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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: Scanger on Thursday 16 September 10 14:38 BST (UK)
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Hi - Newbie here :) I would appreciate some direction - researching my Dad's lineage I have managed to get back to Thomas (maybe James) Yates b 1818 Clerkenwell (a Hatter) just can't get back any further than I believe his father was also Thomas (a chair maker) from Spitalfields (found on son Thomas's wedding certificate.
I have also found his son James 'disappears' from a couple of censuses i.e. born 1847 Hoxton - he's nowhere in 1881 & 1891. I know he's alive as he turns up again aged 69 as a night watchman.
Any suggestions?
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Hi (and welcome to RootsChat !) :)
Can you elaborate on how you found "Thomas (maybe James) Yates b 1818 Clerkenwell (a Hatter)" ?
I can find no trace on the 1841 or 1851 censuses. It's best to tell all you know, so we don't try to find stuff that you may already know. Can you also tell us more about son James - what year was he born and where ?
Can you give census refs of where you have found the family ?
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RG10; Piece: 588; Folio: 15; Page: 23 Poplar
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Thanks for the welcome :)
The info I have so far mostly gleaned from ancestry.co.uk & IGI is as follows:
James was born 10 plumber Street Hoxton New Town - 11.06.1847
1861 errand boy 11 Wilkes St? Tower Hamlets
1871 Lived 1 Hatfield Buildings, Tower Hamlets - Dock Labourer
Baker in Ewell Road, Long Ditton on 1881 census (sorry I said he wasn't on 1881 - meant 1891).
The details I have on Thomas are as follows - Hatter. 1861c Wilkes Street Tower Hamlets. Has him down as a law stationer on James second wedding certificate in 1878, also names him as James not Thomas - think this is an error.
Married Ann Gravenor East London 1859(her husband had also been a hatter). His Father also named Thomas - Chair maker. B \SpitalfieldsChristchurch, Middlesex? 1871 c.lived
48 Pollard Row, Bethnal Green
Thomas (73) & Ann (75) 1891c -living in 9 Colchester Terr, Angel Lane West Ham.
I haven't got the certifictaes in front of me at the mo.
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Forgot to add that Thomas married Mary Ann Bryant Lambeth Vol 4 281 Jul quarter who died between 1856 & 1859 (when he married Ann Gravenor)
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Also - (I have the brains of a rocking horse today) - James was married twice, firstly to Jane Warren who died c1872 & married Hannah Jeffery b. Croydon in 1878
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I found Thomas' baptism.....
St John the Baptist, Hoxton.
Baptism date: 4 July 1847
Birth date: 11 June 1847
Father's Name: Thomas Yates Occupation: Hatter
Mother's Name : Mary
Address: Plumber Street
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Here they are in 1851.....
Thomas Yates, Head, 32, Hat Maker, Clerkenwell, Middlesex
Mary Ann Yates, Wife, 25, Marylebone, Middlesex
Thomas Yates, Son, 7, St Pancras, Middlesex, England
Mary Ann Yates, Daughter, 5, Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
James Yates, Son, 3, Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
Charlotte Yates, Daughter, 1, Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
HO107/1536, Folio 267, Page 3
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So, if Thomas Yates was born 1818/1819, his father would have been born somewhere around 1788 - 1798.
Here's a possible candidate.....
Thomas Yeats
Burial 9 Nov 1834
Age: 44 (b. abt 1790)
St Mary, Whitechapel, Tower Hamlets, Middlesex
He was residing in the London Hospital, Whitechapel when he died.
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Possible parents:
Thomas Yeats & Mary Ann Humpreys
Married: 31 MAY 1817 Saint Bride Fleet St, London, London, England
Baptisms:
THOMAS JOHN YATES, Christened 31 MAY 1818 St Bride Fleet St, London, London, England
Parents: Thomas Yeats & Mary Ann
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Thank you for your help Nick :)
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No problem :)
I got the info in my last post from the IGI, incidentally. And if you put in the batch number from the entry of Thomas John Yates into the relevant box, and just put the surname Yates in, it brings up another Yates birth in the same area, but different parent's names, but could be part of the same family.
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Hiya,
I just wanted to get in touch to give you a side shoot to this family, as I was looking into the marriage of Thomas Yates born 1818 to Ann Gravenor nee Smith, as she is my 3x Great Grandmother from her first marriage.
Thomas and Ann are together on the 1871 Census along with her son Charles Gravenor and their daughter Ann Yates in Bethnal Green. Ann was aged 9, born circa 1862 in Spitalfields, Middlesex, but so far I have not been able to trace what happened to her afterwards.
Just thought you would be interested, if you didn't know already.
Regards,
Natterjack
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Hiya,
I just wanted to get in touch to give you a side shoot to this family, as I was looking into the marriage of Thomas Yates born 1818 to Ann Gravenor nee Smith, as she is my 3x Great Grandmother from her first marriage.
Thomas and Ann are together on the 1871 Census along with her son Charles Gravenor and their daughter Ann Yates in Bethnal Green. Ann was aged 9, born circa 1862 in Spitalfields, Middlesex, but so far I have not been able to trace what happened to her afterwards.
Just thought you would be interested, if you didn't know already.
Regards,
Natterjack
Hi - haven't been on here for a while -so thanks Natterjack. I have this information already. Did you know however that Ann's Father was John Smith b 1787 Upminster Essex. He was a seaman & is a boarding house keeper of 37 Betts Street, St Georges Tower Hamlets (1851c) :)
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Hi Scanger,
I had known her father was John Smith born 1787 in Upminster, Essex. Up until yesterday that was all I had known. Then I found various websites with one stating about the boarding house at 37 Betts Street, but nothing about him being a seaman. If you have information about that, I would be interested, including any other children he may have had. If you have discovered this of course. I have at some time in the past, found reference to a son also named John born in 1821, but not further information there. I've also not been able to find a marriage between him and his wife Rebecca.
I have however found this website: http://www.readhistory.co.uk/family-trees/chapman-smith/direct.htm#I74
Which states his father's name and his two wives and their children and also more about the family of John Smith's mother.
Though not everything I learned yesterday is on there. I also have a website you might be interested in. www.therobinsfamily.tribalpages.com
Thank you for getting in touch.
Kind regards,
Natterjack
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Hi Scanger,
I had known her father was John Smith born 1787 in Upminster, Essex. Up until yesterday that was all I had known. Then I found various websites with one stating about the boarding house at 37 Betts Street, but nothing about him being a seaman. If you have information about that, I would be interested, including any other children he may have had. If you have discovered this of course. I have at some time in the past, found reference to a son also named John born in 1821, but not further information there. I've also not been able to find a marriage between him and his wife Rebecca.
I have however found this website: http://www.readhistory.co.uk/family-trees/chapman-smith/direct.htm#I74
Which states his father's name and his two wives and their children and also more about the family of John Smith's mother.
Though not everything I learned yesterday is on there. I also have a website you might be interested in. www.therobinsfamily.tribalpages.com
Thank you for getting in touch.
Kind regards,
Natterjack
Hi again
I only know that Thomas Yates had 6 children with his previous wife. Ann's previous husband I thought was named Richard (not sure why, will have to dig through my records) also a Hatter & Ann was a hat trimmer. The only children I have for Ann is Rebecca b 1846 & Charles b 1850. Thank you for the other links I will have a look at them. I'm sorry but don't know anything about John's time as a seaman. :)
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Hi again,
no worries about not knowing about John's time as a Seaman, I just thought it would be worth asking in case you do.
I'm a descendant of Rebecca (my 2 x Great grandmother), so I have quite a bit of information about her on my website including her birth date, baptism, marriage and some of the Census records during her marriage and subsequent children. I just don't seem to know much about where she was before 1871, though I presume she was with her mother and step father Thomas Yates. Until yesterday I didn't even know she had a step father and half sister, hence the interest now.
Again thank you.
Kind regards,
Natterjack