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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Wightlady13 on Saturday 04 June 11 09:46 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I have a 1911 census record which shows that my great grandparents had 7 living children, at the time they had been married for 7 years, however only 3 have been fully entered onto the census record a fourth was crossed out. My question is this, does any one know how I can trace the 4 children which are missing from the census I only have the name of one of them with a rough date of birth?
Wightlady
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Hi
Were the three still at home stated to be born in the same place? If so it may be possible to find their baptisms and see if there are any others to this couple.
evie
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I have just done exactly that with my Bailey family in Macclesfield Cheshire.
The 1911 shows 12 children of whom 4 had died.Luckily the 8 left are all still at home and all are born in the same place.Using a combination of baptism records from the new LDS site ( https://familysearch.org/ ) and birth/death records from Free BMD ,I now have all 12.
Hubby died in 1909 or I'm sure she would have had more, poor lady.
She them went on to lose 2 more of her sons in WW1.
You cannot imagine how sad it must have been for them can you?
Carol
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Are you trying to confirm the births?
If so then trawling the bmd index along with baptism/burial records will help to build the details for the family group. I have a few instances where the census can never show the full household as there are children who were born and died between census years.
For the earlier census years I have also found missing children recorded in other households with aunts, uncles, older siblings and grandparents, luckily my need for the 1911 is almost non existant as it's well covered by my cert and probate collection.
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Hi
If you so wish - give us the details of the children, parents etc you have and we might be able to help.
evie
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Hi again,
Thank you for replying to my post.
Evie - 2 of the 3 were born in the same place and I have their baptism records.
Glen - yes trying to confirm their births and existance, like I said the census return clear states total children born alive 7, children still living 7, children who have died 0.
This is proving tricky as not only is the surname common (Robinson) but I don't know the first names of three of the missing children.
Any how back to the searching thank you again, I guess its just going to be a time consuming trawl through bmd and parish records.
Wightlady
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It sounds as though the missing children would have been very young at the time of the census. Have you had a look for young visitors in the households of their grandparents or aunts & uncles - and/or searched the 1911 census by surname only, using likely birthplace and age range to narrow results?
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Thanks every one for your helpful suggestions, I think I have a long job ahead of me, sadly I have no living relatives that can shed some light on things.
avm228 - the three children that were on the census were 6, 4 and 1 years old so the missing children would have been quite close in age its also possible that there could have been a set of twins. Below is as much information as I have
Henry Tudor Robinson married Harriet Allison July 1903
The children were listed on the census in the following order:
Margaret Louisa daughter, b Marylebone - this name was scribbled out
Henry Herbert son 6, b Marylebone
Frederick Tudor son 4
Violet daughter 1, b Belgravia
At the time of the census the family were living in Peabody Buildings, Pimlico
Thanks again
Wightlady
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A lot of people seemed to get very confused over that 'how long married' and 'how many children' questions in 1911.
I have seen people write down the names of children whom I know died young and still include them in the total.
So it may be that although they say they had 7 children ,some of them may well have died.
Carol
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The part that is really puzzling is why Margaret Louisa's name was scribbled out, I know she existed as my mother remembers her aunty Margaret, her dad's sister, as to whether there was another 3 children whose names were not on the census the only clue is the total children born alive number ???
Wightlady
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Have found the baptism of two of their children
At St Mark's Marylebone Road.
Henry Herbert Robinson bapt 1st Dec 1904 -parents Henry and Harriet- milk carrier.
Frederick Tudor Robinson bapt 22 Nov 1906 - parents Henry Tudor and Harriet Robinson-milk carrier.
222 Vauxhall Bridge Road.
Carol
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The part that is really puzzling is why Margaret Louisa's name was scribbled out, I know she existed as my mother remembers her aunty Margaret, her dad's sister, as to whether there was another 3 children whose names were not on the census the only clue is the total children born alive number ???
Wightlady
Were they not quite married when Margaret was born....maybe they felt they shouldn't have a 7 year old (or older) daughter when they'd just admitted to being married just 7 years?
Carol
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The part that is really puzzling is why Margaret Louisa's name was scribbled out
Probably because she was not at home.
I asked above whether you had looked for the children with relatives - if young children are not at home with parents I tend to find they are often with grandparents or aunts & uncles.
For example, I see from the 1891 census (RG12/14/102/15) that Harriet had a sister Margaret Elsie ALLISON b abt 1887 Marylebone - she seems to have married a Robert POORE in Lambeth in 1910. Have you had a look for them in 1911?
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I see dad died in WW1.
Name: Henry Tudor Robinson
Birth Place: Westminster, Middx.
Residence: Pimlico, Middx.
Death Date: 9 Nov 1914
Death Location: Home
Enlistment Location: Westminster
Rank: Private
Regiment: Bedfordshire Regiment
Battalion: 7th Battalion
Number: 13703
Type of Casualty: Died
Theatre of War: Home
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Birth, Dec qtr 1903
Margaret Louisa ROBINSON
Lambeth 1d 290
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The part that is really puzzling is why Margaret Louisa's name was scribbled out
For example, I see from the 1891 census (RG12/14/102/15) that Harriet had a sister Margaret Elsie ALLISON b abt 1887 Marylebone - she seems to have married a Robert POORE in Lambeth in 1910. Have you had a look for them in 1911?
I can just hear her now,oh go on mum please can I stay with Auntie Margaret......oh please ;) ;D ;D ;D
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"You named me after her mum - she's my favourite auntie..." ;)
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;D ;D ;D 8)
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I am at present trying to grow several twigs of the Robinson/Allison tree, twiglets as we all know take time to nuture and grow, I'm sure all my lovely helpful friends on here will understand that it can take many hours of tlc to come up with a thriving family tree :) :)
Carol, yes I have the record for my great grandfather's war death and also the baptism records you mentioned, along with bmd certificates. I will try over the next few weeks (back to the day job on Monday ::))to search for aunts/uncles/grandparents census returns etc.
thank you Wightlady
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Hi
Here's their marriage
Sep 1903
Allison Harriet Louisa St. Geo. H. Sq. 1a 1036
Robinson Henry Tudor St. Geo. H. Sq. 1a 1036
The Anglican parish registers for Westminster parishes have been deposited at the City of Westminster Archives so aren't part of the Ancestry/London Metropolitan Archives dataset and baptisms only go tup to 1906 anyway.
Using the free 1911 advanced search, Robert & Margaret Elsie Poore and Margaret Robinson appear to be together in Medway Kent
and a related topic here
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,535796.0.html
Dawn
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:) ;) ;D 8) :-X
All I can say is thank you mystery solved, I think!
Carol - I think like you said the return was incorrectly filled in hence it appears there were 7 live births, lets face it we all know how confusing census forms can be to fill in as we have recently (in the uk) had to fill one in ourselves.
I think thats why I enjoy family research cos there is always they odd redherring or seemingly dead end!!!
I hope one day I can repay the kindness shown to me by being able to help others on this site. ;)
Wightlady