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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: jaybelnz on Saturday 18 December 10 23:38 GMT (UK)

Title: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Saturday 18 December 10 23:38 GMT (UK): :) Hi, I'm Jeanne (Mathews) Bell, from NZ. I am winding my way through Mathews familky postings. I'm researching my Mathews family, which is my paternal direct line of descent. I've been stuck in Ireland for quite some time, a marriage 1845, with Henry Maxwell Mathews, Gentleman. of Dublin named as the father of John Gibbons Mathews, a Sergeant of Lancers.

So that makes Henry Maxwell Mathews Esq. my 4xgreat grandfather. I also have more children for him. I will post more about my Mathews later, when I have a more specific enquiry, but probably many more than one!! LOL - But right now I have to go to a christening - no, not another Mathews, but there is a new one on the way!!

In the meantime, I have found an interesting site that I thought some of you may find informative. You may possibly already know of it, but lots of Irish Mathews information there to while away the hours!! Hope you find it helpful!

http://members.iinet.net.au/~nickred/newspaper/np_abst36.htm

Thanks and Happy Hunting
Jeanne (Mathews) Bell NZ
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: pinot on Sunday 19 December 10 00:14 GMT (UK): Hi Jeanne,
It seems that I'm the first to say hello and welcome to Rootschat :D I hope you get the response you deserve to your enquiries, and that you get the pleasure and profit that I do.
Enjoy! :)
Pinot
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ambers on Sunday 19 December 10 00:58 GMT (UK): Hello and welcome to RC Jeanne :)

I am sure someone will come to your aid soon...I warn you now, it's a very addictive site :D

Ambers
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 19 December 10 03:49 GMT (UK): ;)Thank You Ambers & Pinot. ;)!! I can see that your "warning" is warranted!! Looks like a really supportive community, and I hope I will be able to contribute as well as beg!!
My goodness, I really am getting old - it was a birthday party I went to, not a christening!! Oh dear!!
Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: eadaoin on Sunday 19 December 10 19:16 GMT (UK): welcome, Jeanne

it isn't age that makes you substitute "christening" instead of "birthday" - it's Genealogy!!

just see how many family Historians say that they were born in 1840 instead of 1940, etc!!

eadaoin
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 19 December 10 20:15 GMT (UK): Here goes with my Mathews Family. I would really appreciate if someone could please help me with this.

I currently have three marriage certificates with my 4xgreat-grandfather HENRY MAXWELL MATHEWS (gentleman) named as father. These three marriages all took place in Dublin. John Gibbons Mathews is my 3xgreatgrandfather.

1845-11 July. JOHN GIBBONS MATHEWS (Sergeant of Lancers, Residence at time of marriage- Nottingham - to MARY JANE FLEMING ( daughter of DAVID FLEMING,Officer Royal Irish Artillery
This marriage took place in the Donnybrook Church in the Parish of Donnybrook, City of Dublin

1851-19 April SARAH ANNIE MATHEWS, residence at time of Marriage, 47 Aungier or maybe Aughrim) to JOHN POTTER Esq. son of ROBERT POTTER, Clerk in Holy Orders. This marriage took place in the Parish Church of St. Peter, City of Dublin.

1865 -30 Dec. PHOEBE MATHEWS, residence at time of Marriage,31 Synge Street to
William Coote, shopkeeper,usual residence Moate Co, Westmeath, son of George Coote, farmer. This marriage took place in St Kevin's Church in the Parish of St. Peter, City of Dublin.

From all these details and addresses I have been unable to find any more info for HENRY MAXWELL MATHEWS or his two daughters. Street directories have not turned up anything for me, although, having said that I have an entry in Pettigrew & Oulton Almanac Dublin Directory for 1842 for a MRS Henry Maxwell Mathews, living in Blackrock, Carysfort Avenue but I have no idea where to look next, trying to track birth & marriage for Henry.

Anyone have any ideas for me please?? I've run out!! Thank You so much.

Jeanne (Mathews) Bell NZ ::)
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 19 December 10 20:31 GMT (UK): LOL -Thank You Eadaoin. Yes, you're right! Anyway, it was a lovely christening - oops - birthday party - for 3 year old twins - a great day. After they had all the fun of their birthday presents, they started on the Christmas presents under the tree! Saying "Mine - Mine"!! ;D ;D

Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Sunday 19 December 10 22:13 GMT (UK): mod note : Topics merged
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Sunday 19 December 10 22:52 GMT (UK): Quote from: jaybelnz on Sunday 19 December 10 20:15 GMT (UK)
......
1851-19 April SARAH ANNIE MATHEWS, residence at time of Marriage, 47 Aungier or maybe Aughrim) to JOHN POTTER Esq. son of ROBERT POTTER, Clerk in Holy Orders. This marriage took place in the Parish Church of St. Peter, City of Dublin.
.....
.... I have an entry in Pettigrew & Oulton Almanac Dublin Directory for 1842 for a MRS Henry Maxwell Mathews, living in Blackrock, Carysfort Avenue but I have no idea where to look next, trying to track birth & marriage for Henry.
......

Many Dublin City parish records are available at www.irishgenealogy.ie, but the problem with Henry could be that Blackrock is in Co. Dublin and most county area are not covered by the website. An it's also possible that Henry came some other part of Dublin, or elsewhere originally.

Pettigrew & Oulton 1840 shows the same detail for Mrs Henry Maxwell Mathews at Carysford Ave, but I dont see any sign of Mrs. or Mr. Matthews in the 1834 edition. There's no mention of Carysford ave.. so it may had a different name of not yet existed at that time.. I'll check further

There is a Mr. Henry M. Matthews listed in 1834 with an address at 5 Buckingham place. This is located Dublin North city close to the Royal Canal and the North Strand Rd/Ballybough area in the civil parish of St. Thomas.

some additional details on one the marriages :

The address of Sarah Annie at the time of her marriage is 47 Aungier Street. St. Peter's church was on the same street at number 53. In 1852 a Robert Read, licensed measured & valuator of works is listed at 47. see link (http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/6fe9f30923527) (www.irishgenealogy.ie)

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 19 December 10 23:15 GMT (UK): :D Thank You Shane. Really good that you have done that for me. Wow - that was quick.
I had trouble in deciphering the Street name Aungier from the Cert.I have, that's why I was looking at possibility of Aughrim as well, so that's great. Also Robert Potter's address of Bell Villa on Heytesbury Street was a bit hard to read, I had read it as Dale Villa. Now that has solved both of those for me. Thank You so much. I really appreciate your help.
Jeanne :)
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Monday 20 December 10 08:24 GMT (UK): both addresses are difficult to read, but I'm reasonably certain of the one for John Potter as there's is a street named Belle Villa off Heytesbury street, although he is not listed as the principle occupant in either 1850 or 1852. Both listings show a Mr. Frederick Rosborough as the householder.

The address for the bride is more difficult, but I think begins with Aun then a possible g... followed by a squiggle... and a lost dot for an i.

I checked Aughrim Street just to be sure... and there seems to be no number 47 on the street during the 1850, as the numbers skip from 40 to 107. Maybe part of the street was being redeveloped at the time?

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Monday 20 December 10 08:56 GMT (UK): I think it looks more like Aungier as well. Aughrim was the other street in the directory that I looked at, but talking about the lost dot - there is one above and between Aungier & Street, and same thing over the Annie - the dot is above the n next to the i in Annie.
Thanks Shane - much appreciated.
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: Martytoby on Monday 20 December 10 11:19 GMT (UK): Hi E,

I noticed an email to you from Paul Breslin, who is my first cousin. I am in Australia, and was chasing information about Toby Breslin, my maternal grandfather. He died in 1974, I never met him, but visited not long after his death. His wife was Agnes who I did meet and stayed with in late 74/ early 75.

My email is ^(*)

Appreciate your help.

Regards Marty

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Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: eadaoin on Monday 20 December 10 17:16 GMT (UK): Marty, I think we were in touch some years ago.

As this thread is about the Mathews family, we should chat about this on a separate topic.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=502400.new#new

Then maybe you'd post 2 more messages on THAT topic, and we'll be able to chat through private messages, or email.

regards eadaoin
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Monday 20 December 10 18:47 GMT (UK): OOps, thought I had a new cousin LOL. :D Happy Christmas!!
Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Tuesday 21 December 10 08:11 GMT (UK): just wondering if you had traced anything in later records about the birthplaces for John G., Sarah A. and/or Phoebe .. did they stay in Ireland or emigrate somewhere ?

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Tuesday 21 December 10 08:45 GMT (UK): Hi Shane, don't know any more about Sarah or Phoebe, or their father Henry Maxwell Mathews, other than what I found on their marriage certificates. I did however get some English census info in reply to a message board post on Ancestry (or it may have been Genforum) some time ago, which gave me a Portarlington Ireland birth for Mary Jane Fleming and a Newatt Ireland birth for John Gibbons Mathews. Ronnie Mathews (no relation unfortunately) hasn't been able to turn up anything in Portarlington for me, and I'm a bit stumped with Newatt - thought it may be Newrath or Newry?? Could the Portarlington also be a corruption or incorrectly transcribed maybe??
Copy and paste of that info below.
THESE ARE OUR MATHEWS – BUT INCORRECTLY TRANSCRIBED as MASTERS. Sent to me by Charlotte EDWARDS IN VANCOUVER.
Dear Jeanne,
I was doing a search for my Henry Masters in 1861 index and found one
that was the correct age in the 1861 for Sheffield (county of Yorkshire) Piece 3496
folio 49F.Thinking it could be my Henry Masters, I listed all the ones on that folio:
John G Masters age 43 bn Ireland
Mary J " age 43 bn Ireland
Henry M D " age 14 born Hounslow, MDX
Mary G " age 12 bn Hounslow, MDX
John R " age 10 bn Manchester
Robert W " age 5 bn London, MDX
I haven't actually looked at that image, but I thought it was worth a
further look.
The birthplace wasn't right but since he lived in Middlesex by 1871,
I thought I would check him out in the 1871 on ancestry.
On Ancestry, the surname is transcribed as "MATHUE" for Richard
and MATHUES for all the rest but when one looks at the 1871 image
the surname is actually MATHEWS
RG 10 Piece 677, Folio 173 p. 39 Lambeth London
(address looks like 12 Bunily Pl)
Eccl. District St. Michael

Henry M Mathews (25, head, occ. accountant), My G-gfather
Jane (27, wife bn Sheffield),
Alice (2, daur bn London),
John J (Father, 53, no occ bn Newatt, Ireland), my John Gibbons Mathews
Mary J (Mother, 53, bn Portalington, Ireland), my Mary Jane FlemingRichard (brother, 21, railway clerk bn Manchester),
Robert (brother 15, no occ bn Bristol)
Julia Stacey, (servant, 17, domestic servant, bn Bristol)
Thats about the extent of what I have, after Sheffield I lost track of John Gibbons and Mary Jane, although I have the movements of most their children tracked.
Thanks,Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Tuesday 21 December 10 08:59 GMT (UK): Oh, I just thought of something else! At the time of her 1845 Dublin Marriage, Mary Jane Fleming - Usual Place of Residence -stated to be Triton Terrace Irishtown. Her father David Fleming was an Officer in Royal Irish Artillery - could that possibly have been a Barracks maybe?
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Tuesday 21 December 10 09:09 GMT (UK): Quote from: jaybelnz on Tuesday 21 December 10 08:59 GMT (UK)
Oh, I just thought of something else! At the time of her 1845 Dublin Marriage, Mary Jane Fleming - Usual Place of Residence -stated to be Triton Terrace Irishtown. Her father David Fleming was an Officer in Royal Irish Artillery - could that possibly have been a Barracks maybe?

There was a barracks not far from Irishtown at Beggars Bush on Haddington Road.

I was thinking that place of birth for the children would help give you an original location for the family and possibly lead to a baptism or two to give you their mother's name and then follow on from that to search for their parents marriage..

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Tuesday 21 December 10 09:30 GMT (UK): Yes, you're right Shane, I had thought that as well, but so far haven't been able to dig up anything in Portarlington for Mary Jane Flemings birth. And Newatt - is there actually such a place in Ireland? I haven't been able to find one, but of course that doesn't mean it's not there. A few years ago an elderly Irish acquaintance of mine said not so, but she lived in Wellington NZ and thought she was living in Tipperary!! It was actually her that suggested either Newrath or Newry....
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Tuesday 21 December 10 09:32 GMT (UK): I'll have a look for that 'Newatt' census return and see if I can make anything more out of it..

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Tuesday 21 December 10 10:19 GMT (UK): Found that 1871 record.... pretty bad, the first part of the placename is partially covered with some sort of mark.. but I dont think it states 'Newatt'

All the other t's on the page have definitive crossbars - see the one in Portarlington. Not sure that the first letter is an N either - the N in Norfolk a few lines above is quite different... The first letter in John's place of birth looks a bit like some of the other M's on the page

I'll check it a bit more, but I'm not sure how much detail can be worked out with so much of the word obscured.

Have you found John on a later census return ?

Shane

English Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Tuesday 21 December 10 11:16 GMT (UK): :)Thanks for all you're doing! I don't have any later than 1871 census info for John & Mary Jane, although Henry MD Mathews, his wife Jane & 8 chn were in Boston by 1881 US Census. I have just had a thought! Maybe they could be found in 1881 census with one or other of their other sons or daughters mentioned in the 1871 census entry. Mary,John, Richard or Robert? They may still be in England in 1881 or 1891 census. What do you think?? Mary (their daughter aged 12 in the 1871, would have been 22 by 1881, and was married to an Albert Pile in Surrey (not certain of the date yet). Maybe still all around Sheffield?? Time for me to call it a night, or I'll never get up for work in the morning!! Shane I can't thank you enough for all this - you're so fast I can't keep up with you!! ::) LOL Amazing!!! G'night then!
Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Thursday 06 January 11 10:18 GMT (UK): :) Hi Shane, Thanks for your efforts on my behalf. Just been digging a bit sideways on the Newratt birth location census reference for John Gibbons Mathews, and and the Portarlington birth location reference given in the same 1871 Lambeth London) census information for his wife Mary Jane Fleming.

Mr. Google tells me there is also a Newrath in Country Waterford, in County Kilkenny, and Dundalk, Dromiskin County Louth. And a Portarlington, (as well as County Laios where I have been looking - with Ronnie Mathews - thought I had struck gold there with the Mathews name LOL - but sadly not, and although he is not connected to my Mathews family - he keeps me in mind).

So Portarlington again, another in County Louth, and another in County Kilkenny. I'm still trying to find other places that might have been interpreted phonetically as Newatt, or Newratt. I must talk to my Irish neighbour again, and ask her to say the word as written. Might be worth a go! Not so difficult for me with my Scottish names as perhaps written by an Englishman, as I grew up with my Mum & Dad and Grandparents all speaking with broad Scottish accents, and can usually work those ones out! However, what do you think of a Portarlington and Newratt?rath? whatever?? being in one of the other counties. Interested to know your thoughts!

Thanks
Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Thursday 06 January 11 10:43 GMT (UK): Rath is the Irish for a Fort and occurs as part of many placenames. I dont think there are many locations in Ireland that end in ..rat, ratt or att. See the townland database at www.thecore.com/seanruad

The problem is that the Mathews family may have moved between the births of John G. and Mary A. and 'Newatt' may be nowhere near Portarlington.

Pity there are no other census returns for them...

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: shanew147 on Thursday 06 January 11 10:48 GMT (UK): Quote from: jaybelnz on Thursday 06 January 11 10:18 GMT (UK)
.....
Mr. Google tells me there is also a Newrath in Country Waterford, in County Kilkenny, and Dundalk, Dromiskin County Louth. And a Portarlington, (as well as County Laios where I have been looking - with Ronnie Mathews - thought I had struck gold there with the Mathews name LOL - but sadly not, and although he is not connected to my Mathews family - he keeps me in mind).
.....
So Portarlington again, another in County Louth, and another in County Kilkenny.
.....

not sure if I'm reading that bit about Portarlington correctly...

I'm only aware of the one on Co. Laois.

Shane
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Thursday 06 January 11 11:10 GMT (UK): :) Hi again Shane. No other later census info - I did ask for an 1891 England lookup on the Census page, but nothing for that year. Someone did do an 1851 one though, and found them - but birth stated for only Ireland. Children had different England birth places though, that may be helpful. Here's the link to that post.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,503195.0.html

As for the Portarlington in other counties, that's just what Mr. Google picked up, (and I'm sure he's not an Irishman with your knowledge), but just thought it may be place name change or boundary change or something.

Thanks Shane
Jeanne :)
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Wednesday 02 July 14 10:43 BST (UK): Here I go again, after a good few years, I have at long last actually found some death information on Ancestry for Henry Maxwell MATHEWS, my Irish G G G GRANDFATHER. He died in 1875 and was buried at St. Peter's, Anglican, Dublin, 18.6.1785. Doesn't actually give a date Of death, but I'm not really too concerned about that. Then there is location, (or maybe it said place) stated Revs Port.

Would appreciate if anyone has any clues ,any clues, couldn't find anything relevant to a place called revs port on google. It's typed, so may have been lost in transcription.

This location doesn't seem to me to be a place name, but I'm wondering if maybe it's an abbreviation of "Reverend's" part, or something or other to do with St. Peter's. Interesting.

Thanks for any ideas
Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 26 July 14 13:18 BST (UK): There's a death announcement in the Manchester Times for October 19th, 1851:

On the 12th inst, at Dublin, Sarah, relict of Henry Maxwell Mathews Esq, of Moyally, Kings County

So Henry must have died before then
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 26 July 14 13:21 BST (UK): Here is Sarah's burial record. Aged 58 so born circa 1793. http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=d-116-1-4-197

Address 47 Aungier Street
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 26 July 14 13:49 BST (UK): On FindMyPast there's an 1874 landed estate record which mentions an 1828 lease on land at Parkwood (not very far from Moyally in Co Offaly):

"Lease dated 25th April 1828 between Elizabeth Jones and Sarah Jones of the one part and Michael Molloy of the other part......for the lives of Michael Molloy, the lessee, William J Norris eldest son of Thomas Norris, and Richard Mathews, second son of Henry Maxwell Mathews, now deceased"
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 26 July 14 15:24 BST (UK): The Dublin directories list Mrs Henry Maxwell Mathews as a head of household from 1840 (possibly earlier - I haven't been able to check 1836-1839) so it seems very likely that Henry died before that.

The 1835 directory lists a Henry M Mathews at 5 Buckingham Place and also one at 18 Portland Street.

There's an 1838 Dublin burial for a Henry Mathews of Portland Street. He was aged 64.
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 26 July 14 18:22 BST (UK): See references to "Maxwell Mathews" in the Tithe Applotment records for Moyally in 1827: http://tinyurl.com/q6f9fw3

Also there are reports in newspapers in September 1828 of an attempt on the life of an "industrious and respectable Protestant farmer named Maxwell Mathews, of Moyalley". Maybe he decided to move to Dublin after that.

" On Thursday night last, an industrious and respectable Protestant farmer, named Maxwell Mathews, of Moyalley, in the county of Westmeath, was waylaid and maliciously fired at on his return home from the town of Mullingar. A man walked close up to him, and having ascertained his person, deliberately presented a pistol at his head. Mathews fortunately had presence of mind sufficient to strike the instrument of death before the assassin could effect his bloody purpose. The direction being changed, the ball passed through both his coats a little above the hip, but without doing any injury to his person. The assassin immediately fled, and without uttering a single word. Will the Government offer a reward for this outrage ? "
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 27 July 14 09:30 BST (UK): YOU ARE ALL SO AMAZING,,,

Thanks so much Shaun. Fabulous. I had had little of this info, but certainly not the majority of it. As usual, it's incredible the support I've had on this board.

I've had a bit if trouble posting a reply, but it was probably mostly waffle anyway. I had an attachment on it as well, but it was probably too big or something. Anyway, I'll sleep on what you've given me.

Went through the burial records that your link pointed me to for Sarah Mathews death, but couldn't actually spot her. Had a couple of goes, but I'll try it again in the morning. Hopefully my brain and eyes will be a little fresher by the time I do it again. Thanks Shaun

Happy Jeanne
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: ShaunJ on Sunday 27 July 14 09:45 BST (UK): Quote
Went through the burial records that your link pointed me to for Sarah Mathews death, but couldn't actually spot her.

It's the last one on the page
Title: Re: MATHEWS in Dublin/New to this board
Post by: jaybelnz on Sunday 27 July 14 10:45 BST (UK): Ok just had another look. Opens at Page 33, first name. Sarah Berford, or something like that, then there are three more full entries, and the next one for White, is cut off half way through. So I wound my way through the whole lot, no go.

Later.... Just had a thought, I've been working from my iPad mini, so I ducked up to the P.C, logged in there, and hit the rest of it, WOUND RIGHT DOWN AND THERE SHE WAS. so no worries on the PC.
Thanks. Yet again !

Jeanne

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