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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Free Photo Restoration & Date Old Photographs => Topic started by: Thornett on Sunday 05 December 10 13:07 GMT (UK)

Title: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Sunday 05 December 10 13:07 GMT (UK)
Hi

I need some help dating this photo taken of Lyle Thornett. Unfortunately there are two Lyle Thornett's (Uncle and Nephew) and a date will help me work out which one it is.

Thanks for your time.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Sunday 05 December 10 13:15 GMT (UK)
Also can anyone tell me anything about this unknown couple. Does the gentleman's hat mean anything?
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 05 December 10 18:52 GMT (UK)
The dashing young chap looks like Lyle in around 1908-12.Around 25-30 in that 'tache.how does that fit?
The other chap's wearing a smoking cap.The woman looks like a barrister,court official or similar but I'm not sure when women first occupied these positions.
The mans dress style could place this from the 1890's up to the 1920's.Some older chaps just refused to budge when it came to updating their wardrobe.
The plant stand looks Art Deco.
What sort of photo is it? postcard,snapshot etc.

jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Seoras on Sunday 05 December 10 19:02 GMT (UK)
Seems to be 1921/22 first woman barrister Jim,would that fit.

George.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 05 December 10 19:09 GMT (UK)
I've just been reading that bit George.I think it also said that women had to modify their hairstyles to accommodate the wig which may explain the rather modern hairstyle of this lady.
So it looks like we're into the 20's now.
jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Seoras on Sunday 05 December 10 19:24 GMT (UK)
I wouldn't think even then there would be many women barristers so she may be traceable.The chap beside her definately has a look of Edward VII about him. ;D
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 05 December 10 19:43 GMT (UK)
I was thinking George Bernard Shaw.
jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 06 December 10 01:05 GMT (UK)
The dashing young chap looks like Lyle in around 1908-12.Around 25-30 in that 'tache.how does that fit?

jim
The timeline probably matches the Uncle more, he was born in 1885. Problem is I already have a photo of him and to me it is not the same person although I could be wrong. This is the photo I already have of Lyle Thornett (b.1885)
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 06 December 10 01:08 GMT (UK)
The other chap's wearing a smoking cap.The woman looks like a barrister,court official or similar but I'm not sure when women first occupied these positions.
The mans dress style could place this from the 1890's up to the 1920's.Some older chaps just refused to budge when it came to updating their wardrobe.
The plant stand looks Art Deco.
What sort of photo is it? postcard,snapshot etc.

jim
This photo is actually not mine. The person who sent me the other photo sent this one as well to see if I knew who it was as there is no name on the back. I don't know of any barrister on this side of the family so it could be from her other side. I will let her know the details though.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: mozza29 on Monday 06 December 10 03:19 GMT (UK)
Hope this version finds a place in your family archives.
Regards,
Morrie
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 06 December 10 03:23 GMT (UK)
Thanks Mozza!
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Monday 06 December 10 16:49 GMT (UK)
They look 2 different people to me.
I'm assuming the one in uniform is from WW1 when Lyle would have been in his 30's & he doesn't look that old.
how old was the other Lyle at this time.
jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: imstillstanding on Monday 06 December 10 18:09 GMT (UK)
They look 2 different people to me.
I'm assuming the one in uniform is from WW1 when Lyle would have been in his 30's & he doesn't look that old.
how old was the other Lyle at this time.
jim

sorry to poke in, but these two gents are not the same person
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 06 December 10 23:19 GMT (UK)
They look 2 different people to me.
I'm assuming the one in uniform is from WW1 when Lyle would have been in his 30's & he doesn't look that old.
how old was the other Lyle at this time.
jim
The Lyle in uniform would have been about 30 years old at the time of that photo, he died in Belgium in 1917.

The other Lyle was not born until 1923 so if the second photo was him it would have been taken until about 1945-1950 which I think is not the case.

They are the only Lyle Thornett in the family so it looks like someone has written the wrong name on the back of the photo at some stage.

sorry to poke in, but these two gents are not the same person
No poke away! I happy to get everyones opinions.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Seoras on Monday 06 December 10 23:30 GMT (UK)
Lovely colour job there Morrie.

George.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Monday 06 December 10 23:32 GMT (UK)
Did he have any brothers?
jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 06 December 10 23:41 GMT (UK)
He had two brothers, Frank (b.1894) and Ray (b.1896). The photo came from Franks family and they are certain it is not him.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Tuesday 07 December 10 00:11 GMT (UK)
any takers.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Tuesday 07 December 10 00:22 GMT (UK)
An Aside

Re Lyle THORNETT .... do you have the 58 page document from the Australian National Archives for his WWI service .... sadly he was K I A on the Western front in 1917...  His father had been missing for ten years when Lyle enlisted... Lyle Thornett's physical description is noted in those records...

http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/recordsearch/index.aspx  search as a guest...

Cheers,  JM

EDIT TO ADD  

Frank and Ray also enlisted in WWI, could the photo of the chap in Australian uniform be of one of them rather than of Lyle ... Their WWI service records also on line, lots of family history information in those records .... there was also a sister (Lyle's nominated next of kin and executrix of his will), and their mother was recorded as a Mrs McLean on Lyle's papers... 
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Tuesday 07 December 10 00:47 GMT (UK)
Thanks JM, I have already picked all that up.

Am I the only one who thinks out of those four headshots, one and three look like a match? Same rounded eyebrows and chin.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Tuesday 07 December 10 01:20 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

I think 2 and 4 are very similar, could well be the same person even ...
And I can see why you think 1 and 3 are alike, but different generation

Do you have photo of the sister for Frank, Ray and Lyle, does she have similar ears, nose, eyebrows, lips etc  ;)

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Tuesday 07 December 10 01:33 GMT (UK)
I'm attaching a WWI photo of a great uncle who was KIA Western Front ... He was born 1895 in NSW, ... so this photo was taken when he was 20 .... comparing his youthful face with your photo of Lyle, who was 30 when he enlisted, makes me wonder if the photo you have of Lyle would be actually a photo of one of his younger brothers...   

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Tuesday 07 December 10 01:45 GMT (UK)
I will post this just to make it easier for people
Photo 1: unknown
Photo 2: Lyle Thornett (1885-1917)
Photo 3: Frank Thornett (1894-1962)
Photo 4: Ray Thornett (1896-1933)

The photos that have been named are definitely those people. All brothers that didn't have much to do with each other and lived in different parts of WA.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Tuesday 07 December 10 01:47 GMT (UK)
I'm attaching a WWI photo of a great uncle who was KIA Western Front ... He was born 1895 in NSW, ... so this photo was taken when he was 20 .... comparing his youthful face with your photo of Lyle, who was 30 when he enlisted, makes me wonder if the photo you have of Lyle would be actually a photo of one of his younger brothers...   

Cheers,  JM
The photo is definitely Lyle, I have had different parts of the family with the same photo named on the back and he is in his regiment photos as well.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Tuesday 07 December 10 03:37 GMT (UK)
Hi

I need some help dating this photo taken of Lyle Thornett. Unfortunately there are two Lyle Thornett's (Uncle and Nephew) and a date will help me work out which one it is.

Thanks for your time.

Photo 2 of  Lyle Thornett in uniform was taken in 1916.  He enlisted March 1916 and embarked Nov 1916 and was KIA June 1917.  I feel that this photo would have been taken when he was in camp in WA, most likely in the weeks before embarkation (badges, cap, condition of uniform etc).  It was usual for the various commercial photographers to take individual photos for the men to give to their loved ones before they embarked.  These photographers went to the camps and set up mobile studios.  One of my forebears was a photographer who took these types of photos during WWI, but he was operating his mobile studio in and around Sydney NSW.

Photo 1 of unknown cannot be that same Lyle, as it is a photo of a different person (eyes, ears, eyebrows etc).  As you note that that other Lyle was born in 1923, Photo 1 does NOT seem to me to be a photo of Lyle's nephew, Lyle, but rather Photo 1 would be of a generation earlier than Photo 2.  What is on the reverse side of Photo 1?  The clothing, posture, moustache, seem to indicate that earlier generation.  What is the original of  Photo 1 mounted on ... I realise you have been asked this earlier by jim #3 but I seem to have missed the answer.

As there are many similiarites between Photo 1 and Photo 3, could the chap in photo 1 be a forebear for the three brothers ?   

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: mozza29 on Tuesday 07 December 10 04:20 GMT (UK)
Whilst you haven't requested restore or color, perhaps these ones  may find a place in the family albums.
Regards,
Morrie
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Tuesday 07 December 10 11:21 GMT (UK)
Tell me that's not the same ear & I'll go away.
jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Tuesday 07 December 10 20:54 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

I agree with Jim, that's very likely the same ear  ;) . 

Surely that helps with dating these photos for Thornett.  If the photo of bearded chap is circa mid to late 1920's ... could he be aged 50 - 60 plus in that photo ....  born say 1855 - 1875 .... and thus would the unknown chap's Photo 1 have be taken circa 1910 presuming he would be aged in his 30's in that one ?  Jim suggested the photo could be taken 1908-12 in reply #3 and that makes good sense .

I doubt if Photo 1 is of a chap born in 1923, as that would mean the photo would have been post WWII which seems to me to be most unlikely. I have photos of forebears with similar pockets on their shirts, photos taken 1905ish in rural Queensland (Australia), although none with any similar necktie.  None of my collection of photos of my forebears include anyone wearing collar and necktie in that style post WWII (nor even post WWI). 
  

PS Morrie's colourings are wonderful  :) 

Cheers,

JM 
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 13 December 10 02:50 GMT (UK)
Thanks to everyone for your help in this thread and thanks to Morrie for the great coloured photos.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: majm on Monday 13 December 10 02:58 GMT (UK)
Hi there,

Thanks for the thanks, just curious though,  have you sorted the mystery as to who was the unknown chap in the photo

Cheers,  JM
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 13 December 10 06:20 GMT (UK)
I haven't really settled on who it is yet. I have sent back the details to the owner of the photo for her thoughts.

To me it looks more like Frank Edward Thornett (the third photo in the group of four). Frank is the owners Grandfather so if it is him she should know. I am hoping that she always thought it was Lyle because his name is on the back but when she looks at it closer she might see her Grandfather.

The other photo of the older couple rings no bells for me. I don't know of any female barrister on my side so it may be on the other side of her family.
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: Thornett on Monday 13 December 10 09:44 GMT (UK)
I have just spoken to the owner of the photo and she said there is no way it is of her Grandfather so it is back to square one.

She is adamant that it is his father but he went missing in 1901 which is outside the range of the clothing. Is there any chance it could have been taken 1895-1900?
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: jim1 on Monday 13 December 10 15:21 GMT (UK)
The 2 1/2" starched collar first appeared mid Edwardin era.It was quite short lived being superceded by the smaller a probably more comfortable 1 1/2" rounded collar.You're unlikely to see this after around 1912.

jim
Title: Re: Can someone date this photo of Lyle Thornett
Post by: sandgroper38 on Monday 14 March 11 11:18 GMT (UK)
was looking for a picture of " uncle FRANK" seems this one ws taken when he was about 20 also(1914) fits with his birth date of 16/7/1894 and dod 28/7/1962.Coincidence ?? I have similar  birthday date??16/7/1938
.I have a pic of his headstone at Carnarvon cemetery