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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: oasorgard on Tuesday 29 March 11 21:52 BST (UK)
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In 1865 Thomas Collis, Stephen Edward Comyn, Joseph Rodney Croskey, William Frost and Alexander Prince bought around 600,000 hectare of land in the middle part of Norway, and found the company THE NORTH OF EUROPE LAND & MINING CO. LTD. The purpose of this purchase was logging and to establish a sawmill. It was transformed in 1888 to a new company whit other owners. Is here some who know who this five gentlemen was?
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There's some information here:
www.lonelyplanet.com/shop.../norway-4-nordland-preview.pdf
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I tryed to open your link, but I just got the message: Sorry, we can't find the page you're looking for.
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Ah, I'm getting a similar problem with it cut and pasted. Try googling....
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http://www.lonelyplanet.com/norway/northern-norway/mosjoen
This link works.....small write up on it....
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http://www.lonelyplanet.com/norway/northern-norway/mosjoen
This link works.....small write up on it....
About the link, I am from and live right outside Mosjøen, so that history I know. I am searching for more information about Thomas Collis, Stephen Edward Comyn, Joseph Rodney Croskey, William Frost and Alexander Prince. Where did they come from etc?
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Welcome to rootschat oasorgard.
I don't know anything specific about this company or these people but just to start you off I can see Stephen E Comyn age 43 living in Cheltenham England in the 1861 census. His occupation is MD Edinburgh not practising (so he's a doctor) born in Bengal Burr??? (I cannot read the place name). He is married but his wife is not home, but there are several children and servants.
Is this the sort of information you are looking for? I can see Stephen in other censuses.
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In the 1881 census there is a Joseph R.P. Croskey living in Paddington (London). He's a retired merchant born in the USA. There is a dark line through his age but it is transcribed as 70. In the 1851 census he is aged 40, living in Southampton, occupation is 'American Consul for this district', born USA.
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There are a lot of men with the name Thomas Collis and William Frost, so without knowing a bit more about them (eg date or place of birth) it will be difficult to identify the correct ones. There aren't many Alexander Princes but I can't see an obvious one on the 1871 census.
I will continue looking ...
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I'm not sure about this one but I found an Alexander Prince in the 1861 census living in Paddington. He is aged 41 born in Ealing Middlesex, and occupation is 'Agent". His wife Julia is a "government agent's wife" which sounds promising. There are a lot of children and some servants in the household. In the 1851 census he is a "Patent Agent" and a widower so Julia is his second wife. In 1871 he is mistakenly listed as Alexandra Prince - he is a "Patent Agent".
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Welcome to rootschat oasorgard.
I don't know anything specific about this company or these people but just to start you off I can see Stephen E Comyn age 43 living in Cheltenham England in the 1861 census. His occupation is MD Edinburgh not practising (so he's a doctor) born in Bengal Burr??? (I cannot read the place name). He is married but his wife is not home, but there are several children and servants.
Is this the sort of information you are looking for? I can see Stephen in other censuses.
Yes, this is the sort of information I am looking for.
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There are a lot of men with the name Thomas Collis and William Frost, so without knowing a bit more about them (eg date or place of birth) it will be difficult to identify the correct ones. There aren't many Alexander Princes but I can't see an obvious one on the 1871 census.
I will continue looking ...
I do not know the date or place of birth for any of Thomas Collis, Stephen Edward Comyn, Joseph Rodney Croskey, William Frost and Alexander Prince.
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The Company was declared bankrupt in 1872. The following item appeared in a newspaper at the time.
The Birmingham Daily Post, Wednesday 25th December 1872
COMMERCIAL AND MONETARY
The order to wind up the North of Europe Land and Mining Company (Limited) was accompanied by the statement that there had been gross fraud on the part of the Secretary of the company, who had absconded, and the company was utterly insolvent.
regards
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The Morning Chronicle Saturday November 9th 1850
FOREIGN OFFICE NOV 6TH
The Queen has been pleased to approve of Mr James Foy as Consul at Dublin, of Mr Day O King as Consul at Glasgow and of Mr Joseph Rodney Coskey as Consul at Southampton and Cowes - for the United States of America
Birmingham Daily Post Saturday November 8th 1862
Representation of Southampton - Captain Charles E Mangles and Joseph Rodney Croskey have issued addresses to the Electors
regards
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The Company was declared bankrupt in 1872. The following item appeared in a newspaper at the time.
The Birmingham Daily Post, Wednesday 25th December 1872
COMMERCIAL AND MONETARY
The order to wind up the North of Europe Land and Mining Company (Limited) was accompanied by the statement that there had been gross fraud on the part of the Secretary of the company, who had absconded, and the company was utterly insolvent.
regards
Was The North of Europe Land & Mining Co. Ltd. registered in UK?
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oasorgard,
Sorry, don't have the answer to that one.
Although the winding up order was issued 1872 there are newspaper references to the North of Europe Land and Mining Company as late as 1881 and Chancery Division. No details - just the name and a time.
Can find several references to Joseph Rodney Croskey (including other business dealings) - yet to check for others in the gang of five.
regards
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The Times February 8th 1862
On the 12th inst. at Sunbury, aged 38, Charlotte, the beloved wife of Stephen E. Comyn, Esq, and only child of Alexander Innes Scott, Esq of Cheltenham.
Is this the Stephen E Comyn MD in the 1861 Census?
regards
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The Times February 8th 1862
On the 12th inst. at Sunbury, aged 38, Charlotte, the beloved wife of Stephen E. Comyn, Esq, and only child of Alexander Innes Scott, Esq of Cheltenham.
Is this the Stephen E Comyn MD in the 1861 Census?
regards
It looks like the right family Hanes teulu. I take it that is a death notice? But something is a bit amiss. Stephen is married to Emily in 1851, says he's married but no wife present in 1861 and by 1871 he's married to Maria. Some further investigation is required depending on how much detail oasorgard requires.
Oasorgard,
How much detail do you want about these men? For example are you looking for personal information about them? I can try to locate them in all of the censuses for example, and post all details of family, if that is what you require.
Also, are you looking for birth, marriage and death information as well?
I'm not sure whether you are mainly looking for information about the company or the men.
This is an interesting and unusual request. Do you mind if I ask why you are researching these men and this company? :)
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Marriages Mar 1842
BULLOCK Francis Witham 12 379
CLAPTON James Philemon Witham 12 379
Comyn Stephen Edward Tendring 12 379
Connyer Stephen Edward Witham 12 379 ?
ORPER Eliza Ann Witham 12 379
SMITH Ellen Harriet Witham 12 379
SURRIDGE Charles Witham 12 379
THATCHER Charlotte Witham 12 379
Marriages Jun 1861
Bush Edwin Clifton 6a 229
Comyn Stephen Edward Clifton 6a 229
Crossman Mary Ann Clifton 6a 229
Scott Charlotte Clifton 6a 229 ?
Marriages Dec 1866
Comyn Stephen E Marylebone 1a 857
FERRIS William Marylebone 1a 857
GROVE Marian D Marylebone 1a 857
PONTIN Jane Marylebone 1a 857
Unsure if these are all the same Stephen. They seem to fit except that it appears that he first married an Emily and is with her in 1851. If the 1861 marriage to Charlotte is correct and the death in 1862, then she may have died in childbirth? (just a guess of course). I think Maria in the 1871 census is Marian in the 1866 marriage - middle initial is D.
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Joseph Croskey appears with wife Sarah and children in the 1851 census. This appears to be his marriage but to which Sarah?:
Marriages Sep 1843
CROSKEY Joseph Rodney I of Wight 8 341
DENNISON Sarah Frances Boiling I of Wight 8 341
FANCEY Edith I of Wight 8 341
LASHMAR Emily Ellen I of Wight 8 341
LEE Joseph Isle of Wight 8 341
OSMOND Daniel Isle of Wight 8 341
ROPER Sarah I of Wight 8 341
ROPER William I of Wight 8 341
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Ruskie,
Yes, it was the death notice.
The Ipswich Journal Saturday January 8 1842
MARRIED
4th inst. at Rivenhall Church, by the Rev. Bradford Donne Hawkins, M.A, Stephen Edw Comyn, Esq, MD, of Cheltenham, only surviving son of the late Major General Wm Comyn, Bengal Establishment, to Emily Harriet, 2nd daughter of Paul Kneller Smith, Rivenhall Place in the County of Essex, Esq.
regards
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Reynolds Newspapers Sunday December 23rd 1860
Carries a lengthy report of the Court case (Comyn v Comyn) where Stephen E Comyn was granted a decree nisi and damages of £2,000 (originally claiming £10,000!) against Emily Harriet Comyn.
Bristol Mercury Saturday May 16 1861
May 11th at Clifton, by the Rev Edward Cockey, MA, Stephen E Comyn, Esq of Cheltenham, to Charlotte, only child of Alexander Innes Scott, Esq, of Lansdown Terrace in the same place.
regards
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Ah, that's really helpful hanes. :) So the 1842 marriage on Freebmd is the correct one, and should read Emily Harriet Smith rather than Ellen Harriet Smith. I wonder why the two registration districts for Stephen? :-\ Not important at this stage ...
I must say that court case sounds fascinating. Is Reynolds newspapers online?
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Oasorgard,
How much detail do you want about these men? For example are you looking for personal information about them? I can try to locate them in all of the censuses for example, and post all details of family, if that is what you require.
Also, are you looking for birth, marriage and death information as well?
I'm not sure whether you are mainly looking for information about the company or the men.
This is an interesting and unusual request. Do you mind if I ask why you are researching these men and this company? :)
I am mainly looking for birth, marriage and death of the men, and children if there are. I am also looking for more general information about them, where they lived and what they worked whit in UK. But if you find any information in UK about the company I am interested in that too. The local historians have written mutch about the company, but almost nothing about the men, that is why I want to know more about them.
When the North of Europe Land & Mining Co. Ltd. (called "Engelskbruket" in norwegian) started up whit logging and established a sawmill, it was in a scale no one had done before in the district. The local community, what now is the municipalitys of Vefsn (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vefsn), Grane (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grane) and Hattfjelldal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hattfjelldal), passed through a deep change from a natural economy to a market economy, and new ideas came to the district. The company was transformed in 1888 to the North of Europe Land Co. Ltd. whit new owners, and the company profile now was to sell hunting and fishing exclusively. But in 1899 it was over, the land was sold, and the company was dissolved. A local company, Nes Trælastbrug, bought some of the land, and few years later they established a new sawmill at the same spot as the English company. And it have been working until last year.
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That's very interesting oasorgard.
Do you have any more information about Thomas Collis and William Frost? Because these are common names, they are more difficult to trace than the men with unusual names.
Any little thing at all?
Names of wives or children?
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Reynolds Newspapers Sunday December 23rd 1860
Carries a lengthy report of the Court case (Comyn v Comyn) where Stephen E Comyn was granted a decree nisi and damages of £2,000 (originally claiming £10,000!) against Emily Harriet Comyn.
Bristol Mercury Saturday May 16 1861
May 11th at Clifton, by the Rev Edward Cockey, MA, Stephen E Comyn, Esq of Cheltenham, to Charlotte, only child of Alexander Innes Scott, Esq, of Lansdown Terrace in the same place.
regards
I just read this article in Reynolds - what a scandal. ;D Mind you Stephen didn't waste any time remarrying.
Would you be interested in reading the article oasorgard?
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I've had another look for Thomas Collis.
I started with the 1871 census and after eliminating all those who weren't 'head of family', I went through those remaining, then eliminated all those who were farmers, labourers etc.
Now the one which looks maybe, possibly the most likely is one living in Lewisham. He is aged 43, and is a 'Hop Merchant', born in Boston Lincolnshire. He has a wife and many children (all with two middle names ;)) and several servants.
Tomorrow I will see if I can locate him in any other censuses.
This may be the marriage of this particular Thomas to his wife Harriet E:
Marriages Sep 1856
Baker Adolphus Camberwell 1d 748
Collis Thomas Camberwell 1d 748
Key Clara Camberwell 1d 748
Pattenden Harriet Ellen Camberwell 1d 748
Of course this may not be the correct Thomas Collis - further investigation is required ....
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That's very interesting oasorgard.
Do you have any more information about Thomas Collis and William Frost? Because these are common names, they are more difficult to trace than the men with unusual names.
Any little thing at all?
Names of wives or children?
I am sorry, I do not know any details about about them.
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Reynolds Newspapers Sunday December 23rd 1860
Carries a lengthy report of the Court case (Comyn v Comyn) where Stephen E Comyn was granted a decree nisi and damages of £2,000 (originally claiming £10,000!) against Emily Harriet Comyn.
Bristol Mercury Saturday May 16 1861
May 11th at Clifton, by the Rev Edward Cockey, MA, Stephen E Comyn, Esq of Cheltenham, to Charlotte, only child of Alexander Innes Scott, Esq, of Lansdown Terrace in the same place.
regards
I just read this article in Reynolds - what a scandal. ;D Mind you Stephen didn't waste any time remarrying.
Would you be interested in reading the article oasorgard?
It could have been interesting to read that article. You wright that Stephen E Comyn was a Esq of Cheltenham. Is Cheltenham a village or a manor?
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It was build a villa for the company manager. It is still standing, littlebit reconstructed, now the site for Vefsn Folkehøgskole - http://vefsn.fhs.no/
Here are som photos taken by me:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/oasoergaard/376595776/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/oasoergaard/376602954/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/oasoergaard/282670843/
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Hanes,
I'm not very good with this kind of thing, but maybe you would be kind enough to send a copy of that newspaper article to oasorgard? :)
Cheltenham is a very nice town in England:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheltenham
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The Company was declared bankrupt in 1872. The following item appeared in a newspaper at the time.
The Birmingham Daily Post, Wednesday 25th December 1872
COMMERCIAL AND MONETARY
The order to wind up the North of Europe Land and Mining Company (Limited) was accompanied by the statement that there had been gross fraud on the part of the Secretary of the company, who had absconded, and the company was utterly insolvent.
regards
oasorgard,
Although the winding up order was issued 1872 there are newspaper references to the North of Europe Land and Mining Company as late as 1881 and Chancery Division. No details - just the name and a time.
regards
Can I get more details out this informations?
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oasorgard,
Can send copy of the divorce case if you send me your e.mail via Private Message.
Regards checking out details of the bankruptcy have a look at www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/bankruptcy-records-after-1869.htm#19200
Essentially, it explains that bankruptcy records, although available, tend not to include background information. If you provide an e.mail will also send an example of the references continuing to appear in the newspapers after 1872.
regards
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Newspaper articles forwarded.
An interesting post!
regards
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I haven't had much time for researching this weekend, but hope to try to get back to this thread in the next couple of days. Fascinating families - I'm enjoying the search.
Do we know who the Secretary of the Company was? Was it one of these five men?
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Wondering the same thing myself.
Have been looking for possible bankrupties against the other 3 in the "gang of five" - w/out success to date.
regards
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Thank you for sending the files whit newspaper articles. May I ask from what newspapers the articles was from, and the dates?
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oasorgard,
Apologies - I normally incorporate the newspaper details in each file name before sending. Will be in touch
regards
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I have located the same Thomas Collis as found previously in the 1871 census.
In 1861 he is with his family in Lewisham, he's a 'hop merchant' b Lincolnshire. I have been unable to locate him in the 1881 census, however I did find a death which may be him in 1875/Lewisham/age 47. Age and place fits. I had a quick look for wife Harriet in 1881 but haven't been able to locate her or the children - Harriet may have remarried. I will search more carefully if you'd like this information?
I also located Thomas Collis in the 1851 census. This is quite interesting as he is living at home with his mother in Boston Lincolnshire. She is a "hop and timber merchant", and so is Thomas. This may tie in with Thomas Collis being involved in the timber aspect of The North of Europe Land and Mining Coy".
IF this is the correct Thomas Collis, then there is only William Frost to find. ;) I know that this is quite a common name. The surname is most common around Norfolk/Suffolk ....
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In the 1871 census there are 361 men with the name William Frost who are head of the family .... so we need another clue to trace him.
I found an article in the Daily News, London, Sat, Jan 9, 1875:
On the 8th at 5 Aberdeen Tce, Blackheath, Thomas Collis, youngest son of the late THomas Collis Esq of Boston Lincolnshire, aged 47.
This may be the Thomas Collis death mentioned earlier and the same Thomas Collis (hop/timber merchant) found in the censuses.
I also found an Alexander Prince in 1881 living in a boarding house in Marylebone. He is a widower aged 64 born Ealing Middlesex, and a Civil Engineer. Odd place for a Civil Engineer to be living. I wonder if this is the correct Alexander Prince, and the one I found earlier - he may have fallen on hard times if the Company was having financial difficulties?
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Unusual ... I found Gilbert Collis (son of THomas Collis) in the 1881 census. He is aged 21 and it states he is "son" though he doesn't appear to be a "son" of anyone. :-\ Interestingly he is living at 5 Aberdeen Terrace (stated as the address of the Thomas Collis who died), Lewisham. So undeniably the same family. Gilbert is an "Undergraduate Student of Law".
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Hello Oasorgard, JOSEPH RODNEY CROSKEY was my husband's great great great grandfather. He was born 12 April 1810 in Philadelphia, USA, but his father was an English settler from London. He married Maria Teresa Elvira MACOMB in Phil. in 1833, but was widowed shortly after, and remarried in 1843 on the Isle of Wight, England, to Sarah ROPER. His daughter from his first marriage was Isabella Bloomfield CROSKEY born 1834 in Burlington, New Jersey. She was my husband's great great grandmother. He had seven more children with his second wife.
I have some notes pertaining to JRC, which may be of interest - I will quote them below:-
"In the packet ship Sheridan, palled yesterday for Liverpool—Joseph Rodney Croskey, Ver Planck's Point, NY. (From NY Spectator, May 1842).
To Joseph Rodney Croskey, of Saint Michael's House, Cornhill, in the city of London, for the invention of "improvements in machinery or apparatus for receiving and paying out submarine electric telegraph cables". (From London Gazette, 6 May 1864).
The Bankruptcy Act, 1869. In the London Bankruptcy Court. In the Matter of Joseph Rodney Croskey. formerly of No. 43, Portsdown-road, .Maida Vale, and now No. 31,St. Mary's-terrace, Paddington, both in the county of Middlesex, formerly Merchant and Contractor, but now out ot business, a Bankrupt.
Archibald Scott Lawson, of 32, Essex-street, Strand in the county of Middlesex,. Gentleman, has been appointed Trustee of the property of the bankrupt. Tbe Court has appointed the Public Examination of the bankrupt to take place at tbe London Bankruptcy Court, Lincoln's-inn-fields, on the 16th day of January, 1878, at eleven o'clock in the forenoon. All persons having in their possession any of the effects of the bankrupt must deliver them to the trustee, and all debts due to the bankrupt must be paid to the trustee. Creditors who have not yet proved their debts must forward their proofs of debts to the trustee.—Dated
this 10th day of December, 1877. (From London Gazette, Dec 1877)."
JRC died in London in 1886, in the Chelsea Registration District.
I have other info on file but am not sure how much you are interested in. I knew nothing of his dealings in the N.E.L.M. Co. so this is new information to me.
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Welcome to rootschat Coomkeen.
I have really enjoyed the search for these men. Your husband's ancestors certainly led interesting lives.
It's quite sad to learn more details of their financial troubles. I hope Oasorgard will return to let you know if he requires further information about the Croskey family, or any of the other families.
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Hello Oasorgard, JOSEPH RODNEY CROSKEY was my husband's great great great grandfather. He was born 12 April 1810 in Philadelphia, USA, but his father was an English settler from London. He married Maria Teresa Elvira MACOMB in Phil. in 1833, but was widowed shortly after, and remarried in 1843 on the Isle of Wight, England, to Sarah ROPER. His daughter from his first marriage was Isabella Bloomfield CROSKEY born 1834 in Burlington, New Jersey. She was my husband's great great grandmother. He had seven more children with his second wife.
I have some notes pertaining to JRC, which may be of interest - I will quote them below:-
"In the packet ship Sheridan, palled yesterday for Liverpool—Joseph Rodney Croskey, Ver Planck's Point, NY. (From NY Spectator, May 1842).
To Joseph Rodney Croskey, of Saint Michael's House, Cornhill, in the city of London, for the invention of "improvements in machinery or apparatus for receiving and paying out submarine electric telegraph cables". (From London Gazette, 6 May 1864).
The Bankruptcy Act, 1869. In the London Bankruptcy Court. In the Matter of Joseph Rodney Croskey. formerly of No. 43, Portsdown-road, .Maida Vale, and now No. 31,St. Mary's-terrace, Paddington, both in the county of Middlesex, formerly Merchant and Contractor, but now out ot business, a Bankrupt.
Archibald Scott Lawson, of 32, Essex-street, Strand in the county of Middlesex,. Gentleman, has been appointed Trustee of the property of the bankrupt. Tbe Court has appointed the Public Examination of the bankrupt to take place at tbe London Bankruptcy Court, Lincoln's-inn-fields, on the 16th day of January, 1878, at eleven o'clock in the forenoon. All persons having in their possession any of the effects of the bankrupt must deliver them to the trustee, and all debts due to the bankrupt must be paid to the trustee. Creditors who have not yet proved their debts must forward their proofs of debts to the trustee.—Dated
this 10th day of December, 1877. (From London Gazette, Dec 1877)."
JRC died in London in 1886, in the Chelsea Registration District.
I have other info on file but am not sure how much you are interested in. I knew nothing of his dealings in the N.E.L.M. Co. so this is new information to me.
Hello, I am sorry for my late reply. The information I want to know about Joseph Rodney Croskey (and the other 4 founders of The North of Europe Land & Mining Co. Ltd) is where and when he was born and died, when and whit who he was married, name and birthdate of his children, and a summary about his life.
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Hi, I'm not sure if this is still active, but I'll try to post anyway.
I'm trying to find my great great grandfather's father, which was one of the englishmen who founded this company. Or, so my grandfather believes. I know for a fact that he worked there, in a high position, so it seem logic that he was one of the co-founders. All I know is that he had an affair with my great great great grandmother, and that they had a son i the late 1800's. She left her son with her sister and her family in Herøy. I don't know if he was married at the time, or had any children. He was a bit older than her, I think. I believe she worked as a maid or something, and I think she lived in Mosjøen. I don't know which one the englishmen that could be his father, I haven't founds a listings which mentions either names. So I wonder if perhaps anyone knows if any of these man had a child in Norway. I would like to know who he was, and if I have any relatives in England. And it would be nice for my grandfather to know where his ancestry is from. All of the Brænden-relatives at that time where blond and blue-eyed, my great great grandfather had dark hair and dark eyes, which I believe is an heritage of his father. If anyone could help me find him, or give examples of pages I might visit, I would be thrilled!
Best regards,
Hanne, from Herøy - Norway :-)
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Hi, I'm not sure if this is still active, but I'll try to post anyway.
I'm trying to find my great great grandfather's father, which was one of the englishmen who founded this company. Or, so my grandfather believes. I know for a fact that he worked there, in a high position, so it seem logic that he was one of the co-founders. All I know is that he had an affair with my great great great grandmother, and that they had a son i the late 1800's. She left her son with her sister and her family in Herøy. I don't know if he was married at the time, or had any children. He was a bit older than her, I think. I believe she worked as a maid or something, and I think she lived in Mosjøen. I don't know which one the englishmen that could be his father, I haven't founds a listings which mentions either names. So I wonder if perhaps anyone knows if any of these man had a child in Norway. I would like to know who he was, and if I have any relatives in England. And it would be nice for my grandfather to know where his ancestry is from. All of the Brænden-relatives at that time where blond and blue-eyed, my great great grandfather had dark hair and dark eyes, which I believe is an heritage of his father. If anyone could help me find him, or give examples of pages I might visit, I would be thrilled!
Best regards,
Hanne, from Herøy - Norway :-)
I found out some new facts about my great great grandfather. He did grow up at his aunt and uncle, but they lived around Mosjøen, not in Herøy as I first wrote. He driftes the farm for a few years before he bought his farm in Herøy. He was born in 1882. And his mothers relatives came from Gudbrandsdalen.
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Hi all, Stephen was my second great grandfather. As far as I can tell he and Emily divorced in 1856 or 1859 I can’t recall which so I assume he remarried. If anyone has any intel on his ancestors I’d be most grateful, busy researching!