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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Fife => Topic started by: dandylion on Tuesday 04 January 11 17:07 GMT (UK)
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I have been trying to trace my 3xGG David Fairfoul who married Mary Mcdiarmid in Newburgh on the 2nd of April 1846. I can find no suitable births for him at scotlands people site or a death for him. On the census of 1851 Mary is a seamans wife, so I am assuming as he isn't on with the family he is at sea. By the 1871 she is a widow. Peter thier last child was born in 1856, so he must have died somwhere between his conception and the 1871 census. I cannot find any death for him at all and wondered if he were lost at sea would he have a death cert ? Also would such a death make the local papers if there were such things. Would there be an enquiery or would it just be forgotten? Any helpful ideas or info would be great. Dandylion. :)
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Hi dandylion,
Yes there were papers around since about 1780/90 i think the first paper was the Chronicle? someone tell me if I am wrong. Also there is a possibility that there would be an inquest if it was reported.
If it wasnt, then nowt to be done. Have you tried changing the boxes from exact to variations of the name, using the wildcards on SP. I would do the death one first, then you could see if he was born in Scotland or came from Ireland as it would list this fact and maybe the names of his parents along with his spouse.
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Hi Dandylion
Have you checked the original image of the 1861 census to see what marital status shows for wife of Mary? From 1861 - family indexed as Fairpll on the transcript I am looking at:
Mary 40, Winder Of Linen Yarn
Margaret 8
Peter Fairpll 4
Address: High St, Newburg
You could also check whether father still shows as alive on Peter's birth cert (22 OCT 1856 Newburgh).
By the sounds of it though, you have already searched for his death and not been able to find it on SP. A death at sea can be so difficult to trace. If you do find a newspaper mention, it won't give you what you need which is likely to be confirmation of his parents' names and birth details :-\
Monica
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Hi Marcie, Yes I have used varient spellings and all the different options SP has. Without his birth or death I can't definitly tie him to the earlier Fairfouls in the area. Mary was a local girl but as David isn't on the census I can't even get an idea as to where he was born or his age. I have the 1861 census and it states w in the box for status so he must be dead by then. Peter's birth cert doesn't have father dead on it so he was there at the time, so this cuts the time period down to between 22nd october 1856 to the end of march 1861(asuming the scotish census was taken at the same time as in England). Do you know where there would be info on inquests held in scotland? Dandylion.
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I am fairly sure that Scotland doesn't have inquests. Sudden deaths are reported to the Procurator Fiscal, and in some cases nowadays a Sheriff can order a fatal accident enquiry.
I suspect that an accidental death at sea in Scottish waters in the 1850s may not have merited any sort of enquiry at all. But I could be wrong.There ought to have been a death cert though if it was after 1855.
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Dandylion, Elwyn
I have seen a death around that time before and it was registered, then an RCE raised after what must have been an inquest or whatever, with the reason of death on it.
Have you tried just putting in the wife to be's name. I have done this before and I have been lucky the marriage cert has come up anyway.
Have you had a look at what Monica has said. She is usually very good, knows her stuff.
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From www.scan.org.uk:
Do records of coroners’ inquests survive in Scotland?
The Scottish system of investigating sudden deaths differs from the system of coroner's inquests in England and Wales. Sudden deaths in Scotland are investigated by procurators fiscal (local state-funded prosecutors). The findings of investigations by the local procurator fiscal are recorded in the Register of Corrected Entries maintained by the General Register Office for Scotland (GROS), but few other records of the Procurator Fiscal service are deposited in Scottish archives. The National Archives of Scotland hold records of Fatal Accident Inquiries (FAI) held by sheriff courts (since 1895). There are fewer sources for fatal accidents before 1895. For more information about these, and for further details about Fatal Accident Enquiries, sheriff court records and the records of procurators fiscal go to the National Archives of Scotland website.
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Hi Dandylion,
I don't know if this will help you, but I too was searching for an ancestor, living in Newburgh around this time, who disappeared. My search is here on rootschat:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,444235.0.html
Long story short: I discovered that my 4xgt (changed from 3) grandfather perished in a boat made in Newburgh, with a crew from the town, in a storm off Sweden in 1860. Its loss was reported in the Glasgow Herald on Friday, November 16, 1860:
"Scotland - Loss of a Newburgh Schooner. - Intelligence has been received in Newburgh of the loss of the schooner Lady of Mugdrum, belonging to that port. She sailed from Elsinore on the 18th of October, laden with wheat, on her voyage from St. Petersburg to London. On the 22d of the same month she was discovered on the Swedish coast a total wreck. It is feared that the captain and the crew - most of whom belong to Newburgh - have been lost. The schooner was comparatively new."
James Whittet, my ancestor, was the Ship's Captain. It may be a very long, long shot, but perhaps your ancestor may have been on this voyage, too.
Best wishes, Jimmijam
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I have been trying to trace my 3xGG David Fairfoul who married Mary Mcdiarmid in Newburgh on the 2nd of April 1846. I can find no suitable births for him at scotlands people site or a death for him.
Hi Dandyloin don't about David but I'm sure this must be his son
Peter FAIRFOUL in Newburgh Cemetery, maybe of some intrest
221 Erected by Peter FAIRFOUL in memory of
his wife Winifred CRAWFORD died 16.6.1907 age 50
also their infant son James
the above Peter FAIRFOUL died 4.3.1915 age 59
daughter Lizzie died 26.11.1916 age 22
also son Willie died 3.1.1917 age 28
also son Crawford killed in France 24.10.1918 age 20
NorrieG
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Hi dandylion,
I lost relatives who were fishing in 1883, fisherman nearby saw the ship flounder in the rough seas and no bodies were found. This fact was marked on all the crews death certificates and 2 months later there was an RCE added on each crewmans death certificate.
The drowning was reported in the press, I have an article printed in the Scotsman at that time.
Tom
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Many thanks Jimmijam for this info, it's good to know I am not alone in trying to find lost rellies. I have looked at your other posts and I will keep looking for more on the Lady of Mugdrum and if David could have been a crew member
Norrie G, Thank you for the picture of the grave, it has filled in a few more details of the family, including young James who I didn't know about at all, so I will have to find his death cert.
Dandylion
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I do quite a bit of indexing of certificates for Peterhead, Aberdeenshire, also a fishing village.
Deaths at sea are normally recorded at the first Port the vessels docks at after the incident, which may not always be the home Port.
From what I've noticed, deaths on fishing vessels from home ports, the family are normally the informants and details are known. For others this obviously depends on the informant and have seen examples of only the name given, no age and unknown parents.
Another example of three deaths recorded at the same time: Peterhead (232) 1877 Deaths Page 86.
No.106, Malcolm Campbell, 1868 August Twenty Fifth at Sea off Buchanness Parish of Peterhead, male, age 22 years, parents not given, cause: Drowning Body not recovered.
No.107, no name given, 1868 (found) September Twentieth at Sandford Bay Parish of Peterhead, male, age ?, parents blank, cause: Unknown
No.108, no name given, 1875 (found) December Third On sea beach opposite Love Lane Peterhead, male, age ?, parents: blank, cause: Drowning - supposed to have been lost in some shipwreck.
Therefore you really need to look for any mention of a fishing accident in the local newspaper to narrow down any date for a possible search and even then example No.107 & 108 show that you may have no way of proving it is your relative.
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Norrie,
Which burial ground was it that you found the stone in the picture, might help to know. Is there only the one in Newburgh?
marcie
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Hi Marcia yes its Newburgh Cemetery,
as for as I know this is the only Cemetery
and that was the only FAIRFOUL in my index
of 16000.
Norrie