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Research in Other Countries => United States of America => US Lookup Requests => Topic started by: bagpuss on Thursday 20 January 11 21:50 GMT (UK)
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Hello there,
I wonder if anyone might be able to help, I'm at a bit of a loss as to how to go about it!
I have Edith Clara Wilson in my tree who married William Huntington Wells in 1908 in Islington, London. According to the 1911 census his place of birth was US America (1867), she was born in Hanley, Staffs (1877).
As I can find no record after 1911 and no death record for either, I am working on the idea that they went back to his home, America. I don't know how to go about proving this, help would be immensley appreciated.
All the best,
Sue
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Hello Sue,
There is a passport application 4th Feb 1919 for William Huntington Wells born 28 March 1868 Winthrop, Maine. Father Charles K Wells (deceased) Resided in London 1902 - 1919. Followed the Occupation of Branch Manager. Requires the Passport for Commercial Business in London and Managae the London Office. Intends leaving New York Feb 10th 1919. Works as treasurer for Hendee Corporation. Springfield. Massachusetts (motor vehicles, principally motor cycles) Photograph attached - albeit not very good quality
Regards
Sandra
Another 23 rd 1920 application - slightly better photograph
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William Huntington Wells born 28 Mar 1868 in Winthrop, Kennebec Co., Maine son of Charles Kittredge Wells Born 18 Aug 1833 in Windsor, Berkshire Co., Massachusetts Died bef 1880 in Winthrop, Kennebec Co., Maine. Married 6 th June 1860 to Anna H Sturtevant Born 17 Aug 1841 in Winthrop, Kennebec Co., Maine.
Massachusetts Town Birth Record shows:- Charles Kittridge Wells - Birth Date: 18 Aug 1833 - Windsor
Father's First Name: H. M. Mother's First Name: Judith
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Hi Sandra,
Ooh this is all good stuff - Well done!
So he would have travelled back and forth from the US to England?
Sue
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New York Passenger List shows Wm Huntington Wells. Born about 1868 Winthrop. Maine aged 46 years and 10 months. Travelling on New York Passenger List 25th Sept 1914 Liverpool to New York on SS Mauretania. C/O Hendee Corp. Massachusetts.
Here is an earlier New York Passenger List - William Huntington Wells. Born about 1868 aged 44 years. Travelling Liverpool to New York - Arrival Date: 13 July 1912 on SS Luistania. Manager Motor Business.
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New York Passenger List William H Wells. Born about 1869 Winthrop. Maine. Aged 53 years 7 months
Travcelling Southampton to New York - Arrival Date: 9 Dec 1921 - SS Auitania
C/O Hendee Mfg Co. Springfield. Massachusetts.
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That'll be a yes then - Any sight of his wife?
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There is a family tree which says he was married to Louise P born 1870 New York. A 1900 Census is attached showing William with a wife and daughter Margaret in Brooklyn Ward 29, Kings, New York. ???
William H Wells 32 Born March 1868 Maine Kentucky. Machinist. General. Married for 4 years
Louise P Wells 30 Born New York. Had 1 child and 1 survives. Married for 4 years.
Marguerite Wells 2 Born New York July 1897
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Hello Sue,
So far - travelling alone and no mention of his UK wife just Hendee. Massachusetts ???
Regards
Sandra
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Hello Sue,
If you would like to send me a personal message with your e-mail address I can forward some of these for you to go through yourself, if that would help you.
Regards
Sandra
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Found this UK Incoming with a London address given - Wm H Wells. Born about 1868 aged 54 years
Port of Departure: New York, to Liverpool - Arrival Date: 4 Feb 1922 on SS Scythia.
Going to 46 Portland Gardens. London. Occupation:- Manager.
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Oh cripes ???
I'm completely confused now, I've been sifting through my notes to see if I've gone wrong somewhere.
At least you've proved there really was a person of that name.
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Phew - I wasn't barking up the wrong tree
1911 Census
WELLS, WILLIAM HEAD MARRIED M 43 MANAGER MOTOR BUSINESS U S AMERICA RESIDENT
WELLS, CLARA WIFE MARRIED 2 F 33 HANLEY STAFFS
WILSON, HANNAH MOTHER IN LAW WIDOW F 63 PRIVATE MEANS MADELEY SALOP
Address: 12 FIELDSWAY HOUSE FIELDSWAY CRESENT, ISLINGTON
and
Marriages Dec 1908
Wells William Huntington Islington 1b 623
Wilson Edith Clara
So what's going on with the US wife? Could she have died?
Sue :-[
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Hi Sandra,
I've sent you a PM, I'd love to see what you've uncovered, I wouldn't have had a clue where to look. It all sounds very interesting - and thanks a million for all your hard work.
Many Thanks,
Sue
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Hello Sue,
Lots for you to wade through. Have you got the marriage certificate ? What does it say his marital status was - divorced/widowed/single ? Or parents ?
Some Census and other records are available on the link below
https://www.familysearch.org/
Regards
Sandra
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Hiya,
Just wondering, are their later NY censuses available? If so any sign of Louise P Wells or Marguerite Wells?
Any advice on marriage/death records or where I might go from here?
Sue :-\
(PS - Yes, I think William and Edith's marriage certificate may have to be purchased to reveal his status)
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Hello Sue,
Sorry, have'nt deserted you - just not made any progress on later Census for what could be the first wife of William. Re:- the photograph - will send later. The 1908 marriage certificate could hold some vital information as regards William - although there is a family tree entry showing a wife - it is not sourced and so could be leading us up the garden path !!
Some Census and other records are available here
https://www.familysearch.org/
Some New York City Records are available on the link below.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0ae8/
Regards
Sandra
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Trying to trace William Huntinton Wells back -
This looks as if it is possibly him in 1880 Brooklyn, Kings, New York but I have no idea at the moment which one he could be related to - could be Glen or Anna ???
Glen Cyler 52 Born New York. Fire Ins. Agt
Anna Cyler 49 Born New York
Juliah Cyler 20 Born Wisconsin
William Wells 12 Born Maine. Nephew.
Sarah Scramson 22 Servant
In 1880 his father Charles had died and his Mother Anna - is living Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts with a son, brother of William called Harry M Wells. Sturtevant was the Mothers maiden name - so Newell is her brother.
Newell Sturtevant 37 Head (1844 - 1891)
Ellen Sturtevant 32 Wife
Julia Rogers 25 Servant
Winfield L. Lloyd 19 Boarder
Anna S. Wells 38 Boarder. Widowed. Born 17 August 1841 Winthrop. Kennebec. Maine
Harrie Wells 17 Boarder
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In 1870 the brother Harry M Wells born 7 Apr 1863 in Winthrop, Kennebec Co., Maine is in
Winthrop, Kennebec, Maine with grandparents (Ann Sturtevant parents) No sign of Charles, Anna and William ???
Albert Sturtevant 64 Farmer. Value of real estate $11,000 Value of personal estate $2,000
Eunice H Sturtevant 59
Mary Pulsiver 23 Servant
Harry M Wells 7 Born Maine.
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This is Anna Sturtevant with her parents in 1860 before the 6th June 1860 marriage. There is a Kittridge in the household which is the middle name of Anna's husband Charles (spelling variation Kittredge) ??? The date of the 1860 US Census was 1 st June 1860.
Albert Sturtevant 53 Agricultural Labourer at Marble Works
Eunice H Sturtevant 49
Anna H Sturtevant 18
Newell Sturtevant 16 Student
Henry Woodcock 17 Farm Labourer
Nancy Young 17
Charlotte P Kittridge 19 Born Vermont.
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This is the birth record of Charles Kittridge Wells - 18 th August 1833 Windsor. Berkshire. Massachusetts. Parents H M Wells and Judith.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bfu/
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A Marriage Judeth S Kitteredge (as it is spelt) to Hezekiah M. Wells 16 th May 1828 Windsor,Berkshire,Massachusetts.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bfv/
A birth of Judith S Kittridge 3 rd March 1805 Hinsdale ,Berkshire. Massachusetts. Parents Abel Kittridge and Eunice.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bfw/
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Well done Sandra,
You've worked really hard, all this back information is really great, I'll note it all down and add it to my tree.
I'll take a look through th NY records and see if it turns anything up.
Many thanks,
Sue
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Your most welcome.
The brother Harry M Wells appears on New York Passenger List.
Harry M Wells. Born about 1863. Aged 33 years American. Occupation Engineer. Travveling as Cabin Passenger.
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England to New York on SS Germanic 17 August 1896
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Harry M Wells (occupation Book-Keeper) married Lillie F Leslie 24 Nov 1886 Chelsea. Suffolk Massachusetts. Parents listed as Charles and Annie. ???
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bfy/
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Harry's wife Lillie died 15 April 1908 Chelsea. Suffolk County. Massachusetts.
They had 2 daughters - interestingly using the maiden name of Anna as a middle name.
Katherine Sturtevant Wells Born 19 Apr 1888 in Boston, Suffolk Co., Massachusetts.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bfz/
and Anna Leslie (Lillie's Maiden Maiden) Wells 4 th Jul 1890 in Boston, Suffolk Co., Massachusetts.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bg1/
1900 Census with image (Anna - Mother is with them)
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bg0/
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1910 - the 2 girls are with Uncle (brother of Lillie Leslie) after death of Mother, living in Chelsea Ward 5, Suffolk, Massachusetts.
Alexander Leslie 52
James W Leslie 48
Nellie B Leslie 48 Sister In Law
Katherine S Wells 21 Niece
Anna L Wells 19 Niece
Julia A Bagg 20 Servant.
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Harry remarried to Hildred - 1920 shows him with wife and Mother Anna who does not appear to have married again. Living in Brooklyn Assembly District 7, Kings, New York
Harry M Wells 54 Born Maine. Father Massachusetts. Mother Maine. Salesman. Auto
Hildred Wells 33 Born Massachusetts
Annie Wells 75 Born Maine
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1930 have found the second wife who is now widowed - presumably Harry has died between the Census years.
1930 Brooklyn, Kings, New York
Laura Zeller 67 Head. Born New York. Married at 27 years
Edna Zeller 32 Daughter Born New York. Single
Hildred Wells 43 Niece. Married at 26 years.
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1910 - Harry and Mother Anna together. Passaic Ward 4, Passaic, New Jersey.
Annie S Wells 68 Born Maine. Widowed.
Harry M Wells 45 Single. Agent. Auto Co
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Both Harry and William mentioned on the links below.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bg2/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bg3/
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Great work once again.
I wonder if Harry worked for the same company as his brother William, looks entirely possible.
Sue :)
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Found this on one of the NY sites you recommended
Surname Given Name Age Month Day Year Certificate
Number County Soundex
Wells Harry M 62 y Feb 25 1926 4545 Kings W420
also this -
Surname Given Name Monthof Marriage Day Year County Certificate
Number Soundex
Durham Hildred D B Apr 11 1914 Manhattan 9956 D650
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Well done Sue,
Could be a possible for Anna Wells in the deaths, the year fits but the middlie initial was "H" ???
Yes, certainly a man of mystery William - did you wade through the passport and passenger list entries. 1922 passport said he had a Mother and brother in the USA. Gave an address of 366 Euston Road N W 1. Did that mean anything ? Or was it the business address ? Also said he had last lived in the USA in 1900 on that entry.
Regards
Sandra
Added the same address 366-368 Euston Road. London NW 1 is on a UK Incoming Passenger list 27 Oct 1914 (this must be the return from the 25 Sept 1914 New York - Out -bound.
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Yes I agree with the Anna entry.
The Euston Rd, address doesn't mean anything to me, I also think it could be a business address.
I am also beginning to think that the New York marriage may be a red herring as neither of us can find any documentary evidence! I'm a little puzzled by all those temporary passport applications - if he had married a British citizen in 1908 would he not have automatically gained British citizenship? She never seems to accompany him on any of the trips either!
What a puzzle!
Sue :)
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He would still have needed a passport though - I've never seen as many entries for one person before. The last one issued 14 April 1924 - refers to London as a temporary residence. Fornerly a Manager of the London Branch of the Hendee Manufacturing Company of Springfield. Massachusetts. Now retired. I have many relatives in the United States and I file my tax returns in Baltimore. Maryland. I intend to return to the United States permanently to reside within indefinite years.
Most peculiar he never mentions a wife or family but the trips stop when he is retired.
Have you found a death record in the UK ?
Sandra ;)
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How about the 46 Portland Gardens address - 4 th Feb1922 (in reply 10) ??? Does that mean anything ?
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Unfortunately the USA does not have a BMD index - what is available varies State to State and County to County. The only thing I could suggest was that you contacted the tree owner to see if they can throw further light. If you have'nt got access to the subscription site then I would be willingly to make contact if you wish - entirely up to you.
Regards
Sandra
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OK so I found a record of the 1900 census so there is documentary evidence, I just don't know if it's the same William H Wells.
The Portland Gardens address hasn't come up anywhere before - but they're all in the same(ish) vicinity. Re: death registers there are a couple of possibilities so I'll chase them up.
Is the tree you found with the NY marriage on ancestry, because I've just left a message on there, as yet no reply.
Thanks again for your continued help.
Sue :)
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Yes Sue, that would be the one. Good luck, hope you receive a reply.
Regards
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Just an update to let you know that I received the marriage certificate of William Huntington Wells and Edith Clara Wilson this morning, and I'm pleased to say his condition is listed as Widower, I was a bit worried there for a while!
It also confirms that his father's name was indeed Charles Kittredge Wells, so you were right on the mark there.
I haven't heard from the Wells family tree holder despite contacting her through Ancestry and GenesReunited, so I've not been able to verify the US family, but I'll keep my fingers crossed that she'll be in touch.
Just wanted to share this with you as you have been so very helpful with this search.
All the very best,
Sue :)
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Hello Sue,
That good news Sue, a little sad that perhaps he lost a wife and a daughter though.
I did go through the marriages again on the italiangen.org site - drawn to one in particular in 1895.
Her name was down on the tree entry as Louise P ??? The marriage entry is below ???
Emma L Pomeroy Oct 23 1895 Kings 5029
William Wells Oct 23 1895 Kings 5029
Regards
Sandra
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Blimey Sue - I think thats her. ??? Found another family tree and it says divorced from W H Welles. Look at her Mothers name - same as the daughter they had !!!!!
Father:- Ralph Pomeroy - Born 18 MAY 1839 in New York Death 16 AUG 1903 in Brooklyn, Kings County, New York. Married Margaretta Ann Nostrand - Born 6 APR 1850 in New York Death 14 JUN 1926 in Brooklyn, Kings County, New York.
Children:- Margaretta Maria Pomeroy 1868 – Emma Louise Pomeroy 1870 – Adelia Hamilton Pomeroy 1873 – 1881 Clara May Pomeroy 1875 – Charlotte Augusta Pomeroy 1879 –
Next Generation Back:- Paris Rhodes Pomeroy - Birth 6 Nov1810 -Death Abt Octt1871 in Brooklyn, Kings County, New York Married to Maria Betts Kinnier - Birth Abt 1820 in New York Death 25 Dec 1855
Goes way - way back to a Richard Pomeroy who died in England bef 1635 !!!
Regards
Sandra
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You can view the parents on the 1900 Census (with image)
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bkv/
Should be an Obituary for Raplh Pomeroy in th New York Times 16th August 1903.
Could try the site below to see if anything tuns up - sometimes slow to load.
http://www.fultonhistory.com/Flash_ok.html
Looks to be a family steeped in history.
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YES - YES Look at the 1910 Census entry in Brooklyn Ward 23, Kings, New York
1269 Bedford Avenue.
Margaretta Pomeroy 59 Widowed. Had 5 children and 4 survive.
Margaretta Chapman 40 Daughter. Divorced, Dressmaker. Out
Louisa Wells 37 DIVORCED. Milliner. Private. Had 1 child and 1 survives.
Margareta Wells 12 Grand-Daughter
Should be an Obituary for Margaret Pomeroy - New York Times 16th June 1926 (Page 25)
Looks like the burials could be Greenwood Cemetery
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Margaret A Pomeroy.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bkw/
and Ralph Pomeroy
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0bkx/
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Excellent work Sandra, you've well and truly cracked it!
So Louise survived, and William was divorced not widowed - naughty boy!
It's really brilliant to solve this,
thank-you thank-you thank-you.
;) Sue
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Hello Sue,
Your most welcome. I could kick myself for not pursuing that marriage entry earlier - I must have looked at it a dozen times !!!
Pleased that everything tied in nicely and the mystery was unravelled.
Regards
Sandra ;D
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Hi Sandra,
Just an update to let you know that I received the marriage certificate of William Huntington Wells and Edith Clara Wilson this morning, and I'm pleased to say his condition is listed as Widower, I was a bit worried there for a while!
It also confirms that his father's name was indeed Charles Kittredge Wells, so you were right on the mark there.
I haven't heard from the Wells family tree holder despite contacting her through Ancestry and GenesReunited, so I've not been able to verify the US family, but I'll keep my fingers crossed that she'll be in touch.
Just wanted to share this with you as you have been so very helpful with this search.
All the very best,
Sue :)
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Hi,
I'm new to this website and I came across this by accident. William Huntington Wells is quite familiar to me in that he is one of my great heroes. This man is a legend in Indian motorcycle circles in UK and Ireland. He was better known as Billy Wells and he was the leading importer of Indian machines into the UK via his London base. He came second in the 1907 TT races on the Isle of Man on a Vindec machine. He hurt himself badly whilst starting the 1909 TT races and conldn't complete. This is the man who introduced the great Irish racer and engineer Charles B. Franklin to the Indian board of directors who subsequently, in 1916, offered Franklin a job at their factory in Springfield, Mass. USA. Charles Bayly Franklin went on to design two of the most iconic machines in motorcycle history, the Indian 'Scout' and Indian 'Chief' models.
Wells also was a star in his own right in that he is the man responsable for the development of the motorcycle sport of 'Speedway' in Britain.
Is Wells' wife Clara related to you? Please let me know as I know a chap from Sussex who has a wealth of information on Billy Wells. Much more information can be found in a very recently published biography on Charles Franklin called 'Franklin's Indians' (Panther Publications).
Billy Wells' son, called George Hendee Wells, died in 2009. I MIGHT be able to put you in touch with his son (Billy Wells grandson) in Australia.
Regards
Bad Bill
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Hello Bad Bill,
Your post has really excited me, I had no idea about any of this and would have continued not to have had it not been for your wonderful information, I will certainly search out the book you mention, and having a father and husband who are both very interested in motorbikes this will be of great interest to them too.
I also didn't know that they had had children so thanks for that information too. I am related to Edith Clara Wilson through my dad's line, she was his grandfathers sister. I don't know a deal about this family apart from the information already listed above, and I never discovered the death dates for either Clara or William, so a link to living relatives who may have these answers would be invaluable and if you could sort this out I would be eternally grateful.
Many, many thanks for taking the trouble to get in touch with me, You have given me a wealth of information to go on.
All the best,
Sue
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Hi Sue,
I will be glad to help.
Billy and Clara were photographed on the deck of the Lusitania on their way to the U.S. in 1915. This boat was sunk on the return journey to Liverpool.
In all, Wells made as many as 30 voyages between the U.S. and U.K between 1906 and 1924.
Billy and Clara's first born was called George Hendee Wells as a tribute to his employer George Hendee, boss of the Hendee Manufacturing Company. (This business was later renamed 'The Indian Motocycle Company' ).
G.H. Wells died last year. There is a DVD/Video featuring this wonderful old gentleman. He appears for a few minutes in 'Old Indians Never Die'. This is still available at Duke Video.
I also have live pictures of Billy Wells ( a few seconds) in an early film of a motorcycle organisers meeting. This is copyrighted so may be costly to reproduce.
The reason for Billy Wells coming to Britain in the first place is that he was a motorcar salesman. This didn't work out so he returned to the U.S. He was at a loose end when he bumped into George Hendee his old pushbike racing rival who, when discovering Wells was out of work, offered him a job selling Indian motorcycles into the British Isles. Wells accepted the job and returned to London where he set up the 'Indian' franchise on the Euston Road.
As I've already mentioned, there's loads more info on this subject contained in the new Charles Franklin biography, 'Franklin's Indians'.
Sue, should you wish to speak to me directly, I would have no objections.
Regards
Bad Bill
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Hi again,
This is all really interesting stuff, you say George was their first born, does that mean they had more children? I'd love the details and a copy of the photograph you mention if that's possible I don't have any photo's of Edith, how exciting!
I'll send you a personal message with my e-mail address
Kindest regards,
Sue
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Hi Sue - you maybe the same person as we have just "met" But I am Billy and Clara's grandson David. George....my father was the only child of Billy and Clara. He died only last year at 94...and would have loved all this. Really interesting stuff!
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Hi David,
Yes it's me - but I'm glad you can see how we got to this point.
All the Best
Sue ;)
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Hello Sandra - I too would very much appreciate any info you get - email (*). I am Billy Wells Grandson David Wells. I can confirm that Billy became a permanent British Resident - though he never gave up his American citizenship. George Hendee Wells (Named after Geroge Hendee of Indian fame) was his only son. He in fact managed Indian affairs for many years based in Portland Street) I don't know if you are interested in any more information but I am more than happy to help. Don't want to "bore" you! Must go - its late in Australia. David W
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
New members must make at least three postings before being allowed to use the PM facility.
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Hi Bagpuss (Sue), Bad Bill and Davecus 90,
Sorry I was AWOL during August and never saw the new info that was posted here. Great that you are all in touch and so pleased everything worked out Sue.
All the best
Sandra
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Hi all - and especially Sandra!! Sorry we were not able to contact each other whilst we were in the UK in September but I had no contact address. Not sure how you do this in Rootchat as they remove email addresses for understandable reasons. I have just been lucky enough to have received a copy of "Franklin's Indians" . First perusal suggests this is a very well written book and most interesting. Whilst the book is about Charles Franklin it contains quite a lot of information on Billy Wells
Cheers Davidicus 90.
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HI Davidcus90,
I am not related to the family - just helping to research for Bagpuss (Sue)
Now that you have made 3 posts you can contact Bagpuss and Bad Bill privately using the personal message system.
By clicking on the members's name in the left hand margin, this will take you to another screen
At the bottom of the profile, you will see a link: Send this RootsChatter a personal message.
Click on the link, and write your PM and this will go to them in a private message. (you are now up and running)
Good Luck.
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra for your help! Cheers D
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Suprise suprise, I am researching the history of Speedway racing (Dirt Track racing as it was known in the early years) and I came upon this thread. If anyone is interested? Billy Wells was also associated with motorcycle racing at the famous Brooklands track in Weybridge Surrey
Billy was also involved with the organisation and running of speedway racing at Stamford Bridge, London 1928-32, (Chelsea football ground) but he was not the promotor. He was also responsible for bringing to England American racer Art Pechar who raced at Stamford Bridge.
Hope this is of some interest ;)
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Thanks for this speedway ace.
The early history of motorcycling has often been neglected with the result that many accepted 'facts' are now having to be corrected. This has come about thanks mainly to the internet communication of dedicated people interested in the history of the engineering and sport of motorcycles.
In the recently published biography FRANKLIN'S INDIANS, much of Billy Wells career is featured along with many previously unpublished photographs of him.
Happy New Year
Bad Bill
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Hi Sue
Just a quick message to let you know that a wonderful article on Billy Wells is featured in the September 2013 iissue of "Cycle World" (an American magazine available in the best newsagents)
It is very interesting and informative.
Bad Bill