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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: joboy on Tuesday 15 March 11 05:45 GMT (UK)
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I dont know where to post this photo post card from France c1916.
It was in amongst family photos and no one can identify where this soldier might fit (if at all) in our family tree.
He is a corporal as you can see and on the reverse side is written;
"Sincerely Yours H E ANDERSON 4531" ...... the number would be his regimental number.
Obviously an Australian
joboy
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Hi there,
Could be Henry Edward ANDERSON, 4131 EDIT TO NOTE later posts show Albert Edgar ANDERSON would be the chap in the photo
His AIF service records should be digitised at the National Archives of Australia's website
http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/recordsearch/index.aspx
He is listed at the AIF project http://www.aif.adfa.edu.au/index.html
Cheers, JM
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Joboy,
I'm sure the Australian War Memorial would like a copy of that photograph. They are trying to collect photographs of all those who served in WW1.
Dee :)
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Sorry to butt in on your thread joboy (great photo, by the way :) ) - Dee, where did you find out about the project to collect photos of WW1 soldiers? I have a couple I'd be happy to donate copies of, but just had a look on their website and can't find anything about it...
Cheers
Prue
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;D
Me again ! Prue, I heard about the AWM seeking photos also.... It was on the ABC radio perhaps Tony Delroy interviewing the curator re Hall of Valour opening... Also, there's those 3000 glass plates found in France ... all AIF
Cheers, JM
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Thanks JM ;) I'll email my friend who's the assistant curator of photography there, and get the details! Have a few pics of Grandad Harry and his friends that I'd love to share with them.
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EDIT TO NOTE that later posts show the chap in the photo would be Albert Edgar ANDERSON, and not Henry Edward Anderson.
Re Henry Edward ANDERSON 4131
His service records are digitised, 31 pages... he enlisted twice, discharged first time after gun shot wound to right knee, returned to South Australia in late 1916. Recovered, re-enlisted, and sent back to France. Discharged 1919. His next of kin was his father.
Henry was born May 26 1898. His father was John ANDERSON of Parr St LARGS BAY South Australia.
There's a death on an online index for a Henry Edward ANDERSON, with d o d as 25 June 1959, registered Sth Aust. Page Number 4001, Vol 893. I am not familiar with Sth Aust records, and have no way of confirming if this would be the same Henry Edward ANDERSON 4131.
Perhaps the RChatters with good understanding of Sth Aust records can follow up ;D ;D ;D
Cheers, JM
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Re the glass plates (I'm thinking the photo that joboy posted could have been taken by the photographer of those glass plates)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,517066.0.html
also
http://www.gloucesteradvocate.com.au/news/local/news/general/local-link-to-lost-diggers/2096698.aspx
Cheers, JM
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Great photo Joboy!
Interesting project - I wish I had a photo to send to the AWM ....
[Prue, it would not be fair on the other lads to have Grandad Harry's image appearing alongside theirs. He's too damn good looking! ;)
(PS. Love your website by the way)]
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Thought I should post what is on the reverse of the photo just in case I have not given the correct initials or anything else.
joboy
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His name was Albert Edgar Anderson Serv No 4351
He was born in Victoria and his father was Peter John Anderson and his mother was
Beatrice Ellen Mudge
He's a digitised record.
Cheers Sue
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The regimental Number is 4351 (not 4531)
This appears to be the 20th Btn, 11th reinforcement.
The only Anderson in the Btn I can see is:
(Corporal) Anderson, Albert Edgar - a farmer from Bearbong, Gilgandra.
NOK- P.J. Anderson (father) of Bearbong Gilgandra
:-\
edit: Oh that's good news Sue - I thought I must have had the wrong guy, Pleased to see I haven't lost all my marbles just yet ;D
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Yes, great news ...
From Albert Edgar ANDERSON's digitised records, he returned to Australia with his wife and child in Nov 1919... He had married in England.
Fingers crossed there's a link to Joboy's family!
Cheers, JM
PS, I will re-edit my posts re Henry Edward ANDERSON... :)
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Sorry to butt in on your thread joboy (great photo, by the way :) ) - Dee, where did you find out about the project to collect photos of WW1 soldiers? I have a couple I'd be happy to donate copies of, but just had a look on their website and can't find anything about it...
Cheers
Prue
Prue, when I visited the AWM a couple of years ago, the guide on one of the tours explained that they were trying to collect a photograph of every soldier to put with their records. You'll notice if you search the collections, that some records have a photograph with them. I was also given a pamphlet explaining what they were doing. I'll see if I can find it.
Dee :)
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Great - thanks Dee :D
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Re Albert Edgar ANDERSON
There's an online tree with his details perhaps Joboy can contact the tree owner as there's a portrait photo of Albert on this link
http://anderson.sacada.net/FamilyTree/individual.php?pid=I113&ged=Anderson.GED&tab=0
Born 6 March 1896, Victoria AUSTRALIA
Married 9 May 1919, in England to Elsie Ivy AMOS
Died 9 April 1968, Norton Fitzwarren, Somerset, England
Fingers crossed, EDIT TO ADD, there's living descendants for Elsie and Albert ANDERSON noted on that tree.
Cheers, JM
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My Goodness ........ you people can ferret out anything ...... I have written to Scott Anderson telling him what I have ........... will keep you posted.
joboy
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Will look forward to hearing what results, joboy. :D
For Prue.....
Sorry to say I can't find the AWM pamphlet. It's not in any of the places I thought it might be. I was going to PM this message to you but then I did some research on the AWM site and thought it might be of interest to others if I post this link to the page I found.......
http://www.awm.gov.au/blog/2008/04/14/roll-of-honour-photographs
Added: I did get it a bit wrong.....photos are being collected for those on the Roll of Honour, not all who served.
Dee :)
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What a fantastic picture.
I also have photos from WW1 and did not know of the program to collect photos. Must contact them
Elsie Amos
Father Joseph Amos
I do like the part of his record that states the reason for extended leave was that he was shearing in England.
Mentioned as wounded in action in the Sydney Morning Herald on the 29th October 1917.
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Great results on the photo, everyone :D :D :D joboy, would love to hear back when/if they make contact with you...
Dee, never mind - thanks for looking. I'll get in touch with them anyway and find out about it. :)
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The email address for photographs enquiries is on the page of the link I posted, Prue.........
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Got a bewildering answer from the administrator of the website this morning which reads (identifying parts removed);
You sent the following message to a PhpGedView administrator:
Your Name: Joe ******
Email Address: ************
A photo of Albert Edgar Anderson as a corporal in the Australian Army c 1916 has shown up in an old family photo box.
No relation to the family has been found so far.
Joe in Parramatta NSW
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This message was sent while viewing the following URL:
http://anderson.sacada.net/FamilyTree/individual.php?pid=I138&ged=Anderson.GED&ged=Anderson.GED
=--------------------------------------=
IP ADDRESS: 58.172.113.15
DNS LOOKUP: CPE-58-172-113-15.ryqa1.ken.bigpond.net.au
LANGUAGE: english
...................................................................
so have replied asking them whether Scott Anderson has/has not got my message or are they merely confirming that I have sent a message.
....................................................................................
Sometimes I really despair over this modern world ........ have we lost the art of *effective* communication?
joboy
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I must have hurried things along ........... just heard from Scott Anderson said;
I have received your message. Albert Edgar Anderson's family is now in
England. They may be interested in your photo. Could you email a scan
please.
..........................................................
so I have just done as he asked but asked him to ask them as to how this photo may have wound up in my family's treasured momentos.
Will keep you posted.
Joe
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Hi Joe,
Great news!
It might be that Albert was mates with one of your own rellies during the war, and they swapped photos.
I hope the family enjoys seeing his picture :)
Cheers
Prue
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Hello there
there is also this wonderful site
Mapping our Anzacs
http://mappingouranzacs.naa.gov.au/
where you can contribute what information and details you have for the men and women who served in The Great War
Jenn
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The following is a positive answer from his UK family;
.........................................................................................
Hi Joe,
I have been in contact with Norman and Alan, Albert's sons. This is their
reply...
"We have decided that this is our dad! On three counts:-
The signature on the back of the photo is identical in style to the one
he was still using right up to the end of his life.
Alan, my brother, looked at Mum's marriage certificate, and there he is
described as a corporal.
Although at first I did not think the photo looked like him, a
comparison with the other one you mentioned shows that the chin and cheek
line are very similar, as well as the nose. It's the hat that makes him look
different.
The signature really confirms it.
Why the photo is with Joe 's folk we can only guess. The card
is from France, but not written on, so I guess Dad sent it to Australia in
and envelope. The number by his signature is probably his number as a
soldier, and is included for the censor's satisfaction. Maybe there was a
letter with the card, but the rather formal 'Sincerely yours' suggests to me
that he may not have known the addressee very well.
Dad's best friend in the army was Norman Drummond, a
Methodist whom befriended him on the troop ship going to Europe. (I was
named after him.) Norman was later an executive in the Far West Children's
Charity. If that rings any bells with Joe's folk that may explain the
connection. But that is a long shot. Dad must have had many other contacts
back home."
Norman!
We would be interested in finding the connection to your family. Does any of
that information help?
Cheers,
Scott.
.......................................................................................
So it looks like this will be an ongoing project
I have responded by providing the following;
...............................................................................
I am so glad that the image has come home to roost.
The question now is 'How did it arrive with my folk?"
I can be eliminated from the equation as I am a 'blow in' and arrived in
Australia in 1947 as a Royal Marine and married an Australian girl.
The family names in her family were;
Finch;Harding;Bell;Gill;Muir;McGee and Clarke
My best guess is with the Muir McGee group who were closely related and I
have attached a newspaper clipping that is relevant to this group.
William Crawford Muir father of the Muir that died at Gallipoli married into my wife's family.
............................................................................................
Joe
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Well Done Joboy !
You certainly found the right place to post the photo !
Cheers, JM
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may help
sylvia
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Well Done Joboy !
You certainly found the right place to post the photo !
Cheers, JM
Well done to everyone who participated!
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may help
sylvia
Hey ............. I like that enlargement Sylvia ......... I must send that on.
Thank you,
Joe
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Great news, Joe!
Thanks for keeping us posted on this story.......
Dee :)
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Ditto from me ;D
allways good to hear the outcome thanks for posting Joe
Jenn
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then I did some research on the AWM site and thought it might be of interest to others if I post this link to the page I found.......
http://www.awm.gov.au/blog/2008/04/14/roll-of-honour-photographs
Added: I did get it a bit wrong.....photos are being collected for those on the Roll of Honour, not all who served.
Apologies for replying to a very old post. Only just found it.
I think it a pity that the war memorial is not collecting photos of all who served. All the WWI diggers are gone now and many of their families may be gone soon. The opportunity to collect these photos is now and not in a generation or 2 or a hundred years' time when the photos are no longer there.
Do those who left no kin not have the right to be remembered?
Do those who were wounded and died once home not have as much right to remembrance as those who died on the battlefield? After all they had the daily battlefield of injury?
Are they too not be remembered because they did not die early enough or reach their centenary of age?
Bravery is not necessarily awarded medals. I am certain many deserved VCs but the process and system of observing and recording and reporting was not in place or unknown to those present.
Unobserved and unseen bravery is still bravery. And those who lived with and died of wounds later still died for Australia but do not appear on the roll of honour.
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In many localities throughout Australia there are War Memorials, Honour Rolls, Plaques and other permanent reminders. Recorded on these are the names of those locals who served, not just those who did not return, but the names of those who served. Local communities raised the funds, collected the details and set about ensuring that "their name liveth forever more"
Lest We Forget.
JM
then I did some research on the AWM site and thought it might be of interest to others if I post this link to the page I found.......
http://www.awm.gov.au/blog/2008/04/14/roll-of-honour-photographs
Added: I did get it a bit wrong.....photos are being collected for those on the Roll of Honour, not all who served.
.....
Do those who left no kin not have the right to be remembered?
Do those who were wounded and died once home not have as much right to remembrance as those who died on the battlefield? After all they had the daily battlefield of injury?
Are they too not be remembered because they did not die early enough or reach their centenary of age?
Bravery is not necessarily awarded medals. I am certain many deserved VCs but the process and system of observing and recording and reporting was not in place or unknown to those present.
Unobserved and unseen bravery is still bravery. And those who lived with and died of wounds later still died for Australia but do not appear on the roll of honour.
ADD
https://www.awm.gov.au/encyclopedia/war-memorials/
Further ADD
https://www.warmemorialsregister.nsw.gov.au/
http://monumentaustralia.org.au/sources
http://www.dva.gov.au/commemorations-memorials-and-war-graves/memorials/war-memorials
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I'm hoping that this message will make it through to Albert Edgar Anderson's family in the UK. As I mentioned in response to a previous post, he sent letters through to the Sydney Stock & Station Journal under the name "Lucerne" as did his sister.
He sent this letter in about his trip over on the boat:
Sydney Stock and Station Journal (NSW : 1896 - 1924), Friday 14 April 1916, page 8
________________________________________
FAREWELL.
Dear 'Planets,' — My address you want I know, so I am writing now to let you have it. We embarked under an overcast- sky, but we did very well though. We are on a lovely boat, and everything seems very comfortable. We are in for a great trip, I think, and I have to come through with some knowledge of troopship travelling to tell fellow-Leaguers. I am just writing this before dinner, so I will have to dose. I will try and write to the League later, as I am afraid they will think me a deserter. having not written for montns But during the last few weeks I have been just awfully busy and couldn’t write to anyone hardly. Must close or miss the last post, so with best wishes. I bid you and all the Leaguers good-bye for the present. — Your, etc., _ 'LUCERNE.'
I started researching these soldiers as I could trace them back before the war and in some instances afterwards as well. One of the journalists enlisted. He was Colin Barclay Smith but wrote as "Barclay". After joining him on bike tours through NSW before he enlisted and through Egypt and France, it turned out that he lived a street away from where I grew up in Sydney, although he had died by then. I would be happy to share my research with his family.
Best wishes,
Rowena
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May I just share a thread about joboy
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=819731.0
JM
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Great story and wonderful picture
World war 1 photography was not accessible to all. Anyone who has photos of their ancestors is lucky .
One of my grandparents got a box brownie camera in 1925 . My other grandfather had a few photos of his family who emigrated in 40's and his shipmates from ww2 but all in a box mixed up ..He knew who they were but didn't think to make notes for us .
I donated the navy ones to someone doing a project .