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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: shelby4178 on Wednesday 30 June 10 07:45 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I'm looking to find any information on my grand parents. As my father was not close to his family, I've found it hard to get anymore information than just very basic.
I know where Annie and Edward are buried and born, but when I try and date it back further than their parents, I'm getting stuck.
I have tracked down some information on QLD'S BDM and NSW'S BDM and have not been able to find a marriage certificate between them, although I have found that she was married previously to a man called "Arthur Jehan Austyn" maybe "Austin".
My grand mother's name was "Annie Frayne (May) Seery" also known as "Williams" we are not sure if or where "May" came from. My grand father was "Edward John Victor Williams" from Peak Hill NSW.
Any help will be much appreciated,
Michelle :)
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Can you give us the dates for them please and where buried!
Annie
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Hi!
Yes, here is the information on where they were buried and dates:
Annie: Rockhampton, Queensland, Australia Birth Certificate number 1898/11504 BDM QLD ???
Morpeth NSW Australia Death Certificate Number 61910/1972 BDM NSW ???
Edward: Peak Hill, New South Wales, Australia 27049/1894 Birth Certficate Number BDM NSW ???
Maitland, New South Wales, Australia Death Certificate Number 6843 /1973 BDM NSW ???
I also have information on my father's siblings and little information on Annie and Edward's parents. This is where I seem to hit a wall as I'm beginning to think that they were never married.
Cheers Michelle ???
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Electoral rolls show:
1919
Williams, Edward John Victor, drover, at Canoona Junction, via Rockhampton
1930
Williams, Edward John Victor, labourer with Annie May Williams, hd, at Derribong St, Peak Hill
1943
Williams, Edward John Victor, farmer, with Annie May Williams, hd, at Crawford River (subdistrict Bulahdelah)
1949
all at 67 Swan St Morpeth, all surname WILLIAMS:
Williams, Edward John Victor, carrier with Annie May Williams, hd,
Amy Ethel, machinist,
Arthur Victor, butter factory hand,
Edy Dorothy, factory worker,
So it looks as though Edward and Annie were together and using the same surname by 1930
Judith
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There a couple of trees on Ancestry, 1 may be yours?
Neither show a marriage to Edward, just lots of children :D
Annie
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National Library digi newspapers show a voluntary bankruptcy for an Edward John Victor WILLIAMS, labourer of Union St South Lismore 1924
http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/16185442?searchTerm=edward+john+victor+williams
Judith
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Hi Michelle,
If you would like some help to search , you will need to share the information which you do have. This needs to include all dates you have, names and locations
when I try and date it back further than their parents,I'm getting stuck Michelle
I also have information on my father's siblings and little information on Annie and Edward's parents. Michelle
Arthur was married before ANNIE SEERY
QLD
In 1916 Reg.3399 Randell Ivy Maude to Austyn Arthur Jean
Sue
PS please do not post details of living people
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Wow thankyou for all of that information! you are gems! I have the information which you found Judith where they lived in Swan St, this is all correct. I was fasinated to read about the bankruptsy.... interesting
Father: Edward J V WILLIAMS
Mother: Annie F SEERY (middle name of MAY also used)
Children:
Amy Ethel Williams, Annie J Williams (eldest), Arthur Victor Williams, William J Williams, Edy Dorothy Williams 1928 – 2007, Edward J Williams 1930 – 1995, Robert Stanley Thomas Williams 1938 – 2002 (my Father)
ANNIE F WILLIAMS (nee SEERY)
1898
Birth
Rockhampton, Queensland, Australia Birth Certificate number 1898/11504 BDM QLD
1919
Age: 21 Residence
Fitzroy, Capricornia, Queensland, Australia Australian Electoral Rolls, 1903-1954
1921
Age: 23 Marriage to Arthur Jehan Austyn
Qld, Australia Add Media 1930 (This information is what i'm not sure about but the dates ad up)
Age: 32 Residence
Peak Hill, Gwydir, New South Wales, Australia 1930's voting records for Annie and spouse Edward J V Williams in Peak Hill1 Australian Electoral Rolls, 1903-1954 A 1949
Age: 51 Residence
Maitland East, Paterson, New South Wales, Australian Electoral Rolls, 1903-1954
DIED: Morpeth NSW Australia Death Certificate Number 61910/1972 BDM NSW
EDWARD J V WILLIAMS:
1894
Birth
Peak Hill, New South Wales, Australia 27049/1894 Birth Certficate Number BDM NSW
1930
Age: 36 Residence
Peak Hill, Gwydir, New South Wales, Australia Australian Electoral Rolls, 1903-1954
1974
Age: 79 Death
Maitland, New South Wales, Australia Death Certificate Number 6843 /1973 BDM NSW
Is that ok? Thankyou Michelle
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Hi Michelle.
1919 Electoral Roll
Box St Baldercline (Kennedy District)
AUSTIN Arthur Jehan - Lengthsman
1922 Electoral Roll
Yeppoon Rockhampton North (Capricornia District)
AUSTYN Annie Frayne - Home Duties
Oak Steet Barcaldine (Kennedy District)
AUSTYN Arthur Jehan - Lengthsman
So they are not living in the same place by 1922. I wonder if this was for employment reasons or if the marriage had failed. I note in your opening request you refer to Annie as
"Annie Frayne (May) Seery" also known as "Williams"
"Known as Williams" would seem to indicate to me that there was no marriage.
Can you please remove the names of living persons from your last post (for privacy and security reasons) Thank You.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,368728.msg2632620.html#msg2632620
Cheers Kris :)
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Hi Kris,
Thankyou for your reply. I have modified my last post, sorry :-\
I'm guessing that Annie and Edward were not married as I can not find a marriage cert number.
The history of the Williams family is sketchy as from what i've been told, they didn't really get along. It's been a long and frustrating process to find what I have... ::) lol
Fingers crossed I find more, Michelle :)
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Hi Michelle,
You have not mentioned the names of ANNIE's parents, so going on your death certificate reg. number,, it is here
Reg. 61910 In 1972 WILLIAMS, ANNIE MAY father JAMES , mother MARY ELLEN at MAITLAND
Qld marriage
In 1898 Reg. C1822 Smith, Mary Ellen to Seery James.
The records show siblings to ANNIE.
From Qld immigration records, the possible arrival of JAMES SEERY with a large number of extended family
http://www.archives.qld.gov.au/research/index/immigration.asp
SEERY James 13 Hampshire Nov 1883 IMM/126 113 Z1967 M1706
Sue
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Hi Sue,
Thankyou for the information. I've been looking up the information that you sent me. I think that the James Seery I'm looking for is on there, age 13-15, vessel Hampshire arrived in QLD from Plymouth.
Do you know how I can track this back to make sure it's him?
Thankyou for all of your help, you've been fantastic ;D
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Hi shelby,
To help in identifying JAMES SEERY you would need his parents' names. You may then be able connect him to the shipping record as he would be likely travelling with parents at age 13.
This is his marriage index entry and by purchasing the certificate you may learn a great deal about him (assuming the details therein are complete and correct) see this link for what you may find.
http://www.jaunay.com/bdm.html.
QLD
In 1898 reg. C1822 Smith, Mary Ellen to Seery, James.
https://www.bdm.qld.gov.au/IndexSearch/BirIndexQry.m
I am not sure from what you tell us whether you have actually sighted certificates of your people or are just working from indexes.
To move on, (or back!!) you need get certificates.
ADDING
QLD death
In 1920 REG. C3845 Ronald, Seery. father not recorded. mother Annie Frayne Seery ** born Queensland aged 15 days.
Before the marriage to ARTHUR AUSTYN.
Sue
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Hi,
It appears the family on the shipping index (ship Hampshire, 1883) were from Ireland.
There are more births to the couple, JAMES and MARIA in Australia after their arrival.
One of these is
In 1885 REG.B34683 Arthur Seery. father James. mother Maria McNulty
ARTHUR enlisted for ww1 and sites his sister MARIA living in Brisbane as NOK. She is one of the children on the passenger list.
Maria the mother died, 1892
In 1892 Reg. B25321 Maria Seery father Thomas McNulty. mother Mary McMahon
A nd her husband
James [snr] died 1904
In 1904 Reg. C3260 James Seery. Parents Not recorded.
They are buried together at South Brisbane Cemetery
http://austcemindex.com/inscriptions.php
The births of some of their children have been extracted from Irish registers and can be seen by searching
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp
Here are the details for James. (aged 13 on the ship)
Birth James
Date-8th Sept. 1872
Place Ireland
Parents- Father James SEEREY.Mother MARIAH Mc ANULTY
The birth details, on the same search site for the eldest child, ANNE give a specific county of her birth- TYRONE.
This information may be of help if your JAMES SEERY turns out to be this son of JAMES and MARIA.
Sue
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Hello my great helpers!
I'm looking into the information you have given me about James and Maria Seery.
It doesn't shock me to learn that my Father's Mother, Annie, had a child before she was married to her 1st Husband. There were so many secrets within that family which I think will remain hush hush.
I'm working until next Tuesday but look forward to chatting more with you about what we've found. Great work!!!
Thankyou Shelby ;D
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Shelby
Annie Seery was my Grandmother's (Catherine) oldest sister. According to my mother Annie just disappeared - for years - and they didn't know what had happened to her until many years later (@the time she passed away I think), when her daughters(?) came to Queensland to track down her (quite large) family. Her father, James Patrick, - also according to my mother - was a lovely Irishman. Some information that we have (in my grandmothers handwriting) has that he was born @1868 - but where I am not sure. His father, also James, according to Grandma was from Brackland??in Ireland - (but I cannot find that). His mother was Catherine Frayne. His wife was Mary Ellen Smith and her parents were from Co. Leitrim (something like Crudhamody and Woodfaddy???)
I do not have their arrival dates in Australia, but I could go on and on...
Karyn
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Hiyas,
The James SEERY who died 1904 had parents Laurence SEERY and Mary AIRLIE.
I think James mother was Catherine SEERY who died 1905 father listed as FRAYNE.
Annie Frayne was born on 1st Apr 1898..
Bored
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Hi Karyn,
Firstly thankyou for the information you have passed on.
My father was Annie's youngest son, Robert. I really don't know much about this side of the family but am learing more and more daily. I do have some old photos that I found at my Father's home after he passed. They contain photos of his sisters and Mother Annie. I hope to have them scanned and on my page soon.
It would be interesting to know what happened with Annie and why she disappeared for so long, I wonder what she may have been hiding or running from. Sadly, being my Grandmother and not knowing anything about her.
I was just thinking out aloud that, if Catherine was your Grandmother, Annie is mine, that would make you my 2nd cousin??? I'm hopeless at working that out.
As you can see, Annie had many children but I'm still trying to find out more about her life before she met my Father's Father Edward.
Shelby :)
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Hi Bored,
Do you mean that his surname was Frayne?
Thanks Shelby
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Hi Shelby,
I assume so...nothing else is noted -under father it has Frayne-under mother it is blank.
James and Maria's daughter Catherine died 3 Aug 1900. An unwed Catherine SEERY has a son Edward Burtenshaw SEERY 24 Jul 1900 and he dies 30 Aug 1900.
James and Maria's son William died 23 Jan 1913.
Someone already posted Maria's death.
There is a death for a James SEERY 14 Sep 1910 Father Michael SEERY / Mother Mary TRAY (??)
Bored
Sorry had to change Thomas to Michael.
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Shelby
Yes, I do believe we would be second cousins - and you would have very many of them in Queensland, (especially in Central Qld) and some in NSW...
My family tree is posted on Ancestry.com (DuffFamily, I think) Someone else has information there as well, looks like from the Annie Frayne side to me, but they have tied in to the James Seery and Maria McNulty people who were not ours (not saying they weren't somehow connected). Our Seery's were very much Central Qld farmers. (I suspect they were probably farmers in Ireland - maybe flax)
Annie Frayne's father was a farmer - and the children all grew up at Midgee, south of Rockhampton. Talking to my mother again, she has told me that our Grandmothers' mother - Mary Ellen (nee Smith) - was a wild Irish woman, and loved to bet on the ponies. She must've just upsticks and moved into Rocky so she could go to the track and play cards. I'm guessing she lost more than she made. She also apparently had a boyfriend (scandal). James eventually sold the property - and died when he was staying with another sister, Alice.
I'm assuming that the manure would've hit the ceiling when Annie Frayne found herself with child - and then married, perhaps quickly and badly. This may be why she had to leave - who knows? Mum said Annie's daughters actually brought her up with them when they came north - and Annie actually spent some time at my family's cattle property (north of Rocky). They drove her around on the back of a flat bed truck sitting on some hay, and she loved every minute of it - they were bona fide country girls. She would've been pretty old then, I should think.
If you want to contact me off-site, I would be more than happy to give you my details (though I don't know what the protocol here is - I only joined when I stumbled upon your post).
Regards
Karyn
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Good Evening Karyn,
I've just not long come in from work and am now relaxing with a coffee. Your last post made for some very interesting reading. Slowly slowly, things are starting to make more sense.
That other person that you saw on ancestry was me. I mistakingly added Maria McNulty. I have since deleted that side and started a fresh with the information you have provided me. My family tree name is Sharrock/Williams. I have noticed the Duff tree appear alot actually.
I would be more than happy for you to contact me, my email is (*)
I look forward to hearing from you, Michelle :)
Moderator Comment: (*) email address removed as per RootsChat Policy. Please use our secure PM (personal message) system to share email addresses and other personal information. Thank You.
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My great grandmother was Mary Gertrude Seery, born in Tullamore Ireland in 1863 to James Seery, farmer, and Catherine Frayne. She arrived in Queensland with parents some time before 1871 when her sister Elizabeth was born.
A witness to her marriage in 1883 to John Hogan was Margaret Mary Seery, presumed to be another sister.
I think the James Seery you have identified (married to Mary Ellen Smith) might be Mary Gertrude's brother.
I am happy to provide information on Mary Gertrude's descendants. Her youngest daughter, Mary Cecilia Hogan, was my grandmother.
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Hi! EllenS,
I am also a descendant of James Seery and Catherine Frayne. Great Grandaughter of James and Mary Ellen Seery. You are correct, Mary Gertrude and James are brother and sister. Margaret Mary Seery is a sister, as well as Elizabeth, and there is another brother, Patrick. Margaret's married name was Salmon. I've been researching the family for some time and have some information on the Hogan's and Salmon's. I was just recently looking for information on Mary Cecilia.
Progress is slow with the Seery Family research but I am gradually putting things together.
I would like to share information with you and would also appreciate any help you could give with the Hogans. I would like to contact you privately if this is okay.
Regards,
Meka
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Hello Cousin Meka
I'm very glad to have heard from you.
I have detailed information on the Hogan family, which I keep on an excel spreadsheet and am happy to send to you if you can read that format.
In summary, Mary Gertrude Seery and John Hogan married in 1883 and had 10 children, of whom 3 sons died in infancy. The surviving children were John Joseph, James, Thomas, Alice, Kathleen, Margaret and Mary Cecilia, born between 1884 and 1900. John Hogan died in 1933 and Mary Gertrude in 1930.
If you can send your email we can continue the correspondence.
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Hi Meka and Ellen,
If you post a couple more times our secure PM system will be available. We use this system to share email addresses and other personal information privately. We do not allow email addresses to be posted to the public boards. You need to have made 3 postings to the public boards before the PM system is fully functional.
Information on the PM system.
http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
All the best with the contact.
Cheers Kris :)
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Hi! Again EllenS,
Lots of Rellies!
Our ancestors certainly did have large families. James and Mary Ellen had 9 children that I have details of, and my Grandmother said there was
also a set of twins which died. I haven't found records for the twins. Maybe they were lost during the pregnancy.
Margaret Salmon (Seery) had 14 children, three of which died in infancy.
My grandmother Alice Acheson (Seery) had 12 children, two of which died in infancy.
So we will have a lot to share. Out of curiousity, are there any twins in the Hogan family? My uncle had 2 sets of twins and my daughter has a set of twins (girls).
I see we have to have 3 posts each to be able to send a private message so I will endeavour to make some other posts.
Cheerio,
Meka
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Hello Meka
Yes, a very large number of relatives. John Hogan, husband of Mary Gertrude Seery, was one of 11 children, most of whom married and had large families also. I don't know of any twins among the second generation, i.e. John and Mary Hogan's grandchildren, but in the third generation I have identical twin cousins.
Hogan children:
John Joseph Hogan married Margaret Charles: Mary, William, John, Joseph, Margaret, Kathleen.
James Hogan married Martha Cowan: Janet
Thomas Hogan did not marry
Patrick, Edward and Martin Hogan died as infants.
Alice Hogan married Edmund Balfe: Noel
Kathleen and Margaret Hogan did not marry.
Mary Cecilia Hogan married James Sullivan: John (my father), Brian, Desmond, Kevin and Noel.
The other feature of the Hogan family is the determination not to let good names go to waste, which is very confusing looking at the multitudes of Mary, Margaret, Catherine, Alice, John, James etc.
I am handicapped by the date limits of the Qld RBDM so I don't know very much about the later generations of the Hogan family.
Regards
EllenS
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Hello all!, (extended family)
I have only just sat down and read all of this information and am a little confused LOL...
I'm going to sit down and go back into the tree bit by bit so I know who is who.
Please keep in touch, Michelle :-)
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Hi Ellen,
Just a quick question for you while I'm working on the tree tonight, are the Hogans from the USA the correct branch?
Thanks Michelle :-)
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Michelle
As far as I know all members of this particular branch of the Hogans came to Australia. My great great grandparents, John Hogan and Alice Noonan, sailed from Liverpool in 1863 with their children and all those children remained in Australia.
However, John Hogan might well have had siblings who went from ireland to the US.
John was born in Kilbehenny/ Mitchelstown area about 1815, the son of Edward Hogan. Alice was born about 1817, the daughter of John Noonan and Hannah Mahoney.
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Thankyou,
That does clear up a few things for me as there were hints that I thought may have been wrong.
My husband and I are working on our tree "SHARROCK & WILLIAMS family tree", we had to start it again as Steve ended up adding a few of his family members twice... So, if you see "Sharrock/Williams", that's our old tree.
Hope to hear back from you soon,
Michelle
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oh goodness,
I forgot to ask, what is the name of your Tree?
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Michelle
If that message is addressed to me, then I don't have a tree online
EllenS
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Yes EllenS, that question was addressed to you.
I was hoping that you may have a family tree on Ancestry etc because you seem to have alot of information that could be very helpful
Hope you've had a great day :)
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Ok, after walking away from the family tree for a while, a much needed break through has been made by my cousin.
Turns out that Austyn is my Grandfather... For questions that now remain unanswered as i'm still getting over the fact, my Grandfather changed his name back in the 1920's.
With One answer comes many many questions haha! :)