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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: BAC3 on Sunday 22 May 11 14:26 BST (UK)

Title: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: BAC3 on Sunday 22 May 11 14:26 BST (UK)
Hello,

George KILMISTER, born c1829 in Cirencester, Gloucester, was transported for 7 years as an "Exile" to Port Phillip aboard the "Thomas Arbuthnot", arriving Williamstown in May 1847.   He was immediately employed as a Shepherd by Alex Irvine in the Pyrenees.  From that moment onwards he seems to vanish, despite extensive research through TROVE, on-line BDMs, Digger CDs and Ancestry "Family Trees" here in the UK.

His parents were James and Mary  according to the 1841 England Census and he had been originally sentenced on 19/07/1843 at Gloucester Assizes for "Stealing luggage from a wagon".   He was one of the "Parkhurst Boys" who I am researching for a PhD.

I wonder, and would be grateful, if anyone can help with any bits of his Biography down under?

Thank you

Tony Cocks
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: judb on Monday 23 May 11 20:18 BST (UK)
C'mon you great Aussie R'chatters......................

Here I am in rainy Sicliy and I told Tony Cocks we were the best researchers in the business so can anyone help him with George KILMISTER??

Judith
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 01:42 BST (UK)
Here I am, late autumn, Lake Macquarie NSW .... calm waters reflecting the sky back at me...

Possible clue "Retrained as a brickmaker; refer HO 11/15 P 145"
George Kilmister, 7 year sentence, at age 14, tried Gloucester 19 July 1843, robbing a wagon.

http://members.iinet.net.au/~perthdps/convicts/park8.html

So could be that after arriving down under he was a brickmaker despite his first occupation in Vic being a shepherd.... 

Speculatively ....
could his surname have been altered once he got here?
could he have (post 1851 etc) gone to the gold fields?  .... miners licences/ Ballarat petitions come to mind

I guess we all need to pull our thinking caps down harder.... 

Unfortunately, Judith and Tony, I am very NSW centric, so I am not much help with Vic records, so sorry

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:01 BST (UK)
Hopefully this may be of help

NSW State Records Office Keyword search for IRVINE has quite a few, several of likely interest including this one
 
1 July 1842 Irvine Alexander Pyrannees Western Port District Bounded on the North by Western Port District by the East by Sea Coast on the South by Glenelg River and on the West by Portland Bay NRS 906 [X814]; Reel 2748-2749, Page 20 Superintendent: Alexander Irvine.


http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/

There's also an index reference for George Kilmister at NSW SRO, and it has to be "HIM", as it shows
Thomas Arbuthnot, 11 Jan 1947, Port Phillip etc  (it also says there's no copy service for the actual record, so it would need someone to attend the Kingswood Archives (Western Sydney) and look up)

Fingers crossed

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:10 BST (UK)
Not sure if any connection, and thus I could be WAY WAY off track  but

NSW SRO index for deceased estates notes
John H Kilmister of Wagga's d o d as 31 December 1920, with probate granted 22 July 1922 ...
and NSW BDM online index gives
John H Kilmister, son of John H and Georgina was registered at Albury in 1921, ref 4485.

I find that NSW Probate Packets often contain more than just the will or the administration records, I have been fortunate enough to find in several of my forebears packets such things as m.c. and b.c. and court records naming siblings, forebears etc and arrival ships etc .... more particularly when there were disputes as to the disposal of the estate...

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:24 BST (UK)
Port Phillip Government Gazette, December 1847, page 404

John Kilmister is one of many names listed re unclaimed mail held at the General Post Office...  (did not find any in that Gaz for George Kilmister).

I realise you are looking for George Kilmister, son of James and Mary. 

Was George already literate when he was sent to Australia?   I know that George can be shortened on official records to Geo.  and that John can be shortened to Jno.  Both these when written in long hand in the 19th C can be at first glance difficult to tell apart in the 21st C.

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: Aussie1947 on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:26 BST (UK)
Hi,

There is a brief notice in the Sydney Morning Herald 13th June 1865 on page 1.

" Mr GEORGE KILMISTER, broker is requested to CALL on Mr EDWARD LOWTHER., Sussex-street, without delay."

Unlikey to be your George though.

Regards
Gerry
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: alison2763 on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:29 BST (UK)
Haha no pressure at all then Judith  ;)
No Info on George yet but just to confirm Alex's life;

Alexander was granted a Pastoral License in 1840.
He was granted an extension of his lease in 1848.
he was appointed magistrate of the Teritory on 23.10.1848
Alexander and Isabel  { WILLIAMSON} IRVINE had the following children in Victoria:
Alexander James b 1849  Pyrenees # 8624 Presbyterian  Portland Bay Fiche:171
Alexander James b 1849 Pyrenees # 8878 Presbyterian Bunningyong and Portland Fiche: 177
Catherine b 1850 Pyrenees # 8897 Presbyterian Bunningyong and Portland Fiche: 177
George Forbes b 1851 Glen { Glenlogie?}  # 9324  Presbyterian Bunningyong and Portland Fiche: 190
Margaret Christi b 1852 Glen # 9620 Presbyterian Bunningyong and Portland Fiche : 200

John Wilson Forbes IRVINE d  1884 aged 38 Prahran  # 10270

regards
Alison
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: johngirl on Tuesday 24 May 11 02:49 BST (UK)


Not sure if this may help.It seems a man called Andrew Gill compiled a series of files on information on the 234 Parkhurst Boys that were sent to Western Australia between 1842-1849.You do have to get permission from Andrew Gill to view these files as they are restricted.Might be some valuable information on George Kilmister amongst these files.
Here is the link which is from the State Library of Western Australia.Just contact them with you enquirey and they may be able to help you view the appropriate file on George Kilmister.

http://www.slwa.wa.gov.au/dead_reckoning/private_archives/n-s/parkhurst_boys


  Johngirl
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 03:00 BST (UK)
Death in 1898 NSW for George W B KALLENSEE son of John L and Marion Registered in the district of Moulamein.  Ref 2357. 

Tony, Judith will confirm that Info on d.c. is only as reliable as the informant’s own knowledge, and in the case of NSW BDM index. Although  Kallensee v Kilmister seems to be way off, but parents names are akin to Geo’s. And Moulamein is very close to the border of Vic, and I have not found any other KALLENSEE on NSW BDM b, d or m indexes.... 

Judith, the NSW BDM online site is experiencing some online difficulties, so don't use the usual "*" wildcard option, it has been removed.  There's a current RC thread about these difficulties.   Transcript options for that Kallensee d.c. would be cheaper and quicker, and could be emailed as pdf file.

Re Kallensee v Kilmister, I realise I am speculating, and that it isn't really the "proper" thing to do.... Sorry BUT there's plenty on trove for Mr George Kallensee, associated with sheep droving and in various states ...  (oops, only four cuttings on trove, I had too many windows open and mis-read)

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 03:16 BST (UK)
Re KALLENSEE

NSW SRO index for Intestate Papers (keyword search, Kallensee) gives

KALLENSEE George William Blackford,  Moolpa Station near Moulamain, Station Overseer, 1898, and you can order that record via their online option.

EDIT TO ADD  I have just checked the NSW 1903 ER for Riverina, polling place Moulamein, alas none with surname Kallensee (nor Kilmister).

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Tuesday 24 May 11 05:18 BST (UK)
Hi,

An slight aside of sorts, searching trove using keywords Parkhurst Prison
 
George Hall, Esq, Governor of Parkhurst Prison, Isle of Wright, late of the 52nd Light Infantry, was married on the 21st, to Julia, the eldest daughter of Colonel George Grawler, H.H., (formerly of the same regiment,), late Governor of South Australia. (second and third cuttings show this marriage as 21 Sept 1847, in Derby, England)
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/2970063 12 January 1848 The Courier 
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/48728464 2 February 1848 Sth Aust Register
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/4763356 29 February 1848 Melb. Argus (leap year !)


Letter to the Editor from George Hall, Govenor of Parkhurst Prison could well be of interest for that PhD
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/27452142 25 February 1846 Sth Aust Register.

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: BAC3 on Tuesday 24 May 11 11:24 BST (UK)
Thank you all,

Mr KILMISTER continues to be elusive, so elusive I may consign him to the "forever pending tray".   There are a few there already!!

TROVE has been a marvellous resource and, in fact, since it became available to me in the UK has forced rewriting of many a Biography of the "Parkhurst Boys" that I thought were complete, though references to KILMISTER sadly have not been appropriate.

Incidentally, I have met Andrew Gill on several occasions on his research trips to the UK.   He confines his work expressly to the Parkhurst Prison "Apprentices" transported to WA, but my interest extends to the 2,000 or so sent to NZ, VDL and Port Phillip, including the odd 100 who were denied entry to Port Phillip and transferred to Sydney aboard the "Hashemy" and "Randolph".   If anyone has any "ancestor interest" in this particular area I would be delighted to hear from you or offer any help I can.

Once again thank you and, separately, Judith, of course.

For now,

Tony Cocks
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: tropicalj on Wednesday 25 May 11 06:28 BST (UK)
Hello  there Tony ;D

there is this marriage in Victoria
George  KILMISTER married Elizabeth HILLYER in 1844 reg no 4830
Denomination Church of England
Parish ST JAMES, MELBOURNE
Fiche  944

Jenn
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Wednesday 25 May 11 06:39 BST (UK)
That's very very interesting Jenn,

It is also indexed as 1844 on the NSW BDM register showing St James C of E Melbourne.  I just wonder if there's a transcription error from way back, and in fact it should be indexed as 1847 .... 

NSW BDM gives its reference as Vol 29 line 697  (V1844697 29/1844 )   It would be interesting to read line 696 and line 698 to see what year for those. 

I wonder if those early records for pre separation of Vic from NSW (c1851) are based on the actual parish records at St James, or are based on NSW Archives or NSW BDM records etc .....  It is quite possible there's been a transcription error along the way.  The Early Church Records at NSW BDM were not lodged with them until after the establishment of that very organisation which of course dates from mid 1850's (ie after Vic had separated).

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: sparrett on Wednesday 25 May 11 07:13 BST (UK)
There are  at least 3 births to the couple JENN has found.

GEORGE and ELIZABETH (nee Hillyer)

They start at 1846, followed by 2 registered in 1848.

The surname in each case is KILMINSTER

Hard to assess whether the spelling error is in the marriage or the births.

Happy to type up the births if relevant but........ ???


Sue
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: majm on Wednesday 25 May 11 07:40 BST (UK)
Hi Jenn and Sue


Umm, well George doesn't seem to have arrived early enough then   ;)

JM  ......

Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: donnatb on Wednesday 15 June 11 03:29 BST (UK)
Hello Tony,
I'm new to rootschat. I found earlier posts from you alluding to your PhD research on Parkhurst boys. Do you have information about a John Connelly who came out on the Marion to Port Phillip in 1848.  I have a lot of information about JC post 1852 in Victoria.
Donna
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: BAC3 on Wednesday 15 June 11 10:25 BST (UK)
Hello Donna,

Delighted with your news about John CONNELLY (sometime CONELLY)........thank you.

Certainly he was a Parkhurst Boy ("Exile") and I have a little information for him up until he arrived at Williamstown on 25/01/1848, but nothing from that point onwards.   Am more  than happy to exchange details and I will drop you a Personal Message with my email address to make corresponding easier.

Once again, my thanks.

Tony
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: Ruth74# on Saturday 23 February 13 06:52 GMT (UK)
Hello Donna and Tony
 I see you both have information about John Connelly who arrived in Australia on the Marion in 1848.
I know he was a Parkhurst exile  and I have the birth certificate of his son John Henry but i would dearly love to find out more about him,his parents, early life, prison experiences and his life and death in Australia.  Can you help?
Helen
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": George KILMISTER
Post by: BAC3 on Saturday 23 February 13 11:05 GMT (UK)
Hello Helen,

Thank you for the message.

Sadly, Donna and I could not absolutely decide that "her" John CONNELLY was the Parkhurst Prison "Exile" so the exercise we started had to be shelved for the time being.   However, it would be interesting to read through the details you have and compare them to the documents I hold but which have not been converted into a narrative.   The difficulty is that you cannot send me a Personal Message with your email address which would make it easier to pass information back and forth.........you need a minimum of 3 posts for the Personal Message system to work.

Nevertheless, I am going to send you Personal Message with my email address on the off chance it may work.   Allow 24 hours or so and if it fails send me 2 separate posts with pieces of information and we should be able to take it from there.

Complicated I'm afraid.........................!!!!

Regards,

Tony
Title: Re: Port Phillip "Exile": John Connelly
Post by: Ruth74# on Wednesday 27 February 13 07:00 GMT (UK)
Hi Donna
 I am interested to know what information you have about John Connelly who is thought to have arrived on the Marion in 1848?
Regards Helen