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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Durham => Topic started by: LSpegal on Wednesday 10 March 10 22:08 GMT (UK)
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My gggrandma, Jane (Geddes) Aitkin and husband Robert Aitkin are said to have had a pub, I'm supposing in Gateshead since that's where they lived, but could have been elsewhere I suppose.
Does anyone have any good pub resources they might share? And could anyone tell me if there's anyway to find out for sure if they owned or operated one, where, and the name of it? Are there any kind of pub records? I saw somewhere else I was researching had some kind of indexes for licenses or something of that nature.
I don't have any experience in this sort of research, but thought perhaps s others of you might!
Robert died 1901 Gateshead and she died in the 1920's I believe, by then she had remarried to a James Smith in 1907.
Robert was born in Gateshead and Jane in Shields after marrying (1870) I believe they lived in Newcastle for a year or so then moved to Gateshead.
Thank you for any suggestions, or wisdom, Lisa
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Pubs and their licensees are listed in directories http://www.historicaldirectories.org/hd/
Stan
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Thanks, I've searched in those many times to no avail, but am looking again, just in case I missed something! I tried to get in there a few days ago but it wouldn't open at all. Maybe link was wrong but it was the only one I found online or stored.
Lisa
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Hello Lisa
Do you have the census information for them showing occupations?
In 1891 Robert was a locomotive engine driver, same in 1901 although he was not living at the same address that night as Jane, she was listed in 1901 as a Provision Merchant - no mention of their running a pub. I can give full census details if you don't already have them.
Barbara :)
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Hi Barbara,
This family has been a little challenging. I do have the censuses, at least I think I have it all, will let you know if I find that I don't after all. Robert is listed as engine driver on all kids birth certificates as well. The info about Jane I got from my grandma here in the USA who has since passed away, no-one here in the family knows anything! I have been the one digging up the info on this family, so am hoping I might make some connections in Gateshead and find living descendants possibly, at least that's the dream...LOL
I did find on the 1911 census that one daughter was working at a tea house. And that's as close as I've gotten.
Any ideas how I might prove or disprove this pub theory? I'd be eternally grateful!! ;D
grandma said that Robert & Jane had the pub still when he died or she died? Am sure grandma got the info from their dau. Ethel who came to the USA or perhaps son Robert who also came to USA.
thanks again, Lisa
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Hi Lisa
Do you have Robert's death certificate also showing his occupation, or maybe his will? There's nothing in the census to say that he may not have owned or run a pub as well as working as an engine driver, but certainly looks as if Jane was running a shop in 1901 - again, trade directories might show that.
Have you gone further back to see if either of their parents perhaps had a pub?
Barbara
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What was James Smith's occupation on the 1911 census, not a publican I take it, or you would have mentioned that. :)
I've had a look at the 1890 Kelly's directory for Durham, pages of pubs, but no Aitkin listed as publican
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In those days lots of people sold alcohol - especially if they were provisions merchants I would think. Not a pub as we would know it today but there were dozens of them in every town. I wonder if it could have been something like that?
Andrea
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Man I missed these replies, so sorry! YES, I have his death certificate, no mention of pub, I don't have his will, hadn't really thought of that, I guess my mind is elsewhere, that might be a nice thing to have anyhow, are copies expensive? and where do you get them from?
Have parents + grandparents back to Cumberland, none in pub business. Haven't found any for Jane's family either, looked just in case it was a family story mix-up.....
Lisa
Any other ideas?
Hi Lisa
Do you have Robert's death certificate also showing his occupation, or maybe his will? There's nothing in the census to say that he may not have owned or run a pub as well as working as an engine driver, but certainly looks as if Jane was running a shop in 1901 - again, trade directories might show that.
Have you gone further back to see if either of their parents perhaps had a pub?
Barbara
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On their marriage certificate James Smith is a blacksmith and his father a spring maker.
Still hunting, thanks for the reply, if you have any other ideas, please let me know, I need all the help I can get ;D
Lisa
What was James Smith's occupation on the 1911 census, not a publican I take it, or you would have mentioned that. :)
I've had a look at the 1890 Kelly's directory for Durham, pages of pubs, but no Aitkin listed as publican
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Just thought of this on the 1911 census one of the daughters is working at a tea house. Probably not a clue though.
Lisa
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, I don't have his will, hadn't really thought of that, I guess my mind is elsewhere, that might be a nice thing to have anyhow, are copies expensive? and where do you get them from?
You can apply for a probate search to the Postal Searches and Copies Department, The Probate Registry, Castle Chambers, Clifford Street, York, YO1 9RG
The standard fee for searching for the will of a named deceased is £5 - this covers a 4 year search period and includes a single copy of the grant of probate together with the will (if any) - extending the search period costs an additional £3 for each 4 year extension
You can download an application form for a Probate Search at
http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/pa1s_0405.pdf
Stan
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Thanks for that info, I hadn't looked it up before.
Lisa
, I don't have his will, hadn't really thought of that, I guess my mind is elsewhere, that might be a nice thing to have anyhow, are copies expensive? and where do you get them from?
You can apply for a probate search to the Postal Searches and Copies Department, The Probate Registry, Castle Chambers, Clifford Street, York, YO1 9RG
The standard fee for searching for the will of a named deceased is £5 - this covers a 4 year search period and includes a single copy of the grant of probate together with the will (if any) - extending the search period costs an additional £3 for each 4 year extension
You can download an application form for a Probate Search at
http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/pa1s_0405.pdf
Stan