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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) => Topic started by: kay727 on Monday 21 February 11 16:35 GMT (UK)
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Martha pickersgill was born in 1833 in wombwell in barnsley to a joseph and elizabeth pickersgill. I am trying to track down baptism records She has a brother reuben who is born in the same place in 1831. Has anyone come across them at all? thanks.
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On IGI ther is a Martha Pickersgill bp. at Darfield Yorkshire on the 29/7/1832. She is the daughter of a Joseph and an Elizabeth Pickersgill.
Maybe the one.
Regards Amber39
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Thanks for that, it saids in the census that she is born in 1833 but that could be a mistake. Did you be any chance pick up a baptism in 1831 for a reuben pickersgill at the same church, he is the only sibling I have been able to trace via census records.
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My 3rd great grandmother is called Ann Pickersgill and according to Censuses was born about 1820 in Greasbrough. However, on the 1841 Census, when married to Thomas Burton, she is living at, Smithley in Wombwell. On the same street is a Joseph Pickersgill with his family, so I have wondered for a long time if Joseph is somehow connected to 'my' Ann Pickersgill.
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Kay, IGI does not have a Christening for Reuben, but it does have the following:
Mary Pickersgill
Sept 19, 1824 - Darfield
Father: Joseph Pickersgill / Mother: Elizabeth
Martha Pickersgill
July 29, 1832 / Darfield
Father: Joseph Pickersgill / Mother: Elizabeth
Marriage
Joseph Pickersgill / Elizabeth Ditch
Dec 25, 1815
Darfield, Yorkshire
Madri
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Thank you to everyone for kindly supplying the information on martha pickersgill. with regard to Ann pickersgill, I have not looked at the 1841 census in detail, but it puts joseph and elizabeth, who are stated as both 45years old, and their children Martha and Reuben, who are 8 years and 10 years, in ecclesfield. Both children are born in wombwell, and Martha it seems is probably baptised in darfield. Reuben certainly goes on to baptise his first son in darfield. The closest baptism I can find for joseph, puts him in Normanton on 19th febuary 1792, and his parents as Ruben and susan pickersgill, but this is just going by his census details in 1861, and is not confirmed. If ann is a sibling then her history may fit in with this, if you have got that far. Where did she marry? I am interested in Martha as she is the mother of my great great grandmother, and I was filling out her family background.
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I haven't yet purchased Ann's marriage certificate as I'm not sure I've got the correct entry, but the most likely match is for a marriage in Ecclesfield (to Thomas Burton). So, your Pickersgill link to Ecclesfield is an intriguing one as I'd previously assumed that my Ann wouldn't have any connection with Ecclesfield. I've been stuck on this branch for a while and it doesn't help that Ann consistently gives her birth place as Greasbrough. Perhaps the Pickersgills in your family tree lived there for a while?
Having just double checked the 1841 Census, Ann (Pickersgill) and Thomas Burton are living just a couple of doors away from Joseph Pickersgill, ELizabeth Pickersgill, Reuben Pickersgill and Martha Pickersgill.
There must be a connection here.
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Kay, do you have these Census details:
1851 Census
HO107 / 2333 / 168 / 39
Fearnleys
Joseph Pickersgill / head / 59 / Farm Labourer / b. Normanton
Betty / wife / 58 / b. Wom?
Reubin / son / unmarr / Collier / b. Wombwell
Martha / dau / 18 / unmarr / b. Wombwell
1861 Census - family listed as Cockler
RG09 / 3509 / 43 / 18
8 Triggs Houses, Greasbrough Road, Greasbrough
Elizabeth Pickersgill / head / 69 / Widow / Laundress / b. Wombwell
William Cockler / son / 35 / Miner / b. Middlewich, Cheshire
Martha / dau / 28 / b. ...dler (cannot read it)
Ann Elizabeth / g.dau / 6mths / b. Greasbrough
Madri
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thank you madri, this ties things together nicely, martha pickersgill marries a william cokeley in rotherham in the last quarter of 1852, often spelt cockley, but not seen this version. they have a daughter elizabeth ann in 1860, the name has been reversed by mistake at one point. she is born in greasboro, so that works. Elizabeth ann is my great great grandmother. He is a miner and is born in middlewich. I did not have this entry, as not got down to trawling the census in detail, so this has been very useful. The tie in to normanton is handy too as confirms baptism details for joseph.
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does the 1851 census give an address, as I have them in ecclesfield in 1841 and barnsley in 1851, an address would be great.
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Kay, address is as shown: i.e Address: Fearnleys / Registration District: Barnsley.
Madri
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craig does your ann pickersgill have a sibling called mary, one was baptised in darfield on 19th sept 1826, parents a joseph and elizabeth pickersgill. Both joseph and his son reuben have children baptised here so obviously a family connection to the parish.
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sorry I didnt pick up fearnley as an address as usually its a road etc, they seem to come to and thro between rotherham and barnsley. thanks.
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Kay - I have the family in Wombwell on the 1841 Census (Joseph, Elizabeth, Martha and Reuben). Are we looking at different families?
By 1851, my Ann is living in the centre of Rotherham on Westgate.
By 1861, she is living in Greasbrough and thereafter back in the centre of Rotherham.
My Ann named her children, Joseph, Thomas, Elizabeth and Mary. Some coincidence that they are names belonging to your Pickersgill family don't you think?
Unfortunately, I know nothing about Ann's siblings and parents. This thread is probably the biggest breakthrough I've had so far.
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Having just looked at the 1861 Census, I have concluded that my Ann must have been on or very near to Greasbrough Road in 1861 as they are living very close to the Junction Inn. This pub (perhaps a rebuild) has closed but is still standing and is at the bottom of Primrose Hill on Greasbrough Road.
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Just found the following website which seems to connect to the Pickersgill family we're looking at:-
http://www.faulkners-web.com/Sharon/genealogy/pafg123.htm#4693
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craig, Elizabeth Pickersgill is in 1861 living at 8 triggs houses, greasborough road, she is now a widow, as joseph had died inbetween census. With her is Martha, who in dec quarter of 1852 married william cokeley, and they have a 6 month old child, elizabeth ann. Reuben in 1861, is married with a family and remains in barnsley. I do not have online resources and have not yet looked up the census in the records office, my basic search just put the family in the district of ecclesfield, but if you have a more detailed address that would be good. Joseph and eliza were married in 1815, and in 1841 have two children, so it is probable there were older siblings who are in seperate households due to marriage. The fact that ann stays close to elizabeth would seem to suggest a strong possibility that they are mother and daughter. If you come up with anything else let me know. thanks.
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Hi Kay,
Just double checked and they were livng in Wombwell.
Apparently Ecclesfield Rural District which lasted until 1850 covered a very wide area:-
http://www.ukbmd.org.uk/genuki/reg/districts/ecclesfield.html
Therefore, although 'my' Ann and Thomas marriage in the registration district of Ecclesfield, I reckon they married in Darfield. Apparently, Wombwell wasn't equipped for marriages until the 1860's.
I got the above information from the Sheffield Indexers website where I made a post. The Sheffield Indexers also hold records for Darfield burials.
I'm sure we must be connected - our ancestors living in both Wombwell and Greasbrough (and in close proximity to each other) and my Ann naming her offspring after Joseph, Elizabeth and Mary etc.
I just need to find somebody with access to the Darfield parish records or shell out to the GRO. LOL
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Joseph and elizabeth appear to be married in Darfield in 1815 and Martha is baptised there, so its probable. Martha dies in 1874 prior to her daughter elizabeth anns marriage in 1877, but william cokeley ends up with his daughters family in snail hill which is near westgate. Hope your search goes well and thanks for your help.
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Hi Kay,
The circumstantial evidence here is mounting. Ann's children, Thomas and Mary both lived on Snail Hill for over thirty years. In fact, on the 1891 Census, Mary Morton (nee Burton) is living next door to William Cockley who is living with his daughter, Elizabeth A. Surtees?
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Having looked at Reuben Pickersgill, I realise that there were two Reuben Pickersgills living at the same time and in the same areas.
Reuben number 1 (who I believe to be 'ours'):-
1) Reuben is with his parents on the 1841 Census in Wombwell.
2) Reuben is with his parents on the 1851 Census in Hoyland (birth place is given as Wombwell and birth date about 1831).
3) Reuben appears to marry Martha Siddall about November 1852 in Rotherham. This marriage appears on the same page as Martha Pickersgill who married William Cokeley (I have submitted a corrected to FreeBMD with regards to William not appearing on this page due to a transcription error).
4) Reuben is with Martha and family on the 1871 Census in Hoyland (birth place given as Smithly and birth date around 1831).
5) Reuben is with Martha and family on the 1881 Census in Monk Bretton (birth place given as Wombwell and birth date about 1831).
6) 2) Reuben is with Martha and family on the 1891 Census in Barnsley (birth place given as Wombwell and birth date about 1831).
Reuben number 2:-
1) Reuben appears to be with his parents (John and Susan) on the 1841 Census in Finningley.
2) Reuben is with a Kay family on the 1851 Census in Greasbrough (birth place given as ? and birth date about 1835).
3) Reuben appears to marry Sarah Thompson about May 1857 in Rotherham.
4) Reuben is with Sarah and family on the 1861 Census in Greasbrough (birth place given as Finningley and birth date about 1832).
5) Reuben is married but visiting a Beardshaw family on the 1871 Census (birth place given as Finningley and birth date of about 1833).
6) Reuben is widowed but living with family on the 1881 Census in Rawmarsh (birth place given as Finningley and birth date about 1833).
7) Reuben POSSIBLY married Emily ? about February 1890 in Barnsley.
8) If the above marriage is correct, Reuben is with Emily in Ardsley on the 1891 Census (birth place given as Tinsley (?) and birth date around 1832). Two members of the household are apparently born in Parkgate which is next to Rawmarsh where Reuben was living in 1881.
Both Reubens appear to be dead by the 1901 Census. I believe 'ours' died about February 1901 in Barnsley (aged 70) and the 'other' Reuben died about May 1898 in Barnsley (aged 65).
It seems very coincidental that both Reubens have associations with Greasbrough but I believe that that is all it is. It seems more than likely that Reuben and his sister, Martha, married at the same time – a double wedding perhaps.
I still have not been able to establish a confirmed link between the Ann Pickersgill in my family tree and Joseph Pickersgill and Elizabeth Ditch. However, I am provisionally going to attach her as a child of Joseph and Elizabeth on the following grounds:-
1) Ann is living two households away from Joseph and Elizabeth on the 1841 Census.
2) Ann is living in close proximity to her mother and siblings on the 1861 Census in a different town – Greasbrough.
3) Ann's daughter, Mary Morton, is living next door to Elizabeth Ann Surtees and William Cokeley (marriage to Martha Pickersgill) on the 1891 Census. William is Mary's Uncle and Elizabeth Ann is William's daughter which makes Mary and Elizabeth Ann first cousins.
4) Ann names her children, Elizabeth (after her mother?), Joseph (after her father?) and Mary (after her sister?).
There can be no doubt that the two families are connected although I aim to get documentary evidence of this at some point in my lifetime.
Elizabeth Pickersgill, Martha Pickersgill, William Cokeley, Elizabeth Ann Cokeley and Frederick Surtees are all buried in Moorgate Cemetery, Rotherham. Moorgate is also the resting place of Ann Pickersgill and many of the Burton clan.
The website, http://www.faulkners-web.com/Sharon/genealogy/, would appear to connect to 'our' Reuben.
I would welcome any additional comments if anybody reading this has any, either now or in the future.
People who believe they are connected to the Joseph Pickersgill/Elizabeth Ditch branch, may wish to visit my website which can be found at, www.mollekin.net. I host a large family tree there and it contains a lot of information regarding the Burton family including photos of people, residences and other locations of relevance.
Kind Regards,
Craig
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Sometimes this site is useful found Martha www.familysearch.org i have some Pickersgills in my tree good luck :)
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Craig, in case you want the details for your family tree, I found the parish marriage entries for Reuben and Martha at all Saints parish church in rotherham, not a double wedding, Reuben marries martha siddall on the 1st November and Martha marries at the same church on the 14th novemeber 1852. Joseph is confirmed as their father. Residence is generally described as rotherham so no detail there. Interestingly Reuben and martha both state they are 21, but could be an error on reubens part. They all sign by mark so obviously were illiterate.
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Thank you Kaz for the suggestion, I have used this site, but it did not give much on marthas early years, so this posting has given me a lot more background stuff.
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Hi, haven't any info but picked up on the message from Craig on 22/2 leading you on to a website. Here it mentions Joseph Pickersgill marrying Priscilla Ward in the 1889. Priscilla is my maternal grandmothers sister who's family lived in Cudworth. I have been researching the Ward family and found that my g/mother and a sister moved in with Joseph and Priscilla around 1891 after their father died.
Sorry this is not helpful but i was interested in the very "distant" link.
Regards
Joan - Bolton/Lancs