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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Completed Lookup Requests => Topic started by: SueB on Thursday 07 April 05 09:50 BST (UK)
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Hi
Its me (SueB) still looking for the family of ABBOTT DURELL in Bethnall Green.
I have obtained the birth certificate of one of Abbott's daughters - ELIZA born 4 July 1853 at 25 Green Street, Bethnall Green.
Please could someone check who was living at this address as it has been given to me previously for this family but never confirmed. Abbott's wife Mary has the former name of BEFRAFT so maybe the Durell's were living with the in-laws.
Thanks in advance
SueB
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Hi
25 Green Street, Bethnal Green. 1540/139
Edward MAYCOCK / HAYCOCK? Head U 32 MRCS E?g LSA Surgeon & Druggist born Southwark
Elizabeth BROWN Servant W 48 General Servant born Southwark
Reyz
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Thanks for such a quick reply - even though it still doesn't seem to help me find my DURELL family.
Sounds as though it could have been a rather grand address if the occupier was a surgeon...............
SueB
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Perhaps he had a Surgery at that address and delivered your Eliza there by Cesarean or something?
Might be worth asking for a address look up in 1861 to see if Edward Maycock/Haycock is still living there?
Guess it wont find Eliza but might explain why that address. :)
Rey
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What a good idea. I have only imagined my family as very poor (Abbott is listed a beer retailer and was working as a stevedore when he died) not as if they could afford a surgeon to deliver a baby!!
There were 2 other children (11 and 13 in 1861), who are all listed as born in Bethnall Green but I have checked all the birth records without any luck....
Thanks for the suggestion
SueB
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Perhaps they were poor as they had to pay the Surgeons fees? :)
I need to look through that area soon and will keep an eye out for the name.
Good luck
Reyz
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Befraft is a very unusual name. There is not one on the IGI. Are you sure this is the right name? I looked in Bethnal Green and Whitechapel and there is no-one with that name. Can you put a copy on here so we ban look at it?
Sylviaann
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Thanks for your reply.
I am in the middle of changing computers and my scanner is "dead" so as soon it is up and working I will be back in touch.
Sue
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Hello
I'm doing a bit of housekeeping and wondering if this older request has been resolved in the meantime or you are still looking for the information? If the latter, do you have any further information to hand?
If I don't hear from you in a while I'll assume this is resolved and move it to the 'completed' section.
Regards :)
Biker
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I am still hoping for some help but since changing computers I have lost some records and haven't checked the site for some time.
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SueB
Another olde..............
Can you show us any census with your "Abbott" Durell family displayed please
As for "BEFRAFT" ..........BEF???? or is it BES??S? whatever it is it isn't BEFRAFT!
Bryant
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Thanks for your interest in this difficult-to-place family.......
The family are listed on the 1861 as DARELL/DURELL living at Old King Street, St Nicholas, Deptford (RG9/397 page 36.
1861
ABBOTT DURELL 40 stevedore
MARY A DURELL 38 wife
ABBOTT 11 son
MARY A 13 daughter
Eliza 7 daughter
MARY A (the wife) has a question mark LIMEHOUSE against her birth but the father and the rest of the children were born in Bethnall Green.
ABBOTT died in 1863 aged 42, he was born in Bethnall Green but I have been unable to make any links with the other DURELL families in Bethnall Green.
If you can shed any light on MARY "BEFRAGHT" DURELL I would be most grateful.
SueB
I have only been able to trace the birth of one of the children ELIZA who was born in 1823 and the mothers name looks to me like BEFRAGT but I can't send any image as I don't have a scanner.
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Is it possible that the name might be Becroft/Beacroft as it is along the lines of Befraft?
And if I look at Bethnal Green in 1841 the only 15-20 year olds (because of the 1841 rule ie 15-19=15, 20-24=20) are these who are all born Middx
William.........Richard........James........John
which one is Abbott...if any?
Bryant
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I went to a site showing "old writing" and I still couldn't decide what the letters were supposed to be.....
The Capital "B" is ok because the certificate has beer seller as occupation with a similar "B"
the next letter could be a "a" or a "e"
the next letter could be " double "S" but it looks more like a"f" and there is nothing to compare it with
the next letter is "r" - OK
the next letter is probably "a"
then the "double s" or "f" again
lastly the "t" which corresponds to others on the certificate
The three children on the 1961 were all born in the late 1840/1850's
Is there any mention of Abbott on the 1941 as I doubt if he would be married by then. He would have been 21.
Mary B.......... would also have been single aged approx. 19
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No sighting of Abbott with a surname that remotely resembles Durell!
So we are looking for three children in the 1961 census who were born in the late 1840's early 1850's..............so they would all be 110 + in age ;D
And then we are looking for an 120 year old Abbott in the 1941 census who is too young to have been married! :o
Find him we must...........before he gets any older ;D
Bryant
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Sorry about the typing errors - I did read the reply before I sent it as well !!
Thanks for looking anyway.
I wonder why his records all state born in Bethnall Green but he can't be found. I have found an Alfred Durell born in 1842 at S.Stoneham so maybe I'll try and get the certificate and see if it could be a mis-translation. A later Abbott Durell is shown on the 1901 as ALFRED...
If I can take a decent photo of the birth certificate I have of ELIZA DURELL b 1853 with Mary's maiden name beginning with B............. I will send it to you.
I feel this may be the only way to trace this family by the marriage certificate.
Thanks again
SueB
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Sue
after looking at it.....i'm with you, I tried to make it something different but I can't
I thought it might have been Groom Street but didn't find one in Bethnal Green... so I have to agree it must be Green Street!
ABBOTT .............can't argue
DURELL................. "
BEER SELLER.......... "
BEFROFT...............would like to argue...so will..........it looks like BEFROFT and the two "f''s" are identical.............but I think the first f is a mistake ie the registrar/clerk who transposed the info misheard or was somewhere else at the time!
you could sat it's a zzzzzzzzzz mistake but we wont go there :-X
I think Mary's name is BECROFT and you will find her in 1841 living at 13 GEORGE STREET, STEPNEY and living next door at number 14 is a family with a strange name....looks like DARRELL or DURRELL :o
Bryant
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1841
13 GEORGE STREET, STEPNEY
RICHARD BECROFT 45 LAB N
MARY " 45 Y
MARY " 15 Y
ANNE " 15 Y
ELLEN " 12 Y
ELIZABETH " 9 Y
ELIZA " 5 Y
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14 GEORGE STREET, STEPNEY
JOHN DARRELL 45 CARPENTER N
MARY " 45 N
THOMAS " 20 CARPENTER N
MARGARET " 15 N
WILLIAM " 15 Y
ANNETT " 10 Y
JAMES " 4 Y
---------------
1841 rule on age applies ie 10-14=10, 15-19=15, 20-24=20 etc etc
Bryant
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ABEL DURELL married MARY ANN BECRAFT .........MARCH QTR 1853...POPLAR
Got their in the end
Bryant
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How clever you are ...
I have just sent you a message saying I would look for their marriage and then another message appears with the info.
I must now try and find their dates of birth although I have tried Abbott's in Bethnal Green many times but if I get the marriage certificate it may give me a bit more info.
Thank you so much - just wish I had the logic to think the way you did.
Hope you don't mind me contacting you if I come across any other difficult problems.
SueB
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No promises...........but he may be older than Mary
1841
BOWERS FARM, COLESHILL, AMERSHAM, HERTFORDSHIRE
JAMES DORRELL 70 FARMER NO
MARY " 70 NO
THOMAS " 35 " NO
ABEL " 30 " NO
HESTER " 20 NO
_________
the only Abel Dorrell that I can see.............and as he wasn't born in Hertfordshire (NO)...now all you need is evidence ;D
Bryant
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I said no promises >:(
10th Sept 1808................LITTLE MISSENDEN, BUCKS
ABE DORRELL christianed...........parents JAMES & MARY
SO.......................if your AB* was born in Bethnal Green, Middx......he doesn't appear to be that one?
definitely not that one.........his brother Thomas was christianed 1804 at the same place and parents James & Mary (Langston) married at Monks Risborough, Bucks in 1794
Sorry
Bryant
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Having had a look around..........the Durell's
Saint Matthews, Bethnal Green could hold the key......be aware as many forms of Durell are there!
but I think you will need that marriage cert first 8)
Have fun
Bryant
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message from Sueb
I now have their wedding certificate and Abel(Abbott)'s father is listed as Richard Durell, a weaver.
The address for Abel is 10 Cottage Street but I don't know if it is Bethnall Green or Poplar. Mary Ann Becraft's father is John, a sailmaker and her address is 5 Wall Street, presumably Poplar as that is where the wedding took place.
Both are of full age so now I am hoping to find them or their parents on the 1851 or 1841 census or any parish records
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The PM I sent you with Richard Durell the weaver in 1841..... Abbot's/Abel's father.............Richard does appear a bit on the young side doesn't he?
ABEL DURELL married MARY ANN BECRAFT .........MARCH QTR 1853...POPLAR
Got their in the end
Bryant
1841
GROSVENOR PLACE, ST MATTHEWS BETHNAL GREEN, MIDDX
RICHARD DURELL 30 WEAVER YES
REBECCA " 25 YES
RICHARD " 5 YES
/
JOHN " 32 WEAVER YES
JAMES " 18 LAB YES
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1841
13 GEORGE STREET, STEPNEY
RICHARD BECROFT 45 LAB N
MARY " 45 Y
MARY " 15 Y
ANNE " 15 Y
ELLEN " 12 Y
ELIZABETH " 9 Y
ELIZA " 5 Y
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14 GEORGE STREET, STEPNEY
JOHN DARRELL 45 CARPENTER N
MARY " 45 N
THOMAS " 20 CARPENTER N
MARGARET " 15 N
WILLIAM " 15 Y
ANNETT " 10 Y
JAMES " 4 Y
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1841 rule on age applies ie 10-14=10, 15-19=15, 20-24=20 etc etc
Bryant
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SueB
If youv'e got those names of the happy couples father's the wrong way round I'm going to come down there and smack your bum..........
tell me you meant to say Richard Becroft and John Durell as per the 1841 census at George Street
Bryant
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Well.....
unfortunately it is Richard Durell, weaver and John Becraft, sail maker.
SueB
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SueB
That marriage cert was all based on the 1841 findings ie Mary Becroft aged 15 and the daughter of Richard Becroft
+
the family of John Durell living next door
name of witnesses at the marriage please
8)
Bryant
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I'm finding it hard to keep track here! Who is this one?
Richard Durell 39 Silk Weaver Bethnal green
Rebecca " 35 " Whitechapel
Richard " 15 " Beth grn
Martha " 4mths " "
KenB.
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If Richard with wife Rebecca are Mary Ann's parents where is she in 1841/51...I don't like it!
Mary Ann Becraft married Abel Durell in the Mar qtr of 1853........which means she would have been born no later than 1837........the marriage cert said she was of adult age (might be a fib?) which would make her birth no later than 1832 :-\ :-\ :-\
We need to find (if they are still alive?) Richard Becroft/Becraft aged approx 55 and also John Durell aged approx 55.....in the 1851 census....based on the 1841 census where they lived next door to one another in George Street, Poplar.
Unfortunately I don't have access to the 1851.............
I didn't find either in the 1861 census so I checked B/M/D and their are 3 x Richard Beecroft's that died in Middx 1841-1861............all at Stepney....two? in June 1852 and one in Mar 1854 so he should be around in 1851
Bryant
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Hi guys,
Is this any good to you? From 1851 on HO 107/1553 folio 795 page 4
At 11 Henry Street, Mile End Old town lower.
Richard BEECROFT head 56 labourer b Shadbrook Suffolk
Mary wife 55 b Stepney
Richard son 32 unm labourer b St Georges Middx
Mary Ann Merkhins? Dau widow 29 waist coat maker b Stepney
John Merkhins? grandson 3 b Stepney
Mary Ann's name has been transcribed as Mertkins.........but not sure myself ;D
Hope this helps
Carol
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Hi
Checked George Street in 1851
No one of those surnames - looks like FULLER & PATTEN
Check Cottage Street and Wall Street (think its WELLS Street) in 1851 again no luck, sorry.
Good luck..
Reyz
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Ahhhhh in Sept 1843 FreeBMD have a possible marriage between a
Mary Ann Beecroft and a Marten Mehrtens - in St George in the east.
Volume 2 page 37
Two of 8 names on that page of course ;)
They also have the death of a Martin Mehrtens in Stepney in June 1849.
Is this your girl...........?
Carol
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Carol
wrong girl......
message from Sueb
Marriage 1853
I now have their wedding certificate and Abel(Abbott)'s father is listed as Richard Durell, a weaver.
The address for Abel is 10 Cottage Street but I don't know if it is Bethnall Green or Poplar. Mary Ann Becraft's father is John, a sailmaker and her address is 5 Wall Street, presumably Poplar as that is where the wedding took place.
Both are of full age so now I am hoping to find them or their parents on the 1851 or 1841 census or any parish records
---------------------
Carol
I wanted him to change occupation.............but he is still a labourer
In the 1851 is their a John Becraft/Becroft/Beecroft living in the east end (Poplar, Bethnal Green, M.E.O.T, or somewhere within Tower Hamlets) who must be at least 35 and has an occupation of a sailmaker
Bryant
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Not that I can see Bryant- I've found one who's a brewer in a distillery ;) and another who's a floor cloth painter.
I helped someone yesterday,who's ancestor was a basket maker ! and yet daughters marr cert said labourer. Still trying to prove he's the right one....or not.
I'll have a coffee and come back to this later........it might wake me up more,this one sounds a lttle ;D complicated.
All the best
Carol
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10 Cottage St has a Lewis family in 1851.
Haven't been able to find Wall Street in either Poplar or Bethnal Green yet.
Will keep looking
Carol
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1853........ABEL DURELL married MARY ANN BECRAFT
Looking at the 1861 census Mary A or Abel/Abbott or Mary Ann & Abbott had children before they married in 1853.............now ...what if Mary Ann Becraft is actually Mary Ann "Mehrtens" and when she remarried she reverted to her maiden name.............it's beginning to look good (it isn't as you will find out later)
Carol..........you may well have cracked it
The family are listed on the 1861 as DARELL/DURELL living at Old King Street, St Nicholas, Deptford (RG9/397 page 36.
1861
ABBOTT DURELL 40 stevedore
MARY A DURELL 38 wife
ABBOTT 11 son
MARY A 13 daughter
Eliza 7 daughter
MARY A (the wife) has a question mark LIMEHOUSE against her birth but the father and the rest of the children were born in Bethnall Green.
ABBOTT died in 1863 aged 42, he was born in Bethnall Green but I have been unable to make any links with the other DURELL families in Bethnall Green.
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Perhaps Mary gave her surname as Mehrtens and the registrar couldn't spell it so he said oh s*d it lets have your maiden name :P
Carol
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SueB
Don't order any certs yet............ ??? is leading to more ???
It's official..............the plot HAS been lost...back to basics
Mary Ann Mehrtens (nee Becroft)
and
Mary Ann Bliss (Mehrtens)
are nothing to do with the family we are looking for.......are they :-\
Bryant
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Do we know who the witnesses were at the Durell/ Beecroft 1853 wedding?
Or have I missed that bit of this complicated saga 8)
Carol
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Waiting for SueB to supply them....requested yesterday
if we can find "ABBOT DURELL'S" birth circa 1850 (as per 1861 census) it can only help..............but is he Abbot and is he a Durell?
a few male Durell's were born 1848-1851 Middx.......obviously no Abbot
according to the marriage cert of 1853............Richard is Abel/Abbot's Durell's father.... their was a Richard Durell born Bethnal Green Dec qtr 1851 which doesn't appear likely as the person we are looking for was stated as being 11 in 1861....not impossible but unlikely
come in SueB ;)
Bryant
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if we can find "ABBOT DURELL'S" birth circa 1850 (as per 1861 census) it can only help..............but is he Abbot and is he a Durell?
Bryant
He's a flipping nuisance thats what he is............. ::)
No I don't think he was born a Durrell.........but we have a variety of possible names he could have been born as.
Just been reading back over Sue's previous posts- and way back in 2005 she mentions having Eliza's birth cert........was she born a Durrell Sue?
Hmmmm not getting very far are we?
Carol
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Eliza was a Durell...(mothers maiden name Becraft)....aged 7 in 1861...they married in 1853
Now............if Mary Ann Becroft/Becraft/Beecroft was a widow when she married Abel Durell
1/ it should state widow on the 1853 marriage cert
2/ she should be findable in 1851 with another Becroft as a husband and at least two children "Abbot" aged 1 and Mary Ann aged 3
3/ her father wouldn't be a Becraft as stated on the marriage cert............. :'(
4/ Abbot the father Abbot the son.............it makes sense and therefore logical that the two older children are his and not Mary Ann's............and Mary Ann's father is a Becraft
SueB..............stop whatever you're doing and supply those witnesses before we go mad :P ............Sue was last online at 9:42 yesterday evening >:(
Bryant
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Maybe the poor girl is still at work 8)
I have trawled through every Abbott(except Russ :P) born c 1850 on the 1851 census, but none have any of the surnames we have found so far.
And those people who have Smith or Brown in their trees think they have trouble ;)
Carol
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1793
RICHARD DURELL........BORN 1ST MAY 1793....CHRISTIANED 19TH JULY 1793....ST MATTHEWS BETHNAL GREEN.....PARENTS...RICHARD & MARY
SISTER...MARY ELIZABETH DURELL...BORN 23RD AUG 1794....CHRISTIANED 14TH SEPT 1794....AS ABOVE
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1820
RICHARD DURELL.....MARRIED....PHOEBE SMITH....28TH AUG 1820....ST DUNSTANS STEPNEY
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1841
GREAT GEORGE STREET, ST MATTHEWS BETHNAL GREEN, MIDDX
RICHARD DURELL 35 WEAVER YES
PHOEBE " 35 " YES
RICHARD " 15 " YES
MATILDA " 15 " YES
PHOEBE " 13 " YES
WILLIAM " 10 YES
ANN " 9 YES
MARIA " 6 YES
JOHN " 7 MONTHS YES
-----------------------
1841 rule applies ie 15-19=15
ABEL/ABBOT could be Richard.....then again he could have flown the nest?
1851....NOT AVAILABLE TO ME!
Sue...........witnesseswitnesseswitnesses
Bryant
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1851 QUEUE CAROL ;D ;D ;D
At The Flying Horse,32 West Street,Bethnal Green
RICHARD DURELL head 49 beer seller b Stepney
Phebe wife 49 b Shoreditch
Ann unm dau 20 b Spitalfields
Maria unm dau 16 b Bethnal Green
John 11 son scholar b " "
Henry 8 son " " "
So who's Abbott???
Hope Sue can read the witnesses names ;)
Carol
Edit..........just noticed son Richard is next door with his family. ;D
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1851 next door, son Richard............
33 West Street,
Richard Durell head 25 silk weaver b Spitalfields
Susan wife 25 " b Bethnal Green
Susan dau 6 scholar b Spitalfields
Richard son 3 b Poplar
Phoebe dau 2 b " "
Sarah dau 1 mth b Bethnal Green.
Bryant what does this prove? That Abbott is really Richard??
Carol
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I think we have the right Durell family ("Abbot's" parents & siblings).....Richard being the eldest child in 1841 and he is quoted as being 15 in 1841 and 25 in 1851 hence he was born circa 1825...........5 years after his parents married in 1820...........so their should be more children?
"Abbot" would have been born circa 1820 the year his parents married or early 1821?..............he is stated as being 40 years old in 1861 which is the only census we have him on..............
In 1841 "Abbot" has flown the nest >:( and is out there in the big wide World calling himself ??? and taking the Micky out of us
Bryant
witnesseswitnesseswitnesses?
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Richard Durell as seen with wife Phoebe in 1841 is not "Abbot's" father..........he is his brother!...........he and his brother James must have bee the last? children of Richard & Mary who produced children from 1793-1822 (29 years!) and all were christianed at St Matthew's Bethnal Green..................I don't actually like the 29 year bit but what is definite is..............
1820
HABBIT (ABBOT) DURELL...born 15th April 1820...christianed 2nd July 1820....St Matthew Bethnal Green...........parents Richard & Mary
+ a brother
JAMES DURELL ...born 26th Oct 1822....christianed 17th Nov 1822....St Matthew Bethnal Green......parents Richard & Mary
------------
Bryant
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Well Bryant,
Who's a clever boy then? 8)
Now you say that,how about this birth.........
Habbit DURRELL in Bethnal Green Dec 1849 Volume 2 page 24.
Sue obviously isn't a sad genealogist like us is she..........not been online for over a day now :o
Carol
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That looks a good cert for Sue's collection..............Habbit Habbit.....Habbit Habbit Habbit
In one of my earlier replies I found these..............
1841
GROSVENOR PLACE, ST MATTHEWS BETHNAL GREEN, MIDDX
RICHARD DURELL 30 WEAVER YES
REBECCA " 25 YES
RICHARD " 5 YES
/
JOHN " 32 WEAVER YES
JAMES " 18 LAB YES
--------------------
James aged 18 appears to be the brother born 1822 of Habbit who was born 1820.................
the 1849 birth of Habbit holds the answer to Habbit (senior) in as much ....has he been married before he met Mary Ann Becraft or did they have children before they married in 1853?
Bryant
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I feel really guilty that I have been away for a couple of days celebrating my birthday while you folk have been so diligently searching for "my" Abbot.
Wedding certificate: Mary Ann Becraft is full age and her condition is Spn (presumably spinster).
The witnesses are John Becraft and Mary Ann Becraft.
I like the connection with beer because I have been told Abbott was at the White Swan ,24 Wappin Wall in 1855 and at the Earl of Chatham in 1859. these came from Pubsindex but are not confirmed with the 1851 as there is an Elizabeth Dornay? as the licensed victualler at 24 Wappng Wall.
Also in 1876 there is a M A Durell, a beer retailer at 57 Great Green Street.
Thank you all for taking such an interest in this family.
SusB
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Sue
You are not excused.......... ;D your profile shows your age as N/A
But if you can wangle another £7-00 out of someone you are going to need the 1849 birth cert of HABBIT DURELL
The possibility is that Abbot (Habbit) born 1820 had been married before he ever met Mary Becraft and whom he married in 1853......
Is it a coincidence that a HABBIT DURELL was born in Bethnal Green in 1849? the likelyhood is he is the son of Abbot and the cert will display where he is living and the maiden name of his wife
Bryant
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Hi
I was just going to let you know that I have also been doing some work tonight!!
I've found 7 children belonging to Richard and Mary - Richard, Mary Elizabeth, John, Richard (do they replace the names when a child dies?) Sarah Hannah, HABBIT,James and John ...
Since I began this family's tree I have had a sheet of B,M,D's of Durell's and it has finally come into some use BUT it never would without your help. I certainly would never have thought of HABBITT as ABBOT or even ABEL.
I did send for Habbit's and Mary Ann's birth certs when I got the parents marriage one. (No expense spared in this household) details as follows:-
19.09.1849 HABBIT. father Habbit Durrell,(laborer)mother Mury Durrell formerly Beacroft
8.06.1847 Mary Ann Clara, father Abbot Durrell(coal whipper) mother Mary Durrell formerly Beacroft
2 Apple Street, BG
So I think they must have been pretending to be married which must have been quite daring in those days - unless there is another marriage pre 1849.
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Sue
Methinks he wasn't married before he met Mary Ann (change of opinion) now that you have told of the two births pre 1853...........
Now...............if you had told us that before >:(
I could understand you wouldn't associate Abel........but HABBIT/ABBOT
Replacing a child's name because of death was a common occurence.......Iv'e seen the first three boys all given the same name .....as the first died ......... another and he died....then finally one that lived
It is rare....... but is far from unknown to have two living children with the same christian name in large families
Bryant
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I can' see the 1851............ ;D I do have discs but i'm sure some nice young lady has got online access QUEUE CAROL ;D ;D ;D
IF YOU CAN'T SEARCH BY STREET NAME input SMITH or BROWN...BETHNAL GREEN and then search for APPLE STREET ............ the theory being their is normally a Smith or Brown in every Street ;)
are they at 2 APPLE STREET, BETHNAL GREEN in 1851
Bryant
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My husband was born in 1950 and given the name of his brother who had died(at 9 mths old) 2 years before.This was from an Irish family,where it was almost compulsory ;) to have a son called Patrick ;D
So are you saying Sue that you had Habbit/Abbot's 1849 birth cert all along?
Carol
Flipping heck Bryant - I ain't gonna get any ironing done today either!!!
So what surname are they under in Apple Street?
Can't search that well known website under street names ::)
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I have searched the Street index on 1851
No Apple Street
Appleby Street Shoreditch
No number 2 written in but think it is a an error
Roughly where no 2 is :
William HANS 40 born London Finsbury
252/ 26a / p29
So hope it helps.
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I too have the CD roms but as Reyz says there isn't an Apple Street ???
Where are you getting this info from Bryant?
Can you give us a reference please.
Carol(half way through the ironing ;))
EDIT - I have just looked through an 1848 map of Bethnal Green too and again there is no Apple Street- any chance you could scan the relevant portion of the birth cert Sue and post it here? One of us(or more) could give you a second opinion on the street name.
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On 2nd looks I don't think it is Apple Street. I'm not much good with this fancy script writing used by Thos.Howard the registrar on all my family's birth certificates........... His capital A for Abbott is definitely not like the first letter in this street name. Sorry for all the confusion.
It could be O - G or Y - P or K - E.
I will have to get someone else to scan the cert and email it to me and then I'll email on to you again. Shall I send Mary Ann Clara's as well? I'm wondering if the marriage cert of Abel Durrell and Mary Ann Becraft is really the Habbitt Durrell after all....
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See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=191822.new#new
for a possible of siting of them in 1851.
Wouold appreciate others thoughts on this,the enumerators writing leaves a lot to be desired 8)
Carol
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Hi Sue
Am coming into the lively Durell discussion a bit late but only just found it whilst Googling. A great relief to find someone on the trail of the same Durells as me. I belong to Sarah Hannah b 1818 (I believe she's my Sarah anyway).
Sarah Durell married James Buckingham 28 January 1838 at St Matthew Bethnal Green. Sarah's father Richard Durell, weaver. James's father David Buckingham, writer. James lived 7 Grosvenor Place BG; Sarah lived 4 Park St BG.
James and Sarah's first son James Edward Buckingham born 22 March 1838 at 7 Grosvenor Place BG. In 1841 census James and Sarah at 83 Wheler St BG with Mary Durell, 60, weaveress. As you know, same census has Richard and Rebecca Durell with son Richard, plus James and John, at Grosvenor Place. No house number, but it's the seventh household from the beginning of the street on the form....
In 1851 census James and Sarah are at 53 Holywell Lane Shoreditch and with them is Mary Durell, widow, 67, weaver. You probably won't have found her in the index as "they" have indexed her as Mary Dyrell.
Given that my Sarah's father was Richard (marriage cert) and that Mary lived with Sarah till her death (1850's), and that Sarah is aged 32 in the 1851 census, I am as certain as I can be that she is Sarah Hannah Durell b 1818 to Richard and Mary, and thus sister to your Abbott. Also, James, John and Richard Durell (with Rebecca nee Bain) living at Grosvenor Place 3 years after my Sarah and James lived there, places them all neatly as your Abbott's siblings.
Only fly in the ointment is that Habbitt Durell's baptism shows "female" (can't remember where I saw this now but will look it up again later). This threw me for a while when I was also looking for your Abbott.
Sorry I didn't get into this earlier as I could have saved you all that faffing about with the other Richard Durells - there is a whole other branch getting in the way of ours at BG! Can fill you in on those if you like, but to be honest it's really good to be getting somewhere with MY Durells for a change (keep helping other people with THEIRS!)
There's more to say on all this but hope you're still out there ... how far have you gotten since those earlier postings c 2005?
Kim