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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Lancashire => England => Lancashire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: gortonboy on Wednesday 06 April 11 17:23 BST (UK)

Title: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Wednesday 06 April 11 17:23 BST (UK)
Hi,,,I have a Joseph Taylor b 1920 in Manchester...trying to sort his parents out,,so did the right thing and ordered his birth cert.....the birth cert gives his father as George Taylor and his mother as Ada Taylor formerly Dunn. All well and good,,except i cannot see a marriage between a George Taylor and an Ada Dunn.
There is one between a George Taylor and an Anne Dunn in 1911....????

so i am a bit stuck now,,,i have nothing to cross check the birth with as yet,,i have no idea of the parents ages or even where they were born,,,so if i ordered the George Taylor/Ann dunn marriiage cert,i would still have no way of knowing if these are the correct parents,,,any suggestions

the other detail on the birthy cert gives an address of 175 cheltenham street,Manchester....i have checked the 1911 census,just in case,,no joy !
George Taylor was described as a coal carter,,ex private K.L.R.   which i assume means he served in the war with the Kings Liverpool Regiment,,,i have searched for a possible service record,,but with the name being so common,and no service number,,no joy !!

I have posted a thread regarding searching for a GeorgeTaylor in the absent voters list at the cheltenham sreet address....so...have i covered all the bases,,,anything else you can suggest.... ;D cheers   GB
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: J D------ on Wednesday 06 April 11 18:10 BST (UK)
On Lancashire bmd the george Taylor who married Ann Dunn 1911 has Ann been married befor as Ann Clayton ?

J.D.
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Wednesday 06 April 11 18:15 BST (UK)
cheers JD,,,will follow that up  ;)
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: Sumi on Wednesday 06 April 11 18:49 BST (UK)
Did you already know Joseph's father was George TAYLOR before you ordered the birth certificate?  If not, you could be going down the wrong track....get a copy of Joseph's marriage certificate for his father's name and occupation.....also witness names which can be helpful sometimes.

Sue
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Wednesday 06 April 11 20:15 BST (UK)
yes we did know his fathers name,,we already had a short birth certificate,,and we have Josephs marriage certificate.....no clues on josephs marriage cert.
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: Marj on Thursday 07 April 11 13:07 BST (UK)
Hi


There is a marriage for
Ada Clayton & Francis Dunn in march qtr 1897 married at St.James Collyhurst.

Could Ann the marriage in 1911 been a mistake and Could it have been Ada ?

on the 1901 census index I don't have access for the details

Francis Dunn aged 26 b. Manchester Marine Store Dealer
Ada Dunn aged 24 b. Manchester
Ada Dunn aged 1 b. Manchester

There is a death for Francis Dunn in 1905 aged 29 March Qtr

Hope this helps

Regards  Marj
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 14:58 BST (UK)
thanks Marj,,,there is a connection with  collyhurst and St James church,,i dont have the details to hand,,,but will have a read of my notes,,,,cheers.  ;)
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 15:43 BST (UK)
it is interesting that i cannot find Ada Dunn or her 2 daughters on the 1911 census,,,i am not asking for a look up,,as i have acess,,,just wondering if Ada could be the Ann that married George Taylor in 1911,,,as JD pointed out,Ann was indexed on Lancs bmd as Clayton and Dunn ?   
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 15:46 BST (UK)
i remember the Collyhurst connection now,,,we believed at first that Josephs father was the George Taylor who married an Ada Ancoats at Collyhurst St James in 1899....this is now looking very unlikely.  ;)
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: Marj on Thursday 07 April 11 17:00 BST (UK)

Hi

Just a thought
Have you looked for Ada Dunn and her daughter Ada, as Ada Taylor, a possibility that they could have  been living  with George but they wasn't married,  as they married after the  1911 census was taken.

Regards   MArj
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: Sumi on Thursday 07 April 11 17:03 BST (UK)
 I looked at the CLAYTON/DUNN marriage as well......but the GRO birth index lists Joseph's mmn as DUNN and it would be CLAYTON for this theory to work.

Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 17:08 BST (UK)
i had thought of that,,,but it wouldnt be the first time an entry on a birth certificate was wrong,,,i would have expected it  to say mothers name Taylor formerly Dunn was Clayton....but maybe she just wanted to put her old married  name down?   ;)
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 17:11 BST (UK)

Hi

Just a thought
Have you looked for Ada Dunn and her daughter Ada, as Ada Taylor, a possibility that they could have  been living  with George but they wasn't married,  as they married after the  1911 census was taken.

Regards   MArj


Yes,,i have looked for Ada under Taylor,,and under Clayton,,and under Dunn,,,cant see a match.
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 17:18 BST (UK)
in 1901  Ada had 2 daughters,,i cannot find Ada or her 2 daughters in the 1911 census,,as i said,,i am not requesting a look up,,i have searched myself??

Ada dunn b 1877
Ada dunn b 1900
Mary dunn b 1897

i think i will have to order the george taylor/ann dunn marriage cert,,and see what it says...maybe it will say she is a widow and she was formerly Clayton,,if it doesnt,,,then back to the drawing board  :D
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 21:47 BST (UK)
ok,,some more info,,,according to the daughter of Joseph Taylor,,,,Josephs mother and father are buried in Philips park cemetery in Manchester,
the grave gives
Ada Taylor  died 1st May 1930 age 53  so b c 1877
George Taylor died 1960  age 82          so b c 1878

this is why we first thought that the parents were the george Taylor and Ada Taylor  nee Ancoats who married in 1899,,even though 1920 was late for Josephs birth ,,Ada would have been 43.....but Josephs mothers maiden name  was Dunn?
Then we thought maybe George remarried another Ada,,,but they are together in the 1911 census,,,and the marriage to the Ann Dunn is also 1911,just after the census ?

there are supoosedley some stepbrothers and sisters of Joseph,,but because of the surname taylor,,,and the lack of exact birthyears,,,again i cannot cross reference....ah  well... ;)
 
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 22:09 BST (UK)
just in case it may prove to be relevant,,it probably wont  :D

the george taylor who married ada ancoats in 1899...in the 1901 census,,ada is living under her maiden name Ada Ancoats,,i cant find george ,and supposedly they had a daughter ada in 1900,,i cant find her either ??

i know it the correct Ada Ancoats in the 1901 census because the surname is so rare,,,and her occupation is the same as her wedding certificate. Why is she living under her maiden name??  this may not even have anything to do with my Joseph thread,,but just in case.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,oooh  my brain hurts !!! ;D
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Thursday 07 April 11 22:14 BST (UK)
Blimey !!  just had a look at the 1891 census for Ada Ancoats,,,and,,,  is this just a wierd coincidence,,,in the 1891 census Ada Ancoats is living in Cheltenham street ???
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Saturday 09 April 11 14:54 BST (UK)
the marriage for George Taylor and Ann Dunn has been looked up {cheers beannie ;) }

George  Taylor batchelor 33  Carter 17 Mary Ellen Street  father George Henry Taylor  bricklayers labourer

Ann Dunn spinster  33 cotton waste sorter  19 Mary Ellen Street  father Thomas Clayton deceased a slater

this means that this is definitely the George Taylor who married Ada Ancoats in 1899.
George is living at 17 Mary Ellen Street in the 1911 census with Ada !!!

So this must be Josephs father,,but why is his mothers name on the birth cert given as Ada not Ann ?
The strange thing is that George is buried with his first wife !! and i wonder what happened to his first wife,,,he certainly didnt hang around getting remarried,,,,he has 1 family in the 1911 census ,,and marries again  4 months later? He has also put that he is a bachelor !! am i wrong to suspect bigamy?
there is something not quite right here  ;) 
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Saturday 09 April 11 16:34 BST (UK)
Think ive sussed it  :D

found an ADA Clayton b1877 with father Thomas Clayton a slater on the 1881 census,,,,so,,,Ada Clayton marries Francis Dunn in 1897...Francis dies in 1907....Ada then marries George Taylor in 1911.... ;D
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: Marj on Sunday 10 April 11 11:50 BST (UK)
Hi
Have a look at the 1901 census
on the index I have found

George H Taylor aged 48 bricklayers labourer
Elizabeth Tayloy aged 50
Francis Joseph Dunn aged 10

all b. Manchester

Could this be George's father and what relation is Francis J Dunn to George & Elizabeth.

There could also be other members in living in the household.

Regards  Marj

Regards  Marj
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Sunday 10 April 11 13:20 BST (UK)
Yes,,it is George Taylors father,,,,,but although they are neighbours,,,this francis dunn cannot be the one who married Ada Clayton,,,he is much too young. Thanks for the input though.
I am left to wonder what happened to Ada Taylor nee Ancoats,,i cannot see a death for her in 1911,,,so what happened to her?
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: J.D. on Sunday 04 September 11 13:33 BST (UK)
My grandfather Francis Dunn was born 1900 (according to his 1919 marriage) I have recently come across his Army record, 1920, the record is under Frank Dunn.

According to his army record his mothers name is Ada and his stepfathers name and address is George Tayor 123 Cheltenham St/Rd.

George Taylors  first wife was Ada Ancoats his second wife was Ada Dunn, nee Clayton. Ada first husband Francis Dunn died 1950 in Bolton, so she must have divorced Francis to marry George.

Ive found George Taylor and Ada at in the 1911 census at 17 Mary Ellen St, but not her son Francis Dunn.

Just found Francis Joseph Dunn with with George H Taylor and Elizabeth, he must have stayed with them on census night.

I'm still struggling to find the birth and death records for Francis Joseph Dunn, has anyone come across them.

Regards

J.D.

Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: gortonboy on Monday 12 September 11 17:39 BST (UK)
can you quote the 1901 census reference for FRANCIS JOSEPH DUNN ?  ;)
Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: close2u on Wednesday 21 September 11 22:15 BST (UK)
My grandfather Francis Dunn was born 1900 (according to his 1919 marriage) I have recently come across his Army record, 1920, the record is under Frank Dunn.

According to his army record his mothers name is Ada and his stepfathers name and address is George Tayor 123 Cheltenham St/Rd.

George Taylors  first wife was Ada Ancoats his second wife was Ada Dunn, nee Clayton. Ada first husband Francis Dunn died 1950 in Bolton, so she must have divorced Francis to marry George.

Ive found George Taylor and Ada at in the 1911 census at 17 Mary Ellen St, but not her son Francis Dunn.

Just found Francis Joseph Dunn with with George H Taylor and Elizabeth, he must have stayed with them on census night.

I'm still struggling to find the birth and death records for Francis Joseph Dunn, has anyone come across them.

Regards

J.D.



Title: Re: MISSING MARRIAGE?
Post by: J.D. on Sunday 29 April 12 13:01 BST (UK)

My grandfather Francis Dunn.

According to his marriage cert he was 19 years old in 1919 when he married my grandmother Nellie Hesshion.

Based on the information from his marriage cert I started to look for his birth cert around the 1900 period, which I couldn't find.

I have now found his birth cert which shows he was born on the 5th September  1903, (not 1900) to Francis Dunn and Ada Dunn formally
Ada Clayton at 131 Churnet Street Collyhurst.

Could anyone put anything down on forms, did no one check the information given was correct

Regards

J.D.

(I am not the J.D.------)