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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: sallysh on Monday 09 May 11 22:40 BST (UK)
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Edward Duckworth, born 1756 in Lancashire, partnered in the brewery business with William Clayton and another gentleman named Dutton. That brewery became the Thwaites Brewery when his oldest daughter and heir married Daniel Thwaites. Does anyone have information on Edward Duckworth's family? Who did he marry? Who were his parents? His eldest daughter, Betty Thwaites, is my ancestor. He also had daughters Mary, Grace, and Ellen.
Thanks!
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OK..ets take this a step at a time
Daniel Thwaites married Betty Duckworth 9th dec 1806 St Mary the Virgin,Blackburn
withess SHEPHERD Duckworth and Ellen Duckworth...
so ...we presume this is Edwards daughter who gets married to Daniel Thwaites...lets see if we can find Shepherd Duckworth babtism to see where Edward was at the time...and hopefully Edwards occupation..
oh dear...no Shepherd Duckworth babtised that early ....around 1780
and no Ellen Duckworth with father Edward showing....on lanopc
let me try Familysearch Record Pilot Search
allan
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OK...1750 -1758 there are only 2 on record in Lancashire on Familysearch -advanced search and also Family Search Record Pilot
Extracted record Edward Duckworth babtised 13th January 1754 Edward Duckworth , Great Harwood -father Thomas Duckworth
11th August 1753 Edward Duckworth, Church, Lancashire father George Duckworth
I also found Shepherd Duckworth christened 1st January 1784 Great Harwood ...father John / mother Ellen
so possibly Betsty Duckworth was born Great Harwood as well.....as Shepherd is b 1783...it makes him 22 at the marriage of Betsy, that sounds about right...so - if Betsy was born around 1780`s lets see if we can find her christening
allan
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Hi,
Found a couple of links which may (or may not) be helpful.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0d58/
http://www.cottontown.org/page.cfm?pageid=4814&language=eng
http://matterdalematters.multiply.com/journal/item/24/THWAITES_Brewery
I think I read on one of them that Betty was born in 1784.
Luzzu
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One of those links said Edward Duckworth died in 1822 so I wonder if this is his burial. He was aged 69 so that would give a birth of 1753 which fits very well with the baptism on 13 Jan 1854. The burial is in Great Harwood too :D.
Burial: 26 Dec 1822 St Bartholomew, Great Harwood, Lancashire, England
Edward Duckworth -
Age: 69
Abode: Grimshaw park Blackburn
www.lan-opc.org.uk
Luzzu
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Might have something here
Edward Duckworth married Betty Wolstanholme 1777...let me check on lan opc ...
both of Rishton and they married 13th May 1777 at St Bartholomew ,Great Harwood....
16th Sep 1745 same church Thomas Duckworth of Rishton to Jennet Ainsworth of Clayton
so it looks like
Thomas Duckworth and Jennet Ainsworth married 1745
Edward Duckworth was christened 13th jan 1754
Edward Duckworth married Betty Wolstanholme 1777
Betty Duckworth....can`t find her babtism /christening /birth
Betty Duckworth marries Daniel Thwaites 9th dec 1806 in Blackburn ...maybe as the Brewery grew they moved towns ???
all needs confirming ...maybe someone else can have a look for Betty Duckworth christening ??? the key point here being Betty Wolstenholme....if Betty Wolstenholme is Betty Duckworths mum...all the rest back to the 1745 marriage of Thomas Duckworth fits in
good luck
allan
ADDED...Luzzu...after re reADING ALL POSTS ...did it say where Betty Duckworth was christened in 1884 ?....St Bartholomews would be a big bonus !!
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I think you have.
I have been looking at the Edward Duckworth/Betty Wolstenholme marriage too.
Can't find a baptism for Betty but the OP said she had a sister, Grace:-
Grace Duckworth
bap 19 Oct 1777 Great Harwood
father: Edward Duckworth
(extracted)
There are also two submitted records on Family Search:-
Mary or Mally Duckworth
bap 14 May 1780 Rishton
bur 6 Aug 1780
Nelly Duckworth
bap 27 Oct 1782 Rishton
parents:- Edward Duckworth/Betty Wolstenholme
The OP also mentioned sisters Mary and Ellen ???.
Luzzu
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Thanks Luzzu...all looks good...just that Betty christening to confirm....frustrating isn`t it,,,everything else fits...allan
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This missing christening is so annoying.
Here are a couple of burials which seem to fit:-
Burial: 21 Feb 1828 St Bartholomew, Great Harwood, Lancashire, England
Betty Duckworth -
Age: 74
Abode: Grimshaw Park, Blackburn
Burial: 9 Apr 1855 St Bartholomew, Great Harwood, Lancashire, England
Grace Duckworth -
Age: 77
Abode: Blackburn
There is something that's bugging me. In her original post, Sally said Betty Duckworth was Edward Duckworth's eldest daughter. At the moment we have Edward Duckworth marrying Betty Wolstenhome in May 1777 and then Grace being baptised in October 1777 so that would make Grace the eldest daughter. I wonder if Betty Woldstenholme was Edward's second wife ???.
Luzzu
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I see where you are coming from , but if Betty was born BEFORE 1777 that would make her in her 30`s when she married in 1806 ???...I prefer the 1784 possible that you found....maybe Betty was the eldest child to Edwards second marriage ?? making Edward 30 when Betty was born ??
allan
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Yes I was just thinking that she would have been quite mature when she married Daniel Thwaites and according to those links I posted earlier they had 12 children (Daniel Thwaites junior being the 6th child born in 1817). Not very likely as she would have had 6 more children in her 40's.
However if those burials are right Betty Wolstenholme didn't die until 1828.
Luzzu
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The baptism for Edward Duckworth on 13 Jan 1854 is also on this website:-
http://wilkinp4.blackapplehost.com/Buildings/Churches/SaintBarts/SaintBartsChristenings1547to1812.htm
13 Jan 1754 Edward Son of Tho: Duckworth, innkeeper
and it gives Thomas' occupation as innkeeper.
There are also the baptisms of Grace and Mally but no Betty :(. There are masses of other Duckworths on there as well but it will take some time to sort them out.
Going back to Thomas' occupation as innkeeper, there was an inn called The Roebuck and the innkeeper was Thomas Duckworth. They were there in 1750 and it was in their family for 3 generations.
http://wilkinp4.blackapplehost.com/Leisure/Public_Houses/Roebuck/Roebuck.htm
The tenants were Thomas & Grace Duckworth. I can't find a marriage though.
The big coincidence is ......... The Roebuck was eventually sold to Thwaites.
Luzzu
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I am deeply grateful for all this input -- and a bit overwhelmed. I'd actually found some of that information, after visiting the matterdale and cottontown sites. I'd assumed her father's name was Lawrence Duckworth, from a baptism record in 1785, Haslingden. Then read a portion of a biography about her famous brother Daniel Thwaites, and found the father's name Edward. :-\ Just wasn't able to prove either one, and never found a wife/mother. I'll follow the lines suggested and see where it leads me.
Again, humble thanks.
Sally :)
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Hi.
I can tell you that Edward who died 1822, Betty who died 1828 and Grace who died in 1855 are all buried in the same grave at St. Bartholomews, Great Harwood. It is definitely the correct Edward as the Lancaster Gazette dated 28th December, 1822 states:
On Sunday last, aged 60, awfully sudden, Mr. Edward Duckworth of the firm of Duckworth, Clayton, and Thwaites, of the Eanam brewery, in Blackburn.
This is the link to St. Bartholomews Grave Plans - http://www.great-harwood.org.uk/ choose History on the left and then scroll down to Documents and you should see the graveyard index.
Regards,
Mo
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I should have said earlier that the sisters Mary and Ellen came from christening records in Haslingden, Lancashire when I was going on the assumption that Betty's father was Lawrence Duckworth, mother was Mary, all of Haslingden. This made sense to me since her daughter Betty Thwaites Ward died at a family home in Haslingden, occupied by that time by her daughter Alice Thwaites Thompson (1891). If all of you good folks are correct, I've been in the wrong neighborhood. Betty Duckworth Thwaites always appeared in the census as being born in Blackburn, so that could mean either Great Harwood or Haslinden, right?
I am prepared to let Mary and Ellen Duckworth go; they're both from Haslingden and their father was Lawrence.
Thwaites Brewery histories state Betty Duckworth was the sole heir and proprieter of her father's brewery venture with Messrs. Clayton and Dutton, so that's a problem with Grace being the eldest and also living possibly until 1855, and apparently never married. So is it possible Grace is not a daughter of Edward and Betty, but rather another relative buried in their grave site? Or perhaps Betty was chosen as heir over sister Grace for reasons other than who was the elder? Maybe Grace wasn't into beer?? ???
The purchasers of the Roebuck Inn in 1897 (Thomas Duckworth in Rishton) were T. and W. Thwaites, of Blackburn. These would probably be nephews of Daniel Thwaites (son of Betty Duckworth and Daniel Thwaites), the millionnaire owner of Thwaites Brewery and Eanam Brewery. His heir was his only child and husband named Yerburgh.
I'll have to scrap my baptism of Betty Duckworth (Jan 1785, Haslingden) as it's based on a father called Lawrence.
Many thanks! I'll keep on plugging away.
Sally
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Now that Mosiefish has confirmed we have the right burial for Edward Duckworth, I would be confident that he is buried with his wife, Betty, and daughter Grace. The age for Grace matches exactly for the 1777 christening.
Maybe, as you say, Grace wasn't interested in the business or maybe she wasn' a strong woman - although she can't have been that delicate as she lived until she was 77.
Maybe Betty was chosen to inherit as she was already married to Daniel Thwaites and it might have made good business sense.
Also Grace was unmarried and had no children and Betty had 4 sons and 6 daughters.
Looking at the list of christenings on this link:-
http://wilkinp4.blackapplehost.com/Buildings/Churches/SaintBarts/SaintBartsChristenings1547to1812.htm
19 Oct 1777 Grace, daughter of Edward
14 May 1780 Mally, daughter of Edward (who was buried 6 Aug 1780)
27 Oct 1782 Nelley, daughter of Edward & Betty
I know its a longshot but does anyone think Nelley could be Betty ???.
Luzzu
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I know its a longshot but does anyone think Nelley could be Betty ??? .
Sorry I've changed my mind ::). In 1851, Grace Duckworth is living with her widowed sister, Ellen Greenwood so I think Ellen is Nelley.
HO107/2258/425 p24
and Betty's christening is still a mystery ???
Luzzu
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Further to the death of Edward Duckworth in 1822.
The burial record on the Great Harwood site says aged 69.
Whereas the quoted newspaper article concerning the death of Edward of the brewery says age 60.
Why this discrepancy? Are you sure they are the same person.
Tom Robinson
(also a descendant of Edward)
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From the new book about the Brewery: The Life and Times of Daniel Thwaites Brewery 1807-2007 by Jehanne Wake;
"Daniel had married Betty Duckworth at the Parish church of Blackburn. Betty had three sisters: Mary, who was married to Robert Yates a yeoman farmer of Duckworth Hall in Oswaldtwistle, and Grace and Ellen, who were then unmarried."
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Thanks! As for the book, "Life and Times," I wonder how I might get a copy of it. Thanks for the reference, by the way. Clears up some things, but the birth/christening of Betty Duckworth still remains a mystery, doesn't it.
Sally
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Thanks to Sarah at the U.K. end of Rootschat. I have now been able to get into this reply page - thankfully. Thank you Sarah. Now, about two years ago, a very kind lady from England answered an old question I had on some links, I had some been researching for many years - being for Edward Yates of Blackburn who married Betsy Haigh of Holmfirth c.1836? For a long time I had the Robert Yates of Blackburn and a wife Mary, but found there were so many ladies named Mary with different surnames, that it was just too hard. This kind lady wrote to me, sent me some amazing research and then very kindly sent me the book on Thwaites Brewery. Wow !!! I have been so busy trying to close down my research after 28 years, that I just had to leave it, until I thought about seeing if I could get some data from the net. I am so grateful to this friend, that I will have to share all this with her hopefully, soon. First I would love to know if there are any from this line of family that are interested in communicating with me. Liverpool, Lancashire is well known to me, as over all these years, I have researched my Bostock - Wilkinson, families out of Cheshire and Liverpool. I would love to hear from any who would love to share links. This lady has shared an amazing lineal chart with me too. As I have helped many people over the years, this was a special and wonderful occasion for me. I am delighted to chat from Queensland Australia. I have a Word Document, which I could send if any were interested in this line - Duckworth Yates, Haigh Fearon Wilson and many others.
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We found our YATES family at Blackburn Lancs. Edward Yates b.2.9.1811 Blackburn, christened 17.10.1811 Chapel St. Blackburn. His parents were Robert & Mary Yates [nee Duckworth 2012], Blackburn. RG4_1018. from archives search £5. “From England and Wales, Non-Conformist Record Indexes [RG4-8]”. Found Mary Duckworth m.19.11.1810 Robert Yates [21 & 25 years]. Edward Yates married Betsy Haigh of Holmfirth, West Riding, Yorkshire. Joseph Yates witness at Edward and Betty’s marriage, is his brother. Found 19.8.2006 Joseph Yates b.4.5.1813 to Robert and Mary Duckworth christened 30.5.1813 Chapel St., Blackburn. Both Edward and Joseph were born Chapel St. Independant. The marriage 27.1.1836 for Edward and Betty was bought from West Yorkshire Archives. Register:-Betsy was of All Saints Parish Ch. Wakefield. Ref: AR12/41/LB- Edward Yates, Leeds Parish and Betty [Betsy] Haigh of this Parish, sign Edward Yates & Betty Haigh. Witness:- Joseph Yates & Catherine Lascelles, ? Dixon. Edward & Betsy married by Licence.
Edward Yates was a Veterinary Surgeon and d.c.1854. This may help someone who has links down this line. We are thrilled to get more data from Rootschat just now.
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I'm trying to prove/disprove a Duckworth connection to my Melrose family, I'm wondering if the following names resonate with anybody? On a side note, I am also trying to prove/disprove whether there is 1 or 2 different Thomas Graham Melrose & families at the same time.
I have a Mary Melrose born 1834 Dublin, Ireland (from census records & RGO Birth) to Private Thomas Melrose & Mary (Irvine). There is a marriage recorded at Lancashire on 17th May 1857 of Mary Melrose, dau of Thomas Graham Melrose (Joiner) and James Duckworth (Cotton Beamer) son of Thomas Duckworth (Cotton Twister).
Thanks in advance.
Rhonda
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I know its a longshot but does anyone think Nelley could be Betty ??? .
Sorry I've changed my mind ::). In 1851, Grace Duckworth is living with her widowed sister, Ellen Greenwood so I think Ellen is Nelley.
HO107/2258/425 p24
and Betty's christening is still a mystery ???
Luzzu
Just reading through this thread(finding it interesting!)....my grandmother was christened Ellen but my grandfather called her Nellie.....I have always wondered why because I have never come across it anywhere else, perhaps one of those strange things we do with names, another example in our family is John being called Jack, William called Bill, Robert called Bob...the list goes on... :D
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we have an Agnes - called Senga = it`s spelt backwards ...maybe Ellen = Nelle ( Nelly)
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Of course ;D doh! never crossed my mind that Nellie is Ellen backwards! We humans certainly like playing around with words and names.
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Hello from Australia. I am descended from Robert Yates and Mary Duckworth . Their son Edward Yates, a veterinarian married Betsy Haigh and lived at Holmfirth and Leeds in early 1800's.
I have much on this family that I have shared with another special lady who found me, just a couple of years ago. I will help if I can, as I have the book. Where do you live, is important.
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Hello, I am too a direct descendant of Thomas and Grace Duckworth, but through their daughter Grace (Edward's sister). The younger Grace's daughter Mally was first cousin of Betty and Ellen Duckworth. Thomas and his wife Grace had quite a number of children, the christening/baptism records for them show Thomas was a husbandman before he was an innkeeper (he became innkeeper of the Stag in Rishton, later called the Roebuck, in about 1750)