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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: trishy2141 on Tuesday 14 December 10 23:14 GMT (UK)
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hi,im looking for any info regarding my great grandfather, william moran. 1911 uk census has him being born in Gort in Galway, in 1855. i have a copy of his wedding certificate,he married mary casey in liverpool in 1891, his fathers name was john. but cant find him on previous census. unsure when he came over from ireland. any info or leads would be most appreciated. thanks
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Hi and welcome to Rootschat
Does the marriage cert show that William had been married previously? The 1901 census shows a 12yr old son William b Liverpool
Mary Casey was a widow in 1891 but no children
What was her fathers name on the marriage cert
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Hi Carole,
Thanks for your quick response, as it was my first post I was a bit vague with the info I already have,
Her father name on the marriage cert was Patrick Casey,
Her mother Ellen was a widow on the 1901 census and living with William and Mary at the time, they had 3 sons, William, Patrick (my grandfather) and John Moran.
I can find Mary, Ellen and Patrick Casey on the 1881 census but no sign of William Moran before the 1891 marriage to Mary, as he was born in Gort in Galway I thought maybe he was still in Ireland before 1891.
If you can find out anymore info it would be very much appreciated.
Thanks again :)
Alan Moran
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The 1891 entry I found has Mary Casey aged 28 b Liverpool living as the daughter in law of Ellen Casey aged 45 b Liverpool - this is why I thought Mary had been previously married
Was William shown as a bachelor on the marriage cert? If Mary was a spinster and William was a bachelor - William aged 12 must be the son of one of them
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Hello,
the Liverpool history Projects site http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/
has baptisms for children with parents William Moran and Mary Casey:
William John 1888
Mary Catherine 1892
Patrick 1895
John 1897
which indicate that they were the parents of William so should be around in 1891 :-\
regards
heywood
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There is a Mary Ann Casey with parents Patrick and Ellen and siblings at
1881 RG11; Piece: 3704; Folio: 86; Page: 1
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Hi Heywood
Good find - marriage wasn't until 1891 which threw me
I can find Mary, Ellen and Patrick Casey on the 1881 census but no sign of William Moran before the 1891 marriage to Mary
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There is a Mary Ann Casey with parents Patrick and Ellen and siblings at
1881 RG11; Piece: 3704; Folio: 86; Page: 1
Sorry Alan- just realised that you had mentioned this ::) However, I couldn't find that family in 1891. There is a death for a Patrick C though.
Thanks Carole - someone pointed that site out to me a while ago and it has been really useful. :)
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I know that we aren't looking for Mary here but it may help to find William in 1891.
Was Patrick a Cotton Porter on the marriage certificate?
I just want to make sure that we have the right person.
1871 RG10; Piece: 3844; Folio: 76; Page: 14 has her as M. Alice Casey, 2 yrs.
Mary's age doesn't quite fit with the 1901 census.
Added:
Just found that family at 1891 RG12; Piece: 2991; Folio 117; Page 18
Mary A Casey is with her parents and is a teacher.
So I had the wrong family - which family do you have Alan?
Going back to Carole's point - 1891- Mary as 'daughter in law' - it could also mean 'step daughter' I have seen that described that way. (Or of course a remarriage).
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Hi Carole, Hi Heywood and thanks for your replies. the Casey family i had from the 1891 census, was the one you mentioned, but it has Mary as a Teacher, but on the wedding cert she has an X for her signiature, they are down as Bachelor and Spinster, Patricks occupation is what looks like an Ironsmith. thanks for the baptism site too, i have only ever had their children as; William, Patrick, john and Katie(born 1904) i never knew they also had a daughter Mary, she must have died very young. and one thing i never noticed was that young William would have been 2 when they married, sometimes you cant see for looking! so thanks again to you both for your time and effort. :)
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Hello again Alan,
If you haven't already done so, it might be worth getting the baptism for William- there may be some clues there.
regards
heywood
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HI Heywood, thanks for that, yeah will try and check the baptism for William, sure theres a few surprises in there. thanks again for your help :)
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MICHAEL AND PATRICK MORAN sons of WILLIAM MORAN
Background information found so far:
My ancestors Michael and Patrick Moran (my g-g-grandfather), we believe were tenant farmers in Gort, on the property owned by the Burkes called Marble Hill, but another branch of the family we tracked down in Australia were told they were from Athlone.
We can find Andrew Moran through the Griffith's Valuation at Cappagh, Lessor: Sir Ths J Burke and Michael Moran at Ballynakill, Lessor: Henry Pigott. Maybe they left Athlone to find work in Gort ???
Their father was William Moran, mother unknown. Based on their ages at time of transportation and death certificates Michael was born approx.1805 and Patrick approx.1808/1811.
Naming conventions:
Michael Moran married Mary Byrnes in 1844 (Australia) and died in 1848.
He had a son Patrick and we believe a daughter Mary J and a son William Moran
Son Patrick had eight children:
Michael J, Edward, William Charles, James Timothy, Mary Anastasia, Margaret Jane,Agnes Eugean and Patrick
Patrick Thomas Moran (my g-g-gf) married Mary McMahon (Australia) in 1855.
Patrick had seven children that we know of:
Michael, Mary, John Thomas, Patrick Denis, Margaret Ellen, William James and Winfred
Son Michael (my g-gf) had eight children:
Patrick Francis, Mary Mildred, Winifred May, Helena Aloysius, Kathleen Agnes, Celia Margaret, Owen Alphonzie and William John (my gf)
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In March 1832 at the Galway Assizes there were about 27 Galway men convicted of being a Whiteboy in that same month. The following men were transported together on the "Eliza" in 1832:
Pat Manmon, Malachy Hardiman, Patrick Cannane, Michael Kelly, John Kelly, John Mulville, Edmond Mooney, Joseph Connors, Thomas Cavenagh, Laurence McDonagh, John Burke, John Gantley, Patrick Doolan, John Meskell, Patrick Hanna, John Larkin, Edmond (Edward) Naughton, Patrick Finn, John Heagey, Martin Heagey, John Sheedy, Michael Moran, Patrick Moran, Patrick Carey or Cazey, Patrick Halloran, Patrick Walsh, Patrick Hynes.
Thomas Keneally's "The Great Shame"
TERRYALTISM:
Up to the moment we write, there have been ... about thirty unfortunate individuals convicted under the Whiteboy Act, and therefore destined to spend the remainder of their lives in a clime far, far distant from their native homes - from the land which holds all that is dear to them in the world.
Galway Free Press, 31 March 1832.
Whilst it hints to this event there does not appear to be any other information on these convictions.
My Ancestors Conviction:
Record in Assizes (Court):
Michael Quinn, John Sheedy, Michael Moran, Patrick Moran and James Boland, whiteboy offence, judgement of death recorded.
Another newspaper article read:
James Boland, Patrick Moran, Michael Moran, James Sheedy and Michael Quinn for the assembling of arms and attacking the house of Martin Glynn (Glinn) in May Last: Guilty
Galway Advertiser 1st October 1831: Committed to Galway Jail 9th September by Walter Moloney Chief Magistrate at Gort: John Sheedy alias Silk charged having on 20th May aided by an armed party attacked the home of Martin Glynn (sometimes spelt Glinn) who was severely wounded. On same day he committed Michael Quinn charged with having on 28th August, aided by others, committed a burglary at Patrick Glynn's house who was wounded in the last attack - John Sheedy alias Silk aided him.
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On their shipping records state a cousin of theirs was transported 12 years earlier:
Peter Larkin - cousin of Michael and Patrick Moran. Peter Larkin born in 1787 in Gort and died in 1879 in Dapto NSW. Tried with Gleeson and Patrick Staunton in Galway Ireland in August 1820 convicted at the Galway Assizes for burglary and seditious practices. Patrick Staunton was not indicted on the capital charge. Peter Larkin and Gleeson were sentenced to death but Larkins was reduced to transportation for life. Peter Larkin and Patrick Staunton sailed from Cork on 16/06/1821 and arrived in NSW on 07/11/1821 on board the "John Barry"
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Transportation:
Both Moran brothers were convicted and transported to Australia from Cork on the ship "Eliza" in 1832 with the other Galway men convicted of being Whiteboys. I am unaware of the outcome for James Boland and Michael Quinn as they may have had the judgement of death upheld.
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If there is any information on the above convictions of these Galway men that you may have, or any direct link with Michael and Patrick, I would love to hear from you.