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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Merionethshire => Topic started by: ArwelONeill on Saturday 07 August 10 23:50 BST (UK)
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Searching for any information about Elizabeth (Leusa King), my grandfather's mother. The attached picture is of her. She had only one leg and quite possible that she may have had a wooden leg.
I know that she once lived in Dolrhedyn and also 111 Manod Road. Her husband, John Ellis Jones was born in Treherbert by all accounts, but unsure if Elizabeth came with him or was she born in Ffestiniog...?
Her husband had died by the time my grandfather (Glyndwr Morris Jones) was married on 5th Oct 1935. I cannot find any reference to them in any census, am unsure of dates of births as yet and also unsure where they are buried!
As I await for family members to come back to me with some info, I thought I would try here...just in case!
Thanks all!
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Hi
Can you explain the Leusa King? Was that her maiden name or her middle christian names
When did she marry John Ellis Jones
What year was Glyndwr Morris Jones born
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Hi, sorry to be so vague! It's late here and I have very limited info I'm afraid. I spent most of this afternoon trawling through the local cemetaries in the pouring rain but found nothing!
Leusa can be short for Elizabeth and King was a nickname given to her. She had a daughter, Nancy also nicknamed King.
Glyndwr was born in 1913, could be in treherbert, Glamorganshire or up here in Ffestiniog. He had sisters, Myfanwy, Nancy, Anne Jane and brothers Richard Gwaenydd and John Maldwyn. There may have been others as some of the older generation local people thought she may have been married up to 3 times (or had children from 3 different fathers!)
Elizabeth must have died around 1955 but I don't have a clue when she married John Ellis Jones!
Sorry I don't have any further info at the moment. I'm awaiting a reply on facebook from my late mother's cousing, he should be able to shed some light on the situation!
Thank you for your time
Arwel
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Hi
Not sure if this is any help but there is a birth registeration for a Glyndwr M Jones, Jun q 1913, Pontypridd v 11a p 1389
Mother's maiden name is Morris so I'm putting two and two together and suggesting that Elizabeth was Elizabeth Morris.
Have you got approx dates of birth for the other children?
Gadget
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There is also this birth
Births September qtr 1913
Glyndwr M Jones mmn Morgans Merthyr Tydfil 11a 1782
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Yes - saw that Carole- but given that Glyndwr's middle name was Morris, I put two and two together, as I said.
Also, just checked and Treherbert is in the Pontypridd RD.
:)
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Thank you to you both for your efforts.
I've just received messages on facebook now from a member of family I have not yet met! She told me where she thinks that Elizabeth is buried, with her daughter in a small village not far from here. I will be popping down there in the morning to have a look and will let you know.
Arwel
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I know that Richard Gwaenydd Jones died aged 31 in 1930. I also know that he worked in Liverpool, England. I don't know what his job was though. He is buried here in Wales, along with my grandfather and two of my grandparents children.
Hi
Not sure if this is any help but there is a birth registeration for a Glyndwr M Jones, Jun q 1913, Pontypridd v 11a p 1389
Mother's maiden name is Morris so I'm putting two and two together and suggesting that Elizabeth was Elizabeth Morris.
Have you got approx dates of birth for the other children?
Gadget
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Hi again
Are you sure that John Ellis Jones was b. Treherbert and not in North Wales?
Gadget
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:)
I've done a wee bit of investigation and I think that this is possibly Leusa in 1891:
109 Manod Road, Ffestiniog (no 111 on this census - it goes 113, 112, 109)
RG12/4645/57/37
John Morris, 57, Rockman (slate) , b. Caernarvon
Laura Morris, 58, b. Gwynfryn
Dorothy Morris, 20, b. Ffestiniog
Elizabeth A Morris, 14, b. Llwyngwril
John Morris, 11, b. Ffestiniog
and in 1901:
2 South End, Ffestiniog
RG13/5258/99/18
Jane Davies,wid, 61, grocer-shopkeeper, b. Bethesda
Elizabeth Ann Williams, d in l, 24, b. Llwyngwril
Jane Ann Williams, 2 months, b. Ffestiniog
Richard Price, son, 21, slate quarryman b. Caernarvon
Jane Ann Price, d in l, 20, b. Ffestiniog
Gadget
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There is also a possible family on the 1881 in Ffestiniog - Conglywal - RG11/5550/66/31 but it's slightly out.
I think that the 1891 John and Laura are her grandparents - on the 1871 RG10/5696/60/28, they have a son, John, who fits the father on the 1881.
Here's the 1881, anyway:
Conglywal, Ffestiniog
RG11/5550/66/31
John Morris, 27, quarryman, b. Dyffrun (?Dyffryn)
Ann Morris, 25, b. -do-
Elizabeth Anne Morris, 4, b. -do-
John Morris, 1, b. Ffestiniog
Gadget
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Hi again :)
Forgot to put these details up ~ probably John Ellis Jones and first wife in 1901
92 Woodfield Terrace, Llanwonno, Pontypridd
RG13/5005/45/29
Jones
John E, 34, repairer in coal mine, b. Caernarvonshire
Ellen, 31, b. Merionethshire
Jane E, 8, b. -do-
Ellis W, 7, b. -do-
Richard G, 4, b. -do-
Edith W, 3, b. -do-
John Williams, boarder, 19, repairer in coal mine, b. Montgomeryshire
William J Owen, boarder, 19, -do-, b. -do-
Gadget
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Thank you all for your help.
They are the right family.
Arwel ;)
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Just as a note for you - I have slate mining ancestors from Garndolbenmaen and FFestiniog who then moved down to South Wales - Treherbert in fact - but then they travel backwards and forwards between North and South Wales living with grandparents and then back to parents - this is all the way through to the 30's when my immediate line moved back up to Garndolbenmaen; some of the other lines stayed down South but others moved back North.
I had a really hard time trying to find one of my G grandmother's "Mary Ann Lloyd" in 1911 finally found her by trawling through the census for Blaenau looking at her mother;s siblings and where they were - thankfully one was called Moses - so didn't cost me too many credits ! She was living in the house as part of an extended family with him, his father (her grandfather) an aunt and cousins born in Treherbert.
I think that there was a regular movement to and from - My eldest Aunt (b 1918) basically said that the grandparents up North needed help and it was one less mouth to feed down South.
nesta
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Diolch Nesta,
Elizabeth (Leusa King) moved down to Pontypridd with her children and John Ellis Jones (while she was still married to her husband, Hugh Williams) and lived with John Ellis and his children, as his house keeper.
She fell pregnant in 1913 with my grandfather, her and John Ellis first child together. They married later that year again, while she was still married to Hugh Williams!
Elizabeth later moved back to Ffestiniog with her children, leaving John Ellis and his children from his first marriage down in Pontypridd.
By all accounts, she never went back to Pontypridd after this time and settled in Ffestiniog until her death around 1950 ish. I'm yet to find her grave! I've made numerous visits to cemetaries all over and have failed to find her! Some say she was married again after John Ellis and that her surname would have been Griffiths!! I've also heard an account from my elderly neighbour saying she remembers Elizabeth fighting in the streets with other women, over a man! What a woman!
Arwel
Just as a note for you - I have slate mining ancestors from Garndolbenmaen and FFestiniog who then moved down to South Wales - Treherbert in fact - but then they travel backwards and forwards between North and South Wales living with grandparents and then back to parents - this is all the way through to the 30's when my immediate line moved back up to Garndolbenmaen; some of the other lines stayed down South but others moved back North.
I had a really hard time trying to find one of my G grandmother's "Mary Ann Lloyd" in 1911 finally found her by trawling through the census for Blaenau looking at her mother;s siblings and where they were - thankfully one was called Moses - so didn't cost me too many credits ! She was living in the house as part of an extended family with him, his father (her grandfather) an aunt and cousins born in Treherbert.
I think that there was a regular movement to and from - My eldest Aunt (b 1918) basically said that the grandparents up North needed help and it was one less mouth to feed down South.
nesta
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You're telling me what a woman - My G Grandmother had 2 children (Nain being one) before she married my step (!) ggrandfather; I was an adult when my Mum finally told me where her Mum was born - knowing the area I'm sure you can guess where and then Nain was known by several variations of her name Lizzie Lloyd ! Lizzie Evans, Elizabeth ......and on. She was actually registered as Elizabeth Lloyd - I must get her certificate and see if there is a father there ! She married as Lizzie Evans and named her stepfather as her father. The grave I am looking at is her elder brother's. Apparently he did quite well for himself.
Maybe we should compare notes on Blaenau families - this side is my next project.
Hwyl
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Interesting Nesta! Isn't it amazing to find out what our ancestors got up to, even if some of the stories make us cringe!!
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But wouldn't it be boring if they were all staunch and upright chapel goers !
N
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It certainly would!
Incidentally Nesta, Either a son or maybe grandson of Elizabeth was a 'gweinidog' in Cricieth I'm sure. He had a son called Ioan...or was it Ioan who was the minister, I'm not sure. But in Cricieth anyway!
Arwel
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I know them - the grandson was called Idwal and the son was the minister. The son is still alive, so will continue on pm.
N
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Hi there Nesta, I hope you had a good Christmas...?
I was just wondering...I was reading back your replies and I noticed the name Lizzie Lloyd. Did she move to America in 1903? Now although I have not checked the dates or any other details, I know that a young Lizzy Lloyd was travelling to America from Liverpool, aboard the 'Umbria' with my G G Aunt Catherine in 1903. The passenger list states that she was from Blaenau Ffestiniog.
All the best for the coming year to you Nesta.
Regards,
Arwel
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Hi Arwel - no she didn't move to America ......unless she came back but there are no family stories about her going to America.
Thanks for your best wishes - one of my resolutions is to try and do some more family history !
Blwyddyn Newydd Da
Hwyl
Nesta
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It must be a coincidence in that case Nesta as I'm sure you are aware that names in Blaenau Ffestiniog were commonly used over and over again! In fact I remember my Nain from Manod, talking of a Lizzie Lloyd...but being so young at the time, I didn't take much notice of what was said about her!
I have a 10 year old Lizzie Lloyd travelling with my Gr Gr Aunt Catherine on the 22nd August, 1903. According to the record, Lizzie's Aunt, another Lizzie Lloyd paid for her ticket and she would have met her off the boat in New York. That Lizzie lived in Louth Street, Utica, New York.
Diolch Nesta.
Arwel
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Thank you all for all your help.
Having trawled endlessly through many a cemetary in all weathers, I have found Elizabeth Anne's grave! It is unmarked, which is probably why I couldn't find it! She's buried in Bethesda cemetary, Blaenau Ffestiniog with her 3rd husband.
Regards
Arwel