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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: Rossk on Wednesday 15 June 11 10:23 BST (UK)
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:DGrace arrived in Vancouver BC with her mother and brother in 1919. Her mother Isabel and grace stayed on, while her brother Albert returned to Australia.
Grace went on to be a minister and spent time in India as a Missionary.
As far as I can tell Grace died in Canada in the late 1980's or 90's
I would like to have more information about her movements.
Looking forward to being contacted
The Australian kelly ;D :D :D
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On the passenger list, Isabel states that she was born in Ireland (around 1879), was Roman Catholic, lived in Canada all her life, and her destination was Toronto. The "lived all her life in Canada" leads to the possibility that she was returning to her family in Ontario.
If I'm looking at the right birth reg. for Grace, her parents are Isabel (nee) Robinson, and Albert Edward Kelly. There are a lot of Albert Kelly's and Isabel Robinson's in Ontario, but I can't find a marriage for them.
Do the above names match what you have? If so, we could narrow down the "where to start" to at least Ontario, (although if Grace died in Ontario in the range you mentioned, the death registration would still be under wraps due to privacy laws).
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hi bbart
Both the names you mentioned are familiar. However Isabel Grace Robinson married Albert Edwin Kelly, but I don't have a marriage record either.
Isabel was born about 1870 and died in 1953 in Canada I guess.
A hand written letter that I now have dates Grace in Vancouver BC in 1982.
Maybe Grace was in Vancouver at the time of her death!
Cheers
Aussi Kelly
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hi bbart and Rossk,
Albert Edwin Kelly is my great grandfather, and I've been doing some research myself. Below is what I've managed to discover.
I've got my grandfather's birth certificate (son of Albert and Isabel) and it states that Albert Edwin Kelly and Isabel Kelly (nee Robinson) were married in California (USA) on December 22 1909 (or 1907, not clearly legible.) It also states that Isabel Robinson was born in Ireland, County Antrim, i think in 1883.
Albert Edwin Kelly was born in Australia (Essendon) and was killed in WW1 in France (Mont St Quentin). Following his death Isabel requested free passage to Canada, with her daughter Grace Hamilton and son Albert Robinson (my grandfather). This was around 1920. I believe they first lived in Toronto, then at some point moved to Vancouver. I believe that Isabel Robinson may not have had any family in Australia and upon the death of Albert Edwin requested passage to Canada to be with family.
My uncle travelled with my grandmother and grandfather to Vancouver to see "Aunty Grace" and I believe that she came to Australia for visits also. when he was a small boy (less than 4yo). This would have been around 1950. I can confirm that I've heard stories that she was a missionary also.
Other info which may help, on my grandfather's war records it states that as of 1944 his Next of Kin (Mother) was Mrs. T Walonsley (again difficult to read) from White Rock, British Columbia. It is difficult to read but I expect that the T is probably an I and that Isabel remarried.
Albert Robinson Kelly returned to Australia about 10 years later and lived in or near Geelong all his life.
I'm chasing up any information you might have on Grace, when she died etc. If you have any info please pass it on.
Likewise if you have any other questions let me know and I'll see if I can help.
SRK
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There is an entry for a marriage in Burnaby, BC (not all that far from White Rock) for a James Walmsley and an Isabel Kelly, 28 Oct 1932.
There is no death listed for an Isabel Walmsley, so perhaps James died early and she remarried a third time, but unfortunately, privacy laws kick in for marriages at 1935.
There are too many deaths listed for James Walmsleys' without having an age to work with, which should be on the marriage certificate.
I can get a copy for you both if you like; I'll just need you to pm me your email address. With any luck, Grace might be the witness for them!
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http://bccfa.islandnet.com/search.php
James Walmsley
Isabel Walmsley
St. Peters Catholic Cemetery
New Westminster, Richmond St
Southwestern district
Ref: BCGS-C-58
This is probably worth following up.
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Good find! I guess that means Isabel is missing or mistranscribed in the death index... >:(
The same cemetery has a "Grace Hamilton Pride". Might be coincidence, or a lucky break!
*Update*
I was at the archives today, and snagged a copy of Isabel and James wedding, and James' death certificate (which has Grace as the informant!)
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I looked at the Commonwealth War Graves Commission for information on Albert Edwin Kelly and this showed up.
Albert Edwin Kelly
Australian, Private, Australian Infantry AIF, 21 st Bn, age 40, Service # 6833
Date of Death 01/09/1918
Cemetery: Peronne Communal Cemetery Extension
Additional Information
Husband of Isabel Kelly, of Fenner Post Office, Alberta, Canada
Fenner is approximately 35 km north-east of Hanna, Alberta.
A few questions for clarity.
Were Grace and Albert born in Canada, the USA or Australia and do you have birth certificates for them. If so, can you give the dates of birthand where they were born. You did state that you have the birth certificate for Albert but not when or where he was born.
It is obvious that Isabel lived in Canada, do you have any idea what her parents names are so that census info can be checked to try and narrow down where she may have lived. According to a birth certifcate, Isabel and Albert were married in California. If I have the correct death for Albert Edwin in 1918, Isabel was living in Fenner, Alberta. Do you know what Albert's occupation was as that could also narrow down the search. Also there is quite a spread given in the posts for the birth of Isabel Robinson so are we dealing with more than one person here and getting some of the info mixed up. I always try to find a time line using census info, birth info, etc. to try and track a person or family's movements especially if they moved around a lot. It appears that Isabel was born in Ireland, lived in Canada, married in California, lived in Australia and then again in Canada. Are there passenger lists to support this for the family.
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Hi valeriec,
Yes I´ve found those records too.
I know Albert Robinson Kelly was born in Australia, Frankston in 1910, as I have his birth certificate, I assume Grace was also born in Australia as she was only two years older. Albert Robinson Kelly's Birth Cert states that Albert Edwin was a Farmer and that at the time of his birth Isabel Robinson was 27 years old and that her birthplace was 'County Antrim Ireland´. Looking closely at the birth certificate I´m sure that they were married in 1907, not 1909 as I originally posted, but it definitely states California, USA. I haven't found any passenger lists to date.
The interesting thing is how and where did they meet, what were they doing in California to get married there and how did they end up back (in Albert´s case) in Australia.
From Albert Edwin Kelly´s birth certificate he was also was born in Australia, Essendon in 1878 one of 11 children of Thomas Kelly.
Albert Edwin also fought in the Boer War, so he was in South Africa from 1899 to 1902, so there is a 5 year period from when he was in South Africa and California where he got married.
Regards,
SRK
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Do you know if Albert served with the Canadians or Australians in the South African War. The database at LAC has an A. E. Kelly, Reg. # 1687, South African Constabulary, Type of Records on file - Other Records. Other Records could be Western Land Grants. Veterans were able to apply for land grants and there are 2 for an Albert Kelly. I am not sure how to follow up on these records but someone else on this forum may have that knowledge. There is an A. Robinson that also served with the South African Constabulary. This may only be a coincidence but may be worth following up. Hanna, Alberta is close to Fenner and this is an area where some of the land grants were issued. I wish we could find the name of a male relative of Isabel as it would be so much easier to trace on any of the records. Farming on these land grants was extremely difficult and many farmers left the farms after only a few years. This may be how Isabel and Albert met. California isn't all that far south of Alberta. They may have decided to marry in California on the way to Australia. There may have been more opportunity for ships out of California as well.
As your main research is for Grace Hamilton Kelly, I would contact the cemetery in New Westminster to see if they have a date for the death of Grace Hamilton Pride. Then I would contact the local newspaper for an obituary. In some cases, the cemetery can give you a lot of information so it is worth a try. I would ask for information on the McNair's as well. It is possible they are in the same plot.
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Gooday all,
I will direct this to SRK as we are both Aussie's.
There is a lot of revelant info in these posts, [thanks to all who posted]
I suspect I spoke to your Father by phone from Queensland some months back.
Albert was part of the Aust contingent in the Sth African war and I do have some details on that. He actually was part of the WA Mounted infranty.
I have checked with many of the Church organization in Canada about Grace being either in Ministry or a Missionary but they all have said they have no record. May be she did marry.
I have some Photos of the family and would like more and I am happy to share.
Keep on searching!!!
Cheers
Ross K
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You should be able to get Albert Edwin Kelly's complete military files for both the South African War and The First World War. You may find information in the files that could help in your search. I know that in the Canadian files, there is a lot of information as to pay documents, next of kin, injuries, debarkation, when and where served and sometimes piecing the information together gets you closer to the info that you are really searching.
www.ancestorsonboard.com
has
I. Robinson, b. 1883, female, 1892 Liverpool to Montreal
traveling with
J. Robinson, b. 1857, male
Mary Robinson, b. 1861, female
It is a stretch but someone may have access to the passenger list and be able to give you more information. I checked the National Archives in Ireland for the 1901 census and couldn't find and Isabel or Isabella (common spelling in Northern Ireland) for Isabel born in 1883 or 1884 in living in Antrim.
(I think I found the family above on the Vancouver - lists Joseph age 35, Mary age 31, Ivy (joy) age 9 so I think you can rule out)
I also went to
http://pilot.familysearch.org
to search for a birth for Isabel/Isabella Robinson and there are a few possibilities but the parents aren't listed so that would mean ordering certificates. I tend to try all other sources before ordering certificates especially in Ireland.
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I was doing some internet research on my mother - Grace Hamilton Kelly and I ran across this trail of conversation. Needless to say I my jaw dropped to see so much information on Grace. I can confirm most of the information provided in the trail of Grace's past from 1970 to present. Grace started looking after me as a child in Calcutta India where she was a missionary. In 1972 I came to Vancouver Canada to live with her. She eventually was successful in adopting me when I turn 13. I am happy to share more about Grace's later days. I can confirm that she passed away peacefully in Vancouver June 2007.
I visited Grace's relative (her brother Ned (Albert) and wife Peg as well as their children) in 1981. Grace and I and our storey and her reunion with her brother (after apx. 33years) were exposed in the local Melbourne or Geelong paper (I still have a copy of the story to date). If the Aussie Kelly's are following this conversation - I do encourage you to reach me as I would very much like to know more of Grace's life and also reconnect with my adopted extended family.
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Hi Steve,
Welcome to Rootschat
If you post 2 more message then you can use the personal message system to contact Rossk.
Unfortnately, the site don't allow us to post our e-mail addresses (spamming etc.,) so you will have to remove your e-mail address - before a moderator comes along and does it for you.
Sandra
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Sandra, thank you for the tip. I have edited the post.
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That's good. Is your weather good ? Just noticed Rossk hasn't been online since September 2011, hopefully he will get a notification of this post.
Sandra
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Hi Steve,
I guess that makes us related somehow...
I've sent you a PM.
SRK
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Hi Steve and blueballon
Welcome to Rootschat :)
RossK emails are currently not working, but I think I have managed to find him (fingers crossed) I have just sent an email with a link to your new replies so hopefully he should be back soon.
Regards
Sarah :)
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Sandra and Sarah, thank you both so much for facilitating this re-connection with my down under Kelly clan. Much appreciated.
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Grace Hamilton Kelly. I knew her in Calcutta in 1968 and kept in touch until Dec 1978. I have one letter still giving news of her adopted son whom I also met in India in the 1970's. She lived in the YWCA in Calcutta and she was a great help to me during the fall of the Bengal Govt and the riots which followed. Don't know what happened to Stephen M Kelly but hope he is doing well.