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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: Ohanlon on Tuesday 16 November 10 04:23 GMT (UK)
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I have had some tremendous help a few months ago from the Roots commuity. Maybe you can help me further, please.
My great grandfather and his wife and offspring arrived in New Zealand in 1875. They settled in Wanganui and had two more boys. We can find the offspring deaths etc but we simply cannot find any record of John O'Hanlon or his wife Eliza. We have tried all versions of the surname and first name as in Eliza's case (Elizabeth) but to no avail. Brick wall, brick walk and very sore heads!
Did people in those days ever return to whence they came ie in this case, Kilkenny, Ireland?
or
Is there some other avenuel we can try?
Hope someone can help ........................ Thank you
Jim
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There is a mention in Papers Past of a john O'Hanlon dying Wanganui 1 Feb 1886
Wanganui Herald 3 Feb
Annie
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There is a Elizabeth O'Hanlon that died in 1901, no age mentioned, burial locator states the location was the Wanganui Chronicle & Herald.
Cheers
KHP
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According to the 1893 Electorate Roll, there was an Elizabeth O'Hanlon living in Liverpool Street, Wanganui.
Cheers
KHP
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BDM has an Elizabeth HANLON death 1901#2642 Age 62
Annie
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1896 there is a Bridget O'Hanlon at the same address as Elizabeth.
Tell us she is one of the children Jim:)
Annie
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Death notice for Elizabeth relict of the late John O'Hanlon, aged 62 yrs
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=WH19010617.2.10&srpos=1&e=--1901---1902--10-%2cWC%2cWH-1----2ohanlon--
Annie
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Death notice for John
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=WC18860202.2.26.2&srpos=57&e=--1886---1887--10-%2cWC%2cWH-51----2ohanlon--
Sorry:( These links don't want to shrink for some odd reason.
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Looks like it is them Annie ....and Jim hasn't given us middle names ..... so I guess the next step is for Jim to send off for the Certs for confirmation. I can't seem to find anything more on them.
Cheers
KHP
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Yeah looks promising KHP.
Heavens knows how they have transcribed John's name on his death cert :-\
It sure ain't obvious ;)
Annie
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As we didn't have the Birth dates for them, we will just have to wait for Jim to enlighten us.
Cheers
KHP :D
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You are very helpful ........................ thank you!
John and Eliza were married in Kilkenny on 21 Oct 1869. The marriage certificate gives no details of age or parentage. (was there a major falling out, I wonder....? .... the witnesses were a John & Bridget Glispin who could have been Eliza's brother/sister(in law))So we have no age to go on there ............. BUT the passenger list of the vessel Howrah they came out to NZ on in 1875 gives their ages of 36 (John) and 30 (Eliza) which makes them 1839 (John) and 1845 (Eliza) I have no middle names, sadly.
We are grateful for your help as tragically we have nothing beyond their arrival in NZ and the birth/deaths of their children.
The death notice for John informs people of his demise on 1 Feb 1886 but I cannot locate any death in the BDM for him at all. I have the one for Eliza (Elizabeth) and have sent away for confirmation. Why, do you think, I cannot locate his death record....? Annie - what is the death certificate to which you refer ........?
Thanks again, very much, everyone.......
Jim
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What I meant Jim was I've tried numerous spellings and can't find his death cert either.
Maybe a phone call to BDM saying you know the DOD, how can you find out what name it was registered under?
Cheers
Annie
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I see what you mean, Annie. Thank you.
I will do that tomorrow ... thank the Lord for cheap calls from Oz...................
Jim
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Good luck Jim
Let us know the results ;D
Oh for a wildcard search at NZBDM, it is hard work!
Annie
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???
I was in touch with NZBDM just moments ago - not successful, I'm afraid.
Apparrently, what we have access to is a true reflection of records that they actually hold themselves. The fact that we are unable to locate John O'Hanlon's registration is caused by either John being registered under a different name or non-registration at all. The helpful person tried variations also but to no avail. If the registration for Elizabeth, which I ordered yesterday, is the correct one then it is strange that mother's death was recorded 7 years later and not the father's, previously. He said I could lodge a death certificate request listing all details but it was unlikely I would be successful there.
That brick wall has resurfaced!
Is it possible to access Wanganui records for February for that period to check what name it might have been registered under? ................?
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That's a pity
Maybe see if the Sexton can find a burial since you know the date.
http://www.wanganui.govt.nz/FAQs/FAQs.asp?Fid=14
Annie
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Thanks - will let you know.
Jim
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Strangely, the Sexton cannot locate in his records a grave for either of the great grandparents (even looking at variations of the name) despite the death/funeral notices in the local paper and a chat with the local RC parish secretary who confirmed that John received the last rites of the church and was in fact buried.
HOWEVER, NZBDM has delivered the goods.
This morning I asked them to do a check of their record against the scanned original paper work for that period and, hey presto, they discovered John's name had been erroneously transcribed as O'HAULON. The error has been officially acknowledged and rectified so I was able to order a death printout and hopefully that will lead me forward......................
Thanks for your help ..... a happy chappie now off to celebrate with a dram of Irish!
Jim
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Fantastic news!
;D ;D ;D
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That is good news to hear Jim.
Keep us posted.
Cheers
KHP
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Now if NZBDm had a wildcard search we could have found it :D
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Hi Jim
Not part of your immediate question I know but the Archives NZ website ( www.archway.archives.govt.nz )contains a number of O'Hanlons who were called up in WW1. One of these records is digitised which means you can look at it on line. This fellow was born in Wanganui in 1878 and although his parents are not listed, details of his wife, chidren and many other things are noted. I urge you to have a read of it. I suspect he is one of yours.
O'HANLON, William Henry - WW1 35173 - Army
View Digitised Record (PDF, 8.5Mb)
ORDER DETAILS »
1914 1918 New Zealand Defence Force, Personnel Archives
There are also some articles in the Wanganui Herald re your O'Hanlon family living behind the racecourse and starving whilst the husband was dying of consumption. Worth a read. They give a frightening picture of the family's circumstances.
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=WH18851127.2.7&srpos=6&
e=01-04-1884-31-05-1900--10-WH-1-byDA-on--0O%27Hanlon--
Alan
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Thank you Alan - I was aware of the WW1 history of Wm Henry O'Hanlon, my grandfather.
The other part of your post was of course heartrending and something neither myself or my siblings were aware of. A great shock, of course, and no doubt the sadness of it will disturb us for a while yet. Indeed, those were very tough times for many who came from the other side of the world, fleeing as they did the constraints of the poverty of their Irish environment - only to end up victims of the destitution they were trying to escape.
I am so grateful they had some support in the last weeks of John's life. I am glad he received the comfort of the church in his final moments and I hope Elizabeth took some continued relief from the citizens of the town until she died in 1901.
We have had difficulty locating their graves/headstones and the report suggests they probably could not afford even a funeral let alone an headstone and possibly were laid to rest in a pauper's grave.
Since those frightening years the following generations, in a large part, did very well for themselves and I am sure John and Eliza would be proud of their progeny who finally achieved that which they had left Ireland for.... for their sakes.
Thank you
Jim
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Interesting jim
One of those first paper past links I gave you talked about the , I think, benovelent society, paying for his funeral. One of the names mentioned was Riordan who was my ancestor. It seems there was a strong little contigent of Irish in Wanganui then:)
Annie
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Thank you, Annie.
I couldn't see the segment you referred to but will do a search ........................ I wonder if John and Eliza ever met the Riordans....?
Jim
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Found it, Annie - and I see Mr Riordan listed. Obviously your ancestor knew my great grandfather and was a great help to the family in at traumatic time for them. Nice to know.
Jim
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Obviously your ancestor knew my great grandfather
Jim
And years later you two talking to each other ;D
Cheers
KHP
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Glad you found it Jim ;D
Just to add, Mathew Riordan was a baker so I'm sure your family had enough food which is reassuring.
LOL it is strange KHP ;)
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It all goes to show that the much heralded "Six degrees of separation" is probably closer to four degrees in a country of a little over four million.
Alan
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A very small world indeed.
Encouraging info, Annie, of the continued support from the Riordans which would have eased the O'Hanlon plight over the coming months and, by the time Winter arrived in damp Wanganui, the matter of the clothes would have perhaps been addressed too.
KHP reported earlier that by the 1893 Electoral Roll Elizabeth was settled in Liverpool Street with her 19 year old daughter Bridget and, presumably, with B's younger siblings, including my grandfather.
Interestingly, my sister found a WH School entry for the year when the concern about the O'Hanlons was being expressed - it was a Girls' School Prize List, Class III, of 1885 where a B O'Hanlon achieved x2 firsts and x3 seconds. Against all the odds we like to think that was Bridget and amidst all the darkness there was some light.
Jim
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Iam currently writing a history of CP O'Hanlon's hotel in Wanganui. Any relation to your people?
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Hi Shikyna
The CP O'Hanlon who ran the hotel in Wanganui is my great great grandfather Charles Patrick O'Hanlon
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Given CP O'Hanlon was your grandfather I would like to find out more about him! Would you agree to contact me on my home email (*)? The first letter is a small L for Laraine. I would love to have a photo of him and wonder if you have any of the hotel in his time? Cheers, Laraine Sole
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Hi Shikyna,
Emmamj will need to make another two posts to activate their Personal Message (PM) facility, after which they can send and receive PM's.
Even a couple of smiley's will do, Emmamj!
Congratulations on finding a family connection. ;D
Spades
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Hi Shikyna
Unfortunately don't have any photos of CP O'Hanlon but do have a timeline of his running and owning hotels in Wanganui/Auckland area plus some articles about his pubs - which you may also have.
Have not been able to establish when or why he originally came to NZ - he was the 17th pupil at Wanganui Collegiate School - although I believe this was an industrial school at the time - so he must have come to NZ with his parents. He married in Melbourne in 1862 and arrived back in NZ in 1863.
I will send another post and then we may be able to correspond by private email!
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Hi
I didn't query as to why you are writing about CP O'Hanlon - is it just because he owned the Hotels and you are writing about them generally or are you writing about CP O'Hanlon?
Some of the HOtels he had were: Empire Hotel; Brighton Hotel, Kai Iwi; new hotel on Taupo Quey; Pier Hotel; Hotel Keeper Karangahape Road, Auckland.
I have some articles about these so hopefully will be able to scan them to you, however you may already have them.
His ex-wife Rose O'Hanlon was also a hotel keeper - Railway Hotel, Hawera
From the info I have gathered he seems a rather "colourful" character!
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Yay - that would be awesome...and I might have some stuff you don't have. I will have photos of those hotels if you don't have them. Cheers, Laraine
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Hi, I am new to this site and have just read your discussions regarding O'Hanlon, a family I have recently been researching. This is what I have found thus far...
John O'Hanlon b. 1840 Kilkenny, Ireland
d. 1 Feb. 1886 Wanganui, New Zealand
married 21 Oct. 1869 at Kilkenny to
Eliza Gleespen/Glispin b. 1845 Ireland
d. 16 June 1901 Wanganui, New Zealand.
Their family...
Michael b. 13 May 1871 Gowran, Kilkenny
d. NZ?
William b. 13 Feb. 1873 Kilkenny, Ire.
d. 1876 New Zealand
Bridget b. 8 Nov. 1874 Ullid, Kilkenny, Ire.
d. NZ?
The family came to NZ aboard 'Howrah' departing London 31 July 1875, arriving in Wellington, NZ, 9 Nov. 1875.
John and Eliza O'Hanlon had 3 more children...
John b. 1876 NZ
d.
William Henry b. 1878 NZ
d. 1947 NZ
Philomena b. 15 Jan. 1880 Wanganui, NZ
d. July 1948 Rangiora, Waimakariri District, Canty. NZ
Philomena O'Hanlon married Christopher John Alexander Lawrence (1871-1939) - my Great grandfather on my mother's side.
On the Gleespen side...
Patrick Glispin b. c.1755 Ireland d. Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire.
married
Mary Harden b. c.1755 Ireland d. Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire.
their son
James Glispin b. 1778 Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire. d. Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire.
married
Margaret Bergin b. c.1780 Ireland d. Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire.
their son
Michael Gleespen b. c.1809 Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire. d. before 1864 Gowran, Kilkenny, Ire.
married
Mary Murphy b. (1809 Kilkenny)? d. (1875 or 1879)?
their daughter
Eliza Gleespen married John O'Hanlon...
Hope this adds something to your quest...
Regards
Verdy