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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: tim99 on Wednesday 24 November 10 14:09 GMT (UK)

Title: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Wednesday 24 November 10 14:09 GMT (UK)
been in my family for years, signed 'dearden' but I have no idea where it is.
thanks
tim
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Seoras on Wednesday 24 November 10 14:15 GMT (UK)
Well my immediate thought driven by that curious rock formation at the top of the cliff was the Logan Rock at the village of Treen in Cornwall.

There is another Logan Rock on The Rhinns of Kells in Galloway looks more like this rock though.

George.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Wednesday 24 November 10 14:26 GMT (UK)
wow, thanks for the suggestion - within 5 minutes of posting it !!

however, not convinced it's Treen as the google pix look fairly dissimilar. no cave either that I can see.
tim
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Rena on Wednesday 24 November 10 15:08 GMT (UK)
same minds think alike - I've been surfing trying to see if a Newlyn school (Cornwall) artist painted the original.  I also surfed looking for a similar style boat which doesn't look like anything I've seen on the Yorkshire coast.  Also surfed for the  fish wife attire - my Scottish ancestors had red dresses under their aprons.

A great cove for hiding smuggled booty eh?   ;D
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: carol8353 on Wednesday 24 November 10 15:11 GMT (UK)
My immediate thought was Cornwall too- then I wondered about somewhere in Ireland also.

Carol
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: LindaJ1959 on Wednesday 24 November 10 15:12 GMT (UK)
I'm probably completely wrong here, but it reminds me of Mothecombe beach in south Devon.

Linda
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Seoras on Wednesday 24 November 10 17:12 GMT (UK)
Hi Tim,I just happened to be online and knew of the Logan Rock.This doesn't look like the one in Cornwall,but how good was the artist? One thing for sure is we are looking for a coastal village with an unusual outcrop on top of the cliffs.Of course there is the question,is the outcrop still there? the Logan Rock in Cornwall was tipped over the cliffs by some hooray Henry's and had to be hauled back up.

George.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: oldtimer on Wednesday 24 November 10 17:28 GMT (UK)
Of course, it could just be a place from the artist's imagination!  :D
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: millymcb on Wednesday 24 November 10 17:31 GMT (UK)
That rock on top of the cliff is quite specific though - it would be an odd thing to imagine

Milly
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: oldtimer on Wednesday 24 November 10 17:37 GMT (UK)
very true!  :D
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Seoras on Wednesday 24 November 10 17:37 GMT (UK)
Are those two women collecting seaweed? I know this was an activity on the Outer Hebrides,like South Uist.

I know,I'm not being much help ;D,just throwing some ideas into the hat.

George.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: millymcb on Wednesday 24 November 10 20:05 GMT (UK)
Is it a postcard or a painting?

Milly
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: veeblevort on Wednesday 24 November 10 20:33 GMT (UK)

The style is like that of Harold Dearden (10 Sep 1888 - 6 Jul 1962).

I wondered whether knowing something about the artist might help locate the scene, but information on him is pretty thin, although his work is still selling today, even found it on Ebay.

He was born and raised in Rochdale, attended Rochdale College of Art 1905-1910, then RCA 1910-1915.

Resident in Swindon from 1920, and head of Swindon art school for 30 years. I'm trying to Google for more information about him, but keep getting offered material on a doctor and a writer with the same name.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: ankerdine on Wednesday 24 November 10 20:48 GMT (UK)
wow, thanks for the suggestion - within 5 minutes of posting it !!

however, not convinced it's Treen as the google pix look fairly dissimilar. no cave either that I can see.
tim


I am in agreement with most folks on here that it must be the Logan Rock near Lands End. There are caves in the area (Mousehole) and those rocks look just like those at Lamorna Cove just around the corner.

It's just pretty symbolic I think.
Judy
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: marcie dean on Wednesday 24 November 10 21:02 GMT (UK)
been in my family for years, signed 'dearden' but I have no idea where it is.
thanks
tim
Just to clarify, you state its signed dearden, this must be the signature of the artist and not signifying the name of the place, ??
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Little Nell on Wednesday 24 November 10 21:20 GMT (UK)
It does look as if it is looking south.

There is no settlement on the coast which would give you that sort of angle of view of Logan Rock.  Treen is the village inland of Penberth, a fishing cove, photos here:

http://www.geograph.org.uk/browse.php?p=20354

This is to the east of Logan Rock.  Lamorna Cove is further east still and it is not possible to see Logan Rock from there.

Porthgwarra to the west of Porthcurno was a possibility but it doesn't match.  It doesn't quite meet my own recollections and photos of this area.

I suspect an amalgamation of several places by the artist.  My father, who is an avid water-colour artist, does this all the time.  ;)

Nice item to have.

Nell
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Seoras on Thursday 25 November 10 00:17 GMT (UK)
The three things that make me shy away from Cornwall are:-

1. That rock is neither the shape or colour of the Logan Rock in Cornwall.

2.That red roof,if it wasn't thatch it would more than likely be slate in Cornwall.

3.Those boats don't look like Cornish boats.

As Nell says it could be a combination of several places,though something tells me this is or was an actual place or the artists interpretation of one.

George.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Thursday 25 November 10 11:11 GMT (UK)
gosh, lots of questions & suggestions  - thank you so much !!

It is a painting, I think it's oil - definitely not watercolour.  about 3ft x 2ft.  no frame.

it says Dearden on the back in pencil, I never thought it could be a place name.  Bartholomew's 1905 gazetteer lists no place called Dearden, and I think (don't have it in front of me) that there IS an initial letter in front of the name.  I will check when I get home.

Thanks for the Harold Dearden  comment - my plan was to identify the painting and then put it on ebay with the place name found, as the painting is meaningless to me.   If it is by a known artist, so much the better.

I have looked on google for photos of the places people have suggested so far, and as you all say, the funny shaped rock on the top is pretty definitive.  Nell suggests an amalgamation of places, which I agree is a good idea, but surely if you were painting somewhere "pretty" from imagination, you wouldn't have put that lump on the top would you ?   I guess the painting may be an unfinished work, but then it wouldn't have been in my family (sheffield area) unless someone had bought it (or been given it) at some point.

If anyone can pinpoint a photo which looks like this painting,  (and if it was a definite single place then it would surely have been photographed!) then I will consider the matter solved.  so far there is nothing online which looks like this - even bearing in mind it's probably 100 yeasr ago when it was painted - although I think the recent suggestion of Cornwall coves will bear fruit in the end.  Lamorna \Cove looks the closest so far.  I might stick this on the Cornwall board too, when the suggestions here dry up !

many thanks

tim
ps, Nell, the geograph link is broken on my pc I'm afraid.


Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Seoras on Thursday 25 November 10 12:19 GMT (UK)
Well you can scrub the one in Galloway Tim.The outcrop looks similar but you would need the Hubble telescope to see the sea ;D

George.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Little Nell on Thursday 25 November 10 12:36 GMT (UK)
Quote
the geograph link is broken on my pc I'm afraid.

 ???  seems OK for me.

This is Lamorna Cove - lots of pictures here.

http://www.geograph.org.uk/search.php?i=17142913

If you cannot get either of these to work then I suggest going to the home page for the Geograph project:

http://www.geograph.org.uk

and use the search function.  The rock formation on the left of the painting could be Carn du which is to the east of Lamorna Cove.  But I don't remember a rock formation of any shape on the west side of Lamorna Cove, or a natural cave, although there are plenty of rocky outcrops along the cliffs.

I think part of the problem is that the view as depicted would be impossible to see in reality - the fact that you can see both sides of the bay/inlet or cove would indicate a very wide angle view or a cove that really is almost circular.  The waves don't indicate that this is the case - they are straight, tending to indicate that the far rocks are quite a long way out and that the inlet is not particularly curved in outline.

Just my thoughts.  :)

Nell
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Bilge on Thursday 25 November 10 13:17 GMT (UK)
If you study Dearden's work you will his odd way of painting distant objects, I think that in this case it is a bush not a rock.

Harold Dearden, A.R.C.A. (1888-1969) was a painter of landscape and figure subjects. He studied at the Royal College of Art
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Rena on Thursday 25 November 10 13:31 GMT (UK)
If you study Dearden's work you will his odd way of painting distant objects, I think that in this case it is a bush not a rock.

Harold Dearden, A.R.C.A. (1888-1969) was a painter of landscape and figure subjects. He studied at the Royal College of Art

Yes, I thought Dearden referred to the artist but couldn't find the one in question - the only painting I found which had a similar style had a 'looser' brush than the beautiful postcard of the cove landscape - probably done at a different time in his life eh?  I did find a Dearden art gallery which set me wondering whether there was a family link.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: maidmarianoops on Thursday 25 November 10 13:46 GMT (UK)
hello just for interest
i found this site while looking for your painting
i dont think yours is here but the paintings are great
sylvia

collins antiques co uk index
http://www.collinsantiques.co.uk/index.php?category=Reference%20Water%20Colours
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Finley 1 on Thursday 25 November 10 13:47 GMT (UK)
this is by a more modern 'Dearden'  Chris Dearden


taken that one of to prevent confusion..   ;D ;D
xin
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Ruskie on Thursday 25 November 10 13:54 GMT (UK)
I think this was painted by an amateur.  :)
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: ankerdine on Thursday 25 November 10 15:48 GMT (UK)
I cannot throw any positive light on the location for this painting but have just spent the last half hour perusing the Geograph website suggested by Little Nell. Oh what nostalgia! :(

Our family over three generations spent many happy holidays in this area during the past 50 years.

Thanks for the pictorial revisit.

Judy
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: Bilge on Thursday 25 November 10 15:53 GMT (UK)
If it's a genuine Dearden it's probally worth between £300 - £500  ;D

However your family may have been art forgers :o in which case it's probally worth £1000! :o

 :D :D :D
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: millymcb on Thursday 25 November 10 16:12 GMT (UK)
Is that a signature on the bottom corner (right hand side)?

Milly
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Sunday 28 November 10 19:50 GMT (UK)
thanks for the continuing assistance with this.
I attach the signature close-up. It looks like F Dearden or E Dearden to me.

I have checked on the back, the pencil name just says "dearden" and there is an auction number too, so I think It's likely the name was the Auctioneer's writing, not the artist's.

I can see the Lamorna cove pictures now, but still can't see anything that looks like this painting - the rock formation is so very distinctive.  I will attempt to link this to Cornwall chat, so maybe they will come up with something definitive. In which case, I'll post here too.

Thanks for the help so far.

Tim
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: dobfarm on Monday 29 November 10 04:12 GMT (UK)
Just a possible ? see the the cave under the PH on the writting on the photo

http://www.carl-hierons-photo-gallery.co.uk/products.php?product=Flamborough-Headland

Loads of cave and coves and top rocks but the downward scoremark in the cliffe are similarhttp://www.shutterstock.com/pic-1849831/stock-photo-bungalows-at-thornwick-bay-flamborough-east-yorkshire.html

http://www.shutterstock.com/pic-33330064/stock-photo-flamborough-head.html

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000gQPjDW0Mv2E/s&imgrefurl=http://www.photoshelter.com/image/I0000gQPjDW0Mv2E&h=333&w=500&sz=144&tbnid=wb7d-fFA504LSM:&tbnh=87&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dflamborough%2Bhead%2Bcove%2Bphotos&zoom=1&q=flamborough+head+cove+photos&usg=__PGmn4r4rrjL-r_3RDk-Yx8i8aD0=&sa=X&ei=9CzzTJn2Dt-ShAebncWlDA&ved=0CCcQ9QEwBQ

http://www.flickr.com/photos/martinwalker/page26/
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: IMBER on Monday 29 November 10 09:46 GMT (UK)
The pantiles on one of the cottages must be a pointer.  These were once very common on the east coast of England and Scotland, originally having been brought in from Holland and then made locally.  Plenty of these around Flamborough.
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: dobfarm on Monday 29 November 10 14:38 GMT (UK)
That lady's dress outfit standing by the water seems to make me think of Norway/Finland/Sweden (Ie ;-ABBA the pop group outfits)

It could be anywhere?
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Thursday 02 December 10 11:43 GMT (UK)
Dobfarm, your suggestions are very interesting, and I thank you enormously, but to be honest, I still haven't seen a clifftop with that weird formation on the top. Lots of caves, yes, but no 'hanging rock' that fits.
Still, I've had enough of looking I think, and thank you all for your efforts.
I will see what ebayers make of it, as it IS for sale after all.
thanks
tim
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: dobfarm on Thursday 02 December 10 14:28 GMT (UK)
Hi Tim99

Yes! it does seem an interesting argument for flamborough cliffes! but as there is about 7 miles of them! I had to bring up the possiblity as the hanging rock could be another higher cliffe in the next cove or valley as artists don't always give a true picture impression of reality!

Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: marcie dean on Thursday 02 December 10 15:07 GMT (UK)
Can I suggest that you take it down to your nearest Auction rooms and get their  Art Expert to look at it, maybe he/she can tell you, and value it at the same time.  They do things no sale no fee type of thing.  Then if it does not sell, you could try E-bay, and you won't have lost anything.

marcie
Title: Re: anyone know where this cottage & bay is ?
Post by: tim99 on Thursday 02 December 10 15:53 GMT (UK)
thanks,for the suggestion marcie.
tim