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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => Topic started by: a j bayram on Friday 18 February 11 09:05 GMT (UK)

Title: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Friday 18 February 11 09:05 GMT (UK)
I am seeking information on the above surname and hope someone will come up trumps.

My Grandfather/Gt. Grandfather and Gt., Gt. Grandfather were all born in North Lincolnshire.  However, there are a number of Bayram's North of the Humber in East Yorkshire, especially around the Hull area.

My knowledge of these is, at best, sketchy (I have the family tree back to around 1800 but, no meat e.g. marriages etc.).

Any help appreciated.

It is believed that they may have originated from the West Yorkshire area.

Regards... Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Friday 18 February 11 14:53 GMT (UK)
To be able to help, we really need a bit more detail.

You say you have a tree back to 1800 - is it reliable, or do you doubt it as it does not have evidence in it to back it up?

It would be starting with your most recent confirmed fact (maybe your grandfather or great grandfather, or whatever) and work back, checking marriages censuses etc as you go. This will have a two fold benefit, firtly it will check what you have, and secondly will fill in the gaps you have.

If you use FreeBMD and the censuses, you should be well away. But we are always willing to help here on Rootschat, so if you need help with a look up then do give us all the info you already have (names, dates places etc) and we wil help look for your missing item.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Friday 18 February 11 20:22 GMT (UK)
Have got in tree so far:-


Jack Drewery (Father) b1921 Plymouth;

George Drewery (G.F.) b1881 Grimsby (m Mabel Robinson 1911 @ Broughton); 3 siblings Mary b1877, John b1879 and Martha b1880 [last 2 died in infancy];

William Drewery (GGGF) b1857 Riby (m Dinah/Diana Drinkall @ Frodingham 1877);

John (GGGGF) b1832? Gt Coates  (m1856? firstly Martha Drewery [2 more wifes after?);

John (GGGGGF) b1806? Pontefract? (m???? surname unknown).

There are a number of bayram's on freebmd but, a number do not tie up with the above.

My Grandfather, George b1881 (above) was one of 4 but the 2 mentioned as dying in infancy were aged 2 & 3 respectively and the surviving sister, Mary, appears to have disappeared without trace.  Other information has given me 4 suggestions as to her progress.

GGGGF (b1832) married twice? more after my GGGF was born (I assume this was due to widowhood) and this has resulted in further branches coming down as parallel lines.

As said earlier, most of the above were born in North Lincolnshire.

I hope this is what you ask for.

Regards... Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 11:37 GMT (UK)
Now you may think me rather thick, as I have probably missed something vital ... but can you confirm what surname we are looking at?
I thought it was Bayram, but now they are all listed as Drewery ...
or do they all have the middle name of Drewery?


Have answered this myself as I search ..... ;D
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 11:44 GMT (UK)
OK, have found them in 1881 as Bayram, just before George is born.
Have you seen this? 1881 is free to search.

RG11 3271 12 18
Chalrton Terrace, Grimsby
Willy Bayram 24 Policeman bn Riby
Dinah wife 23 bn Rirton?
Mary 4 dtr bn Grimsby
John 2 son bn Grimsby
Martha 1 dtr bn Grimsby
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 11:49 GMT (UK)
And here they are in 1891 - he does stick to being "Willy" not "WIlliam" it seems, and has finished his police career.

RG12 2613 65 17

76 Chapman Street Grimsby
Willie D Bayram 34 Timber Yard Merchant bn Riby
Dinah 32 wife bn Kirton Lindsey
Mary A E 14 bn Scunthorpe
George D 9 bn Grimsby
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 11:58 GMT (UK)
1901
RG13 3091 91 19
same address
Willey D Bayram 44 Mar Timber yard foreman bn Riby
George D son 19 Apprentice fitter Iron and steel bn Grimsby

Although Willey says married he is actually widowed -

Death
Jan/Feb/Mar 1893
Caistor
Diana Bayram  age 32

And Willy dies :
Death
Jul/Aug/Sep 1907
Grimsby
Willy Drewery Bayram age 51

Have you got their death certs at all?

Actually the best thing to get would br a copy of Willey's WILL - that may mention daughter Mary and give a clue to her whereabouts.

There is an entry in the probate index -
Willey Drewery Bayram of 66 Cromwell Rd Grimsby died 17 Sep 1907, probate granted 18 Dec 1907 Executors Kate Jane Bayram widow and Charles Lister Timber Maerchants Clerk, Effects £826 - 4s - 9d

Kate Jane? did he marry again I wonder!
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 12:08 GMT (UK)
Well I never! He was right when he said he was married in 1901 census -

MArriage
Oct/Nov/Dec 1896
Louth ref 7a 1307
Willey Drewery Bayram
one of brides on same page - Kate Jane Onn

Going back to 1901, Kate J Bayram, married, bn Lincoln, is a visitor in a househols on varios Onns in Fulstoe Lincolnshire
RG13 3087 89 14
so that all ties up nicely.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 12:19 GMT (UK)
Just to finish filling in the details of this family, before going back a generation, here are the births of the children -

George Drewery Bayram Oct/Nov/Dec 1881 Caistor ref 7a 630

Martha Bayram Ap/May/Jun 1880 Caistor ref 7a 690

John Willey Bayram Jan/Feb/Mar 1879 Caistor ref 7a 652

Mary was born before the marriage it seems, so registered in Dinah's maiden name-

Mary Ann E Drinkall Jan/Feb/Mar 1877 Glanford Brigg ref 7a 746


Here is the marriage, which I believe you have already-
Marriage
Jul/Aug/Sep 1877
Glahford Brigg 7a 1118
Dinah Drinkall / Willey Drewery Bayram on same page


And the deaths of Martha and John-

both Oct/Nov/Dec 1882
MArtha age 2, John Willey age 3
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 12:34 GMT (UK)
Now to move back, efore WIlly D married Dinah.
Here he is in 1891:

RG10 3416 63 12
Irby

Ann Drewry 76 widow farmer 43 acres bn Irby
Delphy dtr 36 unm Dressmaker bn MattonRoss?
Betsy 25 grandaughter unm Dairymaid bn Irby
John Tomlinson  22 farm servant
William Bayram 14 grandson bn Riby

Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 12:48 GMT (UK)
1861
RG9 2390 78 13
Waltham, Lincs

John 29 Foreman Ag lab bn Great Coates
Martha 29 bn Irby
Willie 4 bn Riby
George 2 bn Irby
+ 2 farm servants

Marriage
Ap/May/JUn 1856
Caistor 7a 1117
John Bayram / Martha Drewry on same page

Have you got his cert to confirm John's Dad?

Here is WIllley's birth reg -

Ap/May/JUn 1857
Caistor ref 7c 373
William Drury Balim

Have you got his birth cert?
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 12:58 GMT (UK)
Ok, now to investigate John and MArtha further.

In 1871 we know our Willey is at his maternal grandparents farm.

Here is his brother George (we saw as 2 in 1861) and his Dad, who as you say appears to have a second wife
and has produced lots of siblings for WIlliam and George

1871
RG10 3417 48 7
Immingham
John 38 Farmer foreman bn Great Coates
Matilda 33 bn Goxhill
George 11 bn Irby
Drewry 9 bn Waltham
John 7 bn Immington
Elizabeth 6 bn Immington
AnneyG 5mths bn Immington
+ 3 farm servants

Marriage
Jul/Aug/Sep1870
Caistor 7a 779
John Bayram / Matilda Porter

Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:05 GMT (UK)
Thereis a death in Jul/Aug/Sep 1861 of MArtha Bayram.
This is the same quarter as the birth is registered of Drewery Bayram (age 9 in 1871)
Looks like she dies in childbirth or soon after.

That does pose the question of the mother of all the children born afterMarta's death and before his marriage to MAtilda in 1870.
I think you are right, there was another marriage between the two
Jan /FEb/Mar 1863
Caistor 7a 788
John Bayram, but only one bride and two grooms are listed, so it may be to the one bride Mary Ann Vulture, or it may be to the missing bride!
Whoever she was she died approx 1866- 1870

There are deaths of :
Ann BAyram age 31 in 1870 and Elizabeth Bayram age 28 in 1867, so one of these might be the missing bride. You could get the marriage cert to confirm.


Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:13 GMT (UK)
1881
RG11 3275 10 34
Immingham
John 48 Farm bailiff bn Great Coates
Matilda 43 bn Goxhill
Annie E 10
matilda M 9
Harriett 7
Charles 5 all children bn Immingham
+ farm servants

and 1891, by now John has died and Matilda moved back to Goxhill
RG12 2630 114 7
Goxhill
Matilda 57 widow farmer bn Goxhill
Charles 15 son
Martha 18 dtr   both bn Immingham

Death
Jan/Feb/Mar 1884
Glanford Brigg
7a 439
John Bayram age 51
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:24 GMT (UK)
Moving back with jOHN

1851
HO107 2113 396 15
Irby

Large farm, 400 acres, headed by John Hewson and family, lots of farm servants including -

John Baram 18 farm servant bn Great Coates
George Baram 20 farm servant bn Great Coates

I think have seen George in later censuses too, I wonder if he is John's brother?
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:32 GMT (UK)
1841
Ho107 631 2
Great Coates
John 30 Ag lab N
Mary 30 Y
George 9 Y
John 8 Y
Charles 7 Y
Harriett 5 Y
William 3 Y
Jospeh 1 Y
Isaac 1mth Y

So, as you say, John was not bn Lincolnshire.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:37 GMT (UK)
Moving forward with this family , 1851 gives us a clue to John's birthplace

1851
HO107 2113 469 9
Great Coates
John 45 Ag lab bn Yorkshire Upton
Mary 46 bn Lincs Stallyborough
Harriett 15
Joseph 11
Isaac 9
Thomas 7
Margaret 5
Jane 3 all children bn Great Coates

1861 is consistant for his pob
RG9 2391 51 3
Great Coates
John 56 ag lab bn Upton Yorkshire
Mary 57 bn Stallingborough Lincs
Margaret 15 bn Great Coates
Jane 13 bn GC


Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 13:41 GMT (UK)
1871 he does say Pontefract (as you have, I am getting the feeling you have most of what Iam finding already!)

RG10 3416 92 7
Great C
John 65 ag lab bn Pontefract
Mary 66 bn Stallnigborough
Thomas 28 bn GC
Jane 23 bn GC

and 1881
RG11 3275 54 7
Now a widower, age 76 pob Pontefract

Death
Oct/NOv/Dec 1887
Caisotr
John Bayram age 81
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 14:02 GMT (UK)
Familysearch.org (which used to have the IGI on it, still does but has changed it s layout)
has a birth of  John Baram 28 Jan 1806 in Badsworth Yorkshire, son of John and Elizabeth nee Marshall who were married 8 Jan 1804 in Pontefract.
But I am yet to work out the source of this, as I havent found my way round thier new site yet!
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 15:16 GMT (UK)
Looking at google maps I see that Upton and Badsworth are very close, and the nearest big place id Pontefract, making in highly likely he would name Pontefract as pob when living further away.

I dont know where yoyu are, but I know if I were you I would be at the Local Record office as soon as I could arrange a trip, to look through Parish recors for Upton, Badsworth and other neighbouring parishess, to see what contenders there are for John's christening. This one looks hopeful, but it may of course be one of many possibles. Or it may be the one and only!
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Saturday 19 February 11 15:35 GMT (UK)
You have certainly been busy between you!!  I am exceedingly grateful for your endeavours which has given me much to go on.

Am currently living between Ipswich/Colchester.

It looks as though a trip "up North" is called for, pointers to location of necessary LRO's would be very handy as I expect it will involve more than one.

If anyone wants anything looked at in the Suffolk Records Office, please let me know.

Regards... Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: lizdb on Saturday 19 February 11 15:41 GMT (UK)
You have certainly been busy between you!! 

Between who?  ;D  ;D  ;D
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Saturday 19 February 11 15:45 GMT (UK)
Sorry, figure of speech (also getting very irate with keyboard, it stops working, damned wireless thing!!) humble apologies etc, etc...
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: CHRISD1988 on Monday 02 May 11 10:43 BST (UK)
 My g g g grandfather was John Bayram born 1805 in Pontefract.  He was married in 1830 to Mary Bell. Found details of 6 children, not sure  if thats all of them.  Some stayed in n lincs area and a couple moved to east yorkshire.  Confused regarding some of the children!  I have visited the archive at lincoln and not found details  of john having a son john as previous replies suggest.  Can anyone help?

fyi john is buried in great coates and his gravestone is still intact.

Any more info on bayrams would be great!
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Saturday 28 May 11 15:05 BST (UK)
CHRISD1988, it looks as though we share the same GGGFather.

I have them with 10 children (mostly with basic info only) but, no surname for his wife.

I also have his son John as being married 3 times (I descend from the first marriage, Martha Drewery, her surname entering as a christian name which has ended with my Father).

Regards... Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Friday 27 April 12 20:10 BST (UK)
CHRISD sorry for the delay in replying (I've been out of circulation etc) here is my list of the children of John & Mary in no particular order (and subject to confirmation of accuracy):-

Harriet 1836; John 1833 (m. 3 times); George 1831; Charles 1834 (m. Betsy Chesman); William 1838; Joseph 1839 (m. Hannah Carling); Thomas 1843 (m. Harriet ?); Margaret 1845; Jane 1847 (m. John Stephenson) and Isaac 1841 (m. Sarah Seargeant.

I have Isaac with 8 children and gaping holes elsewhere...

Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: repap on Monday 23 July 12 22:51 BST (UK)
there was a Bayram family farmers in Newbald 1940`s     then the same Bayrams went in to
transporting timber 1970`s  they are now in Hull. Hedon road oposite the docks.
maybe some connection
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: oswinh on Tuesday 02 April 13 08:14 BST (UK)
CHRISD1988 and a j bayram - Re: John Bayram born 1805 in Pontefract.
I have very similar info on my Family Tree for this John Bayram although I have him marrying Mary Cook in 1830 rather than Mary Bell, as you've mentioned before. I've not got a source for their Marriage so if you're able to supply me with something that would be greatly appreciated.
I've got the same ten children but with slightly different birth dates for some of them.

Also, have either of you got any info on John Bayram's (born 1805 in Pontefract) father. I have his father as being John Bayram born 14 Sep 1774 in Upton and marrying an Elizabeth Marshall 08 Jan 1804 in Pontefract. What I'm confused about is that John Bayram (born 1774) appears to have at least two other variations on his surname of John Byram and John Barum and possibly John Barham. Can either of you shine some light on what appears to be an anomaly with his surname?
Regards, Hayden Oswin
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Wednesday 03 April 13 20:23 BST (UK)
As yet, I cannot confirm or otherwise the true maiden name of Mary.  In 1851 Census they have 6 children.  Most trees I'm able to view have it as Cook though, I must be wrong.

I admit that the search for a Mary Bayram (found having moved to Liverpool) b. 1876 and her family has taken up much hair pulling of late.

As for the father of John, b. 1774ish, I have him married to Elizabeth Marshall and that's all at present.

I shall have to delve deeper and post as necessary.

Sorry I can't be of much help at present, Andrew.
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: mandy_bayram on Wednesday 17 June 15 05:26 BST (UK)
Hi there, I am a Bayram by marriage and my husbands family is from Yorkshire. If you need any info, please let me know and I will see what I can find out for you  :)
Title: Re: BAYRAM.
Post by: a j bayram on Wednesday 17 June 15 20:12 BST (UK)
Hi there, I am a Bayram by marriage and my husbands family is from Yorkshire. If you need any info, please let me know and I will see what I can find out for you  :)

I have sent a PM, let me know if it doesn't arrive/you're unable to reply.

Regards, Andrew.