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Independent Islands => Alderney, Guernsey, Jersey, Sark => Topic started by: jduggan on Wednesday 08 September 10 20:28 BST (UK)
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Hi
I am tracing my Bosanquet/Bosankoe family history and I know a family lived in St Helier in King Street Jersey and they were cigar makers, can any one fill in any more details, the son was an Edmund Bosanquet and was a muscian.
Jayne
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Could you tell us what kind of info you are looking for BMD? Census?
and also tell us what information you have - it will save doing duplicate look ups
is this the family
31 King? St St Helier Jersey CI
John Bosanquet head M 35 Cigar manufacturer England
Elizabeth wife 34 England
Mary Ann daughter 16 cigar maker England
John son 13 Cigar maker England
Elizabeth daughter 10 England
Joseph son 8 England
Edmond son 5 St Helier jersey
Matida daughter 2 St helier Jersey
RG9 4394 7 7
Suz
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this looks like them in 1851 (name written as "Bosanke")
1851
John St
St Geo in the East Middlesex
John Bosanke Head M 26 Cigar maker St Geo in the East Mx
Elizabeth wife 25 Walworth Suurrey
Mary daughter 6 Stepney Mx
John son 3 Limehouse Mx
Elizabeth daughter 6 mths St Geo in the East
HO107 1548 175 3
I'll wait now until you tell us what info you have already
Suz
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Thanks for the prompt reply, yes they are the ones, rather unusual trade as the children made cigars too, not sure why they went to Jersey, Elizabeth Jessy Bosankoe was my great nan and they lived in Jersey for a while, then returned to London, she married a James Pemell who was a cabinet maker, are you related to this family Jayne
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I am not related - just happy to do look ups
Cigar making wasn't that unusual a trade
1841 John Bosanquet was an apprentice cigar maker - then he became a cigar maker and he must have moved to Jersey between the birth of Joseph and the birth of Edmond and he became a cigar manufacturer with 2 apprentices (I suspect the 2 apprentices were his children :Mary Ann and John)
Is there any parrticular information you are looking for??
to save us looking up info you already have???????
Suz
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It looks like John had the middle name of Richard??
Do you require his baptism and marriage reg??
Suz
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Hi I have a lot of the details, but if you are interested in look ups the Pemell side of the family,are very interesting and the Bosankoes in Cornwall thanks for your time, Jayne
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I still am not sure what type of information you are looking for????
You original post asks "can you fill me in on any more details"?
We need to know what information you have already -or any specific details you are looking for????????
Where do the Cornwall Bosanquets fit in - I can't find a connection so far?
What is the connection with the "pemell" side ???
Suz
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Hi edmund bosanquet there son was a well known musician anything about him as his nephew charles Pemell was a jazz musician in the thirties Jayne
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Hi edmund bosanquet there son was a well known musician anything about him his nephew charles Pemell was a jazz musician in the thirties Jayne
Hi
Could you please please state what information you already have -you have asked for "anything about him" - previously you did this then stated "I have a lot of the details"
On this site we love to help people with their research - but require more definate requests, as looking up information can be quite time consuming and is very frustrating if it turns out to be a duplicate look up for information you already have.
If it is the musical careers of Edmond Bosanquet and Charles(Charlie) Pemell you are seeking -rather than their family history -then if you put their names into a search engine you get quite a few hits
Suz
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Hi Suze thanks for your help with this, its mainly the Bosanquets in Jersey I am interested in, it does not help that they changed the spelling of there surname,they come from Bosankoes from Camelford in Cornwall there was a cigar maker called Joseph Bosankoe who went to Australia on his own and may have been part of the family, since my mum sadly passed away I have no one to refer to so many thanks for your time on this Jayne
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The family which moved to Jersey only had (as far as I can see) 2 children born there . They moved to Jersey between 1853-1856
By 1881 father John had died and widowed mother Elizabeth had moved back to England and was living with son Edmond
I will post all the relevant census etc shortly
I cannot find a connection to the Cornwall family yet
Could you tell me which Cornish family they are descended from = name and y.o.b. would help
Suz
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Just been looking at your tree on ancestry and I think you have made an error somewhere along the line
You have father of John Richard (the one who went to Jersey) as Joseph Bosankoe b.c. 1804
then you have the father of Joseph as Richard John b.c. 1800!!!!!
I don't think he would have a son only 4 years older than him???????
Suz
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Hi Suze I have to update a lot of the tree I work in a busy hospital I have certificates apologies for the mis match they are an interesting tree and moved about a bit my nan was a dressmaker as were some. Of the uncles and lived in the east end of London thanks for your interest Jayne
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Hi Guys, The bosankoes mentioned in Jersey in 1851 are the correct family, John Richard was the father and was 26 at the time, he was born in 1825, his father was Joseph, who was the son of John Bosankoe and he was born in Camelford Cornwall in 1768. He was one of at least 4 children Elizabeth the eldest, Richard first son but second born, John, and Charles the youngest who died in Plymouth in 1818, I have a copy of his will. John Richard died in 1884 in the stepney workhouse. He farther ed two more children Henry Cornwall in 1864, and Rosina Alice Bosankoe in 1867. The John aged 16 years is John Joseph who was a cigar maker, but became a master tailor. He married in 1868 Alice Susannah rogers, and they had 7 children. I am descended directly from this male line, and can trace my name to Cornwall, and earlier to Holsworthy Devon The earliest descendant is thomas Bosanco married in 1721. Edmund was a musician and the family returned to Hackney between 1861-64 when Henry was born in Hackney.
If anyone can help with earlier ancestors of mine that would be great.
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Thanks for the reply, it seems they travelled a lot and tailoring was a big feature of there trade, my nan Rosina who's mother was Elizabeth Jessy Bosankoe/Bosanquet was a Tailoress in Kentish Town but she also a singer and knew Marie Lloyd, they seem a very large family at some point, I presume this makes us some sort of cousin, I would love to know where they originated from as the name Zenobya Bosanco has cropped up. Jayne
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Hi Jayne, it's Steve, actually Elizabeth Jessey was the second daughter of John Richard named I believe after his father Joseph's second wife, the first daughter was Mary named after Joseph's first wife who died in 1830, probably after childbirth. Joseph then married Mary's sister Elizabeth at the end of the same year 1830. Joseph was the second son, and the third child of John Bosankoe the tailor they had at least 5 children three daughters and two sons, Anne Elizabeth, Maria Jemima, Mary Anne, and Richard John, Joseph's brother. Joseph's father was John Bosankoe and he hailed from Camelford in Cornwall, he married Margaret Bushby, he also had two brothers, and one sister, his father was Richard and in turn his father was Thomas Bosanco, this guy was married twice, the second marriage and offspring relate to Elizabeth Jessey, and the second wife was Honnour Tardrew.
He had a son from the first wife Elizabeth Doble, and he was named John, and then a further four sons with Honnour, Thomas, Richard, William, Charles. Richard is the direct line to Elizabeth Jessey, and it was his son John who became a tailor and moved to London. All the Children of Thomas where born in Holsworthy Devon.
Back to Elizabeth Jessey's father he married a hatters daughter Elizabeth Anne Robbins. His father Joseph was a barkeeper, and perhaps this was what lead to cigar making initially.
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Hi is this the Steve I already know or another Steve?
Also I think were I find I come unstuck is where they have married
more than once and also some of the children have similar names
Its interesting to see that they went to Jersey to carry on the cigar
making and also had it as a family trade, I also found a travelling
Richard Bosankoe who went ot Australia noted on passenger list
as a cigar maker but he travelled alone I know some of the Pemells
migrated there so perhaps they met up, there must be other relations
around I have been in contact with Barry which has been helpful,
So we are what percentage Cornish are we then ???
Thanks for your time Steve
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Hi Jayne it's the Steve you already know, as for the Richard that travelled to Australia it could be Joseph's brother or a son of his, because there were a number at one time in the cigar trade, as for the percentage Cornish or Devon I have no idea, in fact the name bosankoe was registered on documents until 1891 on the census,and on birth certificates etc. My guess is that the family changed the name in fact in 1818 Charles bosanquet is named in his will as Bosanquet at that time but this took a while for the London branch to catch up. In 1869 John Joseph still a cigar maker had a son John Williams and Bosankoe was the name they still used at that time, and again in the 1881 census they still used Bosankoe, but then in the 1891 census they were all Bosanquet. John Williams married in 1893 and was then Bosanquet and a Tailor at this time John Joseph his father was listed on the marriage certificate as Tailor., John Williams was my great grandfather. I also have the birth certificate for John Joseph the second child after Mary and before Elizabeth Jessey was born on 28th of August 1847 John Richard's occupation is Cigar maker, in Stepney London. I also have a copy of the marriage certificate for John Richard and his profession is Cigar maker, his father Joseph Bosankoe has the prefession of Publican documented, and Philip Robbins the father of the bride is a Hatter. Elizabeth Ann Robbins was the wife. They married in Stepney, and it was the 25th of December Christmas day.
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Hello Jayne & Steve,
Im so excited, I delved further into the messages between you two and have found another 100years of relatives. Thankyou so much for all your hard work.
To summarize...
Thomas Bosanco of Holsworthy, Devon married Elizabeth Doole in 1721. Do you have his birthdate?
Richard Bosankoe
John Bosankoe (tailor) of Camelford, Cornwell b? married Margaret Bushby. He moved the family to London
Joseph Bosankoe B 1804 Publican "The Free Trader" in Stepney and a cigarmaker.
Name change to Bosanquet in 1818 by Charles and again in 1891 Census.
M Mary who died in 1830 and then married her sister Elizabeth.
John Richard B 02 FEB 1825 m Elizabeth Anne Robins 1843 in Stepney. She was a hatter's daughter b 1827.
Then there is John Joseph b 28 AUG 1847 who married Alice Susannah Roghers in 1868 and Louisa Henrietta Rymer in 1906. Steve, Jayne & myself descended from Susannah & John Joseph..
John Williams, Elizabeth Jessey and others including
my grandfather was Edward James Bosanquet b 1883 - the youngest son of John Joseph.
My father Cyril Joseph Bosanquet b 1920 London, moved to
NZ in 1946.
Just to complicate matters I am "doubly related" as Mathilda Selina Bosanquet who was John Josephs sister, born in Jersey in 1859 married Henry Onslow B 1854 of Cheshire.
They had two children Henry Bosanquet Onslow and Annie Maud Onslow.
Edward my grandfather and Annie were first cousins and they married in 1905. They had 8 children but only 4 reached adulthood and of those 4, one died with no issued and between the other three - Violet, Lily & Joseph there were only
5 children. Im the youngest at 57 and the others are in their
late 60's.
I am in touch with John David Bosanquet, his sister Sue and
their father John Charles Leslie Bosanquet - although not for some time so I do hope John Charles is still alive. They are of the John Williams lineage of which I think you are Steve.
I heard that John William and Edward (my grandfather) both fell in love with the same women but John being the older by 20 years won out and that caused a major rift between the two brothers who had clothing companies opposite each other but they never spoke again or so the story goes. On the rebound Edward married Annie who was boarding with them and who could make a delicious steak and kidney pudding!
I didnt know my grand father and only met my grand mother when I visited England as a 9yr old. It was not till my Father passed away in 1982 that I found out I had a brother and sister and with the help of my Onslow relations and the Salvation Army traced them and now am in touch with them.
Incidentally if you need info on the French side I have that and have visited previous residences/villages in the Languedoc where the Bosanquets hailed from. The challenge is trying to piece together from 1600's to 1700's and when Thomas parents perhaps arrived in England and was it via the Channel Islands. Do you have any more information on their arrival in England? I have info relating to David Bosanquet b 1661 in Lunel who came to London in 1686 via Geneva. But we must be from a different line. I have info going back to Pierre who died in 1554.
My great great grandmother Mathilda Selina (John Joseph's sister) was born in Jersey but that wasnt till 1859 and I dont know why they went there, do you?
I look forward to hearing from you and acknowledge once again your work to date. Thank you.
Kindest regards,
Jolene
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Hi Jolene
Well you have been busy, now I understand why the family fell out I know my mum spoke to Ted a bit and Sydney went to Hong Kong, I think he was in the police or fire service and died in a fire, my mum used to play with Vi and Ted used
to have a very dry sense of humour.
Stev has been a great help this has been years of research getting this family linked up but has been worth it, thanks to the internet and sites like these it has been easy to link up.
my niece went to the Northern territories so which part of NZ are you from also which woman did they both fall in love with.
If you can email me that would be great or ask Steve for my email address and are you or your family on facebook we can exchange photos, Barry Bingham is another relative he descends from Edmund who was born in Jersey.
So pleased to hear from you, I am 52 and have 5 children ranging from 27 to 12 I work as a HCA in Bath.
Looking forward to hearing from you cousin
Jayne Duggan
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Hello Jayne & Suze,
I am Jolene Bosanquet and I live in New Zealand/Cook Islands. Jayne. I sent a long email to you and Steve last night about where I fit in to the family.
I've done research from the other end viz the french connection but have a gap from from mid 1600's to when Thomas Bosanco pops up in Holsworthy, Devon and marries in 1721. With all the Johns in the family it would be logical to assume we come from a Jean Bosanquet.
But why does the name Thomas suddenly appear when we have so many Jeans/Johns?
The Bosanquet/ de Bosanquet/Bouzanquet, Bousanquet and Boussanquet family came from the Languedoc Region in France. They were Hugeonots and many left there to avoid persecution in the 1600's, others turned Roman Catholic to save their lands. I have the info of the family in that area and family trees of Bosanquets who ended up in England, specifically London. But it would appear our branch of the Bosanquet family went to Devon and then Cornwall and finally to London in the 1700's. I believe their name was changed to Bosankoe or Bosanke or Bosancoth probably to avoid undue interest had they kept the french Bosanquet spelling.
Records have a Pierre Bosanquet born around 1505 in Colognac and died in 1554. His son Pierre settled in Lunel.
Then we go into the Jean's for many generations.
The question is did they travel via Jersey en route from Lunel/Colognac in the Languedoc (Southern France) or go
directly from say Brittany to Devon?
Perhaps we should be looking for Bosankoes/Bosankes from mid 1600 to 1700 in Jersey? Was there a census at all during this time?
Why did the branch of the family go there in the late 1850's and have two children borne there? Were they returning to where family had been in the 1600's escaping persecution?
Mathilda Selina Bosankoe b. 1859 was my Great Grandmother. She married an Onslow and had two children -Henry Bosanquet Onslow and Annie Maud Onslow(my gran).
Annie then married her first cousin Edward James Bosanquet , son of John Joseph. John Joseph and Selina were brother and sister.
Another twist is the name Bosanketh/Bosancoth recorded in Cornwall as early as 1525. However it is fact that many Hugenots settled in Cornwall.
What we need to know at this stage is any record of Bosanquet or Gaussen or Coste (as these families intermarried several times - or Bosankoe, Bosanke in Jersey 1600's to say 1720?
Thankyou Suze for your advice so far.
Await to hear the next installment.
Kind regards
Joles (Jolene)
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Hello Jayne And Joles,
Thomas Bosanco married twice first to Elizabeth Doble 30 January 1721, and they had John Bosanco born in Holsworthy devon, and then second to Honnour Tardrew on 26 Dec 1727 also in holsworthy Devon, four sons were born from this marriage, Thomas 1731, Richard 1734, William 1736, and Charles 1739. There could have been earlier children between 1727/1731 and probably were. Also there could have been more from the first marriage, unfortunately I cannot help with a birthdate for thomas, though I have seen potential fathers of the same name born around 1680 in the vicinity. Richard born in 1734 married Elizabeth Nee Dunn and they had at least 4 children Elizabeth 1763, Richard 1766, John 1768 the direct male line to me, and Chales 1770 who died on or about the 8th of July in 1821, and his name was Bosanquet on his will, a copy of which is in my posession through the good work of David Bosanquet my cousin. We have no idea why John Richard moved for a while to live inJersey,Edward james born 1883 and a brother to John Williams my great grandfather who married in 1893 when Edward would have only been ten years old, so I doubt the rift was caused through love of the same women. My father prior to his death had travelled to the Languedoc region and met with locals in search of family history links. David bosanquet 1661 is not from our particular lineage, and the name change is still a mystery.
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Hi all Bosanquets/Bosankoes
Thanks for all the info. I have spent more time researching this family than any
of my other family, it is a bit of a jigsaw but it is definately worth it, many thanks
to everyone