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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Derbyshire => England => Derbyshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: matts on Monday 11 July 11 15:41 BST (UK)
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Looking for parents of John Wass l believe born North wingfeild Derbyshire 1704, Thank you, Regards June
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Hi June
Think this is your John.
John Wass birth 29th April 1704 at North Wingfield, Derbyshire
Father is John Wass
No mention of a Mothers name.
regards
Sandymc
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In the same date range in North Wingfield, 2 John Wasses having Children;
To JOHN/REBBECCA;
JOSEPH 11 Dec 1706
MARY 04 Sept 1709, Died 10 Oct 1711
MARY 22 Sept 1712
ANNE 10 July 1715
REBECCA 16 Dec 1718, Died 07 Sept 1724
To JOHN/ANN;
HANNAH 06 May 1705
JOSEPH 1707 (no exact date given)
CHRISTIAN 21 Aug 1709
THOMAS 07 Jan 1711
We also have;
JOHN Wass, 23 August 1674, Father JOHN Wass
Marriage;
Johem WASS
Rebbecam MOTTERSHAWE, 02 February 1703, Chesterfield, Derbyshire
(All Records IGI Extracted)
Trish :)
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Hi
According to the NW transcript the mother maiden name was Rebecca Mottershaw. Their abode on the baptisms entries was Pilsley.
There is a burial for Rebecca 25.11.1770 at NW but abode was given as South Wingfield.
There are a couple of possible burials for John
12.9. 1729 Pilsley
28 2. 1712 Pilsley (John senior)
Carol
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possible baptisms for John
25.3. 1671 to Thomas Wass abode Pilsley
16.3. 1673 to Ralph Wass abode Woodhead
27.12. 1683 to Henry Wass abode Woodhead
23.8. 1674 to John Wass & Elizabeth Mottershaw abode Pilsley
possible baptisms for Rebecca
11.7. 1688 to William & Mary abode Wingfield
3.10.1678 to Robert abode Clay Lane
Carol
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Thank you for all that information, l think the John Wass born 1704 parents must be Father John Wass Mother Ann? as l have a sister of John's named Hannah also a brother Joseph, so points to his parents being John & Ann Thank you so much for your help much appreciated
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is there a baptism for Radulphus Wass, John's father, around 1635
and a marriage for his parents Ralph Wasse and Isabella Wasse, who were cousins, I think. I really need some proof to firm this up and am coming up to Derby in August - are there old graves still around in Wingfield and Morton churches?
regards Wendy Bowman
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Hi Wendy
Welcome to Rootschat
This could be his baptism
Radulphus Wasse 8.3. 1635 to Radulpi Wasse at Morton
Sorry I can't anwer your question re the old graves
Carol
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you are a star!!!!
anything on Henry Wasse abt 1570 birth?
I am in Bournmouth if you have anything down here to search for.
Wendy
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Hi
I can't see anything on the NW or Morton transcript.
Sorry
Carol
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Hi again
Did find a mention of a Harry Wasse but not his birth but the Father of
Ralph Wasse bapt 3rd June 1595 at Morton Derby
Father Harry Wasse
Also the following marriage
Raphe Wasse married Ann Lownerowe on 14th February 1613 at Morton
Cant find Henry(Harry) christening
regards
Sandymc
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thanks so much for looking - have a great weekend!
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Hello Wendy, just come back from a weeks holiday in Bournemouth, last month l went to Morton also north Winfield, both churches all locked up, very disappointed, N W church yard is really massive, thousends of graves,l walked round for about 2hours & never found one grave stone for any Wass family, could not read a lot of them, Morton was the same but a lot smaller but still could not find any Wass family, if you do go l suggest go on a Sunday morning, when church open (l could not make a Sunday) might have some old records, good luck, Regards June (leicestershire)
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Some info on the Wass family
1. There is a gravestone at N Wingfield on the right (I think) of the path as you walk up to the church. It is a double stone one side to Lydia wife of John Wass d June 18th 1769 age 79 years also dau Ann wife of Thomas Clark she died Nov 29th 1778. On right of stone is John Wass d Oct 18th 1773 aged 79.
2. This John Wass's will of 1774 mentions children John, Thomas, Ann Clark, William, Joseph. I think he could be the son (bp 1694 Pilsley) of John Wass (bp1671 Pilsley) who was son of Thomas Wass (bp 8 Oct 1643) brother of the John who married Elizabeth Mottershaw.
3. John Wass of Pilsleys will 1728 mentions children John, Ann, Mary and was signed by Jonathan Wass and Michael Parsons. Michael Parsons was husband of Ann Wass the dau of John Wass and Elizabeth Mottershaw. The John Wass whose will was dated 1728 married Rebecca Mottershaw 1703 Chesterfield and I think he was the son of John Wass (bp10 sept 1637)and Elizabeth Mottershaw
4. John and Thomas were 2 of children of Godfrey Wass (bp 14 mar 1611 N wingfield) and Elizabeth
5. starting from the beginning:
Thomas Wass of Pilsley will dated 1567 mentions son Nicholas
Nicholas's will 1606/7 mentions son Richard. He married 1. Isabella Parsons with whom he had Thomas, Francis, Margaret, Alice, Ellen, Mary. Isabella buried 21 Oct 1594 Tupton N Wingfield. Richard remarried & had Isabell and Godfrey
Godfrey married Elizabeth & had at least 10 children including John who married Elizabeth Mottershaw and Thomas who was grandfather of the John who married Lydia
John and Elizabeth Mottershaw had at least 8 children one of whom was Jonathan (John) who married Rebecca Mottershaw
hope this all helps - got loads on Wass family - my grandmother was a Wass - still trying to sort it all out
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Hi Keithlb, Wow!! wow, l am very disappointed l missed that grave stone at N Wingfield when l went there last month, you do have a lot of brill info on the WASS family, l have printed you information so l can look threw it carefully, and add to my info, l have got back to Nicholas Wass B 1525 at Morton married a Joanna ? l have lots of bits and bobs dating from that date upto now,( my mother was a Wass) l must sit and sort threw it all, gets a bit confusing, l only found out a while back that the wass family came from Derbyshire, it has taken me over 4years to trace my gt gt gt grandad a James Wass born in Ropsley in 1822 and that was threw Roots Chat, everyone so helpful, only thing is l have never have found out who he married,or if he ever got married, like you still trying to sort this family out, so many children and who married who, Keep the good work up, if you have any questions please ask l will help if l can, Regards June
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Hi there
Can I just butt in and say that Ropesley is in Lincolnsire and Rowsley
is in Derbyshire???? I have found a James Wass living in Ropesley,
Lincolnshire in the 1861 census. Are you getting these two villages
mixed up???? James is 39 on the 1861 census.
In 1881 James is 59 and his wife Harriet is 65.
regards
Sandymc
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hello again June & Sandymc
mmm if it is Lincolnshire then may not be a connection to Derbyshire Wass's. There are 2 distinct lines of Wass in Derbyshire, one descending from Nicholas of N Wingfield(will 1606/7) and the other from Henry of Morton/Woolley Moor (will 1641). There are maybe 3 or 4 separate lines in Nottinghamshire from about the same time. There are also other groups in Essex and N Yorkshire which are also separate families from this period. Hopefully you have the right James Wass in 1822. I'll see if I can find more from my info
cheers Keith
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Hello both, wow this is getting complicated, l am sure the Ropsley which my gggg grandad (James Wass) was born is in Lincolnshire, l have info about his birth showing his baptism Oct 2nd 1821(sorry l did say before it was 1822)in the lincolnshire archives, his parents are William Wass Ann Williamson,(l believe Willams father was a James Wass B 1757 Foston) l think but might be wrong but William Wass B 1782 also in Ropsley Linc's (who married Ann Williamson in Linc's 1808) parents must have moved from Foston Derbyshire or N Wingfield at some point,
James Wass B 1821 on the 1861 census is my gt gt grandad living with a Harriet also showing a son John Frederick Wass B 1852 in Spittelgate Grantham, l have John Fredericks birth cert but it has been altered from his mother either being a Jane or a Harriet, this is the family l have been having lots of trouble with, Harriet seems to have been born at sea/channel island, l have never found a marriage for a Harriet /James, only a James and a Jane Cook but the Jane has completely disappeared no death very complicated, could go on for hour's about all this, l am sure between us we may be able to sort it all out, Byeeeeee for now June
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Hi again Keith l do believe my wass family comes from the Nicholas Wass side in Derbyshire,cheers June
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Hi June
I have looked for a marriage of James Wass b 1821 and Harriet but cant
find one at the moment. Harriet was born n Jersey, Channel Islands and is
on with James and the little John then they seem to get some lodgers who are young children so maybe they were relatives or young kids with no parents.
Her name is Harriet all the time not Jane. Just wondered if whoever was
writing the wedding certificate out accidentally wrote Jane instead of James and then crossed it out and put the correct name of Harriet? Just wondered how Harriet born Jersey, managed to get up to Lincolnshire. As James was a agricultural labourer he may have travelled with the crops etc.
I did see the William Wass born 1785 who married Hannah born 1793 His birth place states Lincolnshire most of the time then it states born in Wickenby, Lincs. Hannah seems to have been born in Sturton, Nottinghamshire. A small village not too far from the Lincolnshire border and about 5 miles from where her and William are living on the 1851 census.
regards Sandymc
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Hi Sandy,
yes l noticed the other 2 children living with Harriet & James, l have followed them both on the censers, Albert got married and Harriet seems to have lived with them, until her death, lost track of the young girl, l sent for Albert's Birth Cert, but had no fathers name only mothers Rawlingson, When Albert married his name said "Albert Wass Rawlinson" strange,
l have been looking at my tree again and lam now going to retrace James Wass b1821 Ropsley Linc's to check his fathers name(who l am sure is William and some how double check this, then don't know how or where to try and confirm who Williams father is, any idea's where to look?, l always thought it was another James Wass b1757 at Foston, but l am now doubting this, might try
the I G I site, thanks for helping speak again soon, Byeeeeeee June
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Hi Jean
Had a look at James born about 1821. It looks as though there were
four brothers born arund 1780+ and they seem to have had sons of
their own and given them the same names - doesnt help does it lol?
I found the following so take your pick.
James Wass christened 2nd October 1821 parents William and Ann
James Wass 26th Feb 1819 James and Elizabeth
James 27th Sept 1824 James and Elizabeth
all at Ropsley.
Not unusual to see two children named the same when one of them died.
Then back again
William Wass christ d 10th November 1782
Elizabeth 10th November 1782
John 8th August 1784
James 12th March 1786
Elizabeth 24th February 1792
all born Ropesley to James and Ann nee Rolls
James and Ann married on 5th March 1782
This probably means that the William we found had a few years added
to his age or if not, and it was James who was James Dad then the
William we found was the Uncle of James born 1821 .
I also found a William Wass chris 26th October 1783 he had a brother
Thomas Wass c 14th August 1785 parents of both were
Thomas Wass and Theodosia. So more children in Ropsley so
maybe another brother of an earlier Wass.
If you are confused now sorry, so am I.
Just one thing about Alberts name. As the Wass was his middle name
that normally meant he was illegitimate and that was the Fathers
surname. So maybe thats why William is looking after him. They were probably his Grandparents.
Anyway, you can find alot of this info on the free Family Search site. Hope you find everyone. Take care
regards Sandymc
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Hi June Sandymc
This is getting very complicated but I have some more info - In 1871 census Ropsley, Albert Rawlison age 1 was a visitor with James Wass (b Ropsley) and Harriett (b Jersey). In 1881 he was listed as a boarder age 11 with another child Emily Kelham age 0.
There are Wass's in Ropsley going back well into 1700's. I have discovered a brilliant website www.lincstothepast.com where you can do advanced search eg on Ropsley baptisms and select images and you can see actual parish records
Not sure who we are following now - is it Albert Rawlinson or James Wass born 1822? It looks as if James and Harriett were foster parents but can't see how or if they are related to Albert. I can't find Albert baptism in Ropsley
keith
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Hi June Sandymc
Got hooked on this yesterday. Some more info:
From the lincstothepast website which is really good:
1. James Wass m Ann Rolls (BOTP -both of this parish) Ropsley 5th March 1782 witnesses Thomas Wass, John Fawlknor
2. Thomas Wass bp June 19 1822 Ropsley parents James & Elizabeth
3. James bp Oct 2 1821 Ropsley parents Wm? & Ann
4. William Wass m Ann Williamson BOTP Ropsley 10 Oct 1808 witnesses John Ellis (parish clerk I guess because his name is on several entries) & John Wass
5. Wm Wass bp 26 Oct 1783 Ropsley son of Thomas & Theodosia
6. Thomas bp 24 Aug 1785 Ropsley son Thomas & Theodosia
7. John bp oct 7 1781 son of Thomas & Theodosia
8. John Wass & Catherine Stanhope married 18 May 1799 Ropsley
9. Thomas Wass m Theodosia Doughty BOTP Ropsley 14 Nov 1799 wit Thomas Rawlinson & John Ellis (parish clerk?)
10. Theodosia Doughty bp Ropsley Aug 10 1755 dau John & Mary Doughty
Albert Rawlinson born about 1869-70 didn't see him in Ropsley records but could have missed him. Might be worth searching neighbouring parishes of Heydour, Raceby, Braceby, Sapperton, Lenton, Ingoldsby, Boothby Pagnell, Somerby, and Welby for single parent baptism
Take care with the familysearch website it doesn't have all the records on it and not always accurate as I have found on several occasions.
good luck
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Hi Keith
Great bit of research on your behalf. I agree you cant always find everything, but it doesnt help when they use the same names over and over does it lol??
I cant get onto the illegitimate site. I just mentioned Albert as he was living with William who was old enough to be his Grandad and normally if the middle name is a surname which Albert had as Wass then its normally the males line name with the female second. Might be because the male died before they were married or as is today he didnt want to marry her?
regards
Sandymc
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Hi Keith, Sandy,
thank you for all your research, Keith l know how you feel once involved you get hooked, l have Albert's Rawlinsons Birth cert saying born 23rd June 1869 Ropsley, no father, mother Mary Ann Rawlinson, was not baptised as Albert WASS Rawlinson, its only been shown as his name having any thing to do with the Wass on his marriage to a Annie Walley,
not to bothered about Albert but l was hoping if l found a bit about him it might give info about my James Wass B1821 Ropsley,
l have been looking threw all my old paper work about the wass family and l am still convinced William & Ann are his parents, now need to find who is Williams father, l keep reading all the dates and getting no where so shutting my eyes and will try again perhap es looking at afew more possibilities, l wish l had some one else who could sit with me and give me there opinion, but my family not that interested which is a great shame as l find it so interesting, they say 2 heads are better than one, but hey what l am l saying you both are there helping me, speak again soon, Regards June
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June
I think I might have found Albert Rawlinson's baptism on Familysearch bapt 9 march 1884 mother Ann in Ropsley. Sometimes children were baptised when they were older so this might be the one. The lincstothepast website doesn't have bapts for that year though which is a shame
keith