Everytime Sarah had a child, she was a differenct age....eg sometimes her young child had a younger mother then her older child. It is a real scramble. Do you have more information to do with Sarah's sisters and brothers? Thomas died in Wanganui and Robert is buried in Palmerston NOrth at Kelvin Grove, same as his sister Sarah......re Sarah Dawson.
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My Late Courins wife always said that Sarah look a lot older than 96 (I think) when she died in 1964.
She was very old..........maybe older than 96 but going by quoted ages, not 106....
All lies along the way I think. Her name varied also, and Charley boy was the informant of the births.
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So, can anyone suggest any way to trace the origins of Alfred and Jane Lewis/Newson ....
NEWSON
The following information relates to the NEWSON family group who departed London per the "La Hogue" on 20 February 1874 - arriving at Wellington, 26 May 1874.
[They were, namely - Alfred NEWSON (36 - bc 1838) Place of Origin: Suffolk, / Sarah E. (33 - bc 1841) / Sarah (15 - bc 1859) / Robert (4) / Susannah (3) and Alfred NEWSON (aged 4 months). ]
Hi John,
What follows, (and it's lengthy ;D), won't help with determining why the LEWIS name was adopted - but will show that the Alfred NEWSON above had the birth name of SMITH ... and that he also (maybe briefly ?) masqueraded as WEBB, (which was the married surname of his future wife, Sarah Elizabeth). :o ;D
So, will begin with their marriage in London -- which took place just three days before they set sail for NZ !
Church of St. James the Great - Bethnal Green (Middlesex)
17 February 1874
Alfred Newson SMITH - bachelor - full age - occupation: Carpenter - residing at Bethnal Green
Father: Alfred NEWSON - Carpenter
Sarah WEBB - full age - Widow - residing Bethnal Green
Father: Thomas STEVENSON - Basket Maker
Witnesses: Charlotte STEVENSON and ? Lavinia ? (looks like) EDWARD (EDWARDS?)
continuing >
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Alfred NEWSON
[I haven't managed to find a marriage for his parents as yet. ]
His birth registration (at Suffolk) as Alfred Newson SMITH can be found at Free BMD and there is also this baptism record.
Alfred Newson SMITH
Birthdate : 29 December 1837
Baptised at Theberton, Suffolk, ENG. on 19 August 1838
Mother's Name : Betsy SMITH
-------------------------------------------
Alfred's brother, Matthew was born on 28 April 1840 and was also baptised at Theberton, his surname though was recorded as NEWSON.
NEWSON - Matthew - bapt. 7 June 1840, Theberton, Suffolk
Parents: Alfred NEWSON and Betsey
[Betsey appears to have died sometime after 1853 : Later records (census and baptisms), show other offspring of this union [details later] ... and that Alfred NEWSON (senior) had a 2nd "wife" and many more children. ]
next >
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Alfred NEWSON (Alfred Newson SMITH) and Sarah WEBB :
1871 - Essex - West Ham - Parish of Holy Trinity, Barking Road
- # 73 Woodstock Street
WEBB - Alfred - head - married - 34 - Carpenter & joiner - b. Suffolk - Theberton
Sarah WEBB* - wife - 30 - married - born Middlesex - Shadwell
* In the "Rank, profession, occupation" column alongside Sarah's name is written, "his wife".
Sarah WEBB - dau - 12 - scholar -b. Middlesex - Limehouse
Leonard WEBB** - son - 8 - b. Shadwell
Mary WEBB - dau - 6 - b. Middlesex - Bow
Robert WEBB - son - 2 - b. Middlesex - Stepney
Susanna WEBB - dau - aged 11 weeks - b. Essex - West Ham
Sarah STEVENSON*** - mother - 62 - Widow? (looks like) - Basket Maker's wife - b. Shadwell
------------------------------
[Notes: * = It's unusal to see the words "his wife" written separately like that - it's almost as if some further verification was required ? Of course she wasn't his legal wife until 3 years later.
** = Leonard WEBB (8) was the son of Sarah by her first marriage. He remained in England. (Further details to come.)
*** = Sarah STEVENSON was the mother of Sarah WEBB. ]
next >
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Just veering off course slightly with info that may be of interest to LANGDON researchers ?
1871 Census - Essex - West Ham
Sarah WEBB - dau - 12 - scholar - b. Middlesex - Limehouse [bc 1859 ]
Leonard WEBB - son - 8 - born Middlesex - Shadwell
[In the household of Alfred WEBB (bc 1838) and Sarah WEBB (bc 1841), his wife.]
-------------------------------------
Although the head of the household in which above children were residing in 1871 is shown as Alfred WEBB, all other information given for him, suggests he is Alfred NEWSON (a.k.a. Alfred Newson SMITH).
This Alfred NEWSON was not though the birth father of Sarah WEBB (bc 1859) or her brother, Leonard WEBB (bc 1863).
Sarah WEBB (bc 1841) (a.k.a. Sarah Elizabeth WEBB, nee STEVENSON) was previously married to William James WEBB :
Tower Hamlets - Parish of St. George in the East
Marriage Date : 5 October 1857
William James WEBB - full age - bach - Fellowship Porter
living at 3 John Street
Father: Benjamin WEBB - Fellowship Porter
Sarah Elizabeth STEVENSON - full age - spinster
living at 6 John Place
Father: Thomas STEVENSON - Basket Maker
The bride signed X = her mark.
Witnesses: James HOLLAND and Mary Ann DUKE (signed X = her mark)
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Children of William James WEBB and Sarah Elizabeth (nee STEVENSON) .... see next post >
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Children of William James WEBB & Sarah Elizabeth (nee STEVENSON) :
All baptisms at Tower Hamlets - Stepney - St. Thomas
- Sarah Elizabeth WEBB
Born : 9 November 1858
Baptised : 5 December 1858
D/o William James WEBB & Sarah Elizabeth WEBB of 4 St Anne's Row, Mary Street, Limehouse
Occupation (Father) - Fellowship Porter
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- William James WEBB*
Baptised: 19 August 1860
Parents: William James and Sarah ELizabeth WEBB of 4 Newcastle Place - Occ: Fellowship Porter
[* There is a burial record which may relate to this child - William James WEBB - 8 years {bc 1860} - Parish of Twickenham, St Mary the Virgin - buried 17 September 1868 (Address: Back Lane ) ?? ]
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- Leonard Richard WEBB
Baptised : 19 April 1863
S/o William James and Sarah Elizabeth WEBB of Shadwell - Occupation: Porter
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next >
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WEBB
1861 - Middlesex - Shadwell
- # 4 Pike's? Hill
WEBB
- William J. - Head - 21 - marr. - Fellowship Porter - b. Shadwell
- Sarah E. - wife - 21 - b. Bethnal Green ?
- Sarah E. - dau - 2 b. Limehouse
- William J. - son - 8 months - born Mile End
[Georgiana RIDDLE - 18 - Servant - b. Wapping and George FABER - 18 - Lodger - Fellowship Porter - born N/K ... are in same household. ]
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I have info for Sarah STEVENSON (WEBB / NEWSON) - her parents and siblings, which I'll add at a later time.
~ Lu
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Hi John
Have much more to come for family of Alfred NEWSON (b. 1838, Suffolk).
Need to take a break right now, so will continue tomorrow.
~ Lu
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I find this all rather extraordinary but in the least not at all surprised!
Smith again! Charles Frederick's father was George Langdon and married Elizabeth SMITH.
That family's details are very vague also, as in changing names to suit their lifestyle.
The poat thickens but the searching does not stop at that!...........
I almost think that these peope.....Langdon and Newson knew each other in London.
Charles Frederick was a baker in Wisbech, Cambridgeshire.NEWSON
Charles set up as a baker, operating a business at Tory Street, Wellingtont in 1890 It is not clear whether he actually owned the business or whether he worked for someone else, at the time.
There seems to be a bit of a mystery. Later on in years, there was a baker operating in Wellington by the name of Hart Langdon. I think There were Hart family/neighbour connections in England and I still believe that
this gentleman was related or even in fact was Charles Frederick.
I may think that I am going off track here a bit, but the langdon family and the Newson family have so much in common....... and running away from something!
Thanks for the information..
I will stay in touch.
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Hi, saw the Newson/Lewis name and believe it to be the name of my great great grandfather. The young Alfred (Tom) on the La Hogue is my great grandfather. From what my dad said Alfred Newson left the family after Sarah, his wife, died. Not entirely sure about the children, Richard, Susannah, Robert, as Tom was a baby when all this happened but he was taken in, not legally adopted, as a Blinkhorne. Known as Thomas Blinkhorne, born i believe late 1873, he married Nellie Gray 1900. They then had my grandfather Archie Thomas (Bay), prior to his birth were Elsie, Evelyn, Len, Ivy, Lorna and the youngest being doris. My Dad, quite a few years ago, made efforts to establish that his grandfather (Tom) was born in England. The rational at the time was patrial rights. Any info on the Newson family before leaving Engand and where they were dispersed upon arrival in New Zealand would be greatly appreciated. ;D
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Hi...........I am well aware of a lot of information to do with Thomas Alfred Blinkhorne.
I am a Gt Grand-daughter of Sarah Newson who was meant to be Alfred Newson's daughter.
28 Jan 1877 Church of St Matthews, Masterton. Yes I knew who fosteed him and he used to drive the Cobb and Co Coach, once for the Right hon. Richard Seddon. He lived in Wanganui and I believe he may be buried at Aramoho Cemetery. He had a brother by the name of Robert Newson who was a rabbit hunter in lived in Taihape. Sarah, their sister lived in Bulls, and Foxton. She had two spouses, 1. Charles Frederick Langdon and the other Charles Dawson. Years ago, I met up with a lady in Te Awamutu (wear I live) by the name of Mrs Wright, who was a daughter Thomas Blinkhorne She told me a lot of stories about him. Robert is buried in Kelvin Grove, Palmerston North, so is Sarah Dawson. There was a sister Susannah, but I have never been able to trace her.
I know the kites were involved somewhere along the line and I have noticed that wthere are Blinkhornse buried in NZ with the Kite name as a second christian name.
I was searching on the net yesterday and it so happens that my Charles Frederick Langdon was AKA WEBB........I will have to find that article again.....the plot thickens! If anyone knows anything about the WEBB family or what happened to Susannah, wouldn't we be ever so lucky to hear from them. Samblink - keep in touch!