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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: spalding 7 on Thursday 11 February 10 19:27 GMT (UK)

Title: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: spalding 7 on Thursday 11 February 10 19:27 GMT (UK)
Herbert Charles Spalding b 1860 d. 1889. married mutford.   washed overboard
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 11 February 10 19:47 GMT (UK)
Hi

Quote
Herbert Charles Spalding b 1860 d. 1889. married mutford.   washed overboard


Not a lot of info there - can you tell us what you are asking please so we can help you
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 11 February 10 22:58 GMT (UK)
Info received by pm

Quote
Herbert charles spalding is my great grandfather was born gorleston? married eliza pratt 1890 mutford. herbert a fisherman was washed over board. no death cert. lost at sea. eliza remarried a henry manning
Am looking for herbert's  father which I believe was a wiliam spalding b. 1840 gorleston and his wife.


Hi

Here is his marriage reg from freebmd

Marriages December qtr 1883 
 
Herbert Charles Spalding/Elizabeth Pratt   Mutford  4a 1728

There is no birth registration for him under Herbert Charles and the 1871 only has 2 Herbert Spaldings - one b 1858 Hendon Middlesex and the other b 1859 Norwich Norfolk. 

Although the last one looks a better bet for Gorleston, Mutford was the registration district for Gorleston so I would not have expected to see a birthplace of Norwich

Do you have a copy of the 1883 marriage cert which will show his age at that time and will also  confirm his fathers name and occupation as you don't seem certain about his fathers name.

That 1859 birthyear - father was Boaz
 
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: carol8353 on Thursday 11 February 10 23:09 GMT (UK)
HI there

I've read your P M to Carole but am still having trouble working out how he managed to marry Eliza in 1890 if he died in 1889 ?

Carol

Ahhh Okay Carole,glad you've worked it out  ;D
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 11 February 10 23:18 GMT (UK)
Hi Carol

That threw me at first but she re-married in 1890 to Henry Manning
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: spalding 7 on Friday 12 February 10 11:10 GMT (UK)
Hi,
Sorry for any misleading info, I’m not used to this method of making contact, It’s usually email. I gave the tree a bit of a break recently, now three years on I’ve lost the thread on what I have, being retired that’s easy.

So I am trying to fill in some of the gaps and go further into my ancsestry. I have dug out the marriage cert for Herbert Spalding. Which I mislaid, He age 24 married Eliza Pratt age 21 on 20th Dec. 1883. Mutford. Herbert a fisherman his father William a malster. In the presents of James Spalding and Ada Spalding.

After Herbert died 9 Feb.1889. Eliza Married Henry Manning 1890 in Mutford.

Before Herbert died he had three children Arnold Charles b. 28 Apr. 1884. Gorleston.(my mothers father)
Ellen May b. 21 Aug. 1886. d. Mutford Dec. 1888. age 2. and Fanny Eliza b. 1888 Mutford.

So Arnold and Fanny had a new father Henry Manning. They then had a son Harry Austin Manning b. O/N/D 1892 Mutford.

Hopefully this info now makes more sense. 

If you should be open to emailing me I could send copies of docs. and images of what I have on the PC Tree program if you feel inclined.

Roger W

Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: carol8353 on Friday 12 February 10 11:57 GMT (UK)
Hello Roger

Thanks for the aditional info.

Rootschat is an open forum ,where anyone of us will try and help you with your brickwalls.

You may find someone on here who is actually researching the same family,but that is very rare.

So just carry on posting your look ups on the appropriate boards and we'll see what we can find for you.

Carol
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 12:31 GMT (UK)
Hi

He's a bit of a puzzle is Herbert.  Nothing on the 1861/71 fits his profile so I've been looking at James & Ada Spalding entries in case they were either his siblings or husband and wife.  Can't get anything there either at the moment
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 12:59 GMT (UK)
Hi All  :)

The closest I can see so far, from 1861:

William Spaulding 32, malster
Lucy Spaulding 30
Ellen Spaulding 9
William Spaulding 7
Arnold Spaulding 3
Charles Spaulding 10 Months...could this be Herbert Charles?

Everyone showing as born in Gorleston - RG9; Piece: 1189; Folio: 64; Page: 8

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 13:02 GMT (UK)
Looking possible  ;) From birth indexes:

Herbert Charles Spaulding, Mutford - 2nd Qrt 1860, Vol. 4a Pg 698

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 13:11 GMT (UK)
Monica - you little gem.  Take a very big bow for finding that entry and I am going into the corner for not finding that birth entry!!
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 13:13 GMT (UK)
I've been working on two big brick walls for other people this morning and got absolutely nowhere  :'( Glad to help out  :)

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 13:24 GMT (UK)
By 1871 - Lucy was widowed and re-married to William Thurston and all the Spalding children are now shown as Thurston - but there are James and Ada who must have been Spalding's

All born Gorleston Suffolk except William

William Thurston 41 bricklayer b Aldeby Suffolk
Lucy   40
Ellen   19
George 15
Arnold   13
Charles   11
Alfred 9
James 7
Robert   5
Ada  3 freebmd - Ada Spaulding June qtr 1868
Mary A 1 freebmd - Spaulding March qtr 1870
RG10 Piece 1782 Folio 48 Page 26

Possible first marriage

Marriages December qtr 1851

William Spalding/Lucy Hine/Hiner or Hines       Newmarket  14 221   


Deleted - correct marriage found - see later reply
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 13:50 GMT (UK)
The 1881 census shows an additional child - Alice Thurston aged 7yrs.  Freebmd shows she was registered as Spaulding!!

It also shows Charles Thurston aged 20 no relationship shown but occ was fisherman so he is Herbert Charles Spaulding

William Thurston is now a malsters man - same as 1861 and same as on Herbert's marriage cert

William 1871/1881 is the same age as William in 1861 - are they one and the same person but under 2 surnames or is Lucy just co-habiting with him  No marriage to a William Thurston between 1861-1871 and no death of a William Spaulding between 1861-1871

Son Alfred on the 1871 census died June qtr 1871 - Spaulding

Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 14:00 GMT (UK)
1841 census has both a William Spaulding b 1831 living in  Rattlesden  parents James & Catherine and a William Spalding b 1830 living in Westley parents John & Hannah

It also has a William Thurston b 1829 living in Gorleston - father John a malster
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 14:12 GMT (UK)
Carole, no idea what is going on between the Thurston and Spa(u)lding names but something is certainly afoot  ::) I agree with you that they are likely to be the same family of Spaldings that we had in the earlier censuses.

If you take the Thurston family 1841 census entry you found, John and Mary with children including a William in Gorleston, and then compare against the batch code on IGI for Gorleston (C104831), it seems to bring up some of the Thurston children except under Spalding!

1. MARY ANN SPALDINGChristening: 10 AUG 1833 Gorleston With Southtown
2. ELEANOR SPALDING  Christening: 22 NOV 1834 Gorleston With Southtown
3. JOHN SPALDING Christening: 25 MAY 1837 Gorleston With Southtown

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 14:27 GMT (UK)
Now why would Ancestry have transcribed it this way? Is there something in notes that can't be seen on the image for the household? From 1851, John and wife Mary and children in Gorleston, same address as 1841:

John Hurston 50, malster
Mary Ann Hurston 50
Mary Ann Hurston 17
Ellen Hurston 16
John Hurston 13
Emma Hurston 11
George Gibbs 23

HO107; Piece: 1805; Folio:  ; Page: 1

All the entries have an additional note on the index summary for the household like this:

John Hurston [John Thurston Otherwise Known As Spalding]

Monica


Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 14:35 GMT (UK)
Hi Monica

Quote
John Hurston [John Thurston Otherwise Known As Spalding]


Somebody has notified this to Ancestry back in 2007 and has justified it as follows:

Quote
Thurston otherwise known as Spalding rather than Hurston
John was born to Mary Spalding, but occasionally took his father's name of Thurston.

User name is shown so I am going to see if she can be contacted via Ancestry
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 14:41 GMT (UK)
I'm glad you could figure it out Carole  :) Just realised that if I click on this bit, up comes the box with the additional notes dohh  :P
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 14:47 GMT (UK)
Possible IGI submitted entry for William's parents marriage:

JOHN SPALDING and MARY BURROUGHS Marriage: 22 JAN 1829 Aldeby, Norfolk

Both John and Mary show as born in Adelby in their 1851 entry.

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 14:54 GMT (UK)
Email sent as shown above but to try and sum this lot up for Roger (who is probably slitting his wrists as we speak)

Herbert Charles Spaulding/Spalding b 1860 Gorleston Suffolk  was the son of William Spaulding/Spalding and Lucy Hine(s) Richardson Wooden who married in Yarmouth in 1850

His father William was the son of John Spaulding who was also known as John Thurston.  John married Mary Burroughs in 1829 in Aldeby and he married as John Spalding (see above info posted by Monica)

John Spaulding/Thurston was the illegitimate son of Mary Spaulding/Spalding and unknown Thurston and although he married as Spalding, he was subsequently known under both surnames

Whilst his son William was actually a Spaulding - it looks as though he also decided to adopt the Thurston surname at some later date as well which is were the confusion arose between the 1861 and 1871 census entries

Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: MonicaL on Friday 12 February 10 14:58 GMT (UK)
 ;D A couple of family trees on Ancestry for this line of William and Lucy, parents of Herbert Charles.

They have William born on 6 April 1829 in Adelby, Norfolk which would fit with the potential marriage for the parents John and Mary in Jan of that year.

Lucy, William's wife is showing as Lucy Richardson Wooden born c. 1832, parents Abraham Wooden and Lucy Richardson.

Something to work from and to add to all the info found by Carole..... :)

Monica
Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 12 February 10 15:10 GMT (UK)
And yet another variation on the surname

William Spallding/Lucy Richardson Wooden Sept qtr 1850 Yarmouth 13   584

Title: Re: Spalding / Manning F'tree
Post by: spalding 7 on Saturday 13 February 10 13:40 GMT (UK)
I wish to thank everyone who took the time and interest to respond to my postings regarding the name Spalding/Spaulding/Spaullding/Manning.

Roger :)