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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Canada Lookup Request => Topic started by: sammie on Friday 14 January 11 15:24 GMT (UK)
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Hi to all
I am trying to find some vital information on Sarah Cluney born 1849 in Sherbrooke, Guysborough, NS
She was the first wife of George Dawson, they married in 1875 as soon as George had become a Canadian citizen.
They already had two children
Finley who may well not be George's son (1869)
James Dawson (b 1872)
Charles Dawson (b 1877) and
Ada Dawson (b 1880)
George then remarries 5 July 1882 to Christy McDonald
We have never been able to find a death of Sarah "Cluney" Dawson between 1881 and 1882, or a divorce for her and George.
It is a mystery as to where she is, if anyone can shed any light on this it would be gratefully appreciated
kind regards
Sammie :-*
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Hi Sammie
Have you looked through the NS Resources on Rootschat to find sites that may be of some assistance to you?
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/board,372.0.html
I'm also going to put a link to the thread requesting information about Finley. It's best to keep everything about one family on one thread to avoid duplication of searches. Very often information found on one family member leads to other family members.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,507056.0.html
Susan
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some sites for you to check for information
http://automatedgenealogy.com
has free access to 1901 and 1911 census and you can also check for alternate spellings of the name such as Cluny and Clooney.
1901 Census of Canada/Guysborough/Sherbrooke
households 83 and 84 lines 8-15 are Cluney and Dawson. You can also use the split screen option for more information. There is an adopted daughter by the name of Ida M. McCarthy in 1901 and also an adopted son in 1911
http://dsconrad.com/genealogy/Cluney-history.html
is an on-line family tree for the Cluney family of Sherbrooke
http://www.guysboroughhistoricalsociety.ca/genealogical-research.htm
Links to cemeteries, etc at bottom of page
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~guys/map.html
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Thanks both for your posts,
Alas my husband I have tried most of them already lol
So still think may need someone living locally to have a look at some time in the future
thanks grately all the same :)
kind regards
Sammie
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George Dawson, widower, died 1931 (born 14 Oct.1840) and ldeath certificate lists Sherbrook as place of burial. Wife Christina Dawson d.1927 (mn McDonald). Daughter Ada H. Dawson d.1911 (age 30)
See https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/
Not sure if you've seen the obituary of Alexander Dawson, adopted son of George Dawson-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/Patsy/obits/obit1481.html
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Aghadowey
Thanks, alas I have all that info already and yes I have the obit for alexander saved against him on FTM :)
But thanks very much for even taking the time to look, appreciated
kind regards
Sammie
Christys death is a bit dubious as reading between the lines I think George may have been responsible for the blow that killed her (deliberate or not) as he sure never stayed around to witness the death cert. Then when he dies a short time afterwards 25 miles or so from Sherbrooke it states on his cause of death that he had lived in Eight Island Lake for 2 to 3 years, think he was hiding away
Sammie xx
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HI Sammie
I have a Sarah Cluney in my line, born 1849 Sherbrooke, died 1923 Sherbrooke. I will have to dig out my research and see what I can find. I haven't researched for over two years.
Let's see what we can find for you
Bren
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Hi Bren
They would be one and the same Sarah Cluney, she married my rellie George Dawson,well he was christened George Daw but I will go into that in more detail tomorrow as I am about to go bed.
Will send you another message tomorrow
kind regards
Sammie
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Have a good sleep, will chat tomorrow.
Looking at your posts for this thread, I see you have been directed to dsconrad's website, he is a 'rellie' and has the same Sarah Cluney as I do. You mentioned that you looked at his site and it wasn't the correct Sarah. I will keep looking around for a bit tonight.
cheerios
Bren
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Hi again Bren
The Sarah listed on that site as daughter of Thomas is the same as my Sarah and as I mentioned she was the first wife of my rellie George Dawson
If as it appears she died in 1923, as I have entered on my tree then she must have divorced George as they were together on the 1881 census in Sherbrooke and then George marrys Christina McDonald in 1882. So if they did divorce I would imagine it to be between 1881 and 1882 :)
Speak again soon Sammie
PS
I am happy to share all I have on the decendants of George and Sarah as they will all be cousins to you in various degrees
:):)
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HI Sammie
Did you see Sarah Cluney's death certificate at https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/ . The names of her parents are listed, but I can't quite make them out.
cheers
Bren
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When I search for death certificate of 'Sarah Cluney' there's only 1 (1927)- parents are James
Bluett? Bennett (born Indian Harbour Lake) and Elizabeth Snyder? (born Halfway _ _), husband Thomas Cluney Sherbrooke.
Correction: surname is Bennett- marriage of Thomas Cluney and Sarah Kate Bennett (1875) also listed on site.
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Hi both
The Sarah Cluney who died in 1927 is the mother of my Sarah (Cluney) Dawson.
I searched the "novascotiagenealogy" page but could not find the Sarah Dawson who died in 1923 so still need to find that I think :)
kind regards
Sammie xx
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Hello,
Was your Sarah born in 1949?
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Have to confess I'm totally confused here.
Bren mentioned "Did you see Sarah Cluney's death certificate at https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/ . The names of her parents are listed, but I can't quite make them out."
However, the only Sarah Cluney death I could find there was 1927. This Sarah was aged 72 years so born c1855.
Now, sammie says "The Sarah Cluney who died in 1927 is the mother of my Sarah (Cluney) Dawson."
Well, Sarah (Cluney) Dawson was "born 1849 in Sherbrooke, Guysborough, NS" so her mother can hardly be born about 6 years later. :-\
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My thoughts also. If Sarah Cluney who was married to Thomas Cluney was first married to George Dawson, then her maiden name would not be Cluney(?).
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http://dsconrad.com/genealogy/Family/f2255.htm#P7314
Looking at this tree ...
Father Thomas
Mother Bridget
Son Thomas who married Sarah Bennett
Daughter Sarah (born 1849).
It would seem Sammie's Sarah is the sister to Thomas and Sarah whose marriage cert we were looking at.
By the way, my great grandfather is William, further down the tree (a brother to Sarah)
Another note:
Sammie, for your info, the spelling was later changed to Clooney. The story is that when members of the Cluney family joined the war, they were illiterate and signed with an X, whoever filled out their attestation papers, spelled the name Clooney. This clue might help in your search also.
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Perhaps Sarah Cluney who died 1927 is the second wife of Thomas Cluney (Sarah's dad)
As on Can 1871 family listed as follows
Thomas Cluney 56 (b 1815 Ireland)
Bridget Cluney 50 (b 1821 NS)
Children
Sarah 22 (1849)
Thomas 21 (1850)
James 19 (1852)
John 18 (1853)
Mary 15 (1856)
Edward 12 (1859)
David 10 (1861)
Elinor 9 (1862)
Elizabeth 7 (1864)
Hector 4 (1867)
William 3 (1868)
Finley 2 (1869) (iligitamate son of Sarah 1849) as on 1881 he is then Finlay Dawson the surname of Sarah and my George Dawson who married in 1875.
A Bridget Cluney died 1900 in Halifax, just checked it on that site :)
Says she was 59 and single so perhaps she is a daughter of Thomas and Bridget the mystery depens.
The marriage of Thomas Cluney (aged 26) and Sarah Kate Bennett in 1875 must be Thomas son of Thomas and Bridget and the brother of Sarah (1849)
So I think the death as shown for a Sarah Cluney in 1927 is most likely the second wife of Thomas Cluney previously married to Bridget.
and therefore still need to find the death of Sarah (Cluney) Dawson b 1849. If it is in 1923 then she must have divorced George Dawson as he is not with Sarah after 1882 as thats when he remarried.
So her death maybe recorded as either Sarah Cluney or Sarah Dawson depending on whether she resorted to her maiden name or not.
kind regards
Sammie
PS
Sorry if I caused any confusion Aghadowey and I hope this post clears it up a little :) and yes Bren our Sarah Cluney on our tree def born c1849
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hehe
When I was typing out my long winded reply I notice you both come up with the same conclusions xxxx
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Cool on the name change info
I know I am now talking to two people related to Sarah Cluney 1849 thats well cool
Alas you are both not blood relatives to me but the decendants of Sarah and George are related to all of us and I am currently chatting with others decended from George and Sarah.
Namely Patricia and Robert Dawson brother and sister and decended from George and Sarah's son James who emigrated to MA, USA and his son Wilkes.
We are currently colaberating to get the whole Dawson branch as best we can onto the Daw/Dawe/Dawson family tree.
I am more than happy to share any info I have on George Daw (Dawson) and Sarah Cluney.
George was a bit f a character
Born George Daw in 1849 in Wellington, Somerset, UK, jumped ship from the Royal Navy, marries Sarah in 1875 and had changed his surname to Dawson :)
kind regards
Sammie
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Phew, I was afraid my head was going to explode.
I will have to dig in the paper files to see what I have in there. Computer crash, you know the story - contacts gone, info gone - thankfully we still have paper.
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very much so, always good to keep paper copies of info and to have tree saved not just on the PC :)
regards
Sammie xx
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We will keep in touch. I will keep looking at this end and let you know if I find anything.
By the way, I am moving back to the home province of NS this year and I plan to take a trip to Sherbrooke. The Cluney/Clooney family home is still there. When I visit (hopefully Summer of 2011) I will get as much info as possible.
take care, keep in touch
xox
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Thanks Bren
Hope you have a fun time when you visit NS and Sherbrooke and take good care and thanks for help so far and to any help in the future
Sammie :)x
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When you find time, would you send me some tidbits on your Dawson family so I can search for them also.
cheers
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Hi again Bren
I just sent you a personal message containing my email address so that I can then send you a gedcom of George Daw/Dawson and Sarah Cluney and their decendants as we have at moment.
Not many, but once Patricia and Robert fill in gaps there will be more and I am sure they would love to hear from you as they as they are your cousins :)
Sammie
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Have been puzzling over all this and think I might have it figures out (well nearly figured out as some certificates don't seem to be on N.S. Vital records website). The key to it is Finlay Cluney/Dawson. This is how I think it goes-
1) Thomas Cluney and wife Bridget McCoy have a large family, including Sarah (c1849) and Thomas (c1841).
- if this is the Bridget who died in Halifax 1900 there are several problems on death certificate (age 59 but listed as single and from St. John Nfld.).
- 1871 Census a son named Finlay is listed (more on him in a minute)
2) Thomas Cluney, son of Thomas Cluney and Bridget McCoy married 1875 Sarah Kate/C. Bennett (c1855-1927).
-In 1881 Thomas' household consists of wife Sarah, sons James and Angus, and his father Thomas (married). Thomas Sr.'s wife Bridget is in Dawson household
-In 1901 Census there's Thomas and Sarah with sons James and Angus plus 4 sons born 1882-1894
-In 1911 Census there's Thomas and wife Sarah with 4 sons
3) George Dawson (born 1840 England died 1931) and wife Christina died 1927.
-In 1881 George Dawson is listed with a wife Sarah, son Finlay 11, son James 10, son Charles 4, daughter Ada 1, as well as Bridget Cluney and 5 of her children. Notice that 'Finlay Dawson' is the same age as 'Finlay Cluney' from 1871 census.
-In 1901 Census George Dawson now has wife Christie, daughter Ada and an adopted daughter Ida M. McCarthy age 9.
-In 1911 Census George and wife Christie have an adopted son Alexander.
So, George Dawson and Sarah Cluney (born c1849, daughter of Thomas and Bridget) either married or living as man and wife are together in 1881 with Charles and Ada possibly children they had together. Finlay and James are most likely children Sarah had earlier.
By 1901 George is now living with 'wife' Christina McDonald and an adopted daughter called Ida M. McCarthy. Death certificate for Ida May McCarthy 17 Apr.1910 (age 19) shows she died from burns and shock.
At the time of the next census in 1911 George and Christie have another adopted child- Alexander born Dec.1907 who accidentally drowns in 1924. Alexander's death certificate (indexed as Danson) givesn his father as William Chapel (born Sherbrooke) and Ida Dawson (born Sheet Harbour)- George Dawson's adopted daughter. After Ida died in 1910 George and Christie must have raised her son as their own child.
There are several certificates I've not been able to find including a marriage for George Dawson to Christina McDonald.
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I totally agree with what aghadowey has found. I was just about to post the same information.
I would like to add a few things though. It is entirely possible that Finley is the son of either Bridget or Sarah. With such large families, older children would take care of the youngest children in the family often taking some of the younger children with them when they married. It is also not unusual for families to split up such as Thomas and Bridget did and live with sons and daughters depending on their financial and health situations.
In my own family, my mother brought up her youngest brother who was 19 years younger than her. My great aunt had a child and brother that were the same age. Also members of the family used a naming pattern so the same names were used over and over again so it does become confusing.
Most of the Cluney's living in the Halifax area were from Newfoundland with no connection to the Cluney's in Sherbrooke that I could find.
BMD registrations for parts of Nova Scotia were haphazard at best and many were not registered. Sherbooke would have been very rural in the 1880's so you would need to rely on church records.
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Sarah wife of George Dawson probably died in 1881 or 1882 and he remarried to provide a mother for the children. That was very common in rural Nova Scotia. Widowers would usually find someone younger in need of a husband to marry out of convenience not love. Life in that part of Nova Scotia would have been very harsh with many women dying in childbirth and that is probably the case of Sarah.
When looking at cemeteries take into consideration that many families had wooden crosses and not granite stones that you see today. The crosses from the 1880's will not still exist. The most likely cemeteries for burial are Indian Harbour Lake - Sunset Rest and Riverside Cemetery in Sherbrooke. Also St James Anglican for some members of the Bennett family. When you go through the census records that have survived and also the BMD's Indian Harbour Lake is a common area for the surname Cluney and Bennett.
I would definitely look more at the site for the Conrad tree that was given earlier. Also, I would suggest when you look at records that are available to pay attention to all the info that is given. Your best bet may be to contact some of the local genealogy and historical groups to see if they have books on local families or newspaper clippings that may be of use. They may hav a lot of info that isn't available on line.
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When looking at
www.novascotiagenealogy.com
these are the only records that are available.
Births 1864-1877, 1908-1909
delayed registration 1830-1909
Marriages bonds 1763-1864
Registrations 1864-1934
Deaths 1864-1877, 1908-1959
City of Halifax 1890-1908
As I said before many BMD's were not registered.
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Again tyvm to Val and Agha for your time and your replies
Was interesting getting my tree amended to show adopted son Alexander was the son of adopted daughter Ida but managed it in the end, was getting a little confused. I had not previously looked that far into the adopted children.
Going back to the death of Sarah Cluney (1849) who married ? George Dawson and to where Finley Dawson is after 1881 I am still in the same position as needing a kind person to look up the posibble death records in the church records.
It is all very interesting.
So I am now going to try and get contact information for genealogists in the Sherbrooke area and seek their help.
Thanks everyone for your helpon this matter, very much appreciated
kindest regards
Sammie xxxxxx
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Think it would be worth contacting owners of several online Cluney and/or Dawson trees to exchange information if you haven't done so already, especially the one that says Sarah, daughter of Thomas and Bridget, died in 1923 (giving NS vital records as the source). I did start looking for Sarah ? died 1923 N.S. but still haven't checked surnames beginning with m, n, r, s and t.
I did check online gravestone records on N.S. Genweb site for Gutsborough and found nothing although as Valerie says many markers may not exist.
Wonder if there would have been a write-up in any newspapers (either local or Halifax papers) about Christina (McDonald) Dawson's suspicious sounding death and possibly George Daawson's death.
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Most early church records are at the Nova Scotia Archives and Records Management.
http://www.gov.ns.ca/nsarm/
You may find the site useful at some point.