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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Kerry => Topic started by: ashleighn19 on Sunday 04 July 10 07:45 BST (UK)
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Hi there,
I'm looking for any information about the Kelly family. I believe William was born abt 1819 in Killarney and married a Mary.. they had 4 children, Elizabeth b. 1847 and Dinah b. 1849-1850 before immigrating to Australia in 1850 abord the Trafalgar. They then had 2 more children after arriving.
I'm looking for any parish records, and any information on Mary's parents and also William's.
Thanks
Ashleigh
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Many Co. Kerry parish records are available (free) on http://www.irishgenealogy.ie/, including Catholic and Church of Ireland details for Killarney.
Shane
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Hey Shanew,
I can't seem to find any of my relatives on there from the dates etc that i have already. anywhere else i could look?
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that's the best online source for Co. Kerry parish records - and they seem to have RC records (I presume the family were likely Catholic?) for the parish of Killarney back to about 1785, which is the same date as the microfilm records in the National Library
Shane
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okay. thanks for that Shane. I'm so sorry its taken me so long to get back to this, I found info on other parts of the family and got sidetracked.
i think i need to take things a bit slower.
thanks again!
Ash
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Hi Ashleigh ! I do not know how much you know but I hope this helps.
Isabella was my Great Grandmother.
She was the daughter of William and Mary Kelly of near Saddleworth, William Kelly was born in Killarney, County Kerry in about 1819. He and Mary, with daughters Elizabeth (3) and Dinah (1) came to South Australia in 1850 on the barque Trafalgar. Isabella was born in 1852 in Salisbury S.A., and a brother William James Kelly was born in 1856 at Saddleworth. Elizabeth Kelly married George Crawford and they had 8 children. Dinah Kelly married Andrew Grant Johnston: they had 3 children but only one seems to have had offspring. Isabella became the 2nd wife of Stephen Wellington who was initially married to a Jane Johns.
William James Kelly married Henrietta BERTHA Bray and they had 6 children all born at Clare.
My second cousin, Carolyn Palmer, found a useful book called "Saddleworth: Hub of the Wheel", which gave me a lot of information about the descendants of Elizabeth Kelly and George Crawford. They have prolific offspring, mostly still around the Saddleworth area, and Carolyn has been able to purchase her own copy of the book. George Crawford and his son seem to have been active in every committee and post in Saddleworth over many years, and many businesses up there bore the Crawford name.
For Dinah Kelly and Andrew Johnston, Carolyn has found names of a grandson who died in 1973. I have yet to discover whether he continued the line or not.
For William James and Henrietta Bertha, Carolyn has knowledge of a couple of generations, but once again there is more to discover.
My great-grandfather Stephen was the Circuit Minister at Saddleworth/Kooringa for 2 different terms, and his first wife Jane Johns ( who I mentioned above ) and one of their infant sons are buried in Saddleworth. He was the officiating minister at the wedding of Dinah Kelly and Andrew Johnston, and Isabella was the bridesmaid at this wedding of her sister. At this time, Stephen would have been married to his first wife Jane. He was also one of the Executors of his Father-in-law's Will.
I hope all this helps. What is your relationship with the Kelly's ?
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Hi Pahern,
Sorry it has taken me so long to reply, I've been run off my feet in the last few weeks. It is sooo good to find a rellie (even distant ones) on here. :) very exciting.. also means if we both ended up on the same board, the info we have is more than likely correct!
I have all the information that you have provided me, but again it is verification that we are right!
I have actually spoken to Carolyn a few times through ancestry, and she also suggested that book which I have recently purchased. It is fantastic! such a wonderful resource and extremely well written.
I have information on Isabella and her family.. PM me your real name and I can see if I have you in my tree.
Elizabeth Kelly married George Crawford, who had a son, John William Crawford. John married Emma Traeger and had three daughters. My Grandfather's mother was the second of these daughters. So I'm pretty sure that makes Elizabeth my great great Grandmother :)
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Regarding the family of William and Mary Kelly of Saddleworth, I offer the following corrections.
Elizabeth Kelly married George Crawford, and they have numerous descendants in South Australia and elsewhere.
Dinah Kelly married Andrew Grant Johnston of Butchers Gap (between Saddleworth and Marrabel). Of their 3 children, only Mary had children. Mary became the 2nd wife of George Stephens. Their son Leonard George Stephens (who died 1973 in Hamley Bridge) leaves a widow and 4 children, also grandchildren and great-grandchildren.
Isabella Kelly became the second wife of Rev. Stephen Wellington, and they had 6 children (this is my branch of the family).
William James Kelly remained a bachelor and had no children. This was confirmed by his death certificate: he died 11.11.1915 near Saddleworth. The Kelly surname for our family died with him.
Originally I thought that the William James Kelly who married Bertha Henrietta Bray in Clare was related to this family, but he is not the right one, and his 6 children are not connected to our Kelly family.
Carolyn
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I've a Kelly too. Ellen Kelly born in Ireland about 1819/20, as shown on the 1841/1951 census. She married a William Redding who was born in 1921 in Birmingham. Not too sure date of marriage, can't find on UKBMD. They had 3 children, Thomas (b1842), Elizabeth (b 1847) and George (b 1851), George was my 2 times great grandfather. Children were all born in Birmingham (Digbeth). George was christianed in St Catherines Roman Catholic Church. William is shown as a soldier on the birth certificate, and on the marriage certificate of George and Sarah Ann Davis. Just wondering if Ellen and William could have married in Ireland if he was serving over there? Any help would be appreciated. :D
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My KELLY family would have been Protestant and Methodist. In South Australia they were known to belong to "Primitive Methodist" church.
I would love to find anyone from Ireland who knows of William and Mary, who sailed to South Australia in 1850 with daughters Elizabeth (then about 3) and Dinah (about 1 year old) aboard the Trafalgar. I have searched briefly for Elizabeth and Dinah in the births, but there were too many to search through quickly.
S.A. records show William born c 1819 in "Killarney/Leix/Queens Co." This baffles me as the map shows Killarney in Co. Kerry is in the south west, Leix/Laois/Queens Co. is in the midlands. Can anyone shed any light on this please?
Someone from S.A. Genealogy here in Adelaide has done a project on the Trafalgar immigrants, but couldn't find this family at the time.
Carolyn
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S.A. records show William born c 1819 in "Killarney/Leix/Queens Co." This baffles me as the map shows Killarney in Co. Kerry is in the south west, Leix/Laois/Queens Co. is in the midlands. Can anyone shed any light on this please?
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Killarney is a town in Co. Kerry, but there are also several townlands with the same name in counties throughout Ireland (e.g. Wicklow, Kilkenny & Roscommon). None that I see are located in Co. Laois (Queens).
See the townland database at : www.thecore.com/seanruad
Shane
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Thanks Shane,
I had wondered whether Kilkenny may have been misread as Killarney. Carolyn
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Thanks Shane,
I had wondered whether Kilkenny may have been misread as Killarney. Carolyn
Kilkenny doesn't really fit with with the "Leix/Queens Co." part of the place name, as it's a separate county... although it's a neighbour of Co. Laois.
maybe it would an idea to post an image extract of the document in question, showing this placename to see if anyone can decipher it ?
Shane
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Thanks for that. It is printed in a book "Biographical index of South Australians" so someone has already collected it as information and it has been printed as such. I don't know the original source. Carolyn
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It would be worth trying to trace whatever Australian BMD certs you can find for the family, to see if you can gather any further clues regarding location and other details.
Kelly is a very common surname in Ireland, it was the second most popular surname after Murphy in the 1890s. To trace your particular family you will need all the documented clues you can find to ensure you follow the correct line.
Shane
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Im also a descendant of the aformentioned Kelly family.
William and Mary Kelly. The only original source ive found in South Australia was the passenger list that says Queens County.
One issue is a maiden name for Mary... I tried looking for birth certificates in Australia for the 2 children born there. Isabella and William James. Isabellas birth doesnt have Mary's maiden name. The issue for WJ (b1857) is that there are 3 ppl with the same name that ended up in the Saddleworth area.
One WJ born in Clare in 1857 in Clare is listed in some ppls ancestry tree is the right one. However birth records say his mother is Margaret Miller. Whilst Margaret and Mary are at least interchangeable in my Scottish research it seems less likely. The other born Gawler Plains (like Clare is realistic for someone ending up in Saddleworth) has a mother listed as Mary Dunn. I found a marriage record for William Kelly and Mary Dunn in Queens County Ireland. So i think this is very possibly the right people. Also noteable is that in South Australia they were associated with the Methodist church. The Irish marriage was also protestant rather than Catholic. see attached.
Then, ive got my father to do a DNA test via ancestry and this links with several people descendant from William and Mary Kelly as expected. I also searched for the above surnames and didnt really get anything for Miller but loads of Dunn results, again, not conclusive but lends weight to the theory.. Whats very interesting is that there are a couple matches with people that in their trees are descended from a different set of Kelly's. Initially not so surprising given that its a popular name. However i see that there is also a William James Kelly in their family tree i initially thought it was the one born in Clare but this fella was born in 1860 in Adelaide and then had a child Richard J Kelly in Saddleworth. So there are now 3 WJ Kellys in the one small town!
I cant say for sure that my relation to this person is via this Kelly link but i cant see anything else in their seemingly well researched tree that gives any other possibility.
So, theres the possiblity that some of the different Kelly's in Saddleworth are infact related.
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Then also, the shipslist original version lists a James Kelly as having paid the deposit for the passage of William and Mary Kelly to South Australia on the 1849 Trafalgar.
Thinking that James Kelly is a relative that had already migrated. A quick look shows there are multiple James Kelly's that migrated prior to 1849. One of which ended up in Riverton, but he was Scottish not Irish. Still trying to work that out but records are spotty.