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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Durham Lookup Requests => Durham => England => Durham Completed Look up Requests => Topic started by: Alreetkidda on Monday 20 June 11 11:22 BST (UK)
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I have being do well on all directions of my tree apart from my grandfather on my maternal side. No body remembers much about him and I have no information what so ever on his parents etc. So having just got back into employment, I decided to order his marriage certificate for him and my grandmother. Whilst on the phone to the registry office at Bishop Auckland, I asked if they had a birth certificate for him but they could not find anything. So the marriage certificate arrives and guess what - no father mentioned. :'( So £12 down and non the wiser.
If anybody can help out in any way, I would be truly grateful. Here are some details:
William Taylor Marley. I believe that he was born in 1881, but maybe 1882. He died in 1955. Married on the 6th July 1921 to Mary Annie Ebdy. He was a widower. No idea on his first marriage. He was a coal miner and they were both residing at New Elvet in Durham at the time of the marriage. The house may have belonged to Mary from her first marriage as her husband was killed in the first world war. I found a medal index card for a William T Marley in the D.L.I. # 104427 but, I don't know if this is him or not.
Thanks in advance.
Allen.
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In Family Search there is a William Marley baptised 24 Dec 1882 St Joseph Patrick & Cuthbert at Cornforth Durham with parents Jacob Marley and Joanna Anderson .
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Hi there,
I've searched for births of a "William Taylor Marley" with variants of spellings between 1880 and 1884 and its come up with the following:-
MARLEY William John T Sunderland Durham 1881 Jul-Aug-Sep
MORLEY William Taylor Tynemouth Northumberland 1883 Jan-Feb-Mar
Does this help at all?
RM :-)
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Possible (short :'( ) first marriage:
MARRIAGE 1: Sep Qtr 1911, Darlington 10a, pg 9
William T MARLEY
Frances M A HOBSON
DEATH: Dec Qtr 1911, Northallerton, 9d, pg 809
Frances M A MARLEY age 24
Cheers
AMBLY
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Births......MORLEY William Taylor Tynemouth Northumberland 1883 Jan-Feb-Mar
There is the death of the same, in the same Qtr/Year & district .
Who were the witness' on the 1921 marriage cert, Allen?
Cheers
AMBLY
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Here are some details:
William Taylor Marley He died in 1955. Married on the 6th July 1921
to Mary Annie Ebdy. He was a widower. He was a coal miner and they were both residing at New Elvet in Durham at the time of the marriage.
The house may have belonged to Mary from her first marriage as her husband was killed in the first world war.
What age was given for William & Mary on their marriage certificate
I know you are looking for William but trying to use all info. you have given to try and establish his whereabouts
Looks as if William Taylor MARLEY’s wife Mary Annie was married to
Frederick EBDY, looking at the Free 1911 search using EBDY Durham New Elvet you have this family
Frederick bn 1886, Mary Annie 1888 dau Alice EBDY 1909
marriage entry Mar qtr. 1909 Durham
Frederick EBDY name on same page
Mary Annie BACKLER
CWGC site gives death of
Frederick EBDY (Private)
15.9.1916 Yorkshire Regiment No. 18831
additonal information given
“Husband of Mary A MARLEY (formerly EBDY) living
19 Margaret St., New Branscepeth Co. Durham
Not sure what to make of the entry she didn't marry William Taylor MARLEY until 1921 and her maiden name was BACKLER ??? I suppose it could depend when the death entry was recorded
Not as easy to pinpoint your William Taylor MARLEY on Free1911 search, if he was in the Army he could have been serving overseas
Possible (short :'( ) first marriage:
Sep Qtr 1911, Darlington 10a, pg 9
William T MARLEY
Frances M A HOBSON
DEATH: Dec Qtr 1911, Northallerton, 9d, pg 809
Frances M A MARLEY age 24
Frances Mary Ann HOBSON b1887 Crakehall Yorkshire
dau of Thomas & Margaret living Yorkshire 1901 & 1911 Darlington
If this marriage/death entry is correct William could possibly be living in Darlington 1911
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Hi,
There is a William Marley in 1901 living at 152 Leadgate. Leadgate St Ives, Sunderland Durham.
Frank Marley Head 34 coal miner born Sunderland.
Matilda Marley Wife 32 (cannot make out pob)
Caroline Marley dau 6 born Sunderland
William Marley Nephew 20 coal miner born Sunderland
RG13/4669/17/26
Sharon
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First of all - Thank you all very much for the help. :)
Right. I will try and go over or answer any questions etc in the order they were posted.
@ Brushbroomstick
Thank you. I can not rule him out, but I am 90% positive that he was born in 1881. The area is not a million miles away though.
@ Rosemagic
The William John T from Sunderland does seem like a very close possibility to me. I came across a William Marley born in Sunderland living at Iveston on the 1901 census with his uncle Frank Marley. He was 20 years old and would tie in with the 1881.
@ Ambly
Jeez that was a short marriage. How would I make a connection though?
The witnesses on the cert are S. Dodds and M. J or I Hopper.
@ Ladyhawk
The ages were 39 for William and 32 for Mary.
Frederick Ebdy details are correct including the military details. It is strange if that is the right word for it, that if he was not killed during the war, then she would not have remarried to William and my mother and then of course me would not be here now.
New Branscepeth is where they lived when my mother was born. So yes that is very strange.
@ Sharon01
Your reply came just before I finished typing this.
That is the family I mentioned earlier in this message. Matilda was born in Guernsey, Channel Islands. She moved to Sunderland with her parents. I had just found that information after posting this when I made a trip to the library to use the free ancestry service. Unfortunately I forgot my memory stick and did not manage to keep many details.
Thanks,
Allen.
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DEATH: Dec Qtr 1911, Northallerton, 9d, pg 809
Frances M A MARLEY age 24
Frances must have died shortly after childbrith :'(
Frances MARLEY mmn HOBSON
Sep qtr. 1911 Northallerton
Here's the link for CWCG to search surname EBDY F
http://www.cwgc.org/debt_of_honour.asp?menuid=14
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@ Ladyhawk
Not sure what to make of the entry she didn't marry William Taylor MARLEY until 1921 and her maiden name was BACKLER
I missed replying to her maiden name. I have 5 generations in my tree of her ancestors. I missed it out on my initial post as I did not think it would help tie in with William Marley. ;) Thank you.
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Possible first marriage:
MARRIAGE 1: Sep Qtr 1911, Darlington 10a, pg 9
William T MARLEY
Frances M A HOBSON
If you think this might be his first marriage it may be worth considering
finding out if there's a father's name mentioned for William on this marriage certificate
Frank Marley Head 34 coal miner born Sunderland.
Matilda Marley Wife 32 (cannot make out pob)
Caroline Marley dau 6 born Sunderland
William Marley Nephew 20 coal miner born Sunderland
It looks as if this Frank had three sisters
Elizabeth born 1855, Sarah born 1857 & Jane born 1859
as there's no father name on his marriage certificate perhaps one these girls is his mother
Frank also has two brothers Richard 1853 & Arthur 1862 their parents
Richard 1825 & Sarah b1826
If only his middle name 'Taylor' had been used on the censuses it would make it easier to find him - Is it possible that was his fathers surname ? Or if his mother married TAYLOR could be her maiden name :-\
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If you think this might be his first marriage it may be worth considering
finding out if there's a father's name mentioned for William on this marriage certificate
Do you think the registry office for Darlington would give that information over the phone?
It looks as if this Frank had three sisters
Elizabeth born 1855, Sarah born 1857 & Jane born 1859
as there's no father name on his marriage certificate perhaps one these girls is his mother
Frank also has two brothers Richard 1853 & Arthur 1862 their parents
Richard 1825 & Sarah b1826
When I was doing some research today, I noticed that Arthur died when he was 22 and that would make him old enough to be Williams father and maybe why William was residing with Frank?
If only his middle name 'Taylor' had been used on the censuses it would make it easier to find him - Is it possible that was his fathers surname ? Or if his mother married TAYLOR could be her maiden name :-\
If only. :( Yes, the name Taylor would suggest it has been handed down from a surname in the family.
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Although the marriage was registered in the Darlington District it does not appear in the online search facilities for Darlington Registrar,s certificates. The certificate will most likely be held at Bishop Auckland and I have usually found the staff very helpful, but can only answer a specific question with a yes or no, on the understanding that you purchase it, if it is the correct certificate.
Colin
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Digging up the past... ;)
It's hard work but my mam said her father William Taylor Marley - 1881 - 1955 had 3 children to his first wife. I don't know nothing about her. The children are obviously older than my mother (1931) and were called Lizzie, Billy & Norman. Now the thing is, they all lived in London. So maybe he was from there? Although mam does not recall him sounding like he was not from the North East. Maybe his ex wife did not die? Mam knows Lizzie married but does not know her married name. She said she was looking at a wedding photo of Billy this morning. I guess that was not strictly true. :-\
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Digging up the past... ;)
It's hard work but my mam said her father William Taylor Marley - 1881 - 1955 had 3 children to his first wife. I don't know nothing about her. The children are obviously older than my mother (1931)
Hi
As your original post was 2011 a recap & some questions, this is info. so far re WTM from his marriage cert.
William Taylor Marley age 39 occ Coal Miner married 6th July 1921 - no father named
Mary Ann Ebdy age 32 nee Backler, both widowed residing at New Elvet in Durham
a possiblity given for William on 1901c 152 Leadgate St Ives, Sunderland Durham.
Frank Marley Head 34 coal miner born Sunderland.
Matilda Marley Wife 32 (cannot make out pob)
Caroline Marley dau 6 born Sunderland
William Marley Nephew 20 coal miner born Sunderland
William Marley died 1955
Have you had any luck finding William on 1911 census?
Are you still trying to find William Taylor Marley’s first wife?
Were the children of WTM born in the order named and does your mother have any idea of their ages?
If it’s after Sept 1911 mother’s maiden name is shown on FreeBMD, not naming your mother
or her siblings there are three Marley children born between
1923 – 1931 Durham mmn BACKLER
In theory the other 3 children born to WTM should be on FreeBMD with their mmn. If we have an idea of their ages maybe they can be located on FreeBMD then hopefully that will lead us to WTM first marriage.
Could this be the birth of his son from his first marriage?
William Taylor Marley born 1904 & death 1905 Lanchester Durham (FreeBMD)
Unfortunately I think the way to check who his parents are is to obtain the birth certificate
you get the full references details from http://www.freebmd.org.uk/
There's a Marley child with the same name as your mother
(I think) will send details via PM, it may just be a coincidence but a possible sibling of William Taylor Marley :-\
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Thank you for the reply and update. :)
I have not been able to trace William Taylor Marley in the 1911 Census as yet. I have 2 people that have information on his father on the Ancestry website that have family connections for William but both have different parents. I could flip a coin for either set. I can't get back on right now as my membership has elapsed to view records/trees etc.
I would certainly like to find his first wife etc. It may have been easier if I knew that he had 3 children to her. Sorry about that. My mam can tell me an address of somebody but does not remember if her father had brothers or sisters and does not remember anything about any grandparents either. :(
I need to ask her again to see if she can remember ages of the first 3 step brothers & sister. I have replied to your message, so you have further confirmation of your findings.
Coincidence on that child maybe? It is surprising how many times I have found what would not be common names that match to people in my tree in similar years but are not connected. Lanchester parish covered a wide area which does not help either.
Struggling with finances at the moment (again :( ) so reluctant to pay out on birth certificates but it may be a necessity soon if I am to progress any further. It is strange with no father on his wedding cert. I don't think there will be anything of use on his death certificate or I would purchase a copy of that for my grandfather.
Thank you.
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A bit of a long shot, but I think worth mentioning to either prove/disprove. There is this 1911 census entry:
19 Waltons Row, Blackhill, Durham
William Marley, 29 (1882), Coal miner, Sunderland
Mary Hannah Marley, 27 (1884), Blackhill
Leonora Marley, 4 (1907), Blaydon
Norman Marley, 2 (1909), Chapwell
Interestingly there is a death registered in 1920 (Durham dist) for a Mary H Marley (year of birth 1884)
Also the son Norman fits with your possible siblings, there is a death for a Norman Marley born 1909 in Wimbledon in 1997 - of course this could be pure coincidence.
The only marriage I can find that fits is in 1902 between Robert William Marley and Mary Hannah Sayer, so the first name Robert not looking good but...
This couple go on to have the following children:
Florence M born 1913 died 1915
John 1915
Willie 1918
Hilda 1920 - died 1920
There is a Willie Marley death registered in Hackney, London in 1975 (birth date 17 May 1918).
I know apart from Norman, the children don't fit, but Willie (sounds like Billy).
Kath
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There is a possible death for John born 1915 in 1917, so that would leave 3 surviving children:
Leonora Marley born 1907, married William Milburn 1924, died 1958 Durham
Norman Marley born 1909
Willie Marley born 1918
Digging up the past... ;)
Could this be the birth of his son from his first marriage?
William Taylor Marley born 1904 & death 1905 Lanchester Durham (FreeBMD)
The 1911 Census with William and Mary Hannah states that one child has died.
Kath
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Thanks for the reply
I have been looking into the William living in Blackhill. There are possibilities and also problems.
The thing that makes it interesting is that my mother said that a “Nora” married a Bill Milburn. Not sure who Nora was – it was possible that Norman was Nora but got mixed up but I am sure she said there was 2 boys and one girl (Lizzie)
The part that throws things is where Mary Hannah married a Robert.
Quote “William Taylor Marley born 1904 & death 1905 Lanchester Durham (FreeBMD)”
I think I need to see who the father was for this child.
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Thanks for the reply
I have been looking into the William living in Blackhill. There are possibilities and also problems.
The thing that makes it interesting is that my mother said that a “Nora” married a Bill Milburn. Not sure who Nora was – it was possible that Norman was Nora but got mixed up but I am sure she said there was 2 boys and one girl (Lizzie)
Nora is short for Leonora, who did indeed marry William Milburn in 1924, see reply above :-)
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Quote “William Taylor Marley born 1904 & death 1905 Lanchester Durham (FreeBMD)”
I think I need to see who the father was for this child.
It would be interesting to see who the father was for the child but costly if he's not related!
On marriage 1921 entry they don’t give William's middle name as Taylor just the initial 'T'
A daft question maybe but was the middle name Taylor given on the birth certificate of one of his children?
Rosiemagic gave this birth entry but surname is MORLEY – I can’t see any other on FreeBMD with middle name of Taylor apart from the child born 1904 died 1905 ???
William TAYLOR Morley
Mar 1883 Tynemouth vol 10b page 215
Is this the death entry for your William ?
Mar 1955 Durham C vol 1a page 305
William T Marley age 74 (1881)
I’m not sure if they give an actual birth date on a death certificate? If they do that may help locate the correct birth entry on FreeBMD.
"a death certificate shows where and when the deceased died, name and surname, sex, age (or d.o.b.), occupation (or last occupation if retired) and address, and cause of death, along with the signature, description and address of the person giving information etc..."
As there’s no father named on his 2nd marriage cert. very difficult to pinpoint him with any certainty on any census ???
As you are pretty certain a child from his first marriage was named Lizzy (Elizabeth)
perhaps that may be a clue - she may have been named after his wife or their mother.
Don't give up :)
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I never did give up. ;D
I have finally re-opened the mystery and now have the answers. Much of which that was suggested here has proved to be correct. ;) So, this is the correct information.
William John Taylor Marley was born on the 9th July 1881 in Sunderland, Bishopwearmouth then classed as being part of Durham. This would be the person suggested by rosiemagic. As with the marriage certificate, there is no father named. His mother was Sarah Marley born 1857 in Sunderland. Her parents I believe were Richard Marley and Sarah Wilson.
His birth certificate states his mothers name only as Sarah Marley, but I believe that she may be the same person who appears as Sarah W (Wilson) Marley, but, that is another story.
Sharon was correct with the following:
There is a William Marley in 1901 living at 152 Leadgate. St Ives, Sunderland Durham.
Frank Marley Head 34 coal miner born Sunderland.
Matilda Marley Wife 32 (cannot make out pob)
Caroline Marley dau 6 born Sunderland
William Marley Nephew 20 coal miner born Sunderland
As Kath suggested, the 1911 Census showed the following:
19 Waltons Row, Blackhill, Durham
William Marley, 29 (1882), Coal miner, Sunderland
Mary Hannah Marley, 27 (1884), Blackhill
Leonora Marley, 4 (1907), Blaydon
Norman Marley, 2 (1909), Chopwell
and later they had another son named as Willie Marley.
I believe that his wife, Mary Hannah Marley to be Mary Hannah Sayers. She interestingly had siblings named Leonora, Norman and Willie. As Kath also stated, there is a death registered in 1920 for a Mary H Marley. Norman and Willie are the ones that died in London. Willie has the same birthday as mine although he is a bit older :P
As with Kath, I have not found a marriage between them, but only the one for a Robert William Marley and Mary Hannah Sayer in 1902.
Thanks to all that have contributed and to Ladyhawk for going through all of the posts and condensing it into something readable and concise. :)
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It's only taken you 7-8 years!! Well done. :) It's very satisfying when you finally unravel the story.
(I had marked this thread for notifications as it was so interesting. Quite surprised to get one today after all these years.)
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I never did give up. ;D
I have finally re-opened the mystery and now have the answers. Much of which that was suggested here has proved to be correct. ;) So, this is the correct information.
William John Taylor Marley was born on the 9th July 1881 in Sunderland, Bishopwearmouth then classed as being part of Durham.
As with the marriage certificate, there is no father named.
His mother was Sarah Marley born 1857 in Sunderland.
Her parents I believe were Richard Marley and Sarah Wilson.
His birth certificate states his mothers name only as Sarah Marley, but I believe that she may be the same person who appears as Sarah W (Wilson) Marley, but, that is another story.
Great news that you have finally got the answer - well done :)
out of curiosity what address was given on his 1881 b/c and who was the informant at his birth?
You may already have done so, now you have an actual birth date you should be able to find William
on the 1939 register......or try the address given at his death
As Kath suggested, the 1911 Census showed the following:
19 Waltons Row, Blackhill, Durham
William Marley, 29 (1882), Coal miner, Sunderland
Mary Hannah Marley, 27 (1884), Blackhill
Leonora Marley, 4 (1907), Blaydon
Norman Marley, 2 (1909), Chopwell
and later they had another son named as Willie Marley.
I believe that his wife, Mary Hannah Marley to be Mary Hannah Sayers.
She interestingly had siblings named Leonora, Norman and Willie. As Kath also stated, there is a death registered in 1920 for a Mary H Marley. Norman and Willie are the ones that died in London. Willie has the same birthday as mine although he is a bit older :P
As with Kath, I have not found a marriage between them, but only the one for a Robert William Marley and Mary Hannah Sayer in 1902.
Says married 9 years (1902) - the same as you both that is the only marriage I could find
Have you seen this from Find a Grave
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/186814151/william-john_taylor-marley
William John Taylor Marley
death place Brancepeth, Durham Unitary Authority, County Durham
burial Ushaw Moor, Durham Unitary Authority, County Durham
spouse May Annie Marley - also buried Ushaw Moor
he died aged 74 at 79 Pringle Place, New Brancepeth and buried 26 January 1955
she died aged 64 at 79 Pringle Place, New Brancepeth and buried 31 March 1953
and it looks as if his married daughter Leonora MARLEY (her mmn SAYERS) was also buried Ushaw Moor - her address same street but a different number - may just be a coincidence that they are living on the same street :-\
Leonora MILBURN wife of William - died aged 52 at 77 Pringle Place, New Brancepeth and buried 12 September 1958
William died aged 74 at 77 Pringle Place, New Brancepeth and buried 10 December 1964
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/186776136/leonora-milburn
His son Ronald MARLEY (his mmn BACKLER) also buried at Ushaw Moor
address 85 Pringle Place, New Brancepeth and buried 10 August 1967
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/186709091/ronald-marley
Couldn't find anything for his married daughter Hetty Marley (mmn BACKLER) other than her death entry giving dob
Hetty BELLAMY Death Age: 58 Birth 11 Oct 1924
Sep 1983 Lancaster Volume: 40 Page: 1599
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I use Durham Records Online nearly every day. There are 305 pages of the Marley name. No luck
You searched for:
Last Name = William Taylor Marley, in all districts...searched in Baptisms...1841 Census...1851 Census...1861 Census...1871 Census...1881 Census...1891 Census...1901 Census...1911 Census...Marriages...Burials...Cemetery Registers...Vestry Minutes...Marriage Bonds...Monuments...Marriage Banns...Confirmations...
Sorry, no matching records found. Please check the following points and search again:
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"There is a William Marley in 1901 living at 152 Leadgate. St Ives, Sunderland Durham".
But I thought that St. Ives, was down Consett way? Last time I was there St. Ives Church was in Iveston.
And more importantly are the Thought Police trying to suggest that Sunderland is NOT in County Durham. And the tram cars do not have shop at Binns on them. And add to my fine for feeding the seagulls.
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Yes silvery. It was a long journey but it shows that if you have the interest, then never give up. I have a friend in Indonesia and she said people there are not that interested in their family tree. Such a shame I think.
Ladyhawk - The address on his birth certificate is 72 Tweed Street, Sunderland. The only significant find that I found for Tweed Street was for Martin H Davison, 8 years, 73, Tweed Street who was killed at Victoria Hall, Sunderland on Saturday 16th June 1883 by which 183 children lost their lives. The only Marley on the list being Marley, John, 5 years, 7, Tees Street.
For those who do not know the tragic story:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Hall_stampede
and
https://www.sunderland.gov.uk/media/6964/5-Victoria-Hall-Disaster/pdf/5_Victoria_Hall_disaster.pdf?m=634783986030100000
List of the children killed:
http://www.lostancestors.eu/memwar/S/Sunderland.htm
The 1939 register shows him at 79, Pringle Place, New Brancepeth where both he and Mary Annie his wife died and my mam Freda was born. It also shows my mams sister Hetty and brother Ron who was a Japanese prisoner of war and bared the scars inflicted by bayonets where they had sliced his legs open.
Yes - I have seen the results from Find a Grave. I was there only 2 days ago. Unfortunately, they have no headstone and there appears to be no records of plot numbers on a map, but, I need to ask a cousin as she may know.
Yes Nora - Lenora Milburn - my mams oldest sister and her husband William are also buried there.
Hetty died whilst on holiday at Morcambe on the 26th July 1983 and hence why Lancaster shows up. She married Fredrick Bellamy. They are buried at Meadowfield Cemetery, Durham.
Thanks for your searches Barry. Help is always appreciated. ;) Yes, there is a church at Leadgate known as St. Ives and that was the name of the parish. St Ives church is on St Ives road which runs from the crossroads in the middle of Leadgate heading up to where Eden Colliery was situated.
From 1293 to 1974 Sunderland was part of Durham until it became part of Tyne and Wear. The photograph that I took at Beamish museum has a tram with Binns on it. ;D