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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Mima on Tuesday 08 February 11 08:20 GMT (UK)

Title: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Tuesday 08 February 11 08:20 GMT (UK)
I  have  been  looking  for  Bridget  McGRATH  born  Ireland  about  1840,arrived  in  Sydney  20-9-1859  on  Abyssinian.she  arrived  with  sisters,I followed  sister  Ellen.  can  find  nothing  on    BRIDGET.  thought  I  had it,  sister,  witness  at  marriage,  Bridget  Chambers,  but  can  find  nothing  to  prove  it,hope  someone,  some where  can  help.  thank  you  mima
Title: Re: McGRATH [STILL]
Post by: aghadowey on Tuesday 08 February 11 08:52 GMT (UK)
Previous threads:
McGRATH,s in Australia (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,474215.msg3337367.html) (Ireland-General)
McGRATH Family (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,439909.msg3438358.html) (Australia)
Look up Parish Register - Thurles - McGrath/Costray (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,361300.msg2378103.html) (Tipperary)
Death of Edward McGRATH ? THURLES (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,363185.msg2393602.html) (Tipperary)
ELLEN mCgrath (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,372345.msg2464460.html) (Ireland-General)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 09 February 11 01:17 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

At the following link you can see images of the passenger list for that voyage of the Abyssinian. 

http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/guides-and-finding-aids/nrs-lists/nrs-5316#the-list-of-ships 

How certain are you that those McGrath girls and boys (separately listed as single females and single males) were in fact siblings?   Have you considered that some of them may simply have the same surname as the others ... were they all shown as born in the same district?

Have you looked for Bridget under Brigid and other alternative spellings?

From a commercial site, I see the passenger list and note that Bridget McGrath was aged 15, daughter of Patrick and Ellen of New Market, (presume they were still alive as they are not noted as deceased), Bridget could Read (but not write), her religion was Roman Catholic, she was from New Market, Co Clare, and she had an aunt in NSW ...  Mary (hard to read Mary's surname, but it could be Lemon) of 103 York St (this would be York Street, Sydney Town) ...

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 09 February 11 01:38 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

At the NSW Resources section of Rootschat there's lots of links to various online resources.   
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,369703.0.html
One in particular is the City of Sydney's Assessment books .... 

From those Assessment books I can see that in 1858, Moses LEMON was the occupier of 103 York St (in the Brisbane Ward) and that it was both a shop and a dwelling.  It was of two storeys, the walls were of brick and the roof was slated/shingled.  There were 6 rooms in total.    Moses LEMON was still the occupier in 1861, but by 1863 it was a Daniel Killpatrick who was the occupier. 

I note that a Moses Lemon married in NSW in 1852 to a Mary FAHEY ... Please check your tree and let us know how Mrs Mary LEMON (I presume she was the wife of Moses Lemon) is connected to your Ellen .... this would then help you sort out if Bridget is Ellen's sister ....

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 09 February 11 02:49 GMT (UK)
Hi JM,

I think you are looking at a different Bridget McGRATH - I believe the girl that Mima is interested in is listed together with Mary and Ellen, parents Edward and Mary of Tipperary. 

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 09 February 11 02:59 GMT (UK)
I also see that there are a lot of gaps in the family details for these passengers and the parental details are actually only written beside Mary's name.

Looking at a different image on the NSW archives site, it looks like Bridget was not a sister and she is the one that you have given details for  http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bqx/

I see Jenn already found these details last year http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bqy/

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 09 February 11 03:34 GMT (UK)
Hi Debra,

I have gone through all the links that Aghadowey has linked.  I am not convinced that Bridget McGrath on the Abyssinia into Sydney Sept 1859 is a sister to Ellen McGrath on that same voyage, so that's why I have posted the info about 103 York St, Sydney....  ;)

I know that the passenger lists for many voyages of emigrants in the 1850's and 1860's seem to be compiled more to assist in the collection of the fares (in Bridget's case, £4) than in any foreward planning for 21st century family history searchings!  It seems to me that passenger lists into NSW were written up in several categories

FAMILIES
SINGLE MALES
SINGLE FEMALES
and then within each of those categories, strict alphabetical by surname and then first name etc ....  so that within single females for example, McGrath Bridget would be written ahead of McGrath Ellen .... but that listing does NOT then mean that all the girls surnamed MCGRATH on that voyage were related as sisters, or even related (cousins) to each other...

I hope Mima will be back at RChat shortly to let us know what exactly she does want to know about Bridget....  I think she's got just about everything available on Ellen ....

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 09 February 11 03:43 GMT (UK)
Continuing to look through the various lists for that voyage, it seems that none of them were sisters.  Ellen's parents were Rory and Winifred McGRATH, both dead.  She was from Makaskey, Tipperary, had a sister Winifred onboard with her, and a brother Thomas in Surrey Hills.

Mima it looks like you have the wrong immigration record, and if you want to post details for your Ellen from her marriage certificate we will see if we can find her.

Debra  :)

Edit to add  Sorry, I see you have posted marriage details on other threads
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 09 February 11 04:09 GMT (UK)
Hi Mima,

Perhaps the following would be your ELLEN and some of her family  ;D

1903 NSW Electoral Roll, Newcastle (Wallsend Polling Place)  (first time females entitled to be enrolled, but it was not yet compulsory)

SMITH, Annie, (living at) Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Ellen, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Joseph, Pittown, coal-miner
SMITH, Mary Ann, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Mary Jane, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Streaker, Pittown, coal-miner
SMITH, William Edward, Pittown, miner

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 09 February 11 04:14 GMT (UK)
Back,

Re Pittown  (ie Pit Town, and NOT to be confused with Pitt Town)

http://www1.newcastle.nsw.gov.au/library/placea.cfm?FIRST=p

Pit Town (Wallsend) Originated when the Newcastle Wallsend Coal Company established two rows of houses near its mine 12 kilometres west of Newcastle, and rented them to its employees and their families on a weekly basis.

Also, do not confuse Wallsend with West Wallsend .... both are in the Greater Newcastle district, and are two separate suburbs ....

Cheers,  JM

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: XXXX on Wednesday 09 February 11 10:36 GMT (UK)
Hi Mima,

Some information for you to consider.

It appears from the Pioneer and Federation Index (Victoria) that the Bridget Chambers that may have been a witness to Ellen’s wedding was possibly a Bridget Chambers (nee Anthony) wife of George Chambers.

George Chambers married Bridget Anthony in the District of Albury, New South Wales in 1868, Reg#1464.  George and Bridget had 10 children in the Barnawartha, Indigo Creek area of Victoria.

Bridget Agnes Chambers died in 1901, at Barnawartha, Victoria, age 53.  Reg#12441.
Bridget’s parents were Michael Anthony and Mary McGrath.

Cheers,

Janet.
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 09 February 11 14:38 GMT (UK)
Following on from Janet's post:

Death
Victoria
1863
Mary ANTHONY
aged 44
Father: Edmund McGRATH
Mother: Ellen
#1483

Their arrival in Australia:

Africa
Arr. Melbourne 14 Aug 1858

Michael ANTHONY, labourer, 42
Mary, 38
Bridget, 11
Margaret, 9
John, 8
Alice, 2
Anne, infant

All of Tipperary, Ireland

The youngest daughter Anne died in 1858 aged 1.

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: XXXX on Friday 11 February 11 06:39 GMT (UK)
Further to Debra’s post:

Ann Anthony (born Tipperary), died 1858, age 1, Reg#5849.

John Anthony died 1913, at Chiltern, age 60, Reg#8799.

Margaret Anthony (born Tipperary), married in 1889, Reg#7571 - Robert Snart (born England).
Margaret Snart died 1943, at Rutherglen, age 93, Reg#22639.
Margaret’s parents were listed as John Anthony and Margaret McGrath.

Please note that there were a couple of other Anthony families in the Barnawartha area.

Cheers,

Janet.
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Wednesday 02 March 11 08:21 GMT (UK)
thanks  all,  i,ve not  been  on  it  lately.  disappointed  when  found  That  Bridget  was a  Anthony,not  mine,  they  all  came  out  to  a  Margaret  Fitsgerald, from  Irrawarra, nsw  got that from  shipping,a friend  did it.  there  father  was  Edward  and  Mother  was  Mary  Costray,can not find that name anywhere.parents  died  with famine,before  they  left  Ireland  I  knew  my  Ellen  was  in  Victoria. then came to  Wallsend   i  will  keep  trying,  but age may beat me.80y next week  thanks  mima
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Wednesday 02 March 11 09:25 GMT (UK)
Hi mima,

Happy 80th (for next week) ....

Where would you like us to look for your Bridget NEXT  ;D  ;D  ;D

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Sunday 06 March 11 04:04 GMT (UK)
i have a copy of  names on ship. from the archives.my  three  girls  came. also  a  brother, in  with the men.  home servants,  Thurles  Tipperary. Edward  &  Mary  dec.  read.  Jack & Margaret   Fitsgerald    Illawarra.  that's what i  make out to be.Ellen   Marrage  Cert.   has  Edward   McGRATH   &  Mary  Costray   Ellen  had  two  children, in  Indigo  creek, Mary  died  at  10 months, son   Andrew,they later lived  at Elderado.  I  might  try  the  assessment  books  next,  see if  i  can  find Jack  and  Margaret     thank you all    mima
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Sunday 06 March 11 05:38 GMT (UK)
Hi Mima,

Just to clarify and hopefully save you from chasing shadows, these are the details for the Abyssinian which arrived in 1859.  They are from the list of immigrants as inspected by the immigration department.

Mary McGRATH, aged 20, general house servant, born Thurles, Co. Tipperary, parents Edward and Mary (dead), Aunt Margaret FITZGERALD, at Illawarra

Bridget McGRATH, aged 15, farm servant, born Newmarket, Co. Clare, parents Patrick and Ellen at Newmarket, Aunt Mary LEMON at 103 York Street

Ellen MAGRATH, aged 27, housemaid, born Makaskey, Co. Tipperary, parents Rory and Winifred (both dead), sister Winifred onboard and brother Thomas at Surrey Hills

James McGRATH, aged 22, labourer, born Thurles, Co. Tipperary, parents Edward and Mary (dead), Aunt Margaret McGRATH, address not known

These three girls were not sisters
.

There were several different lists for this voyage and I think the copy of the list you would have is the alphabetical passenger manifest which is incomplete and only has Mary's family details listed.  Bridget and Ellen's entries, as well as several others on the page, have been left blank. 

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Saturday 19 March 11 08:25 GMT (UK)
I  thank you.  i  have a copy of  passengers,  the way its written i,d say they are sisters.  Ellen ,s  marriage  sayes  her father is Edward, MOTHER IS  MARY  COSTRAY,  ELLEN  WAS BORN  AT  Ardlemon,  or  something  like that,  yes  that  is  my  Ellen  and  Joesph  at  Pittown  Wallsend.  Ellen  died  in  1919,  Joesph  in  1914.their  son  Andrew  died  1919  also,  Thank  you  all  for  your interest  and  help,  i,ll  keep  trying  mima
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Saturday 19 March 11 08:42 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

Re the Abyssinian - Arrived 20 Sep 1859 and Bridget McGrath. 

Debra has given the full details for Bridget and for the others with the same surname.  They have different parents, and come from different counties to Bridget, so I don't think they are sisters.... 

Mary McGRATH, aged 20, general house servant, born Thurles, Co. Tipperary, parents Edward and Mary (dead), Aunt Margaret FITZGERALD, at Illawarra

Bridget McGRATH, aged 15, farm servant, born Newmarket, Co. Clare, parents Patrick and Ellen at Newmarket, Aunt Mary LEMON at 103 York Street

Ellen MAGRATH, aged 27, housemaid, born Makaskey, Co. Tipperary, parents Rory and Winifred (both dead), sister Winifred onboard and brother Thomas at Surrey Hills


I have already given you info about Bridget's aunt (Mary LEMON) and Mary's husband Moses Lemon, and that Mary FAHEY married Moses Lemon in NSW in 1852.

Please let me know how else I can help you to establish how Bridget McGrath connects with Mary Lemon,  or anything else re Bridget. 




Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Saturday 19 March 11 08:55 GMT (UK)
Hi Mima,

Do you think that Mrs Mary LEMON nee Fahey could be sister to Bridget's mum who was Mrs Ellen McGrath (perhaps nee FAHEY).

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Tuesday 22 March 11 08:14 GMT (UK)
hello.   Ellen,s  parents  were  Edward McGRATH. & Mary Costray  the  Marriage   cert. tell,s  me  that,  i  thought  Margaret  Fitzgerald,  may  have  been  a  sister  to  Edward.  brother  James  had  same  parents,   I,ll  chase  Fitzgerald,s  up  and  see  what  happens,  It,s  so  good  of  you  helping  me  thank  you   mima :D
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Tuesday 22 March 11 08:29 GMT (UK)
Hi Mima,

So the Bridget McGrath on the Abyssian in 1859, whose parents were Parick and Ellen and the Ellen McGrath on that same voyage of the Abyssian, and whose parents were Rory and Winifred are not shown to be connected to your Ellen McGrath whose parents were Edward and Mary (nee Costray). 

So are you looking for more information about the Bridget McGrath on the Abyssian in 1859 or are you looking for the Bridget Chambers who witnessed your Ellen's marriage?

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 23 March 11 12:58 GMT (UK)
In relation to Bridget CHAMBERS who may have been the daughter of Michael ANTHONY and Mary McGRATH - there is a Michael ANTHONY shown as a landholder on the Griffiths Valuation of 1851, at Ardloman, in the parish of Clonpet.  This was also Ellen McGRATH's native place.

I have had a look throught the parish register lists held by the National Library of Ireland, and it appears that there are no surviving Roman Catholic parish registers for Clonpet.

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: Mima on Friday 01 April 11 09:53 BST (UK)
hello all,  you have all  been  busy.it looks  like  Bridget  is  not a sister.there  was no  information.  left  behind  Ellen.her son,s wife died  after second  child.Ellen and other granny  took  ,a child each  and reared  them.but  Mary  and James has same  parents.  also  just got  Margaret  Fitzgerald  died  in  1895  Sydney,  parents  Edward  and  Mary,  so  is  she  a  sister  too ?    with  it  being  early  1800.  theres,  not  many  records,  I  thank  you  all .was  Mary  and James  born  Thurles?  so  there  should  be  school  or  church records  ?    mima
Title: Re: Bridget McGRATH [Still]
Post by: majm on Friday 01 April 11 11:51 BST (UK)
Hi Mima,

I'm not much help I am afraid....  BUT ....

1901 NSW Householders Census has this, could be yours

County of Northumberland, in Municipal Council area of Wickham and the Ward of Islington
and the sub-district of Islington and Tighes Hill...

Joseph H SMITH  (noting middle intital)
at Fleming St ... (no street number, no house name)
4 males, 6 females.   (ONLY the head of the household named)

Remembering the 1903 Electoral Roll had SEVEN enrolled, and the 1901 record shows TEN, so perhaps some of the ten were not yet 21 in 1903.
Perhaps the following would be your ELLEN and some of her family ;D
1903 NSW Electoral Roll, Newcastle (Wallsend Polling Place) (first time females entitled to be enrolled, but it was not yet compulsory)

SMITH, Annie, (living at) Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Ellen, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Joseph, Pittown, coal-miner
SMITH, Mary Ann, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Mary Jane, Pittown, domestic duties
SMITH, Streaker, Pittown, coal-miner
SMITH, William Edward, Pittown, miner

Cheers,  JM