RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => Topic started by: rugbyhull on Thursday 10 June 10 12:06 BST (UK)
-
hello , has anybody any old postcards of hulls 2 professional rugby teams (hull fc / hull kingston rovers) pre 1920? (teams or players). duncan studios of anlaby road was a prolific publisher early 20th century. i have attached 2 examples. does anyone know when duncan studios stopped publishing? they also produced plenty of hull city football cards - has anyone any images to share?
-
I have one of my gt gt grandad who played for Hull FC. Its taken when they one a cup in 1891 I believe. My mum has the cap and medal from it to. I do have photos but its on the other hard drive not on this laptop , as soon as I get round to hooking it up I will post.
Heres the link for a photo of the cap though.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,301698.0.html
-
hello, great cap,look forward to seeing photos. i am going to look in my rugby history books to see what info i can find from that period. unfortunately there isnt a lot documented from that era. this is pre rugby league days as you will know. 22 yorkshire rugby union teams, inc hull fc split from the rugby union in 1895 because they wanted broken time payments for time off work and formed their own union (northern union)which is known today as rugby league
-
I did contact the Rugby Musuem to try and find more out about the cap but they had nothing on record
-
The period your GG Grandad played, there were only friendlies played (no league table format) + 1 cup competition – the Yorkshire cup and
Hull FC didn’t win it in that era. Hull FC did award caps to their players after you had played 35 matches in a season.
This seems to tie in with the date on the cap shown ‘HFC 1890’
If he has a medal this may have been for a county representative game with the winning team getting a cup.
Is there an inscription on back? this would help identify.
There was a lot of crossover playing for other teams aswell in that era, so he could of represented other teams or even counties.
There were approx 40 rugby unions teams in the Hull area at the time.
-
Hi Rugbyhull...Welcome to Rootschat...I thought you might like to see this one....my relatives are the Bucknall Brothers.
Carol
Added: Well maybe not ::)
-
carol, thanks for uploading, didnt reply when i first read, wanted to check if any of the players appeared on any of my hull photos, but they dont.....
-
hello! a return visit to see if anyone has any old rugby photos / postcards to upload or any early memorabilia especially hull fc of hull kr. attached is a Baines collectors card of Charlie Coyne c1890 'Play Up Kingston Rovers'
-
Hi...I thought you might be interested to know that there is a talk at The Carnegie Heritage Centre..."Black & White v Red & White" by David Sherwood and James Shaw on Sunday November 6th..1.30-3.30pm £1.00 admission for refreshments:
http://www.carnegiehull.co.uk/
There will probably be photographs and info on the two Hull Rugby League teams. I'm sure they would be very interested to see memorabilia 8)
Carol
-
Hi carol, thx for the info sounds good.
-
anyone have any old photos /memorabilia relating to the many rugby clubs in and around hull in the 19th century?
-
thanks to my brother, here are some photos of the caps, medals and a season pass. On the front of the photo it says WM Edmonds Witham Hull. Much the same on the back and also the negative can be hand finished in, oil,water or crayon to order.
-
some more
-
and a couple of others
-
thanks for uploading photos, fantastic items and v rare. was your gt gt grandads name Arthur Simon or am i getting my wires crossed with your user pic ? (cant find any record in my hull rugby history books)
-
His name was James Mckay/Mackay he died in 1899 from influenza but would love to find out more about his rugby
-
J McKay is listed as a player but there is no info about his career.
He played for Hull FC when they were a Rugby Union club (that’s pre 1895) and there is little documented from that era.
Your best bet is to go to the Hull History Centre, where there is an archive of newspapers from the time and there will be match reports from games he played in (possibly team pics). I would concentrate on years 1890-1892 as per the cap photos you have uploaded.
Good luck.
-
Hello,
This discussion is a bit old, but I'm happy to join...
I don't have any pre-1920 team picture but I do have some Hull memorabilia to share...
Baines Card, Cyril Lempriere, Hull
(http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4099/4801443619_ff971c0980_z.jpg)(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6160/6211133717_f880bdbaa1_z.jpg)
Baines Card - Hull
(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3334/3659020959_5f32de67a5_z.jpg?zz=1)
Hull Stadium - Hull v Seaton - 1st round N.U.Cup - March 15th 1913
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6181/6106320591_1abf4322af_o.jpg)
hi res picture: http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6181/6106320591_1abf4322af_o.jpg
Hull Stadium - no date
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6045/6233768706_aac3a1e4db_b.jpg)
hi res picture http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6045/6233768706_378fa954fb_o.jpg
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6204/6106866062_164f8be52b_b.jpg)
hi res picture http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6204/6106866062_b41d1d13b5_o.jpg
Hull Stadium - 1921
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2185/2413385627_8c1fa78b0a_b.jpg)
hi res picture http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2185/2413385627_444800b443_o.jpg
Here's Hull "Hall of Fame" Billy Batten in 1928, with his son Billy Batten, Jr. Batten joined Hull in 1913 from Hunslet for a then-record £600 fee... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Batten
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6057/6233768560_886e0b6d0c_b.jpg)
Finally, here's a portrait of Mr A.J.Boynton who was Hull FC chairman before ww1 (and after ?)
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6220/6233246391_84dd0764a9_b.jpg)
If you want to get a idea of how pre-ww1 Northern Union rugby was played, I can only recommend these wonderful video footages from 1901-02 (Mitchell & Kenyon collection, British Film Institute). Unfortunately Hull is not featured in these movies... but definetively worth a look ! (Hunslet v Leeds, Salford v Batley, Oldham v Swinton)
http://rugby-pioneers.blogs.com/rugby/2009/12/the-wolrd-oldest-rugby-videos-amazing-.html
I'm mostly a Rugby Union collector, but you could "dig" into my Flickr collection http://www.flickr.com/photos/rugby_pioneers/ for some old R.L./N.U. pictures (Baines cards, Hunslet, Huddersfield, Salford, etc...) if you like...
@+
Frederic
www.rugby-pioneers.com
-
Hi Frederic and welcome to Rootschat...what fabulous photos :o Thank you for sharing them.
Carol
-
Fantastic pictures! Certainly a lack of female fans then wasn't there lol
-
Fantastic pictures! Certainly a lack of female fans then wasn't there lol
Well, if you look carefully... :D
(http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6210/6106865870_401e8a805c_n.jpg) (http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6213/6233768762_e8d2b5bc33_n.jpg)
-
Further to Frederic's pics , here are some late1880s / early 1890s cards of local players/clubs (same style as the Baines cards but a different publishers).
Southcoates (East Hull). One of these features the player ' Bolton ' , anybody have any info?
-
Hull Trinity ( anyone know of the player W Merriken ?)
-
Beverley (9 miles from Hull) not sure if these 2 represent the same or different clubs.
-
Now lets fast forward approx 20 years and go to East Hull, to a match crowd from 1909 at Craven Street , home of Hull Kingston Rovers, where the 'Robins' show the 'Airlie Birds' (as per Frederic's crowd scenes) how to really have a good time!!
-
Thanks again Frederic for your input from France and keep up the outstanding work on your website!
http://rugby-pioneers.blogs.com/
If anyone reading this has any similar Baines rugby cards or rugby postcards , not related to this Hull thread, please mail them to me at (*)
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
New members must make at least three postings before being allowed to use the PM facility.
See Help-Page: http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
-
Hull Trinity ( anyone know of the player W Merriken ?)
Yes he was the captain.
This may interest you from the Hull Daily Mail - Tuesday 20 December 1887 (OCR capitured text, mistakes may be present)
THE CONDUCT OF HULL FOOTBALL PLAYERS AT COTTINGHAM. At the East Riding Police Court this afternoon, before Mr D. Wilson, Mr H. J. Pease, and T. W. Palmer, Johnson, James Sharp, Henry Spencely, John Archer, William Merrikin, Jasper Butter, James Rutter, James Edwards, James Lyons, John Henry Beadle, William Johnson, and George King, members of the Hull Trinity Football Club, were summoned for interfering with the comfort of passengers the Cottingham Bailway Station, on the 29th October laat.—Mr Meek, of York, appeared for the North-Eastern Railway Company, and Mr Gilbey- Cock represented the defendants.—lt was decided to take tbe case against Merriken a test.—Evidence was given by the prosecution to show tbat tbe defendants had been playing match at Cottingham, and when tbey were at the station they absolutely took possession and interfered with the comfort of the passengers. It was stated that there were between 50 and 60 passengers in the station at the time the defendants were misbehaving themselves.— Mr A. Rollit stated that he saw the defendants in Cottingham. They were the worse for drink, and tbeir conduct was disgraceful.—Mr Gilbey-Cook submitted tbat a great injustice had been done to the defendants owing to the extraordinary delay of the North-Eastern Company before tbey decided to take proceedings. As the men never knew what proceedings .were to be taken it had precluded them from b-iagiug forward any of the passengers—and he was informed that there were only about half-a-dozen—on their behalf. The case was trumped-up one, and he considered there was nothing to answer.—ln reply to Mr Wilson. Mr Meek said the reason proceedings had not been taken earlier was owing to the difficulty of identifying each defendant.—Mr Gilbey-Cook further urged that there had not been the slightest particle of evidence to show tbat defendants had interfered with the comfort of passengers.—After considerable legal argument, Mr Cook called a passenger named Westo'iy, who stated that bis comfort was not in the slightest degree interfered with him.—Cross-examined, witness said that he did not belong the Trinity Football Club.—The Bench considered the case proved against all the defendants, but considering the heavy expenses incurred in connection with the case, they reduced the penalty only and costs in each case.—Mr Gilbey-Cook asked the Bench whether they decided that there was evidence of a disturbance against the defendant Merriken ?—Mr Wilson said the Court could give no reason. —Mr Cook asked if he would be allowed to state a case if he was instructed hereafter ?—The Court said it ivould be a matter for Mr Cook to consider.
-
Beverley (9 miles from Hull) not sure if these 2 represent the same or different clubs.
A good question but you may find this report interesting
-
re Bolton and Southcoates, this report may be off interest
York Herald - Monday 01 October 1883
-
His name was James Mckay/Mackay he died in 1899 from influenza but would love to find out more about his rugby
From Hull Daily Mail - Monday 26 April 1886
HULL JUNIOR FOOTBALL CLUB. to the editor of the "hull daily mail." Dear Sir, —Will you kindly allow ire space in your edition to reply the letter of James McKay under the heading of "Selby Mizpah v. Hull Juniors." In this letter he asserts that they wero only partially assisted by H. Mackay and H. Varley, members of the Selby Ist team. If I remember right, he has only mentioned the names of the try-getters. I will not dispute the other players being bona fide members, but I should like to know who they have been playing for this season. The telegram I sent from Selby was a true and correct one, and not a " wicked accusation." would also like ask Mr Mackay why he could not gve us the names of his team when asked. We were peatedly told to "play up Hull; you are not playing Selby Mizpah today ; thou has to play Selby first ancl second teams." I was also told we had been playing several of the same team that played Southcoates in Hull. How far that is correct I am not in a position to state, as I am not acquainted with the Selby players. With regard to the accusation that I had tried to obliterate the defeat of our club, I most emphatica'ly deny it, for when we suffer defeat fairly we can always take it in good part. In conclusion, J can only refer you to the reports which I have senb to your paper during this season as to their fairness, and we are also extremely sorry and surprised that any unpleasantness should occur after such a pleasant game and evening which we spent Selb^— yours, &c., Hon. Sec. Hull Junior F. C. 25, Bright-street, April 24, 1886, SELBY MIZPAH v. HULL JUNIORS. TO the editor of the "hull daily mail." Dear Sir,— Will you kindly allow me space in your valuable paper to contradict the report of the above match inserted in your issue of Saturday last, in which it states the Selby Mizpah were "greatly assisted by players from the first and second teams." I admit we were partially assisted, namely, by H. Mackay and H, Varley, members of the Selby first team, but all the other players were bom-fide members of the Mizpah Club, and have been since its formation. From the report contained in your iss ie of last week, It would lead its readers to believe that we were very ably assisted by members from Selby first and second teams, but such wa3 not the case, the ab Dve being a trug version'of the assistance rendered. am sorry I should have to trouble! you with the insertion this letter, but do so in common fairness to our club, and trust the gentleman who furnished you with his report of the match will tea little more cautious is future, and true and correct reports, and not neck to obliterate the defeat of his club in false and wicked accusations. _ Apologising for trespauing upon your time and space, I «n, sir, yours truly. JAMES MACKAY, Hon. Sec. Football Club. Selby, 22nd April, 1886
-
Hull is fortunate that the old Hull Daily Mail from the late 1800's to 1950 have been microfilmed and available on Britishnewspaperarchive.com, a resource worth paying to use to find out more about rugby in the late Victorian period and to understand how big the game was pre schism.
-
thanks very much for taking the time to find these articles.
its great to place those events with the images of the players of the time.
brilliant!
-
Guess who is taking a trip to the library for a copy of the letters! James had a brother and numerous cousins called Henry, wonder if they were players to.
-
unknown rovers player c1886
-
WFB Calvert Hull FC 1883-89
-
George Jacketts 1884-95 Hull FC