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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: genealogistsykes on Friday 22 April 11 09:41 BST (UK)
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Hi All,
I am looking for the first marriage of Jessie Russell, she married a black man which was frowned upon in the olden days im not sure if she married him in ghana or in England. If she did marry him in England they would of most likely been married in London. Her second husband was Albert Gosling and they were married in 1915 in St.Giles, London.
I think we may of found her date of birth, as my grandmother said that she was born in London:
Jessie Russell
April 1891, Kensington, London
Some researchers have already found her parents and have come accross a sister by the name of NELLIE! my grandmother said that she had two aunty NELLIES so this must be the right date of birth and parents. I have sent off for Jessie Russell's marriage cert - her second marraiage in 1915 and it should confirm her parents aswell as Alberts parents.
On my grandmothers birth certificate it says Jessie BINEY formerly Russell! her madien name was RUSSELL but when her first husband died she stayed with the name BINEY!
Regards,
GeneologistSykes
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Hi,
As the 1915 marriage was in London the certificate will only show the name and occupation of the fathers, no mention of the mothers.
Nanny Jan
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why is that? is it only in 1915 that that happens?
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No mothers are mentioned on England and Wales marriage certificates, even now. Have a look here:
http://home.clara.net/dixons/Certificates/indexbd.htm
This is a site that is recommended over and over again for the basic information found on certificates. It really cannot be beaten ;)
Nell
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ahhh i see, well that's a pain in the arse! how am i gonna find her mother, possibly by tracking her father and then finding her birth with the correct father and maybe i could find her mother that way?
:)
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Hi,
You could look for Jessie and her parents on the census records; her father's name and occupation should be on her marriage certificate.
Nanny Jan
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ahh yes good idea i will do that, the cert. should be here around the 17th of may ! they take an age to deliver .. im on standard post charge and plus i live in jersey, channel islands so that could be why
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There's a few Bank Holidays in between as well.
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You could get the birth cert of the daughter to find out who her parents were
June 1905
Biney, Irene Dorothy, Lambeth 1d 380
I don't think you have the correct birth details
1901 census
RG13/247/10/10 104 Halsworthy Square, Holborn
Elizabeth Russell widow 49 born Islington
Jessie 22
William 20
Nellie 18
Frederick 13
All children born Holborn, Jessie should be born 1879/1880
Dawn
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I can't find a birth entry for Jessie but here are her siblings
Jun 1880
RUSSELL William, London C. 1c 19
Sep 1882
Russell Nellie, London C. 1c 19
Sep 1887
RUSSELL Frederick. London C. 1c 17
Dawn
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A couple of baptisms, both at St Dunstan in the West
24 June 1883
Nellie, parents William & Elizabeth Davis Russell, of 36 Fetter Lane, Pottman
25 September 1887
Frederick, William & Elizabeth Russell, same address, Cellarman
Dawn
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Freebmd
Dec 1876, Shoreditch 1c 220
William Russell & Elizabeth Davis
2nd Dec 1876 St Mary Haggerston
William Russell, full age, bachelor, barman, 4 Hows Street, father William Russell dec, gardener
Elizabeth Davis, full age, spinster, no occ, same address, afther Frederick Davis (cant decipher occ)
Married after banns, both signed, witnesses John Cooper & Felicia Cooper
Dawn
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ahhh okay, do you recon that JESSIE RUSSELL could be illegitimate as there is no trace of her birth registry?
i got sent a messege by a researcher concerning it:
If you follow the census back I'm not sure that mother Elizabeth Russell may have been married at all - certainly, she's shown as a widow in 1881 but had at least 3 children after then!! Birthplaces/ages change continually - Jessie, for instance, is shown as bc.1880 Finsbury in 1911, bc.1879 Holborn in 1901 and, I think, 1877 Hoxton in 1881.
I'm not sure if Jessie was actually married to a Mr. Biney - can't find a marriage and can't see that she ever left or entered the county. Her daughters birth in Jun.1905 Lambert is recorded as Biney - Irene Dorothy. Can't see the death of a Biney in the relevant time frame either.
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my grandmother said that she had two aunty NELLIES
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my grandmother said that she had two aunty NELLIES
No offence but lots of families have the same name repeated on both maternal and paternal sides and that's where you (as the researcher) has the fun part! You have to work out which side and what their surnames were, since only you know all the details of your family! ;)
Nell
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If her parents married in 1876 and she was born in 1878 then she wouldn't be illegitimate, (unless William wasn't her father), it could be that her birth entry has been mis-recorded, mis-transcribed or not in the reg district we are expecting.
Or she may have been born before 1876.
I also think the whole family is not on the 1881 census for whatever reason. The 1881 census you mention is not correct.
By 1881 Elizabeth had 2 children, Jessie & William, a son & daughter, not 2 daughters and she wasn't apparently widowed until after the birth & bapstism of the 4th child.
She could of course have bluffed her way at the register office for the birth registrations and the parish church for the baptisms.
If I was you, I'd get the 1905 birth cert or is that the one you mention in your 1st post?
Dawn
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haha yes, she said:
" i had an aunty nellie mudlock / medlock'' - in an old decrepid voice :)
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i had an aunty nellie mudlock / medlock''
So there is your starting point - to find a link between Medlock/Mudlock and Russell - or was it between her mother's family and Medlock. Time to put your investigative skills into practice ;)
Nell
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who's birth was the 1905? Are you sure it is the right one and that the mother was Jessie Russell? when i get some more news on the cert i will tell you all the information which should help in hunting more of her family
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found the MEDLOCK connection:
Nellie Russell married a somthing MEDLOCK in September 1906 in London
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found him:
Alfred John Medlock
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who's birth was the 1905? Are you sure it is the right one and that the mother was Jessie Russell? when i get some more news on the cert i will tell you all the information which should help in hunting more of her family
Please refer back to my reply #8 and yours #12 on the previous page.
Dawn
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Speculation only here, but I wonder if Irene's father will turn out to be Joseph Edward Biney, who appears on the 1901 census as a Chartered Accountant aged 22, and then is on the shipping list going out to Gold Coast/Ghana in 1902, 1905 and 1919 (and dies in 1939, which is a whole other can of worms!). Obviously this is supposition, but I wanted to get this person marked out just in case!
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That Joseph Edward Biney died 20 Dec 1937 on the Gold Coast and left an estate of £104,000 :o
But as you say, pure speculation at this stage.
If you haven't already got that 1905 birth, try and put it on your shopping list.
If you have already got it, what are the details for Irene Dorothy?
Dawn
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Wait a minute that could be the father, as im sure that there was some connection with ghana? Do you know if he was black because if he is then that is the correct person as her first marriage was to a black man by the name of Biney.
Surely that estate has already been claimed?
I don't have the birth cert yet, but will send off for it in a while
Regards,
Genealogistsykes
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my father said that he doesn't think that Joseph Edward Biney is the spouse of Jessie Russell because when she married my grandmothers father in 1915 she was already a widow, and Joseph Edward Biney died in 1937.
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Then you'll need to get the 1905 birth certificate to find Mr. Biney's name.
It wasn't uncommon for couples to separate and call themselves widowed or single.
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Okay will do, i know quiet a bit about Irene Dorothy Biney, she married a James Coussey i think he was knighted or that could of been his son who was knighted.
Irene only died a couple of years ago and would of been the best person to talk to about all of the family history.
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found a marriage on freebmd:
Joseph Edward Biney - plymouth sept. 1900
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where is the estate of Joseph Edward Biney situated which is worth £104,000? is it in Ghana or England. It's most likely that it would of been claimed or now or the goverment has snapped it up as after 30 years the government have it if there are no heirs to the estate. Regards
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This is what it said:
Probate Date: 17 March 1939
Death Date: 20 Dec 1937
Death Place: Africa
Registry: London
Biney, Joseph Edward of Elmina Road Cape Coast Gold Coast Colony West Africa died December 20, 1937
Administration London 17 March to Charles Lionel Woolveridge Chartered Accountant
Effects £104599 16s 3d in england
Madri
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Might not be any connection but London Gazette, 17 Jan.1936 lists Biney, Charles Joseph Wellington, Second Division Officer, Customs Department, Gold Coast.
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There's a 2nd entry in the probate calendar in 1940, a will was found and resealed in London.
You could apply for a copy if this is your man and see where the estate went.
Dawn
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Hello. Hereiwth 2nd Probate entry.
Name: Joseph Edward Biney
Probate Date: 11 May 1940
Death Date: Gold Coast
Registry: Gold Coast
Biney, Joseph Edward of Elmina Road Cape Coast Central Providence Gold Coast Colony died 20 Decemner 1937. Probate Gold Coast to Reverend Frederick Emmanual Ekuban Reverend Joseph Emmanual Addo ministers Joseph Allpheus Vincent Cann Company Manager and John Samuel Akyianor Clerk.
Effects £104559 16s 3d in England. Sealed London 11 May. Former Grant P.R. 18 March 1939
Madri
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Okay great thank you, hope this is the correct guy! I will order the 1905 Birth Certificate of Irene Dorothy Biney born in Lambeth, South London.
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Hi,
Finsbury was in Holborn registration district so how about this birth for Jessie?
Jessica RUSSELL Sep Q 1878 Holborn 1b 825
This could be the family in 1881, transcribed as BUNNELL on FindMyPast and it does look like BUNNELL on the image but the enumerator could have mistranscribed it.
1881 RG11/375 f.51 p.24 St Andrew Holborn Below the Bars Registration district: London City
5 Norwich Court
BUNNELL
William Head 34 Waiter Scotland
Elizabeth Wife 32 Midx Islington
Jescia* Daur 2 " Finsbury
William Son 1 City of London St Andrews
* transcribed as Jessie but looks like Jescia.
Regards,
Daisy
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Just been reading back over this. Jessie never married to Mr. Biney. There is no record of Jessie/Jessica Russell marrying a Biney.
Irene's 1905 birth cert states that her father was James Edward Biney a Barrister-at-Law. Members on here, on a previous thread, have held the perspective that she may of put down the name James to try and cover up her tracks, seeing as she was never married.
After emailing the Inner Temple I have recieved information on Biney. It turns out that Irene's father was Joseph Edward Biney, younger son to Joseph Edward Biney of Cape Coast, merchant - mining. In 1901 Joseph (the son) was admitted to the Temple at age 25. Giving his year of birth as 1877. The Temple said that he could of gone back to Ghana to practice as a lawyer as there are no records in the annual directory of lawyers for him etc. Does this mean that the Joseph Edward Biney who is listed as a chartered accountant is not Irene's father? seeing as he was a Barrister?
This is getting really confusing.
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On your parallel thread you put it a little differently:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=562484.new;topicseen#new
...that he was admitted to the Inner Temple (this would have been with an intention to study for the Bar) in January 1902, aged 25, and then called to the Bar in November 1904.
So his being a chartered accountant in the 1901 census is not inconsistent - he had not yet embarked on his path to the Bar.
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okay that clears things up. Thanks.