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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: chris2705 on Thursday 04 March 10 11:07 GMT (UK)

Title: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Thursday 04 March 10 11:07 GMT (UK)
Hi

I am trying to find any record of the following chap "Philip Harold William Baker, Lieutenant, Royal Navy" in 1920. DoB 25/12/1883

I have looked on the National Archive site and cannot find him. He is likely to have only served during WWI as his profession before the war, and certainly after 1922 was as a civil engineer (railways and electrification). He spent most of WWI in Buenos Aries, Argentina apparently working for an English company in relation to the local railway which adds to the mystery.

Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: tressle on Thursday 04 March 10 11:38 GMT (UK)
Do you know where he was born, wondered if that would help find him in the records.

Tressle
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Thursday 04 March 10 11:40 GMT (UK)
Hi

He was born in India (British subject)

Thanks
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: tressle on Thursday 04 March 10 11:43 GMT (UK)
There is a Phillip Harold Baker, last residence South Africa, Engineer returning to England in 1926.  I think his proposed address was Pollards Hill, S W 16.

Tresssle
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Thursday 04 March 10 11:57 GMT (UK)
I have seen that record (and in fact my profile photo is of Philip and comes from that trip). He went to SA in 1922 shortly after returning from one of at least two stays in Argentina. When he was in SA he was working as an engineer on the electrification of a railway with no navy activities at all.
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: seaweed on Thursday 04 March 10 18:41 GMT (UK)
Hi

I am trying to find any record of the following chap "Philip Harold William Baker, Lieutenant, Royal Navy" in 1920. DoB 25/12/1883

I have looked on the National Archive site and cannot find him. He is likely to have only served during WWI as his profession before the war, and certainly after 1922 was as a civil engineer (railways and electrification). He spent most of WWI in Buenos Aries, Argentina apparently working for an English company in relation to the local railway which adds to the mystery.

Any suggestions?

I  would try and confirm his RN status by looking at the "Navy List" for the years in question.
The Navy List records details of officers and their ships/shore establishments and where ships were stationed, For the period of the First World War they were published several times a year. They are available in most central reference libraries, NMM , RN Museum and TNA @ Kew.
As far as I am aware, they are unavailable on line in their entirety.
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Thursday 04 March 10 22:41 GMT (UK)
Thanks Seaweed, that is very helpful.
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: jds1949 on Thursday 04 March 10 22:55 GMT (UK)
Whilst your man does not appear in the records for Royal Navy officers he may well have been in the RN Reserve or Voluntary Reserve, and those records are not searchable online - which means either a trip to Kew or requesting a search.

jds1949
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: seaweed on Thursday 04 March 10 23:16 GMT (UK)
If he were either RNR or RNVR then this would be recorded in the Navy List.
Best check it out before shelling out on a trip to Kew or paying for research.
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Friday 05 March 10 09:02 GMT (UK)
My guess is RN Reserve or Voluntary Reserve given his career before and after the War
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: seaweed on Monday 08 March 10 19:14 GMT (UK)
Philip H W Baker is first recorded in the Navy List January 1919
Seniority 3/10/1918
Lieutenant (Temp)
RME
No recorded ship number but the entry above is 703 so PHWB
may have had the same number
.

PHWB was next recorded in TNL April 1919 as demobed.

So what does all this amount to? An educated guess but others may know more.

Seniority 3/10/1918 The date he was commissioned.
Lieutenant (Temp)  Obvious.
RME Royal Marines       Engineer?
No recorded ship number but the entry above is 703 so PHWB
may have had the same number. Ship 703  was HMS PRESIDENT
A nominal shore base for the purpose of pay. It seemed to be home to all sorts of flotsam and jetsam who could not be assigned to other departments.


I would check the RM officers records in The National Archives
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=58
and thoroughly check all the entries for HMS PRESIDENT in TNL January 1919 ( there are hundreds)
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Tuesday 09 March 10 09:18 GMT (UK)
Seaweed, thank you so much for looking at this.

The entry would seem to fit. He was an engineer by profession and shore-based, being in Buenos Aires at that time
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Tuesday 09 March 10 09:29 GMT (UK)
Just looking at the dates again, this must be one of the shortest commissions ever! The timing is curious too, as he was commissioned just as the War was ending and demobbed less than six months later.
Title: Royal Marine Engineer
Post by: seaweed on Tuesday 09 March 10 20:10 GMT (UK)
An interesting post on the Great War Forum
Scroll down to post 3 and 4
http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=140750

It may also pay you to contact the Royal Marines Museum
http://www.royalmarinesmuseum.co.uk/index2.html
Title: Re: Missing Navy officer help please
Post by: chris2705 on Wednesday 10 March 10 08:34 GMT (UK)
I found this thread as well yesterday as it is one of the few hits that comes back when searching online. It would again seem to fit with his profession as an electrical engineer as well as the dates. The more difficult thing now I guess is trying to find out what his role was in Argentina. Thanks again for taking the time to look.