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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: Happy Chappy :-) on Saturday 25 December 10 16:28 GMT (UK)
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Happy Christmas Friends ;
Can anyone help me : is there anyone out there that had Grand parents
or relations in the Irish Citizen Army or the Irish Volunteers -
That trained in Marino/Fairview/Clontarf or surrounding area's
I am compiling local history and putting out into the public domain for the benefit of local records, some times with the efflux of time information, folklore becomes lost,
I am looking any info, folklore, facts, documents or photographs on the above
may be you recall you grand father talking about ICA training at Croydon Park
House in Marino/Fairview.
I am just an amateur historian, probably not very good one, but I hope I might
inspire more people to do something, keep their memories alive.
May be there is one out there with a pile of documents photo's just sitting in a
drawer ?
If you have an grand parent in the ICA/IV pls drop us a line a tell us about them !!
Kind Regards
CPH
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The only place I have heard of my Family training. was in the Dublin Mountains as my family where in the 4th batt area.Have you tried Kilmainham jail or Military archives they might have some pictures ?
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By coincidence I recently located a book titled 'History of the Irish Citizen Army', by R.M. Fox, published 1943. I've only just started reading this, and Croydon park is mentioned on the third page after an introduction to the events of 1913... extract of this below :
"...In response to the call, hundreds of men joined up to be formed in companies and drilled by Capt. White at Croydon Park, the grounds belonging to the union. Clutching their broomsticks or their hurleys, they marched to protect their demonstrations and their band instruments from police attack in the city.
Very slowly arms were secured and at Croydon park they began their rifle practice. Marching out from Liberty Hall on parade, or on a night route march they became a familiar spectacle in the Dublin streets. Connolly chalked on a board at Liberty Hall the simple directions for these route marches...."
I'll keep an eye out for further names or details relating to Croyden park...
Shane
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Hi Gary ;
Thanks for your response and advice, I been searching
on a local level, but will take your advice and try the
Military Archives+Kilmainham.
Was not aware that the ICA trained in the Dublin Mountains
Cheers
CPH
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Hi Shane :
Thanks for the reply, where did ya get the book ? library ?
Thanks for the update - does the book contain any photo's ?
Some notable figures in the Citizen Army
Mick Mallin
Sean Connolly
Frank Robbins
One of my old neighbours uncle was Sean Connolly
he was the first guy shot in the rebellion at the castle.
There is another excellent book called "under the starry
plough" by Frank Robbins, he lived in Marino until his death
around 1979.
I am trying to catpure all the local history and am presently
putting it up on you tube in video format.
Keep in touch
CPH
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Hi Croydon Park House, sorry to mislead you my Family connections are with the Volunteers / IRA,My Dads Father was a member so was my Great Uncle & his brother (My other granfather I know did train, so must have been sworn in).
Gary
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Hi Shane :
Thanks for the reply, where did ya get the book ? library ?
Thanks for the update - does the book contain any photo's ?
....
I acquired the book at an auction... there's just one photo - captioned 'Citizen Army Parade before Liberty Hall'. Nearly all in uniform and with what look like rifles.
There are also some details at the back which might be of general interest. These include Citizen Army members present at various locations during Easter week, and some names with ICA service during the war of Independence. I might try to transcribe these lists at some point as they are not that long..
Shane
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Hi Gary
Thanks for the feedback, the volunteers also trained in Marino
at the back of father Mathews Park, (behind Fairview Park)
Again many thanks for your feedback ;
Kind Regards
CPH
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Hi Shane
Thanks for the reply, the book sounds like a great find ;
I have not heard of it; I am trying to catalouge data on the
area of Marino and it's surrounding areas, especially for
the 1916 period. As Marino was a hallowed ground in the
context of the rising ;
Thanks again afor the feedback and transcriptions todate
Kind Regards,
Steve
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Hi i am new to this. My great grandfather was in the irish citizen's army and was in the GPO at easter 1916. His name was daniel courtney. he was arrested at the surrender and was interned in frongoch, north wales. i have seen a phpto of the volunteers, taken in 1916 and another one , taken after the civil war. He died in 1943 and was given a military funeral. He is buried in Glasnevin. His son, Bernard (barney), also fought in the easter uprising and was at the collrge of surgeons. he was about 16 or 17 and escaped. does anyone out there have any idea as to where I can get copies of any photographs of the men who took part in the uprising?
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Hi Chris ;
Welcome on board. Chris there is not to many OFFICAL photographs of the ICA
(Irish Citizen Army).
Two most famous one of the ICA as a group
1. Croydon Park House (Marino) 1914
2. Liberty Hall Circa 1914
There is also a famous photobgraph of the people who fought in the GPO
it was most likely the 20yr annversary 1936 taking in CROKE PARK - this
is a good clear photo of about 200 people.
There is couple of photo's of three ICA guys on top of Liberty Hall
but not much use to you.
What was your grandfathers address ?
Check out Rootschat Room
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=291195.0
Keep in touch and lets know how you get on, if I come across
anything I be in touch.
Cheers
CPH
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thanks for the information. daniel Courtney's address was 43 Bessboro' Ave. His son Bernard's address is given as Saville place.
The photograph taken in Croke park in 1936 sounds promising. Any ideas as to where I can view it or obtain a copy. That would be amazing!
Thanks
chris :)
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Hi Chris :
I think the the Irish Times produce a copy of the photo ; there may be
a copy hanging up in the GPO ?
My buddy in the US has a scanned copy of this photo -but reluctant to give
us a copy. My Grandfather lived Seville Place also 108 - how's that our grandfather
probably knew each other.
There is also a picture of the old IRA outside the Casino some one issued
to this site;
I check with a few friends see can I dig up any info on the croker,
I make a note of your Grandfather and see I can dig up something.
Cheers
CPH
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I had a great uncle in the GPO as well, and had heard about this photo hanging in the GPO, so I went in yesterday and it's gone !!! Can't understand why they didn't put it in the little museum in there. Apparently it was hanging on the very wall that now has the museum signage on. Very nice man I was speaking to in there gave me an e mail address to enquire about it's whereabouts. He believes it is in storage somewhere.
NL have a little version on their website
http://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000238759
and I also found this amazing Pathé film of the Croke park reunion here
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/survivors-of-the-1916-up-rising
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Hi, My Grandfather is also in this photograph. There is a copy of it in the International Bar on Wicklow Street in Dublin. I also saw a copy of it hanging in a hotel in Glendalough (Lynams I think), but that was years ago, so not sure if it is still there. Hope that helps :)
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Hi,
I've just come across this did you ever get anywhere? Daniel Courtney fought at Annesley Bridge, GPO, Imperial Hotel, Mansfield's, and then back to the GPO. His son Bernard was actually based in Jacob's Factory under Thomas McDonagh.
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Hi Chris, my name is Alan Douglas. Dan Courtney was my Great Grand-Father also. His youngest daughter Julia married Christy Douglas.
If you search under "Daniel Courtney - Grandfather of the Irish Citizen Army" you'll find a wonderful article written by historian Hugo McGuinness.
Kind Rgds,
Alan.
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Alan have you searched in the bureau of military history witness statements for info on your grandad, ? it can be a great source of information for anyone with family links regarding 1916 and War of Independence..I have found that it can also fill in and confirm missing family info.
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Have you seen the two files available online for Daniel Courtney's war pension applications??
http://mspcsearch.militaryarchives.ie/docs/files//PDF_Pensions/R1/MSP34REF811DanielCourtney/W34E182DanielCourtney.pdf
http://mspcsearch.militaryarchives.ie/docs/files//PDF_Pensions/R1/MSP34REF811DanielCourtney/WMSP34REF811DanielCourtney.pdf
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Hi Chris,
Alan Douglas here again.
Charlie Douglas (Sadly deceased 24/02/14) was my Father. I believe the connection between us is Dan and Grace who used to come over to Ireland to visit May Hynes (Nee Rogers)
Kind Rgds Again,
Alan.
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To Brian and Grizzly1,
Much obliged.
Tks,
Alan.
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Hi Alan
I can't believe this.
It is sometime since I have been on this site. Just looked on it tonight and saw your message. Am so very very sorry about your dad. We came to his wedding in 1954(?). My husband and I saw your mum and dad Easter2008 when we were in Ireland. I phoned In 2009 to ask if we could call to see when we were over but your mum said he wasn't well and I got the impression she would find it hard if. we visited. I have written at Christmas but heard nothing. Your Mum and Dad were our last contacts with dad's family. Dad was so fond of your grandma (our Aunt Julia)and your dad. I can remember her coming over to Leeds to stay with us many times. Also your mum and dad brought David( who I know sadly died) and Helen when they were small. Your Mum and Dad came to Leeds in July 1989 to Mum and Dad's Golden Wedding celebrations and we have a lovely photo of your Dad singing. Dad died in March 1989 and mum in 1994.
We Come to Ireland most years, at Easter, for a couple of weeks in our caravan and always stay near Dublin to enable us to go to the Remembrance Ceremony at the GPO.
I would love to hear how the rest of the Douglas family are. I know Martha died some years ago. Is Danny still alive. I think your mum said he lived in Monaghan.
Dad did not talk about his childhood - either his first few years in Dublin or when he came to England with his parents. It's so sad but we always felt his childhood was not particularly happy. His parents separated when he was very young and none of us know anything about Grandad Collins. There are so many things I would have liked to know and asked Dad.
I do hope you still go on this site. If so it would be great to hear from you.
My fingers are crossed!!
Chris
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Hi Chris,
Sorry for the long delay in replying.
Delighted to get a response to my post as I wasn't sure if you got it.
Dad suffered from Dementia for quite a number of years and just did not recognise most people, including Helen and me for most of the time, hence Mam's reluctance to have any visitors as he found it upsetting. She hopes you understand.
Each morning he woke up in a different stage of his life. For example he could wake up one day thinking he was a young lad living at home with his mother and not understanding who Mam was and what she was doing in his house. Another day he would think he was a young married man with small children (David and Helen) and did not understand who I was.
In September 2013 we had to make the heart-breaking decision to place Dad in a nursing home as his condition was getting worse. We weren't allowed to visit for the first two weeks but when we finally got to see him he recognised us all. I can't describe that feeling. Mam got to visit him every Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday with either Helen or myself. Sadly though, Dad only lasted five months and passed away on February 24th, 2014 with Helen and myself at his side. He wasn't in great form on the 23rd and Helen and myself, unknown to one another, decided to visit on the 24th arriving within minutes of each other. He passed very peacefully at 5 O'clock.
Martha died in 1989 and Danny is still alive. His wife Margaret died 3 years ago and he spends most of the year in Lanzarote (a real sun worshipper). Presently, though, he is not in great health and is back home staying with his eldest son Damien.
Bernard died a good few years ago in Australia and we don't know anything about whatever happened to Christy.
Dad always talked about Dan Courtney but never had any details about his "1916" activities. Given that the Centenary of the rising was coming up, I searched online for anything I cold find about him and came across details of his military pension and some other small bits and pieces. Then one day I came across an article written by historian Hugo McGuinness entitled "Daniel Courtney - Grandfather of the Irish Citizen Army". Looking at the photo of him in the article you would swear you were looking at Danny, they are so alike.
If you haven't had a chance yet, search this on the web for an amazing insight into his life.
I'll sign off now and hope to hear from you soon.
Alan.
XXX
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Hi Alan
Many thanks for your reply on 18th February. Great to hear from you and hear about the family.
I sent you a personal message and am hoping that you received it.
Looking forward to hearing from you.
Christine
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Hi Christine,
I sent a couple of e-mails from my private account. I hope you got them.
Alan.
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Hi The photo out side the Casino are F Coy 2nd Battalion Dublin Brigade