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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Perthshire => Topic started by: Chiad Fhear on Saturday 08 January 11 09:54 GMT (UK)

Title: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Chiad Fhear on Saturday 08 January 11 09:54 GMT (UK): Hi Perthshire RootsChatters

I have a the Perth OPR of Birth for a paternal ancestor James Neilson born 17 September 1777, 'Lawfully Procreated' son of Alexander Neilson and Janet Brough.

A second son, also named James, my 3rd Great-grandfather, was born 14 January 1782 which logically indicates that the first one had died, perhaps at birth, but certainly before January 1782.

Alexander and Janet had other children - John b. 6 Aug 1779; Robert b. 17 Aug 1784; Alexander b. 6 Apr 1788 and Jane b. abt 1790. I know Jane survived to marry and have a family.

Can anyone help with pre-1855 Deaths in Perth/Perthshire?

Regards

Chiad Fhear
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: bleckie on Saturday 08 January 11 10:15 GMT (UK): Hi Chiad Fhear

Try this link to the Perth Burial Register
This covers both the main cemeteries in Perth and not the church ones

James n/a NILSON 25 May 1795
PE1/20/1 James n/a NILSON 28 January 1806
PE1/20/1 James n/a NILSON 22 January 1807
PE1/20/2 James n/a NILSON 06 January 1838

http://www.pkc.gov.uk:8082/

Yours Aye
BruceL
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Chiad Fhear on Saturday 08 January 11 10:20 GMT (UK): Thanks BruceL I'll have a look!

Chiad Fhear
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: angelai on Monday 20 June 11 11:08 BST (UK): Hi Bruce
Thanks for posting the link to Perth Burial Register. I have found lots of information on my family.Do you know if there is more than one Greyfriars cemetary in Perth? I was there unfortunately it was closed due to the trees down from the hurricane winds. I do know that there is a Alexander Kelt with a headstone in there.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: bleckie on Monday 20 June 11 12:19 BST (UK): Hi angelai

There is only one Greyfriars Cemetery in Perth has been closed to internments since about the 1850s
from memory.

There is also Wellshill in Perth

Yours Aye
BruceL
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: angelai on Monday 20 June 11 12:26 BST (UK): Hi BruceL
From what I remember this graveyard was down in the centre of the village
it was small nicely kept. Is this the same one that you are talking about?I think all these Kelts on the list must have been buried without a headstone. Just having the information is great.
THANK YOU AGAIN for postingthe site.
Angela
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 26 June 11 13:34 BST (UK): Quote from: angelai on Monday 20 June 11 12:26 BST (UK)
From what I remember this graveyard was down in the centre of the village
The Fair CITY of Perth? village? pop 45,000+

I used to have my own website and this is what I had written re Greyfriars:
GREYFRIARS
To the left, between a church and some recent housing can be seen the old burial ground of Greyfriars.
This was part of the ground where the Franciscan Monastery stood.
The ground lay derelict for a number of years by which time the graveyard which had surrounded St. John's Kirk became full and the magistrates decreed that the Greyfriars would be the new place of interment.
On the 22nd August, 1580 they paid John Richardson to 'build the burial walls with stone and clay and harl with lime'.
On the 20th December, 1580 it was opened for business when the Kirk Session ordained 'that in all time coming, the yard in the Greyfriars to be for burial'.
The graveyard was in use until the middle of the 19th century when a new cemetery was opened (Wellshill), although burials still took place in Greyfriars, the most recent being 1983.
Now the ground is in a deplorable condition with the walls and tombstones collapsing.
In March 1998 the Heritage Lottery Fund awarded a grant of £276,000 towards the restoration of the burial ground.
The boundary walls will be rebuilt as well as the lifting and resetting of fallen gravestones.
A selection of the more finely carved will be housed in a purpose-built shelter to protect them from the elements.
In July 2001, after restoration, the burial ground is once more open to the public.

I used to go to the Graveyard often and I can say that since it has been restored many of the tombstones have been removed.
Some of them were small slabs let into the grass along the pathways. The grass and the pathways are still there but the slab have disappeared.

buckhind
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: bleckie on Sunday 26 June 11 16:08 BST (UK): Hi buckhind

I am led to believe that a lottery funding was provided to allow Greyfriars to become a natural habitat for wild flowers and butterflies.

First grass cut of the year normally around this time of year with the result if you go in in wet weather you get soaked to above the knees and beyond. next time I am down town I will photograph the board on the entry from taystreet and post here.

Some village
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perth,_Scotland
Scotlands Capital once upon a time.

Yours aye
bruceL
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 26 June 11 16:37 BST (UK): Hi Bruce,

Thanks for that.

I wrote about Greyfriars 1999/2000 before the restoration of the graveyard.
Then it was in a terrible mess.
BUT, since the restoration I have noticed several gravestones/markers are missing.
As you come into the yard from the main entrance off Canal Street there were two small stones set in the grass.
One simply had the name 'Weekes 1838' and the other was to an Alex Laurie, baker.
Both appear to be gone.
This is what I wrote re Weekes.
WEEKES
Another gravestone here has the simple inscription WEEKES and the date 1838.
Paddy Weekes was a popular Irish singer and comedian who played to packed houses in the Perth theatre.
On the 14th October, 1838 he was travelling from Glasgow to Perth by stage coach when it left the road and overturned, crushing him beneath it.
He was carried to the Star hotel in Perth where he died on the 24th November and was buried in Greyfriars.
He left a widow and six children.
The owner of the theatre, Corbet Ryder, paid for the burial and staged a benefit night for the widow which was billed as 'Weekes Night' raising the not inconsiderable sum of £60.

There is no excuse for them to be removed.
They were just sitting in the grass verge minding their own business.
At the time I was building my website I took several photos of the graveyard and stones and like you I will go there this week and take some more pics and compare them.

buckhind
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: zigitup on Monday 06 April 15 22:40 BST (UK): Hello Buckhind

I found this post when searching for info about Greyfriars Cemetary in Perth. I think one of my ancestors Peter Haggart might be buried there. I have found a record for a burial of a Peter Haggart ("Hagart") on PKC website. It says he was a carter buried in 1819 aged 26. The name and occupation match but I think 26 (so born c1793) is too young because the Peter Haggart I am looking for was married in Kinnoull in 1802. His wife was called Ann (Campbell). I think they lived in Bridgend. Thanks. I've got no links to Perth so no idea how big a job this might be! Is there a way (map?) of linking PKC burial refs to locations in the cemetary? Any assistance, suggestions or signposts would be much appreciated.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Tuesday 07 April 15 16:51 BST (UK): Hi Zigitup,
If your Peter Haggart was married in 1802 then the one born 1793 and buried in Greyfriars Cemetery is not the same one (unless the age is wrong).
Thoughout the centuries up until the mid 19th century there were two graveyards in Perth.
Greyfriars catered for the citizens of Perth, and Kinnoull Churchyard was the resting place of citizens of Kinnoull parish and the neighbouring parish of Bridgend.
If your Peter Haggart was married and lived in Brigend then he would most probably be buried in Kinnoull Churchyard.
This is a photograph of the Perth Bridge built over the River Tay in 1766-72.
Bridgend is at the far end and Kinnoull is a wee bit further to the right.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/album%202/bridgend.jpg)

These photographs are from my website circa 2000/2001.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/scotgenclub/gf01.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/scotgenclub/gf02.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/scotgenclub/gf03.jpg)

and these are the photos I took in June, 2011:
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/greyfriars-graves-02.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/greyfriars-graves-03.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/greyfriars-graves.jpg)

These photographs are from my website circa 2000/2001.

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/scotgenclub/kin01.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/kinnoull02.jpg)

And these are the ones I took in June, 2011:
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/kinnoull-01.jpg)
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/kinnoull-02.jpg)

An idyllic and beautiful scene.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/album%202/kinnoull%2005.jpg)

I think Perth Library still has the pre-1855 book of Perthshire burials.
I will check out Kinnoull Churchyard for you and see if there is any mention of Peter Haggart and Ann Campbell.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Tuesday 07 April 15 19:27 BST (UK): I went to Perth Library and checked out the pre-1855 MI’s of Perthshire.
There were two Haggarts in Kinnoull Churchyard.
59- Thomas Fleming Baker Bridgend 1818, first wife Helen Haggart 15.4.1804 36 (years old)….

124- 1826 John Hagart of George Street, Perth 2.6.1816 33,
Wife Ann Morison 22.8.1826 37, son James student of medicine 24.3.1817 18,
Son William .3.1822 16 buried Milnathort, son Robert .8.1825, 23, son John in 1826.

There were two in Greyfriars Burying Ground.
Block E- 98- Robert Haggart, wife Helen Garvie 13.4.1834 55, son James 6.3.1846 28.

Block G- By Peter Haggart & Aunt Jane Campbell (mother Grace Stewart 24.7.1841 82).

A couple of the dates are post 1841 census which means you should find them in the 1841 census for Perth.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: zigitup on Tuesday 07 April 15 21:46 BST (UK): Wow! Thanks very much for all this info and the photos, it looks beautiful esp the last one looking back over the river. And they knew how to make headstones back then. Imagine trying to order something like that today?!

I know its not a match but that last one "Block G" seems like a goer. Perhaps that is my Peter's son and Aunt Jane Campbell is Ann Campbell's sister? All of this info will help me with my research. I'm on Scotland's People so it should help me with my searches on there. I've just looked up the 1841 Census and there is a 28 year old Peter Haggart living in Kinnoul in 1841. (So presume that could be Peter and Ann's son?) If Peter snr and Ann aren't on the 1841 census then they must have died before then (assuming they didn't move away).

Once again thank you very much you have made my day!

Tony Haggart
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Tuesday 07 April 15 22:32 BST (UK): When I saw the name Jane Campbell I thought that she might be a sister of Ann.

Scotlandspeople show two deaths for a Peter Haggart.
1 1866 HAGGART PETER M 50 PERTH /PERTH
2 1881 HAGGART PETER M 71 PERTH /PERTH

One of them may be the son of Peter & Ann but no guarantees.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: zigitup on Sunday 17 May 15 07:45 BST (UK): Hello again. Been doing a bit more research and found this record on the PKC site. (Amazing what you can find out!)

http://www.pkc.gov.uk/article/3925/Perth-burgh-burial-registers-1794-1855?pkcrecid=32225&pkcFirstName=Ann&pkcSurname=Hagart&pkcAlternativeNames=true&pkcpageno=0&pkcsortfield=id

So this shows that Ann Hagart (note spelling) was buried in Greyfriars in 1852. It mentions spouse as Peter Hagart. It says he is a "Carter" which matches what I know about his occupation. So pretty sure now this is the right one. I've been in touch with PKC about burial records and frustratingly they can't find a record of Ann Hagart or Peter (who must have died post 1852).

It may be that there is no headstone? Presume that most people couldn't afford a headstone back then do you think? Has anyone got a plan map of Greyfriars? PKC have sent me some details of Haggarts in that graveyard with some refs "Lair 5-293" and "Lair 4 -107". I may come up to Perth at some point so I might have a look around but it would be good to try and find these. I'll be snookered without a map tho? PKC said they didn't have a plan of the cemetery. I note some of your posts quote Block E and Block G. Any tips gratefully received. Thanks.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Thursday 21 May 15 11:39 BST (UK): Hi Tony,
Firstly well done on finding the death of Ann Haggart in 1852
I wouldn’t read too much into the spelling of her name.
It depended on what the official who was writing the documents thought the name should be.

Greyfriars cemetery is roughly rectangular.
The main body of the cemetery is divided up into 6 blocks.
A-B
C-D
E-F
And the wall surrounding the cemetery is designated block G.

I went to Perth Library and checked out the pre-1855 MI’s of Perthshire
Block G- By Peter Haggart & Aunt Jane Campbell (mother Grace Stewart 24.7.1841 82).
I wrote that in a previous post.
The book was written in the 1970’s and has a rough map of Greyfriars.
There are wee squares indicating the headstones that are in the book.
But as I wrote earlier the cemetery had an upgrade in the early 21st century and lots of the headstones are now missing (my opinion).
I have a booklet on Greyfriars written in 1988 which gives a map of the graveyard.
Again there are wee squares indicating headstones but only 30 of them are numbered indicating noteworthy stones.

I found these in the censuses.
1841 census: Bridgend, Kinnoull, Perthshire, Scotland
Ann   Haggart   Female   60   1781   Perthshire, Scotland
Grace   Campble   Female   80   1761   Perthshire, Scotland
Jean   Haggart   Female   7   1834   Perthshire, Scotland

1851 census: Kinnoull, Village of Bridgend, Perthshire, Scotland
Ann   Haggart    Widow   71   1780   Mangler   Perthshire, Scotland
Jean   Haggart   Grand Daughter Unmarried 17   1834   Perth, Perthshire

This must be the family indicated in the headstone
Block G- By Peter Haggart & Aunt Jane Campbell (mother Grace Stewart 24.7.1841 82).
This stone is against the wall of the cemetery.

I will have to go back to the library and see where the stone in block G is and I will then go to Greyfriars and see if I can find it.
If I do I will take a pic.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Friday 29 May 15 13:46 BST (UK): Hi Tony,
I went to Perth library and had another look at the Pre-1855 Monumental Inscriptions for Perthshire.
This was written by a couple of the name Mitchell in 1974.
They are the ones who divided the cemetery into 6 blocks with the 7th Block G being the wall surrounding the cemetery.
By reading their instructions I was able to ascertain where the headstone that Peter Haggart bought should be.
It was number 178 and was on or near the west wall.
The next number 179 was on or near the south wall, much defaced.
I think it is safe to assume that stone 178 was on or near the west wall close to the south wall.
Also in the Library is a book written by a guy called William Sievwright in 1893 titled
Greyfriars Burying-Ground: Epitaphs and Inscriptions
He also wrote a supplement in 1895.
It was in that book that I found these:
Peter Haggart
Placed by Peter Haggart and his Aunt Jane Campbell In memory of her mother Grace Stewart,
who died 24th July, 1841 aged 82 years.

Robert Haggart
Placed by Robert Haggart in memory of his spouse Helen Garvie, who died 13th April, 1834, aged 55 years.
Also George Haggart his son, died 6th March, 1846, aged 35 years. Revised Mary Kemp.

This is the south-west corner of Greyfriars.
As you can see there are almost no tombstones here.
By my reckoning Peter Haggart's stone should be on the ground between the south wall and the large stone attached to the west wall.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_2958.jpg)

The two slabs at the south wall are completely covered with moss.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_2959.jpg)

The grassy border between the wall and pathway had numerous headstones in years gone by.
It is my belief that headstones were removed so that it would be easier to cut the grass.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_2961.jpg)
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: zigitup on Sunday 31 May 15 18:24 BST (UK): Hello Buckhind, once again thank you very much for all your effort and research its been very much appreciated. Its nice to know where they rest so when we do visit we now know where to go.

We'd like to acknowledge all your hard work. Is there a charity you support or a link to a justgiving page you can post here so I can make a donation?

Thanks

Tony
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 31 May 15 21:31 BST (UK): Tony,
Many thanks for the kind words.
I'm just an auld guy, living in Perth and delighted to help a fellow genealogist whenever I can.
I'm no intae charities or whatever so keep your money or give some tae a charity of your choice. :D
Willie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Monday 01 June 15 09:28 BST (UK): Hi Tony,
This is the last bit of information re the Haggart family that I have.
It is Peter & Ann Haggart's son Peter throughout the censuses.

1841 census: Bridgend, Kinnoull, Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Male   28   1813   Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   Haggart   Female   25   1816   Perthshire, Scotland
Ann   Haggart   Female   5   1836   Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Male   1   1840   Perthshire, Scotland

1851 census: Commercial Street, Kinnoull, Bridge End, Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Head   39 1812   Shoemaker Journeyman Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   Haggart   Wife   37 1814   Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Ann   Haggart   Daughter   15 1836 Servant Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Catherine   Haggart   Daughter   10   1841   Scholar   Perthshire, Scotland
Margaret   Haggart   Daughter   8   1843   Scholar   Perthshire, Scotland
Agnes   Haggart   Daughter   1   1850      Perthshire, Scotland

1861 census: Commercial Street, Kinnoull, Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Head 48 1813 Shoemaker Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   Haggart   Wife     45   1816    Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Ann   Haggart   Daughter Unmarried 24   1837 Needle Woman Perthshire, Scotland
Agnes   Haggart   Daughter 9   1852    Scholar Perthshire, Scotland
Henry   Haggart   Son   6   1855   Scholar Perthshire, Scotland

1871 census: 53, Commercial Street, Kinnoull, Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Head Married 61 1810 Shoemaker Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   Haggart   Wife Married 53 1818     Perthshire, Scotland
Agnes   Haggart   Daughter Unmarried 21   1850 Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   Haggart   Daughter     5   1866 Perthshire, Scotland
James   Haggart   Grand Child     3   1868 Perthshire, Scotland

1881 census: 51, Commercial Street, Kinnoul, Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Ann McEwen   Head Married   45 1836 Laundress Perth, Perthshire, Scotland
Isabella   McEwen   Daughter 14 1867 Dyers Assistant Perthshire, Scotland
James   McEwen   Son   12   1869   Scholar Perthshire, Scotland
Peter   Haggart   Father Widower 70 1811   Unemployed Perthshire, Scotland

This is his death certificate from SP
1881 HAGGART PETER M 71 PERTH /PERTH
.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: zigitup on Monday 01 June 15 19:57 BST (UK): Hi Willie, looks like Commercial Street is my ancestral home then! Just looked it up on Street Map and its right next to the bridge overlooking the river. Looks nice.

Magic. All the best Willie. I'm gonna stop thanking you now, its getting embarrassing! ha ha

Tony
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Tuesday 02 June 15 13:46 BST (UK): Quote from: zigitup on Monday 01 June 15 19:57 BST (UK)
Hi Willie, looks like Commercial Street is my ancestral home then! Just looked it up on Street Map and its right next to the bridge overlooking the river. Looks nice.
Magic. All the best Willie. I'm gonna stop thanking you now, its getting embarrassing! ha ha
Tony

Hi Tony,
I‘m afraid that Commercial Street is like Peter Haggart’s tombstone – it’s long gone.
Commercial Street was demolished in the 1970’s and new houses were built.
I took this photo today and the first group of buildings is called Cross Keys Court.
It was a former Inn built about 1800.
But as you can see the rest of the street is of modern homes.
I have tried to find an older photo of Commercial Street but have been unsuccessful.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/commercial.jpg)

(taken from a book)
COMMERCIAL STREET in Bridgend underwent a major redevelopment in 1975/8 resulting in the demolition and replacement of many buildings associated with the area’s ferry, shipping, and import businesses such as its icehouses and quays.
In the 19th century, Commercial Street maintained a shipbuilding industry.

Bridgend, Gannochy & Kinnoull Community Council
http://bgk.org.uk/history.html
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Cagger on Tuesday 22 September 15 11:56 BST (UK): Hello Buckhind

I note with interest that you have photographed a number of tombstones in the Kinnoull churchyard.

Have you seen / photographed one for William Mercer w. Elizabeth Swan and their children. In records I have located here I Australia it is headstone #43 in the churchyard. My interest is the reference on it to "widow Barbara Forres" and the questions - is this what it says and could the Forres be Forbes?

Any insight appreciated.

Regards
Cagger
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Tuesday 22 September 15 19:18 BST (UK): Hi Cagger,
I took this photograph of Kinnoull Graveyard 15 years ago.
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/latest/g19a.jpg)

I went to Perth Library and according to the book Pre-1855 Monumental Inscriptions of North Perthshire (1974), the white tablet nearest to Kinnoull Aisle is headstone *43.
This is what the book says:
43* Wm Mercer of Deuglies, w Eliz Swan, chn Margt, Hannah, Col Jas commanding HM 22nd Regt of Foot, Thom of Burnbrae & Wm HEICS (wid Barbara Forres)

Note: HEICS is Honorable East India Company’s Service.

The IGI show these two marriages
Name   William Mercer
Spouse's Name   Barbara Drummond Forbes
Event Date   09 Nov 1788
Event Place   India Office Ecclesiastical Returns-Bengal Presidency, Misc, India

Name: William Mercer
Spouse: Barbara Forbes
Marriage: 6 November 1788, Corse, Aberdeen, Scotland

This is his birth
Name   William Mercer
Birth:   08 Jan 1755, PERTH, SCOTLAND
Father:   William Mercer
Mother:   Elizabeth Swan

And this is his parents info according to a contributed IGI:
Name: William Mercer
Birth: 1 October 1717, Pittenchar, and Potterhill, Perth, Scot.
Death: 16 January 1782
Spouse: Elizabeth Swan
Marriage: 1 November 1746, Pittenchar and Potterhill, Perth, Scot.

Note: Potterhill is an area behind the graveyard, on the slope of Kinnoull Hill.

I think it is very possible that Forres is a misprint.
I will go to the graveyard and see what the headstone says.
Bear in mind that it will probably be illegible.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Cagger on Tuesday 22 September 15 23:20 BST (UK): Wow, that was quick.

It's definitely who I am looking for as all of that additional information ties in. Just no date of death at this point in time but I will keep searching.

A photo of the headstone would be greatly appreciated, whatever state it is in.

I really appreciate the assistance.

Regards
Cagger
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Tuesday 22 September 15 23:32 BST (UK): Quote from: zigitup on Monday 01 June 15 19:57 BST (UK)
Hi Willie, looks like Commercial Street is my ancestral home then! Just looked it up on Street Map and its right next to the bridge overlooking the river. Looks nice.

Magic. All the best Willie. I'm gonna stop thanking you now, its getting embarrassing! ha ha

Tony

Hi Tony,

My father used to live in Commercial St, Bridgend & did "buying & selling" furniture etc. (a sideline) many moons ago from his wee flat before he married & had his family.

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Tuesday 22 September 15 23:47 BST (UK): Cagger,

Have you seen this.......

http://www.mercermillions.info/mercers-of-perth/generation-12/12-william-mercer/

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Tuesday 22 September 15 23:53 BST (UK): Plenty to read on the Mercers......

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01g6p/

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Cagger on Wednesday 23 September 15 02:32 BST (UK): Thanks Annie

Yes I am aware of the Mercermillions website and have been in contact with them a number of times.

My interest here is in the wife of William Mercer (Captain in HEICS) killed in a duel in India in 1801. Her name was Barbara Drummond Forbes (Mercer). There's very little around but I am gathering more each day.

Thanks for the input.

Regards
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Wednesday 23 September 15 21:58 BST (UK): This is the photograph I took 15 years ago....
The Mercer tablet is the one nearest the building...
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/g19a.jpg)

...and these are the ones I took today
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_3020.jpg)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_3023.jpg)

As you can see there is a large bush/tree covering the tablets.
The good news is that I managed to photograph the faded inscription.
I had to darken it in photoshop but it definitely says Barbara FORBES
(just above the orange stain).
(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/DSC_3019.jpg)

I will go back and try and prune the tree and attempt a decent photo.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Cagger on Wednesday 23 September 15 23:29 BST (UK): Buckhind - you are a star!

Looks like that is her and a decent photo would be fantastic. That's part of the mystery solved. Given that she's buried there any ideas on where I search to find when?

Thanks and regards
Cagger
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Friday 25 September 15 09:31 BST (UK): Hi Cagger,
I took some close-ups of the headstone in the hope of reading the inscription.
It clearly starts:
Sacred
to the memory of
William Mercer ESQ.
of Deuglies
and
Elizabeth Swan

But that is as far as I can decipher.
At the bottom of the stone it says:
Barbara Forbes
HEICS William Mercer
Then there is another line which I cannae read.
Perhaps you can read it better.

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m01.jpg)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m02.jpg)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m03.jpg)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m04.jpg)
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Friday 25 September 15 09:38 BST (UK): I’m no a lumberjack or a gardener so I only had a wee hacksaw to cut down the tree covering the headstone.
I managed to hack away several branches.
Then the rains came.
These photos are the best I could do.

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m05.jpg)

(http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x441/5jdewar/rootschat/m06.jpg)
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Friday 25 September 15 11:59 BST (UK): Quote from: Cagger on Wednesday 23 September 15 23:29 BST (UK)
Buckhind - you are a star!

Looks like that is her and a decent photo would be fantastic. That's part of the mystery solved. Given that she's buried there any ideas on where I search to find when?

Thanks and regards
Cagger

The normal place to look is the Monumental Inscriptions but we have already looked there.
I checked out the Perth Directory but mine only goes back to 1837.
I tried the newspapers of the day but only found four cuttings regarding the family.
1786: The Estate of William Mercer, late of Potterhill.
1809: marriage of Eliza Forbes Mercer to Richard Charles Blunt.
1823: Description of Potterhill (it was for sale).
1841: Death of Graeme Mercer, brother of Willie the HEICS.

Bingo!!!
I just remembered to check the wills & testaments in Scotlandspeople.
I found her
FORBES BARBARA 22/05/1812 MRS, WIDOW OF CAPT. WILLIAM MERCER; D. AT PERTH INVENTORY ST ANDREWS COMMISSARY COURT
It costs 10 credits to view the will (4 pages).

The will is dated 22/05/1812 so obviously she died previous to that.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Friday 25 September 15 12:07 BST (UK): I have zipped up the two images I took of the headstone.
They are roughly 7x10 @300dpi which can be printed out.
I have also added the four newspaper cuttings to the zip file.
If you pm me your email address I’ll send the file to you.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Saturday 16 November 19 02:23 GMT (UK): buckhyne, what a wealth of generous information you are!

If you are easily able, would it be possible for you to help me with an enquiry? Years ago I saw a report from the early book of cemetery records. I'm guessing that they might be among those whose tombstones are no longer extant or at least legible. The report I saw years ago, but can't now find, spoke of multiple sides of the upright tombstone having different names and generations.

My people were Sligo, (but not Irish).

I have the following detail for my great-great-great-grandfather, Alexander Sligo, who died 25 Feb 1827:
Greyfriars Cemetery, Perth, Block D Plot 158
He was a Hostler to Mr Christie? Vintner at George Inn, Perth in about 1805.

His wife Janet (Meek) was buried in the same plot on 13 Jan 1842 having died on the 10th.

Their son Archibald (a shoemaker who lived and worked in High St) (d.1876) outlived both of his wives (Grace Skellie d. 1847 and Mary Gollan d. 1867) and they are all listed as having been buried in Greyfriars. If I remember correctly from my earlier reading, they might have been in the same plot, or at least Grace and Archibald.

When my parents married 60 years ago, they honeymooned in Scotland. My Mum's Dad wanted her to go to Greyfriars to find the graves of his grandparents. Funnily enough, my Mum declined. My Grandfather died in 1965, and he'd already taken his paternal line back into the 1700s. With all the computing power now available, I've only been able to take his line maybe one generation further back, and I'm not even sure about that, because it seems that at least one of the Sligos had an alias of Forbes. Or maybe it was the other way round.

At some point I will travel from Australia and would love to have a more specific idea of where my ancestors are. buckhyne, are you able to help me out here?

Thank you so much, Alison
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 17 November 19 11:38 GMT (UK): Hi Alison,
There are three cemeteries in Perth – Greyfriars, Kinnoull & Wellshill.
Only Wellshill is still in use.
According to the book pre-1855 MI’s for Greyfriars there is only one headstone for the Sligo name.
It is the one you have info for.
There is one headstone for the Gollan name, perhaps a relative.
There are no headstones in Kinnoull for any of the names but there is one in Wellshill.
Again perhaps a relative.
Archibald Sligo is in the Perth Directory from the first one I have for 1837 up until the 1874 directory. The next one I have is 1878 after his death.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 17 November 19 12:09 GMT (UK): Here are Sligo marriages and births from 1800-54 in Perth
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 17 November 19 13:02 GMT (UK): and here is Sligo in the 1841 census for Perth
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 17 November 19 13:55 GMT (UK): The only Sligo in Perth in the 1851 census
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Sunday 17 November 19 18:02 GMT (UK): Wills on SP

Sligo Janet 18/1/1842 alias Meek, residing in Perth, widow of Alexander Sligo residing in Perth
Perth Sheriff Court SC49/31/33

"Notable visitors have included Empress Eugenie and Queen Victoria, who made The Royal George Hotel her place of residence when she visited Perth in 1848. She was so impressed with its hospitality that The George Inn was renamed The Royal George Hotel in her honour, and both the Royal Warrant and two lamps, fashioned from the bed the monarch slept in, are still in the hotel today!"

https://theroyalgeorgehotel.co.uk/

Could only find this close to 1805;

Thomas Wakefield, vintner, George Inn, Perth 10 April 1800

http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/welcome.aspx

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: buckhyne on Sunday 17 November 19 18:57 GMT (UK): Well spotted Annie.
I forgot about the wills.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Tuesday 19 November 19 12:30 GMT (UK): You're all incredible! Thank you! Yes, that page is the description I saw so many years ago. So pleased to see it again. I do remember wondering years ago who the 'Gollen' was, but that was before I knew he'd had a second wife. I've seen some of that information before, and some is new. I'll love sifting through it all. Thank you all again. :)
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Tuesday 19 November 19 15:41 GMT (UK): Thank you. Colin Gollan and Mary Waddle are Mary Gollan's parents. :-D
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Tuesday 19 November 19 20:55 GMT (UK): Quote from: AlisonAus on Tuesday 19 November 19 15:41 GMT (UK)
Thank you. Colin Gollan and Mary Waddle are Mary Gollan's parents. :-D

Reading further, Mary Waddle who died 20 Jan 1848 aged 72 her parents were James Waddle & Catherine Banks.

I didn't find Marys' baptism but there are siblings on SP (Perth);

Catherine 1776
James 1779
Elisabeth 1780
Ann 1782

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Sunday 05 January 20 23:39 GMT (UK): Such brilliant information; thank you so much! My sister aims to be visiting Perth in the next few weeks so I'm gathering as much information as I can for her.
Can you find any reference to Crichton (or Crighton)? The mother was a Sligo (daughter of Archibald and Grace) and her three young sons died within weeks of each other in 1874 and then her husband in the early part of 1875, leaving her with just a baby daughter. My grandfather, her nephew, was sent to live with her when his mother died. I wonder if I can find out where they were buried.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Sunday 05 January 20 23:40 GMT (UK): Oops, I've just reread the title of this thread and realise that it's pre-1855, so don't worry about it.
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: Rosinish on Monday 06 January 20 00:15 GMT (UK): Do you have names of the deceased?

If they died in Perth City they will most likely be buried at Wellshill Cemetery.

Do you have the address or area they lived/died?

Annie
Title: Re: Pre-1855 Deaths in Perth
Post by: AlisonAus on Friday 09 May 25 15:57 BST (UK): Thank you so much for this information on my Sligo relatives in Greyfriars burial ground. 👏

In the Summer of 1959 while my parents were honeymooning in Scotland, my Grandfather asked Mum to take a side trip to Perth to find this grave. Funnily enough, she said ‘no’. 😆
65 years later, I’m now in Perth for the first time, and I found them. 👍 Grandfather would be very pleased indeed!

For others who might be looking and stumble across this post in future years, it is closest to the entrance off Tay St. if you enter off the main entrance, walk left and follow the path around to the right until you just about reach the other entrance. It will be on your right, two rows in, lying flat on the ground. There is no upright section to this grave marker. It is behind one that has, at this stage, a very clear 1840 at the top of its headstone.
Thank you again for your help! It was invaluable.

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