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General => Armed Forces => Topic started by: crubeo on Monday 17 January 11 23:07 GMT (UK)
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Mi -
My English ancestor Jacob Horle (1790-1839) was in the 9th Regiment of Foot 1st or 2nd Battalion between the years of 1810 - 1820. I know he served in Canada around 1814-1816. I'm trying to find any information about the details of his service (and also the service of his old brother James Horle who likely served with him).
Thank You! -- Chris Rubeo
A quote regarding Jacob Horle's Regiment:
" Few days elapsed after the termination of the war in Europe, before the veterans of the NINTH were ordered to hold themselves in readiness to proceed to North America, where hostilities had commenced between Great Britain and the United States. From Bayonne, the regiment marched to Bordeaux, where it arrived on the 22nd of May (1814), and encamped seven miles below the town, until the 3rd of June, when it embarked in transports, but was removed on the following day to the York and Vengeur, seventy-four gun ships, in which it sailed for Canada. Arriving in the river St. Lawrence, the regiment was removed on board of transports, in which it proceeded to Quebec, from whence it continued its course up the river, and on the 22nd of August arrived at Montreal. After halting a week at Montreal, the NINTH marched up the country into cantonments on the left of the St. Lawrence, below Prescot, where they were stationed when the unsuccessful attack was made on the Americans near Plattsburg. In October the NINTH proceeded to Kingston. In the meantime many men had joined the second battalion at Canterbury, from prisoners of war and from sick absent, and two strong detachments arrived in America to join the first battalion. On the 20th of February, 1815, the second battalion marched from Canterbury to Chatham; in the summer it was removed to Sheerness, and it was afterwards encamped in the Isle of Sheppy.
Meanwhile peace had been concluded between Great Britain and the United States: and Napoleon Buonaparte had quitted the Isle of Elba, returned to France, and reascended the throne of that kingdom. These events occasioned the regiment to be ordered to return to Europe, where all the nations were arming to dispossess Buonaparte of the throne of France. Although the NINTH had no opportunity of signalizing themselves in action, during their stay in Canada, yet they displayed the valuable qualities of firm discipline, and unshaken fidelity to their Sovereign, country, and colours. In some corps desertion prevailed to a considerable extent, and tempting rewards awaited such soldiers as should reach the territory of the United States, which could be accomplished with little risk; but, notwithstanding all the temptations and facilities for desertion, not one soldier of the Ninth forsook his colours, an honourable boast, which only two corps, the NINTH and eighty-eighth, could make."
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hello chris
welcome to rootschat , i,ve looked up the service records on FindMyPast and neither one of them is there .
trevor
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Thanks anyway. What is FindMyPast?
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it is findmypast,,,,they have records of soldiers discharged with a pension...
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Trevor, might you be able to check FindMyPast for "Jacob Horl?" no "e?" thanks!
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nothing showing on a Jacob Horl, tried other spelling Hearl, Hurle, Hurrell, no clear hits, there is a John Hurle in the 9th Foot, enlisted 1807, born 1774, left the service 1817, stationed at what looks like St Amano?, no idea where that is, reason for leaving appears to be "worn out", approved by the Surgeon, probably not your man though, the FindMyPast military record is for pensions, all the best in your search
James
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Thanks, James. And you other guys as well! - Chris
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hello chris 2 things firstly what is your source for the info of jacob,s service and also where was he from ie place of birth
trevor
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Jacob Horle was from Banwell, Somerset, England.
His wife Sarah wrote a letter from Canterbury 1813 saying Jacob was with his brother James on route to Spain with 2nd Battalion-9th Reg. of Foot.
Thanks for any help you may be able to give.
Chris
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on my family, research was a pain due to mis-spelling the family name, anyways, I found a Jacob Harle in 1841 census, born at Somerset 1796 so aged 45, wifes name Sarah aged 50 born at Somerset, & son John, living at Milton, Kewstroke, is this a possible match?
not found any military yet, though in 1841 states this fellow as being agricultural labourer
James
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hi chris
we need an expert on this i think for that era to find out wether that reg was involved at waterloo only if they were on there way to spain and waterloo was 1814 they were either involved or were part of a reserve rearguard force it sounds like, i,m guessing at this i,m no expert thats for sure but have a keen interest in the period , i,ve looked at the waterloo medal roll and neither are on it not under horle -hurl -hurle or hall , question can anyone imagine what a somerset accent would have sounded like 200hundred years ago only they could be there but taking into account that most working class folk back then could neither read nor write and so most names were written down phonetically they could be right in front of us but we,d never know it , as james has said in the last post we,ve all i,m sure been there at some stage in our searches .
trevor
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Found this today through the Mormon Family History Library in Los Angeles. The can order these micro-fiches for me. I'll let you all know what I find.
Soldiers documents : service documents of soldiers, containing particulars of age, birthplace and trade or occupation on enlistment, a record of service, including any decorations and the reason for discharge to pension, 1760-1872
v. 302 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Abbott-Blatchley 1760-1854 FHL Film 864821
v. 303 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Blevins-Coe 1760-1854 FHL Film 864822
v. 304 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Coffee-Dyre-Dyke 1760-1854 FHL Film 864823
v. 305 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Evendon-Easman-Gordon 1760-1854 FHL Film 864824
v. 306 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Hornby-Gorman-Ives 1760-1854 FHL Film 864825
v. 307 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Jackman-Lyons 1760-1854 FHL Film 864826
v. 308 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: McAuliffe-Neal 1760-1854 FHL Film 864827
v. 309 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Norris-Needham-Quinn 1760-1854 FHL Film 864828
v. 310 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Reeves-Rackett- Southgate 1760-1854 FHL Film 876859
v. 311-312 9th Rgmnt. of Foot: Spackman-Young 1760-1854 FHL Film 876860
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wow chris that was a great find i,ve never seen the like before , so did you find the site online or what only i,ve never heard of the los angeles library i thought all there stuff came from salt lake city . seems like we,ve got an expert on this already . i think you,ve been holding out on us ;D.
and yes let us know what you find out and keep an eye out for waterloo to see if that reg was there or i,d be interested as to where in spain they were any way
good luck and fingers crossed on a result
trevor
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Those Mormons are incredible. The Library here in LA is just a branch of the main one in Salt Lake. I'll let you know -
http://www.lafhl.org/
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Neither the 1st or 2nd Btn of the 9th Foot were at Waterloo sadly.
1st Btn
1809 Walcheren
1810-14 Spain/France (Peninsular War)
1814-15 North America (Canadian Frontier)
1815-18 France
1818-19 England
1819-26 West Indies
2nd Btn
1809-13 Gibraltar/Spain/Minorca (Peninsular War)
1813-15 England
1815 disbanded
I know he served in Canada around 1814-1816.
His wife Sarah wrote a letter from Canterbury 1813 saying Jacob was with his brother James on route to Spain with 2nd Battalion-9th Reg. of Foot.
Both these snippets suggest 1st Btn to me rather than 2nd
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thanks from me neil for that , so would the reg been used then just to fill a gap left by other regs that had gone on to waterloo i mean is there any details any where as to where they were in spain or just the basics that you,ve posted
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hi chris
thanks for posting the site details thats most kind of you i,ve had a quick look down the home page they have an awful lot of stuff on there thats for sure i hope it,s as easy for us over the big pond to access as it is for you . ;)
thanks again
trevor
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Thanks Neil. I should have a copy of that 1813 letter next week. Anyone know where I can see what his uniform may have looked like?
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Trevor - If there's every something that you find in the Mormon collection, I may be able to dig it up for you - Chris
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Thanks Neil. I should have a copy of that 1813 letter next week. Anyone know where I can see what his uniform may have looked like?
Google can be your friend! ;)
http://www.britishbattles.com/waterloo/images/east-norfolk-l.jpg
Neither of these two is a private soldier but great for a general idea.
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Hi Crubeo
The microfilms you found were indexed by the Friends of the National Archives about ten years ago. These indexes are online on the NA Catalogue, and the records themselves were published by Findmypast last year. Trevor has been unable to find him on Findmypast, and I have been unable to find him in the NA Catalogue.
You will have to pay for a researcher to look at the muster books for the 9th Foot; firstly the one covering the date of your letter, and then paying particular attention to the one for 1815-1816 during which the 2nd Battalion was disbanded. This should tell you if he transferred to the 1st Battalion, or to another regiment, or was discharged.
btw...the army year started on 24th March (don't ask)
Ken
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Oh no! So, I guess there's no use in requesting that microfilm? You're certain, eh? Can you suggest where I might find a researcher who could search those muster rolls? Thanks.
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hi chris
many thanks for the offer to look up anything in the mormon archive library as it stands i can,t think of anything at the moment , do you know if they do look ups from e mail requests from us folk over the pond !
cheers
trevor
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Trevor -
I'm not sure if the Mormon Library does recess for our British cousins, but if something comes up, feel free to let me know.
But, take a look at the latest response from KM1971. What do you think about that? Should I not bother looking at the microfilm?
Moderator Comment: Email address removed to prevent spamming etc. Please use our personal message system to exchange such information.
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hi Chris
again thanks for your e mail address i promise not to bother you unless absolutely necessary , but i,ll get one of the mods to remove it just in case it were to be used for spamming or worse , in these cases it,s always best to pm someone rather than posting e mail addresses keep it in mind for the future no one i,m sure minds getting p m,s i certainly don,t best to be safe , as to the microfilm give ken his due he,s good at the military along with several others so i,d take it as read what he says is right , but if in doubt check them anyway if you,ve the time and it makes you feel assured you,ve covered all the angles and as he says not all records are online re the muster rolls so unless you can get to view them yourself and i presume there at kew in london a researcher is one answer the other pos is to ask an open question for someone to do a look up for you through rootschat but always ask a researcher to give you an estimate of cost for work done and also try and get quotes from more than one it could vary from person to person on hourly rates , as to finding one try googling for researchers with an interest in all things military they would have more insight as to what to look for straight away so saving time and hopefully money .
take care
trevor
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http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/paid_research.htm
The private researchers have not been checked/approved by the NA.
Ken
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hi ken
so are these records at the tna rather than kew?
tevor
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Thanks, guys.
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Just noting that there is a Jacob Howell (and also a James Howell) on the Peninsular War medal roll according to familyrelatives.com.
I don't have a sub at present so can't drill down to find the regiment http://www.familyrelatives.com/search/search_peninsula_medalroll.php
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hi shaun
those records you found jacob was in the 50th of foot and james was in the 3rd of foot
trevor
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hi ken
so are these records at the tna rather than kew?
tevor
TNA = Kew .... unless I'm missing something, or have misunderstood your question. ???
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Another tack...
Somerset archives has an 1813 certificate re the wife of James Horle, a soldier of Banwell http://www1.somerset.gov.uk/archives/
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hi neil
what a p--t i am i can,t even blame that on it having been a long day not at 9 o clock in the morning anyway would you have a look at a post on the ww1 section entitled badge/brooch identification only the lady on there needs help with wether the 23rd bat r fus were in the area of bapaume in the somme area sep 1918 .
cheers
trevor
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Hmmmm... The first names are right. I'll know more soon about the confirmation of 9th of Foot for MY Jacob Horle and his brother James.