RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: jacklyn13 on Wednesday 15 September 10 13:33 BST (UK)
-
I'm attempting to trace an ancestor Charles Thomas Edwards who I know lived in Queensland in around 1884/1885. He had two sons:
John Charles Edwards born around 1884 on Galway Downs Station, Qld
Charles Thomas Edwards born around 1885 in Windorah, Qld
The problem is mainly that I don't believe he actually married the mother of his children, Louisa Elizabeth Lawraunce (born around 1862 in NSW). Extensive searching for a marriage have failed and I know she was born in NSW so I feel fairly safe in assuming its an Australian marriage. I suspect that this is the reason his children do not have registered birth/baptism certificates. I've therefore found it impossible to find out when he was born, who his parents are and I'm not sure of when or where he even died. The occupation listed on his son's death certificate has him as a carpenter.
There are several Charles Thomas Edwards returned in my Ancestry searches but they don't seem to match up with the dates and locations.
Using Ancestry I've located an electoral role entry that has a Charles Thomas Edwards in Nanango, cabinetmaker, up to 1908 but not thereafter. Lousia married a John Clarke in 1887 so I'm not able to use her to confirm his identity.
Does anyone have any ideas about I might go about tracking him down?
thanks
Jacklyn
-
Jacklyn,
1900 Qld ER has
Edwards Charles Thomas
Joiner
Alice St
Maryborough Qld
A joiner works with wood so it might be him!
Also residing were Arthur Edwards ( no occupation) and John Edwards Railway Clerk.
Regards
Gerry
-
Hello Jacklyn .
Welcome to Rootschat :)
You say you have one of the son's death certificates. Does it say whether the father was alive or deceased on this certificate ? What year did the son die ? Who was the informant on that certificate ?
have you got Louisa's Death certificate and if so is Charles listed on that at all ?
Did either of the sons marry and if so do you have their marriage certificates ?
Regards
Alison
-
Welcome to Rootschat from me too ;)
Queensland Insolvencies
Brisbane Court, Charles Thomas EDWARDS, of Toowoomba, occupation : Undertaker
25 August 1883; 13 September 1884; 18 October 1884;
and then
18 December 1886 Charles Thomas EDWARDS of Brisbane, occupation : Contractor
1903 Electoral Rolls in Queensland
I can see three chaps at three different locations, all named Charles Thomas EDWARDS .... none were noted as Undertaker.
Cheers, JM
-
~Aussie1947 - I hadn't found the Charles Thomas Edwards at Maryborough! May I ask what 1900 Qld ER is?
~alison2763 - His son's death was in 1949 so Charles Thomas may or may not be alive at that point (its not specified). The informant on the death certificate is his wife and the Coolullah Station manager at Cloncurry. I'm still trying to trace Louisa, I think I've located her but I'm trying to make certain before I order the certificate. Both her sons married and I have John Charles' certificate. He's listed as being a labourer and and living at Camooweal. His father is listed as simply Charles Edwards and his occupation is Drover. Which is a contradiction to the death cert....
~majm - Contractor's a pretty generic term...it could be him...do the insolvencies give a location at all?
Thank you all for your welcome and help!
-
Hi Again,
I have edited my earlier post to highlight the townships noted on the index I found ;) (Toowoomba for the Undertaker and Brisbane for the Contractor)
I think cabinet makers, carpenters, joiners etc would have the trade skills to make coffins and thus the Undertaker may be worth following up. Also "Contractor" in that era may well indicate Drover.
Oh, as I understand it, if "deceased" was not recorded against a parent's name on a death certificate, then that parent may have been alive at that time, and of course information on a death certificate is only as reliable as the informant's own recollection which if given by a family member would be at a time of grieving.
Cheers, JM
-
Hi Again ;)
On the Qld BDM online, that index has 17 May 1948 death for a John Charles EDWARDS, but his parents are named as Charles and MARY. Reference 1948/C1167 *C being country as opposed to B for Brisbane.
Also, perhaps the Charles Thomas EDWARDS of Toowoomba married in 1882
http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/3407515
Several mentions of various Charles Thomas EDWARDS in the newspapers http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/home
Cheers, JM
-
~majm - I'm pretty sure John Charles Edwards died in the 1970's (based on what little information I've been able to get from relatives). I'm attempting to get more information from them but it hasn't been particularly successful.
The Thomas Charles Edwards in Toowoomba appears to be a merchant who I found through an electoral roll search. My search of the Newspapers of the NLA suggest he went insolvent in 1884 (I think you have him listed as an undertaker? the NLA search had him as a grocer). He appears to have married a Clara Holt in 1882 and he seems situated in the Toowoomba area rather than further out west. I don't think its him...although I can't exclude the possibility he might have been a travelling salesman with a roving eye.
I'm going to request the death certificate for Louisa as I'm sure that I've located her correctly. If there's more info on it I will post it. I've done several searches on the NLA for Charles but I keep getting the guy from Toowoomba.
Luckily my other ancestors haven't been this hard to find!
-
Hi there,
I've access to an index for Qld Govt Gazettes, and the index has his occupation as Undertaker ;D He is indexed as Charles Thomas EDWARDS ... Could the Thomas Charles Edwards, the grocer be someone different again ?
I thought you mentioned a 1949 death for his son, so I take it, this was the other son - one named Charles Thomas, ;), sorry ... however, that 1949 document may well be indicating that Charles Thomas (the elder) was still living at that time ;)
~majm - I'm pretty sure John Charles Edwards died in the 1970's (based on what little information I've been able to get from relatives). I'm attempting to get more information from them but it hasn't been particularly successful.
The Thomas Charles Edwards in Toowoomba appears to be a merchant who I found through an electoral roll search. My search of the Newspapers of the NLA suggest he went insolvent in 1884 (I think you have him listed as an undertaker? the NLA search had him as a grocer). ....
From the Index for Qld Gazettes re the Undertaker, Charles Thomas EDWARDS ;)
Pg 612 for 25 August 1883
Pg 955 for 13 September 1884
Pg 1405 for 18 October 1884
http://www.qfhs.org.au/ Website for Queensland Family History Society ... Have you been in contact with them to see if they have info in your chap ... ;D
Cheers, JM
-
Thanks for everyone who's offered clues! I've located an elderley relative who may be able to throw some light on the mystery ancestor.
I suspect he is the cabinetmaker in Nanango but I will be going out to speak to my relative in the near future and I hope to post the results (which I hope to get).
It will be interesting to see where he fits into the information offered by the various rolls and gazettes.
Thank you so much for your help.
Jacklyn
-
Hi there,
When you meet your elderly relative perhaps you may consider asking for any knowledge of any WWI AIF service for either of the two sons of Charles Thomas Edwards ... I notice that among the digitised records at the National Archives of Australia there's a Charles EDWARDS aged 31 on enlistment in March 1916 (born 1884-5 !) His place of birth is recorded as Mt Perry, Qld and his next of kin is his step-brother, whose surname is recorded as DAVIDSON ... Mt Perry is a long way from Windorah and Galway Downs Station but perhaps Charles and Louisa's sons enlisted and their records among the WWI digitised records at the NAA. ;)
The link for records search is : http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/recordsearch/index.aspx search as a guest
I haven't found the 1949 death indexed at the Qld BDM online .... although I can find it indexed at ancestry under ref 003010 page 647, as Charles Thomas EDWARDS, with parents recorded on that index as Charles Thomas Edwards and Louisa Elizabeth Lawrence. Do you have copy of that certificate ?
https://www.bdm.qld.gov.au/IndexSearch/mainMenuSubmit.m?main_menu=IndexSearch
Fingers crossed that your conversation with your elderly relative works out well for both of you :)
Edit to add Re Louisa Elizabeth, have you considered the 1856 birth registration for Louisa E Lawrence at Bathurst NSW, ref 3253 showing her parents indexed as Charles P and Mary ....
Cheers, JM
-
Hello
Louisa Lawrence married John Clarke a Drover in 1887. Her two sons John Charles Edwards, and Joseph Charles Edwards changed their surname to Clarke. John Charles was also noted on his Death Certificate as Charles Thomas Edwards known as Joseph Clarke. This man was my Husbands Grandfather. He was killed by a horse on a Station at Cloncurry. His brother Joseph Charles Edwards was known all his life as Jack Clarke!! It took me months to find the Death Certificate... I doubt if Charles and Louisa were ever married. Louisa had a Hotel in Camooweal for many years. I do have a photo of Louisa. I hope this information has been of some help. Carol
-
Welcome to RChat Carol
I am sure that Jacklyn will be delighted to make contact with you via the RChat's Personal Messages method.
You will need to make three posts so that you can exchange private information.
Just reply twice more on this thread will get those 3 posts.
Cheers, JM
-
Thanks majm
I've sent Carol a message, I had almost given up with this relative!
Thanks to everyone who has given me help with this
Jacklyn
-
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/31658732?searchTerm=%22Charles%20Thomas%20Edwards%22
- how about this fellow, died in 1924 aged 60, listed as a carpenter, aka "Alf Edwards"
-
Jorose
Thanks for the suggestion. I had wondered if he might had found his way out of Queensland but the name is so common it makes it difficult to tell if its him or not.
I hadn't considered though, that he might also have had a nickname.... I know his sons went by different names but I hadn't considered that their father might also go by a different name or nickname.
thanks for the idea
Jacklyn