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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Staffordshire => Topic started by: poptin on Thursday 18 March 10 15:52 GMT (UK)
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Where is the registration district for Bilston? My husbands great grandad was born there in 1866 by the name of John Baker and I am having trouble finding him. Any help appreciated.
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Hi Poptin,
The relatives of mine who were born in Bilston appear in the district Wolverhampton in the GRO indices, have you tried looking him up on FreeBMD?
Cheers,
Mark
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there were only 2 born in wolverhampton dist between 1865-1867
john henry baker 1865 2nd qtr
alfred john baker 1867 3rd qtr
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I cant see him on 1871, the only John Bakers I can see bn Bilston are younger. Have you got him?
Where does your info about his date and place of birth come from?
Could he have been born before his parents marriage and registered in mums maiden name?
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Uh?
Why has this suddenly moved to Somerset Board
Have I missed something? Bilston....Staffs
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Uh?
Why has this suddenly moved to Somerset Board
Have I missed something? Bilston....Staffs
thats what i was wondering?
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Sorry chaps - slip of the finger when I was moving the post - it was originally in the wrong place (Resources or Offers I can't remember)
Moved it back now!
;)
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Thanks! I worried my Geography was really letting me down .....
Hopefully Poptin will come up with what else he has / source of birth detials etc and we can get searching! (In Staffs ...that is ;D)
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You wouldn't believe the high level of skills we need to move posts around ...
:-X ::) ;D
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I got the info from Ancestry, the 1901 census has him as being 35. I got his name from my husband's grandad's birth certificate. I know census ages can sometimes be give or take a few years. Also I was wondering if his name could have been James, as sometimes names have a habit of being changed in the mists of time, my dad was called John but was always known as Jack!!!!
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Hi,
Could he have been born in 1864 as there is the following entry
Births Dec 1864
BAKER John Wolverhampton 6b 498
also in the 1911 census there is a John Baker aged 47 living in Wolverhampton with his wife Margaret Jane and children Arthur, John and Hilda. Do these match with what you found in 1901?
Mark
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Hiya
Could this be him?
Baptism 20 Nov 1864 Ettingshall Church John son of Joseph & Mary Ann BAKER Ettingshall Lane Sheet iron worker C.W.Richards Born 19 Oct
Willow x
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This looks like the 1901 that I guess Poptin has:
(taken from transcription only, for some reason it refuses to show mr the image)
RG13 4305 120 33
CAstleford Yorkshire
John 35 bn Bilston
MAry 39 bn Normanton Yorkshire
George 9 bn Castleford
Samuel 6 bn Castleford
John Jackson 35
Annie Jackson 7
so that doesnt look like the same one as the one you have in 1911
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For such a common name as John Baker, it is too big a jump to go from one census in 1901 back to trying to pinpoint a birth, so I was hoping to go one step at a time and trace him back through the censuses, see if he is consistant with age and pob, etc etc.
However, there is no obvious candidate in 1891, and with the eldest child in 1901 being age 9, it means he could be married or single in 1891 .... so even less easy to pin him down!
So- really need his marriage, but with names like John and MAry and not knowing where, that is not straightforward.
So we really need a child's birth cert to give MAry's maiden name!
SO- on the birth cert that you have for your husbands grandad, where you say father was John Baker, what maiden name did it give for his mother, Mary?
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Looking at the actual 1901 census image on FindMyPast it appears that someone crossed through his age being 35 and wrote 41 instead. Also it could be that he had been previously married as there seems to be a Wid note by the condition as to marriage column.
Mark
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I cant get the image to open ???
Willow x
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I have just tried on Ancestry and can't get the image to open either.
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Obviously a glitch their end
Could you tell us what is his occupation on the 1901 Mark so maybe we can eliminate some candidates
Willow x
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Hi Willow,
He is a Coal Miner Hewer (as is the John Jackson who is boarding with the Bakers)
Mark
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Thanx Mark I'll see what I can find.
Willow x
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This is really frustrating!
I cant see anyone that would fit. I seem Joseph and Mary had another child as well
Ettingshall Church 11 Apr 1866 Ann dau.of Joseph & Mary Ann BAKER Ettingshall Lane Pipe maker C.W.Richards Born 6 March
As I can only find the two children baptised in Wolverhampton I'm guessing they either moved away or one or both of the parents died
Problem is I can find suitable candidates on any of the census
Willow x
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Hi Willow,
On the 1911 census I have found in Castleford
GODBER, James Head Married M 25 1886 Miner Coal Hewer Nottinghamshire in Ashford
GODBER, Elizabeth Rebecca Jane Wife Married 5 years F 25 1886 Household Duties York Normanton
GODBER, Francis Son M 4 1907 Canada
GODBER, Sarah Elizabeth Daughter F 1 1910 Yorks Castleford
GODBER, William Son M 0 (2 MONTH) 1911 Yorks Castleford
BAKER, George Charles Nephew Single M 19 1892 Surface Man Colliery Yorks Castleford
BAKER, Samuel Nephew Single M 16 1895 Underground Pony Driver Yorks Castleford
BAKER, William Nephew M 10 1901 Yorks Castleford
I would guess that Elizabeth Rebecca Jane Godber was the sister of Mary Ann Baker given they were born in the same town. No sign of wither John Baker or Mary Ann Baker.
Mark
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In 1891, I have found the following (again in Castleford)
HARRIS, Samuel Head Married M 49 1842 Coal Miner Hugglescote Leicestershire
HARRIS, Sarah E Wife Married F 44 1847 Leeds Yorkshire
BARRATT, Charles Stepson Single M 17 1874 Coal Miner Normanton Yorkshire
HARRIE, Samuel Son M 12 1879 Scholar Normanton Yorkshire
HARRIE, Elizabeth J Daughter F 5 1886 Scholar Normanton Yorkshire
BAKER, John Son In Law Married M 30 1861 Coal Miner Coseley Staffordshire
BAKER, Mary H Daughter Married F 19 1872 Normanton Yorkshire
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I may have found Joseph and Marys marriage
St George Wolverhampton 9.11.1863
Joseph Baker 22 b Tower St Iron Bucket Maker father John Baker Iron Bucket Maker
Mary Ann Owen 21 s Tower St father Richard Owen Miner
witnesses John Davis and Amelia Harrington
Willow x
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In 1881, there is this possible for John Baker
BAKER, Rhoda Head Widow F 71 1810 Annuitant Coseley Staffordshire
BAKER, Enoch Son Single M 33 1848 Iron Worker Coseley Staffordshire
BAKER, Fanny Daughter Single F 35 1846 None Coseley Staffordshire
BAKER, John Grand Son Single M 21 1860 Coal Miner Coseley Staffordshire
Mark
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John is still living with Rhoda in 1871
Rhoda Baker W 1810 sedgley Blacksmiths Widow
Frances Baker U 1844 dau Sedgely charwoman
Celia H Baker U 1868 G dau Sedgley
Enoch Baker U 1847 son Sedgley Millman
John Baker U 1860 g son Sedgley (transcribed as Barer) Scholar (Sunday School)
RG10/3006 Folio 86 Page 16
Found the family in the 1851 all b Sedgeley
Enock Baker head 42 blacksmith
Rhoda Baker wife 41
Selina Baker dau 10
John Baker son 16
Hannah dau 14
Pheobe dau 9
Frances dau 5
Enock son 3
William Kynn nephew14
HO107/2031 Folio 96 Page 15
Willow x
Willow x
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James Godber married Elizabeth Rebecca J Harris Sept 1/4 1905 Pontefract
But there isnt a marriage for a John Baker to a Mary Harris anywhere
Willow x
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In 1861 there is the following entry:
BAKER, Enoch Head Married M ? Sedgley Staffordshire
BAKER, Rhoda Wife Married F 31 1830 ... Sedgley Staffordshire
BAKER, Heather Daughter F 29 1832 Sedgley Staffordshire
BAKER, Fanny Daughter F 16 1845 ... Sedgley Staffordshire
BAKER, Enoch Son M 13 1848 Labourer At Iron Works Sedgley Staffordshire
BAKER, John Son M 1 1860 Sedgley Staffordshire
RG number: RG09
Piece: 2050
Folio: 62
Page: 19
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How can Rhoda be 2 years older than her daughter lol
Willow x
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Hi Willow,
It is because whoever did the transcription didn't look very carefully at the page :) (to be fair they have a very poor copy of it on FindMyPast).
Enoch looks to be aged 52 and Rhoda aged 51. Enoch looks to have been a blacksmith (which matches what you found in 1871)
Mark
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Have been on BMD and found his marriage cert. he married Mary Hannah Barrett and was married in castleford, I am sending for their marriage cert hoping that will tell me more. He and Mary were married in December 1889. I think the occupation as miner (1901 census) is correct as his son Samuel, who is my hubby's grandad was also a miner. Thanks to all for helping.
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Good luck Poptin let us know what the certificate says when you get it
Willow x
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Marykb74 found my husband's grandad Samuel, in 1911 census he was 16 and working as a underground pony driver, he was living with a Family called Godber with his 2 brothers. I have been told by my hubbies sister that Samuels parents died when their 3 children were still, hence living with another family. Am going to try and find out when his parents died.
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Received John and Mary Baker's marriage cert and nothing in the space for John's father, it is crossed through with a line - could this mean he was illigitimate? Is it law to include the fathers' name if it was known? Mary Bakers name before marriage was Barrett. It looks like John was born in 1860 not 66 as was previously thought.
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More than likely he was illegitimate then.
Though he may have just chosen not to give a name.
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Are you sure about Bilston being in the Wolverhampton district? I am trying to trace the birth of my grandfather John Thomas Roberts (three of the commonest names in England!) between 1874 and 1878, born in Bilston but BMD has none in Wolverhampton but some in Dudley, Walsall, and West Brom _ Bilston is about equidistant to all four. Any thoughts?
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Are you sure about Bilston being in the Wolverhampton district? I am trying to trace the birth of my grandfather John Thomas Roberts (three of the commonest names in England!) between 1874 and 1878, born in Bilston but BMD has none in Wolverhampton but some in Dudley, Walsall, and West Brom _ Bilston is about equidistant to all four. Any thoughts?
Yes that's correct for Sedgley or Bilston I would look at Dudley Worcs. Linell.
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There are 12 John Baker's born Dudley between 1858 and 1863. ::)
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Are you sure about Bilston being in the Wolverhampton district? I am trying to trace the birth of my grandfather John Thomas Roberts (three of the commonest names in England!) between 1874 and 1878, born in Bilston but BMD has none in Wolverhampton but some in Dudley, Walsall, and West Brom _ Bilston is about equidistant to all four. Any thoughts?
If you click on Wolverhampton when the record appears on FreeBMD, it comes up on another page with the phrase "The district Wolverhampton spans the boundaries of the counties of Shropshire, Staffordshire and West Midlands; information about it can be found here." Click on the word "here" and it shows that Bilston is definitely covered by Wolverhampton
Tony
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Are you sure about Bilston being in the Wolverhampton district? I am trying to trace the birth of my grandfather John Thomas Roberts (three of the commonest names in England!) between 1874 and 1878, born in Bilston but BMD has none in Wolverhampton but some in Dudley, Walsall, and West Brom _ Bilston is about equidistant to all four. Any thoughts?
If you click on Wolverhampton when the record appears on FreeBMD, it comes up on another page with the phrase "The district Wolverhampton spans the boundaries of the counties of Shropshire, Staffordshire and West Midlands; information about it can be found here." Click on the word "here" and it shows that Bilston is definitely covered by Wolverhampton
Tony
Yes but, anyone with a baby to baptise could easily pop into a Church in Dudley for a baptism, worth checking both places. HTH Linell.
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Yes but, anyone with a baby to baptise could easily pop into a Church in Dudley for a baptism, worth checking both places. HTH Linell.
No-one said otherwise! I was merely pointing out that, as far as records are concerned, Bilston comes under Wolverhampton. I believe this was the lead question asked by Coomera.
Tony
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Thanks for confirming that Wolverhampton is correct for Bilston. We have now traced granddad's brother named Ephraim - a name much easier to isolate- and he is shown as born Bilston, registered Wolverhampton. So, we have discarded the second name - Thomas- and have a John Roberts registered Wolverhampton in Mar 1875 which ties in with his age of 36 in 1911. Are sending for his cert. Surely the records are of civil registrations, baptisms are a private matter. Dee. (Australia)
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Just to clarify.
Bilston itself was, and is now, I believe, in the registration district of Wolverhampton , except for a period durng the 20th century when it formed it's own registration district.
However, the boundary with Sedgley is, I think, less than half a mile from the town centre on the Highfields side of the town, so it is perfectly possible for people who thought that they had been born in Bilston (and even lived there all their lives) to have been just outside the boundary and so registered in Sedgley (hence Dudley Registration District, and a different county).
It is therefore, a good idea to check both Wolverhampton and Dudley registration districts for people who say that they were born in Bilston in the 19th century. Wolverhampton Registry Office were very helpful when I applied for one certificate when the person of the same name registered in Wolverhampton turned out not to be the one that I was looking for and found the birth registered at Dudley, and after calling me, forwarded the application direct to Dudley.
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Thank you for the clarification. However, being overseas I am not sure if I can access the local Register Offices - up to now we have had to use the GRO - who, I must say, are very efficient and reasonably priced considering the overseas mail costs. Will look into this. Will send for the Wolverhampton cert that I think is right and will follow up elsewhere if it is not. dee.
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Coomra
A lot of the Wolverhampton Archives have been transcribed and are here http://www.wolverhamptonhistory.org.uk/resources/indexes
There is a baptism of a John Thomas Roberts son of Thomas & Mary Ann 4 Mar 1888 12 W'ton Road Dairyman Born 20 April 1881 at Ettingshall Church (which is in Bilston)
And off Familysearch https://www.familysearch.org/
12.7.1877 at Bilston Ephraim Roberts parents David and Mary Ann
22.4.1775 at Bilston John Roberts parents David and Mary Ann
Willow x
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Willow, thank you for that. The two with parents David & Mary Ann are correct and we now have their full birth dates.
As a bit of trivia: the parents kept the Horseley Heath Tavern for many years and Mary Ann was Mary Ann Farley, a cousin 3 or 4 times removed to Reuben Farley, three times Lord Mayor of West Bromwich. dee.