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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Staffordshire => Topic started by: richy B on Tuesday 16 March 10 22:33 GMT (UK)
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Hello everyone,
I am trying to find out any information on an old farm that was in the Warstones area of Wolverhampton. It would have been somewhere by Merry Hill flats and Pinfold Close from what I have been told. The farmer's name was John Shotton. It is a big ask but does anyone have some old photographs of the area before the flats were built. My thanks in advance for any assistance.
Richard
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Hiya Richard
I have done a bit of googling and found out that Nock and Joseland dealt with the sale of the farm and their papers are kept at Wolverhampton Archives so it might be worth dropping them an e-mail to see if they can help
See http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=149-dnaj_2&cid=-1&gsm=2008-06-18#-1
Reference for the papers is Sales material 1937 D-NAJ/F/1/52 & Sales material 1946 D-NAJ/F/1/61
My one sister in laws mother worked at the farm when she was younger but I know she doesnt have any photos of it because I asked her years ago (I was born in Warstones)
There is also a reference to stock and timber for Bates Farm, Leasowes, Penn so could it have been know by a different name?
Willow x
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Hi Willow
Thanks for your help, I am just up the road in Penn, I can vaguely remember the farm as a child. I have found the old farmer's son, but he has no photos either, and is as curious as I am to find out more. He was only a child when he lived there and wishes he had payed more attention when he was younger. Do you think your sister in law would mind answering any questions he may have?
I don't think I can mention living people on the forum so you will be receiving a PM.
Thanks again
Rich.
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Hiya Rich
Unfortunately it was my sister in laws mother that worked there and she has now passed on my sister in law was born in another part of town so she doesnt know anything about it
Willow x
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Ooh, I should have read your post properly
Rich
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Lol
A friend of mine lived in one of the blocks of flats and I was always interested in the house that used to be there so I have kept my eyes open for a photo of it thats why I know sis in laws mum didnt have one of it
Willow x
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Wasn't the old house incorporated into the OAP home that now stands there? I remember playing around the house when it was empty and, if I remember correctly, semi-derelict.
Also found out that there are papers regarding the farm at W-ton Archives and also panes of glass from the front door!!
Tony
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No I think the OAP home was built around the time of the flats - I think they have rebuilt them again since
I know there was a rumour that the farmhouse was haunted by a farm servant that hung himself in the attics which is the reason I always wanted to see what the house looked like because an old friend of mine lived in the one block of flats and that was haunted because I saw it myself
Willow x
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have you tried the Saffordshire Past Track site?
Cati - also in Penn...
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I remember the rumour that the house was haunted - I think that was why all us kids used to play around there. What we would have done if we'd seen anything I don't know! Probably run a mile!!
Tony
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My eldest half brother broke his finger playing around the house when a brick dropped on it lol
Willow x
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Question is Willow - Who or what dropped the brick?!!!! :o :o :o
Tony
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Thank you all for your replies
No I think the OAP home was built around the time of the flats - I think they have rebuilt them again sinceWillow x
I have spoken to the farmer's son tonight, he thinks the OAP home and the flats were built about the same time.
I know there was a rumour that the farmhouse was haunted by a farm servant that hung himself in the attics which is the reason I always wanted to see what the house looked like because an old friend of mine lived in the one block of flats and that was haunted because I saw it myself
Willow x
You can't just leave it there! we need more details please :-)
have you tried the Saffordshire Past Track site?
Cati - also in Penn...
Hi Cati, thank you for that link I will give it a try. I'm in Penn Hall area
Can I just check we are all talking about the same farm? mine is under the blocks of flats. The farm originally belonged to Benjamin John Shotton, his house still stands in Pinfold Grove. It then passed to his son John Shotton snr. His son John Shotton jnr.( the one I know) mentioned tonight there was another farm belonging to a Fred Siddaway, it was by some filter beds now under the Hamble Road area. As far as John jnr. can recall there was no mention in the family of servants or hangings, though he did say his father was very "funny" and would not talk of such things. I will let you draw your own conclussions on this.
Remember don't have nightmares.
Rich x
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Rich, the flats and the OAP home were built around the same time. I think the flats have been refurbished at some time which is what I think Willow is referring to.
The OAP's home is/was named Leasowes House so I think we are talking about the same place. It used to face onto what is now Warstones Drive at the bottom of The Green and was surrounded on three sides by trees.
The filter beds, which used to be nearby, were at the back of what used to be the play area, usually referred to as "the park" or "the swings" by the local kids. The filter beds were the site of a tragic accident - the year escapes me - when a couple of young boys went missing and their bodies were later recovered from the filter beds.
Tony
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Cheers Tony, thanks for that.
Re: the tragedy with the two boys, I was always led to believe this happened at the Trescott treatment works at the end of Jenny Walker's Lane. Just shows how you can not rely on word of mouth sometimes.
Thanks again
Rich
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Re the two boys, it seems they'd managed to cross the brook that ran across the back of the park, squeezed through the railings and, for some reason, tried to walk across the filter beds. I was living just up the road from the park, and remember the shock that came after the discovery of the poor mites' bodies. Absolutely tragic!
Tony
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fascinating little thread, I know nothing really to help alas, tho i had hard, from somewhere the name warstones farm, but being just up the road in Bradmore it interests me too (my drs as a kid was the ones at pinfold lane, and my church is just behind the school(st michaels)
(Hiya willow btw, nice to see you again Cuz lol)
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Hiya all
Leasowes House faces onto Leasows Drive its Warstone House that faces the Green.
Warstones House used to be a home for people with learning difficulties and then went to an OAP centre
The two boys that died were twins aged about 5 or 6 that I used to play with so it would have been about 1967. One was called Christopher but for the life of me I cannot remember the other boys name I can remember my mum explaining to me that they had died I was about 4 at the time. It was the treatment plant behind the park between Warstones Gardens and what is now Hamble Road. There was a bridge across the brook about there they think that one of the boys fell in and the other one followed trying to help him out
I post the details of the ghost I saw when I have 5 mins lol
Willow x
(Hiya cuz *hugs* x)
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I spoke to my cousin today, she lived on Warstones est. She can only remember one farm in that area, so I will check again with the farmer's grandson (John jnr.)
I keep getting side tracked though.
http://www.search.staffspasttrack.org.uk/engine/resource/default.asp?text=0&originator=%2Fengine%2Fsecure%2Falbum%2Fresource%2Fdefault.asp&album=5221&resource=22622
John jnr. B.I.L.s
Rich
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Brilliant site Rich!
I'm sure this is my Uncle Harry riding on the train. He used to build and repair them and had a track running round his back garden
http://www.search.staffspasttrack.org.uk/engine/resource/default.asp?txtKeywords=&lstContext=&lstResourceType=&lstExhibitionType=&chkPurchaseVisible=&rbAlphabeticalRecent=2&txtDateFrom=&txtDateTo=&originator=%2Fengine%2Fsearch%2Fdefault%5Fhndlr%2Easp&page=15&records=16565&direction=1&pointer=266&text=0&resource=24022
Willow x
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Hi Willow,
Credit where credit is due, I did not find the site, Cati did the hard work. I just keep getting drawn to the old pictures, fascinating!
have you tried the Saffordshire Past Track site?
Cati - also in Penn...
Well done Cati
Rich
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Sorry Cati well done!
I'll get round to that ghost story now
My best friend at that time lived in one of the blocks of flats with her mum who was a nurse who worked nights sometimes. I sometime stopped with her when her mum was working to keep her company (this was bout 30 years ago)
The layout of the flat is that you open the front door onto a lenghtways corridor with the two bedrooms to the left and the bathroom to the right and the door to the living room at the end of the corridor on the right. The living room is the width of the flat with the kitchen off it and behind the bathroom
The one night my friends mum had gone to work and my friends boyfriend and I were stopping over. They went to bed and I went to sleep in the small bedroom but after much tossing and turning I gave up and went to make coffee
I was stood in the kitchen with the door behind and to the left of me when I saw what I took to be my friends boyfriend standing behind me in the doorway so asked him if he wanted coffee too
I didnt get a reply so I turned round fully and there was no one there :o I dashed along to their bedroom and they were both asleep! It would have been impossible for him to get back into bed in the time I took to get there and without me hearing him opening the doors between the living room and bedroom
Needless to say I didnt get any sleep that night
Willow x
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Jeepers! I never knew anything like that happpened around here. Thought you had to live out on the moors.
Was you're friends name Helen?
Incidentally I am still trying to make time to get to Wolverhampton Archives to check those records you found for me.
Rich
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Hiya Rich
No it was Lisa actually lol I'm not saying anything else in case someone new lives in the flat dont want to give them the heebee jeebees :-X
Theres a farm still behind Highfields School (well there was when I last looked but that was about 10 years ago so I might be a housing estate now)
Willow x
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Hi again Rich
According to Dad (aged 83) there was a youth club on the site of Leasowes Farm - not certain when, but Dad was a plumber/builder and worked on the youth club building probably in the late 40s/50s: the kids who used the club had spent a lot of time deorating the interior before some little Herbert (Dad's words) nicked the lead off the roof: Dad was employed to replace the lead: unfortunately there had been a heavy downpour and all the kids' hard work was ruined.
I'm afraid that that's all he can remember about it!
Regards
Cati
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Hi Cati,
Thank your dad for me, every little helps to build up a picture. I keep hoping someone will show up with a photo from an old box on top of the wardrobe. Fingers crossed.
Rich
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Have you looked at Angus Dumphy's books?
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Never heard of him Catti what are the titles?
Willow x
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This thread has been intriguing me for a while now. I remember the farm quite well as being born and bred in Uplands Avenue and being lads we used to cycle regularly to the canal at Diminsdale. Our route was down Uplands Ave up Firtree Rd to the Trysull Rd through Merry hill and past Leasowes farm and the entrance to the sewerage farm.
We then carried on down Langley Rd, past the Ack-Ack site on the right then on to the canal at DiminsdaleWhilst on this thread who remembers the Ack-Ack site?
During the war when my father was in the Homeguard he often used to take me down there to show me the guns.
On the attached map (unfortunately on the very edge ) is Leasowes farm. It is a 1914 map so you will notice quite a lack of housing, shops and of course the Merry Hill pub which I used to frequent when Horace Hollyhead kept it in the 1950's and early '60's.
Happy days!!
Bob.
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I posted this the same time as Willow and the map didn't post with it.
I will try again.
Bob.
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My mom remembers it, and the american soldiers going to church at st michaels, pulling up in there jeeps etc...as to an ARP post, can we get records of arp personnell? the reason i ask is my granddad was in the ARP
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Is the Ack-Ack site that bit just at the end of the houses by the green electric box? I remember my dad telling me about it when I was a kid and if I remember rightly that was supossed to be haunted too lol ;D
I always wanted to go and have a look round there but never got up the nerve when I was a kid to climb over the fence - I'd break my neck if I tried it now!
Willow x
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You are correct in your assumptions Willow, here is an overhead view of it.
As regards to records of the ARP I am sure there will be some somewhere abouts but as to where to start your search escapes me!
Bob.
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OOOHHH!! Even more intrigued now thanx for that Bob
Willow x
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I used to go n play on the ack ack site as a kid... the old remains of the hmmm ack ack batterry? used to make a great den/castle LOL
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These were the days, the guard house was just on the left as you went through the main gate. My father used to take me into the sergeants mess and I can remember throwing darts at a dartboard. The rest has faded into the past.
Bob.
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Cati,
Angus Dunphy looks to be the next step. I googled his name and got side tracked for about 2 hours reading all about Wolverhampton. My dad used to work at Sunbeam and Villiers.
Uplands,
Good find with the map. I have some Cassini Historical maps from 1831 to 1921 they only show the word Leasowes and in a slightly different position. It is lying back more from the road, this may have confused me with the name of the farm. By any chance do you remember a farm where the flats are now. That is roughly where the Leasowes appears on my maps?
I feel an expedition coming on, always wondered what lay along that drive.
Books by Angus Dunphy http://www.goodreads.com/author/list/2107110.Angus_Dunphy
Thanks all for your help
Rich
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Oooh ive been looking into Sunbeam lately, My grandad (and maybe great grandad) worked there, Grandad lost his finger in the machinery there too, he worked there in the 20's 30s then moved on to Villiers I recently had a photo of him sent to me at sunbeam where he was part of the football team
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I found this site on my travels, not sure if it will help anyone,it kept me quiet for an hour or two.
http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac.uk/genealogy/genealogy.htm
tbm you have a PM
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do any photos exist of the ak ak batterry? Id love to see how it actually looked when "in use"
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do any photos exist of the ak ak batterry? Id love to see how it actually looked when "in use"
So would I. There probably are stuffed away in some old suitcase in some old attic, it's just a matter of them coming to light and I doubt that very much!!
Bob.
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Yes, I agree, but after seeing its... remains, ive always wondered of how it actually woulda looked etc...
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Rich, there's an book in Penn Library with maps of Wolverhampton from the 1550s up to the 1980s: don't know if Leasowes Farm is shown, but I'll have a look next time I'm in the library (there's also a copy of the book in Central, but their's is reference only)
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Do you know the name of that book Cati? id be interested in that too
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I just happen to have it with me (*so it's not in Penn Library at the moment!! - it's in Chez Cati)....
'Mapping The Past - Wolverhampton 1577-1986' Mary Mills 1993 pub Metropolitan Borough of Wolverhampton Library and Information Services Division 1993
Very interesting.
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Hi Cati,
I just happen to have it with me (*so it's not in Penn Library at the moment!! - it's in Chez Cati)....
'Mapping The Past - Wolverhampton 1577-1986' Mary Mills 1993 pub Metropolitan Borough of Wolverhampton Library and Information Services Division 1993
Very interesting.
Talk about dangling a carrot. I will see if my contact at Penn Library can pull a few strings.
May be a good find though.
Thanks
Rich
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They have it in Warstones Library I think!
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adds it on my to get list after ive read the ones im reading LOL
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Now back in Penn Library.... ;D
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Re. the Ack Ack Battery, another snippet! We lived in The Avenue, off Bhylls Lane, in the war. The rear of our house faced towards Langley Road, and both my sister and I can remember seeing barrage balloons and searchlights in the sky. I don't remember hearing any guns though. We were told when we were older that the houses across the road from us had Anderson shelters in their gardens, supplied by the Wolverhampton Corporation. We didn't have one, although we were fractionally nearer to the Battery, because we were not in the Borough! I don't know if they were available to buy, but Dad was away in the Army (REME), so I suppose we couldn't afford one :'(
giraffe
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awww at not being able to afford one...i assumed, they were given out free? 1 per house or something?... I know my house had one(bradmore) cos I remember dad taking it apart when i was a kid.., well he took it apart n buried it LOL id still love to know more about the ak ak tho :)
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How many of you remember the public air raid shelters at Bradmore on the junction of Broad Lane and the Bradmore Road and also of the shelters on the Bingley St school playing fields which is all built on now opposite to the Gunmakers Arms?
Bob.
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If any one is interested, Wolverhampton Archaeology Group surveyed these shelters. The report is on this site.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/15583962/Air-Raid-Shelters-at-St-Lukes-and-Warstones-schools-Wolverhampton
This should get you to the report on these air raid shelters.
Phil
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Thank you for that Phil, most interesting.
I remember being at Warstones school during the war and having to do air raid shelter drill. A Mr Dean was the headmaster in those days.
Bob.
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I am interested about the farm servant who hanged himself at the farm. I am trying to find a suicide and have a father and 2 sons working as farmhands at The green Old shotton. Does anyone know where details of such suicide would be found.