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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Berkshire => England => Berkshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Canadiangal on Thursday 10 February 11 21:59 GMT (UK)
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This may seem a very bizarre request! I am Canadian and my great-grandfather Thomas Carter is quite probably the son of John Carter (apparently a notorious murderer from Watchfield, Bershire, England). I came across an article online which indicated that the Bershire Records Office (BRO) houses a collection of records from the Reading Prison including four photograph albums of prisoner "mug shots" for the period 1883-1915 as well as other Reading Gaol records / nominal registers.
John Carter was found guilty of murdering his third wife Rhoda (Titcombe) Carter in Watchfield, Berkshire in 1893 and was hanged for the crime Dec 5th, 1893. I'm looking for the photograph if it exists and information regarding the trial (supposedly the nominal registers would include the prisoner's name, time and place of the hearings of their case, their offence, sentence, personal information etc.) If a record of him is found I would love the information/ a copy.
An unusual look-up I know!!
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Hi
No info on Reading Gaol I am afraid but found these which may give you more info:
http://www.truecrimelibrary.com/crime_series_show.php?id=493&series_number=3
and this:
http://www.whereitis.co.uk/watchfield.chronicle/page25.html
The second link gives quite a lot of info.
Hope this helps
CCRAIL
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Thank You so much. I did find these sites but wanted to dig further. I've contacted the author of the Watchfield Chronicles website to see if during his research he may have collected copies or transcribed more of the mentioned newspaper reports or any other information.
I also found the existence of an article "The Watchfield Horrors" by David Disbury in "The Bershire Family Historian" journal (Jun 1998). Someone at the Bershire Research Centre is going to look it up for me next week and hopfully scan or send a copy.
What I'm really after is first hand/ primary sources of information i.e. the newspaper articles detailing the case and trial (I've read that from July to December 1893 the local Swindon Advertiser reported the events in detail) and I discovered that the Berkshire Records Office supposedly hold Reading Gaol records and prisoner photos covering that period from the following Berkshire Family Historian article:
http://www.berksfhs.org.uk/journal/Dec1999/dec1999ReadingGaolPhotographs.htm
I thought that might be a good lead.
My problem really lies in the fact that I am in Canada and the records are in England and not at present digitalized and accessible online. The idea that this man is very likely my great-great grandfather is obviously a bit unsettling and perhaps a mugshot would be a bit morbid but it may also indicate some family resemblance to my great-grandfather. What I am really hoping to seek out when all is said and done is what happenned to my great-grandfather Thomas Carter after the trial and his younger siblings. I am of the opinion that he ended up in Canada after being in some kind of foundling home.
As you can imagine I want to gain as much information as possible to determine what transpired considering it was such a troubling event!!
Thanks again.
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Would it perhaps be best to contact Berkshire Records Office directly and have staff look it up? Is it quite expensive?
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Hi again, I can understand why you want the info but I personally have no experience of the Berkshire Records Office, Others may well be able to help you. I have found a link that explains what they can do and how much it costs:
http://www.berkshirerecordoffice.org.uk/services/record.htm
Some people on here may also be visiting the office and may be able to do a lookup for you. It is worth a try.
Regards
CCRAIL
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Berkshire Record Office charge £20.00 per hour
Sounds a lot but it depends where you live and how much it would cost to get there !!
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I forgot to say that you can e-mail them and explain what you want and they will give a quote
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Thanks Kimbrey.
I may just do that! I live in Canada so the cost is definitely less than it would be to travel to England ;) Admittedly I'd rather just find soeone already heading there who has time to take a peek for me and maybe just charge for copies and postage but I may just have to bite the bullet and pay a little more. At least I could get a quote and see (might not be so bad).
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John Carter was found guilty of murdering his third wife Rhoda (Titcombe) Carter in Watchfield, Berkshire in 1893 and was hanged for the crime Dec 5th, 1893. I'm looking for the photograph if it exists and information regarding the trial (supposedly the nominal registers would include the prisoner's name, time and place of the hearings of their case, their offence, sentence, personal information etc.) If a record of him is found I would love the information/ a copy.
Most papers of the time covered the case - C19th Newspapers (online via Gale) have lots on the case.
The inquest coverage gives the most detail - reports late Jul early Aug, the trial rarely merits more than a paragraph (mid to late Nov) and the execution barely gets a mention (early Dec).
In mid Aug there is a report that the police were digging for the body of a previous wife - and found some unidentified bones. No mention of a second murder at the trial so I guess the bones turned out to be pig or somesuch.
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No. What happenned was he confessed to killing the second wife just before he was executed (so it was not part of the trial/inquest). According to the Swindon Advertiser (quoted on Watchfield chronicle website) they recovered her skeleton. His first wife (whom I believe is my great-great grandmother) had died of a fall down some stairs which after an inquest was ruled accidental -- makes you wonder however!
Thanks for the information about the c19th Newspapers site. I'll be perusing it tonight.
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No but yes.
The bones reported in August turned out to be animal bones (reported in a follow up story).
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That's strange because I found last night the coroner's inquest into the body of the second wife (it stated that the skeleton still had stockings on the legs and they had recovered the entire skeleton including the skull and complete jaw bone). The coroner actually interviewed the daughter Annie as well as a long time neighbour. I downloaded the article but I see the downloads don't include the date and paper name so I will double check that (I'll post it when I find it--for curiosity sake).
Thanks so mjuch for the reference to C19 Newspapers!! I was on it for hours last night (bought a 7 day/200 article membership) and it was amazing! They even had illustrated articles on the story. I would still like to look into the actual jail records at BRO but wow. Unfortunately it didn't lead me any closer to determining where Thomas went afterward and if he did come to Canada (ergo be my great-grandfather). I have a definite feeling about it. Very awful though to think this might have happenned in the family.
Angela
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Found the information regarding the coroner's inquest:
THE BERKSHIRE DEEMING CONFESSES Lloyd's Weekly Newspaper (London, England), Sunday, December 10, 1893; Issue 2664. (2529 words)
I found it in a search of "John Carter" on C19th Newspapers.
Thanks again for the website info!
Still looking for anyone who can look up John Carter's information in the Reading Gaol records and Prisoner photo albums housed at Berkshire Records Office....if anyone's heading that way :)
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I am so excited!! I contacted a genealogy librarian about a copy of an article regarding the watchfield murder case that had been published in the "Berkshire family Historian" and she sent me a digital copy. when I thanked her and provided ore information about why I had requested the article she wrote back offering to look for further information and mentioned the reading Gaol records and the Berkshire Assize records held at the BRO and offered to check for the information for me when she's in Reading on Friday!!
I am thrilled!! So funny I've been trying to find someone to look this information up for me (especially now that I know definitely that this is my family) and out of the blue, without my even asking someone offers :)
Thanks to everyone here who provided me with information and I will be sure to keep you posted on what is discovered!
Angela
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Hi
My Cousin 3 times removed was Rhoda Titcombe ie. Rhoda Carter .I found the court transcipts of the trial with wittness statements and a copy of the newspaper clips at the The National achives in Kew.The number of the Home Office file which they keep is HO144/256/A55399.If you contact them they are able to photophraph the pages and email them to you. Hope this helps.
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Hi Southerngal,
Rhoda Titcombe was my cousin 4 times removed! Are you on genersreunited?
Canadiangal, I'm still looking for the Didsbury book. I had it but can't find it at the moment.
Regards,
Martin
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Oh my! We need to talk!! I'm not on genersreunited but I am on ancestry (are you at ancestry at all?) I do not have the actual Disbury booklet but I do have a scanned copy if that helps. Please email me at (*)
I am the great-granddaughter of Thomas Carter, the infamous John Carter's son! I almost feel I need to apologize to you for my great-great grandfather's crimes!!
Please email so we can share information!!
Sincerely,
Angela Money
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Hi,
Rhoda TITCOMB was my 3 x great aunt.
I'd love to share information with other TITCOMB and CARTER researchers.
I can be contacted on darren at tenjin.co.uk
Look forward to hearing from you.
Regards
Darren.
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I have a scan of the Watchfield Horror article from BFHS if anyone would like a copy.
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Okay, Southerngal, Widds1965, and tenjin, we all need to connect!! I have copies of several of the newspaper articles regarding the trial and execution of my great-great grandfather, I do have a scanned copy as well of the Disbury article in which it actual mentions my great grandfather and his brother and their emmigration to Canada. I have been researching this intensively and know that they spent some time in the Farringdon Workhouse before their sister brought them to the Fegan Home to be sent to Canada.
Never mind, I can talk more indepth with you about it all in a more private way! I will definitely be emailing you tenjin!! You have no idea how much the discovery of all this has shocked and amazed my family! My great-grandfather, Thomas Carter, was a very gentle and quiet man, obviously not at all like his father!!
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http://murderousmonday.blogspot.co.uk/2014/06/murderous-monday-men-who-kill-john_23.html
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Also, it seems he may be buried in our churchyard in Lambourn, Berkshire?