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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Northumberland Lookup Requests => Northumberland => England => Northumberland Completed Look up Requests => Topic started by: liz_bern on Thursday 04 August 11 06:35 BST (UK)
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Hi everyone, I am wondering if anyone can help with locating the birth of my GGrandfather Thomas Johnson. Yes I hear you all now saying not another common name, just about as bad as Smith and Brown. I have located his marriage in Gateshead, Durham on 14 Sept 1880 to Ellen Richardson. It says he was born in 1854 which his death certificate also confirms. He died in New Zealand in 1937 and at the time of his death he had 8 children still alive.
I have found records in NZ that confirm there were 5 children I can connect to them. The first would have been born either 1880 or 1881 named Margaret then I cant confirm any more births until 1884 (Matthew), 1886 (Ellen), 1888 (Jane my Grandmother), 1889 (Minnie) all born in England (my grandmother having been born in Stockton-on-Tees. Another birth I have found in NZ is Mary Ethel born 1895.
They were supposed to have come to NZ in either 1888 or 1889 but I cant find any records of their shipping list. They ended up in Coromandel, NZ where Thomas was a mining Engineer, his wife Ellen, or Helen as she is listed on his death certificate plus headstone, died in Coromandel in 1897 and is buried there but is mentioned on his headstone where he is buried in Auckland.
Helens father was George Richardson, and Thomas' parents were Matthew and Margaret Johnson. I think I have found Thomas and Ellen in the 1881 census living in No Side 1 Victoria Terrace,m Haydon, Northumberland. It says he is a Driver of standing engine. His death certificate says he was an engine driver so that all makes sense. It also says that Thomas was born in Plunderherheath, Northumberland, but when I google that there is no such place.
I hope this all makes sense, I cant find any of the births in England and guess there could have been more.
Cheers Liz
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Hi
Plunderheath is near Haydon Bridge:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0eiq/
Alternative map:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0eir/
gnu
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This might be the family in 1861, given his parents' names:
West Brockenheugh*, Chapelry of Haydon * very close to Plunderheath
RG09/3863/22/10
Matthew Johnson, 45, lead ore miner, b. Warden
Margaret, 39, b. Kirkhaugh
Jane, 21
John, 18, engine keeper
Joseph, 16, lead ore washer or worker
Matthew, 14, -do-
Mary. 9
Thomas, 7
Robt, 5
William, 3
Edward, 1
Ann Stephenson, niece, 11, b. ?
Children all b. Warden
Info about Warden:
http://www.genuki.bpears.org.uk/NBL/Warden/index.html
Just adding this for completeness:
1871:
Railway Cottage, Haydon
RG10/5150/4/1
Matthew Johnson, 55, lead miner, b. Haydon
Margaret,49, b. Kirkhaugh
Matthew, 24, lead miner
Mary. 19, dressmaker
Thomas,17, lead ore washer
Robert, 15, -do-
William, 13, -do-
Edward, 11, -do-
Samuel, 5
Children all born Haydon
and
1851
Matthew, Margaret and the older children in 1851 at Plunder Heath
Plunder Heath, Haydon
HO107/2415/248/12
Matthew Johnson, 35, leadminer
Margaret, 29,
Jane, 10
John, 8,
Joseph, 6
Matthew, 4
all down as b. Warden
gnu
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I think the family emigrated later than you think!
Found this in 1891:
Reference RG12, Piece 4049, Folio 150, Page 41
16 St Johns Place, Stockton On Tees, County Durham
Johnson, Thomas Head M 37 Stationary Engineman b Haydon Bridge
Johnson, Eleanor Wife F 29 b Newsham
Johnson, Margaret Daughter F 9 Scholar b Haydon Bridge
Johnson, George Son M 8 Scholar b Haydon Bridge
Johnson, Matthew Son M 6 Scholar b Newsham
Johnson, Eleanor Daughter F 4 b Stockton, Durham
Johnson, Jane Daughter F 2 b Stockton, Durham
Johnson, Minnie Daughter F 1 b Stockton, Durham
All, except last 3 born in Northumberland
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Two possible birth registrations for Thomas:
Sept q, 1855 Hexham, 10b p 205
or
Dec q, 1855, Hexham, 10b, p 176 (as Thomas Bulman Johnson) - this was not him, I've found this one in Prudoe with a different family
gnu
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This looks like Ellen in 1871:
Reference RG10, 5132, 61, 23
North Station Row, Newsham, Earsdon
Richardson, George Head M 32 Coal Miner b Morton Square, Northumberland
Richardson, Eleanor Wife F 30 b Morton Square
Richardson, Ellan Daughter F 8 Scholar b Newsham
Richardson, Susannah Daughter F 6 Scholar b Newsham
Richardson, Elizabeth Daughter F 4 b Newsham
Richardson, Alexander Son M 2 b Kitty Brewster
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I've found a family of Johnsons, headed by a Thomas, leaving London for Wellington in 1895 - correct birth year but ..... :-\
I can give full details, if you'd like.
gnu
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Gnu,
I saw that too - but on the list he is described as a carpenter?
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It's the only one showing which was why I didn't give full details. I've checked via Australia but none showing.
People often didn't give their correct occupation for many reasons so has to be considered.
I'll see if I can find any others on another listing.
gnu
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I wasn't criticising!! Honest! ;D ;D
Just letting people know that I had considered that shipping list, but at this moment decided to ignore it. And why!
I would have thought that a Stationary Engine man was more useful to NZ than a carpenter?
Carpenters are ten-a-penny!! ;D
So can't understand why (if it's him) the change of occupation? ???
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I didn't say you were, Kevin :)
People say and do lots of things that we can't uderstand ;D
gnu
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The ages/initials do tie in with the 1891 census:
Thomas 40
Mrs 31 - under!
Miss M 11
Mr G 10
Master M 9
Miss (?) 7
Miss J 6
Miss M 4
Master S 1
Amended to add the 1891 census ages:
Ages at January 1895 and 1891 census
Thomas 40 37
Mrs 31 29
Miss M 11 9
Mr G 10 8
Master M 9 6
Miss E (?) 7 4
Miss J 6 2
Miss M 4 1
Master S 1 (not born)
Depart London 24 January 1895 for Wellington Ship - Tainui
gnu
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Wow, you lot are absolutely awesome. Yes it all makes sense. These are definitely them. Thank you so much. Just as an aside, my paternal gg grandfather came from Scotland, he was in the army then was listed later as a bartender or suchlike but when he listed on the ship to come to NZ he is listed as a carpenter but to my knowledge he never did any carpentry. Just a coincidence or something, dont know, maybe if the person writing up their occupation didnt know what it was they just put down carpenter for something to fill in the gap.
Once again thanks so much for all that, I will continue to look at this end.
Cheers Liz
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Hello Liz
I chanced upon your entry when I Googled "Thomas Johnson Helen Richardson"
Thomas Johnson was my G.grandfather also, my grandfather was Matthew Johnson, and my father Cyril Johnson, his son.
I have collected some information on our family, and have a family tree on Ancestry.com.
I would be interested in comparing notes you have collected, and can organise free access to my Ancestry.com site if you want.
I have found it hard to obtain very much information about the girl members of Thomas's family, and did not even know about most of them until I started this research.
I remember young Thomas, and Ethel Mary (known as Dolly) as the lived with my grandparents for a while, but never knew any of the others.
I hope this gets to you and I hear back from you.
PS I live in Auckland.
Cheers
Bob Johnson
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Hi Bob, yes I was doing a bit of research on this family. My grandmother was Jean or Jane Johnson who was Dolly's sister. If you could give me an email address I could send you all that I have managed to find out. Cheers Liz
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Bobdj,
Don't be tempted to put your email address in a posting!
You saw yourself how easy it was to google these posts! ;D
Instead, make 2 more posts - anything, even just "Hello"!
Then the Personal/Private Message system will be available to you.
And you can send your email address via that ;D
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Hi Liz
Thanks for replying.
I will contact you soon.
Bob
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Thanks for the warning re putting addresses on line.
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I need some help with this family. I agree with the facts for Thomas's family, but I am doubting my facts about his mother Margaret.
I had her as a Margaret West b. 1822 and married Matthew Johnson 5 February 1844, but as Jane & John were born before this, I am probably wrong. Also, Liz says she has a copy of the death certificate for Thomas who died in NZ 1936, and it gives his mother's name as Margaret Smith.
Like Liz, Thomas is my great grandfather.
My information is Margaret & Matthew emigrated to NZ in the 1880's to Otago, Matthew died in 1888 and Margaret 1903.